Democratic congressman’s response to the memo:

“Brainwashing”

   

Edit.

Higgs Boson Wrote:The impending budget shutdown, for one thing, deserves much more attention and could have much larger consequences depending on which side caves.

The Jim Acosta gets owned video from less than two hours ago already predicts what should happen.

Jim Acosta took the idiotic position that, "The Republicans couldn't even prevent a government shut down, even though they control the entire Congress and the White House."

The Republican in a suit (whose name I forgot) made Jim Acosta admit that the continuing resolution requires SIXTY votes, but there are only FIFTY-ONE Republicans in the Senate.

So unless the American people think 51 is greater than 60, the Democrats are fucked. Even today, a FOX News Babe declared a shutdown as the Democrats protecting illegals instead of upholding the Constitution and/or serving the American people.

(01-19-2018 06:20 PM)Higgs Bosun Wrote:  My post wasn't meant to be black bill. I was just trying to provide context. My main point was that in the great scheme of things, the FISA investigations are small potatoes. The impending budget shutdown, for one thing, deserves much more attention and could have much larger consequences depending on which side caves. I guess what happened is that my autism got offended that guys were devoting so much attention to a matter which merits so little, at the cost of mostly ignoring much more important issues.

I tend to think our government branches helping to circumvent elections by passing on information attained through illegal surveillance of fellow Americans as being pretty important.

I don't know how any American could think otherwise unless they were simply trolling threads because they are really anti-Trump. You had a good run with the discreet trolling.

With that said, these matters tend to not live up to the rhetoric. If there is definitive proof, then this is much bigger than immigration.

(01-19-2018 06:44 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

(01-19-2018 06:20 PM)Higgs Bosun Wrote:  My post wasn't meant to be black bill. I was just trying to provide context. My main point was that in the great scheme of things, the FISA investigations are small potatoes. The impending budget shutdown, for one thing, deserves much more attention and could have much larger consequences depending on which side caves. I guess what happened is that my autism got offended that guys were devoting so much attention to a matter which merits so little, at the cost of mostly ignoring much more important issues.

I tend to think our government branches helping to circumvent elections by passing on information attained through illegal surveillance of fellow Americans as being pretty important.

I don't know how any American could think otherwise unless they were simply trolling threads because they are really anti-Trump. You had a good run with the discreet trolling.

Learn to read before you start calling others trolls. I never said or implied that FISA abuse isn't important or shouldn't be punished. I said that even in the best case scenario where there is definite proof and people go to jail, the political effects will be small because everyone is already split among partisan lines, and the real offenders are above the fray and won't be touched. Now fuck off.

(01-19-2018 07:07 PM)Higgs Bosun Wrote:  

(01-19-2018 06:44 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

(01-19-2018 06:20 PM)Higgs Bosun Wrote:  My post wasn't meant to be black bill. I was just trying to provide context. My main point was that in the great scheme of things, the FISA investigations are small potatoes. The impending budget shutdown, for one thing, deserves much more attention and could have much larger consequences depending on which side caves. I guess what happened is that my autism got offended that guys were devoting so much attention to a matter which merits so little, at the cost of mostly ignoring much more important issues.

I tend to think our government branches helping to circumvent elections by passing on information attained through illegal surveillance of fellow Americans as being pretty important.

I don't know how any American could think otherwise unless they were simply trolling threads because they are really anti-Trump. You had a good run with the discreet trolling.

Learn to read before you start calling others trolls. I never said or implied that FISA abuse isn't important or shouldn't be punished. I said that even in the best case scenario where there is definite proof and people go to jail, the political effects will be small because everyone is already split among partisan lines, and the real offenders are above the fray and won't be touched.

Right, because calling something small potatoes usually means it's important.

Your trolling is getting worst.

Quote:Now fuck off.

Truth seems to hurt a little. haha

There seems to be a group of people that have made up their mind that no matter what happens, Trump will cave in and become deep state. No matter how many things he has accomplished nor how many promises kept (or tried to keep). They are just waiting for that one thing that Trump fails on so they can laugh at all of us saps for believing in a person enough to get excited about the things he has accomplished.

It doesn't matter to these people that Clinton was the altenative. It isn't really about that... it is about hoping and/or believing that there may be someone who can help change things for the better. That hope really tears into these people which is why they feel the need to be right about Trump being another politician screwing everyone. Sad!

(01-19-2018 12:54 PM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(01-19-2018 10:03 AM)Suits Wrote:  

(01-19-2018 09:55 AM)MMX2010 Wrote:  

Suits Wrote:Agreed. If this was a game changer, why not sit back, pour yourself a beer and wait for the deep swamp state to drain itself?

Why spend time on the Internet repeatedly posting "this is big!"?

Because the media is complicit in covering up all Democrat crimes.

And because this particular string of crimes leads to one important target: Barrack Obama.

Are the American people psychologically ready to indict Obama? Not yet. But as President Trump continues to prove that Government can be beneficent, he will also slowly build the case that Obama and his cronies need to be arrested. This case will be built day by day, street corner by street corner, one person at a time.

-----

Oh, and asserting that "the swamp will drain itself" is just

OK, so the media is complicit in covering it all up, so the guilty democrats are just going to skate.

Great.

Remind me what the point is of posting "this is big!" every time something that would lead to anything doesn't actually occur?

At this point, what difference does it make?

I am busy with business stuff, but I can take a break and answer this.

I posted about this way back about how big of a deal this is, and so far there is every indication that this is going to change the country forever, much like how Watergate did.

Except for one thing. This is even bigger than Watergate.

There will be at least one new law after this is over with.

Watergate was so damaging to Republicans and conservatives in America, that Gerald Ford could not even beat a skinny low energy Georgian governor named Jimmy Carter. They thought back then that the race would be close, but it ended up being 297-240 beatdown. Up till then Conservatives ran the country for a long time with JFK being the only president that disrupted what is technically conservatism, and even he was fairly conservative and racist, time has revealed. Lyndon B. Johnson who took over after he was killed was a deep South Democrat and very conservative for most things.

Some Dems fought against Jimmy Carter in the primary, because they thought he would be another Deep South conservative, and he ended up carrying Southern states in the election, because it looked like he would be a compromise for conservative voters that used to support Nixon. He ended up be pretty damn liberal to everyone's surprise, not to mention other issues, and got bounced by Reagan after 4 years. Basically everyone realized that even if Nixon was a crook, we fucked up by putting a wimpy Democrat in office.

Now I bring all this up because this time, the Watergate-ish offenders are Democrats and they just got blown out in the election and lost badly to begin with. We are not looking to see how Pence can win re-election like with Gerald Ford. We are looking at the loser party, using the FBI, CIA, and DOJ to get embroiled in this massive Watergate-ish scandal attempting to put forth a candidate to challenge a standing president for 2020 that was the target.

We are looking at the equivalent of an NCAA Death Penalty for an American Political Party. For those of you that do not follow or watch American College Football, just about every university that ever got the death penalty by the NCAA for scandals and violations, pretty much never ever recovered. The Death Penalty typically means no football for one year at least and they take away scholarships. College Football programs are only as good as their current momentum. Take it away and the school will take decades to recover from the damage, if ever, with the only exception being super rich alumni stepping in to fix it.

If any political party takes a hit this hard, it could take them 5-10 years to recover, probably more if Obama/Obama Cabinet members or a Clinton gets indicted or charged either in the same or similar scandal (Clinton Foundation Investigation). Do not forget the DNC is currently under an FBI investigation for other things.

There were people, newspapers, pundits, and editorials that dropped news stories back in the 70s saying that Watergate was a big nothing burger too. When the axe came down, they got blown away hardcore just like the Republican party at the time did. Gerald Ford suffered partly because of poor conservative turnout too. This too is going to massively affect the midterm elections.

The bottom line is that someone is going to jail.

Actually Pound-Me-In-The-Ass federal prison (not a mere state prison).

It might be just Peter. It could be just 3 dudes. It could be 20. Comey might even go too. Lynch could go. Susan Rice could go. Obama himself? Possible, but I somehow doubt it, might depend upon if these women flip on him because they are scared of a Federal Prison. You can easily bet on at least one person striking a deal for immunity to flip on the others.

This is not mere politics anymore. Some people abused our secret terrorism court warrant system just so that they could wiretap a presidential candidate and worked with an MI6 guy to forge the probable cause evidence. That's very illegal. That's not an opinion. This is a fucking crime.

I took the time to dig out all possible federal charges that are likely to be handed down and the ones that apply to this case, as well as the Clinton email case that Peter obstructed.

1. Sedition
2. Treason
3. Election Tampering
4. Obstruction (Court Orders, Justice, and Criminal Investigations)
5. Counts of Perjury/Filing False evidence
6. Federal Civil Rights Violations
7. Fraud Against the Government
8. Possession of False Papers to Defraud the U.S.
9. Public Corruption Crimes
10. RICO (possible but could be too broad)
11. Searches Without Warrant
12. Unauthorized Removal of Classified Documents
13. Destruction of Records in Federal Investigations
14. Conspiracy
15. Conveying False Information
16. Computer/Hacking Crimes (possibly at play)

Still think someone is not going to jail? Peter Strozk might catch half of these just by himself. Many of these charges carry at least 5 years prison time, some are 10-20 years, and one carries up to the death penalty. This is serious stuff folks.

Steele might even get extradited, but I can see the UK trying to block it, which could trigger another large political mess with a major ally. I cannot even predict how bad that could end up being.

Anyway, this will be a major test for our judicial system if they can successfully bring all these charges to all those involved. It is not rocket science, but bringing the cases is going to take a ton of long hours and hard work getting all the facts together to present to a grand jury and then to successfully argue the case in court. This will not be quickly done.

Oh yeah, this time, Trump will not be giving a pardon to the perps either. Ford pardoned Nixon, which no doubt affected his ability to get re-elected. He did not want the country to suffer but it backfired badly. Reagan pardoned one of the burglars. Dems would have to wait for another Democrat president to pardon Peter and Obama's gang. If Obama ends up needing a pardon that deserves it's own thread to discuss the advantages and disadvantages of that. We can cross that hill if/when we get there.

Yes, we know the government does bad things. We also know that the members of the government also tend to get away with doing those bad things.

I'd be overjoyed to see corrupt government officials go to jail and be replaced by honest politicians. However, I'm not going to hold my breath.

So, I'm going to bookmark your post and let's see if anyone other than a fall guy goes to jail.

Because as it currently stands, these repeated statements of "this is big!" are nothing more than individuals giving their own lives false importance.

Larry Schweikert, one of my favorite Twitter followers, speculates the following.

I am buried in the Reagan Papers @ Reagan Library, so this is brief.

1) this FISA stuff is described ad a “threat to our democracy”

2) if the dossier was a blackmail doc on Trump, assigned & assembled BEFORE Trump was even the front runner

3) THEREFORE we can conclude such packages were already fully prepared for ALL candidates, especially those thought to be real contenders.

4) wait for it: “a threat to our democracy”:

5) I will leave you with one name: John Roberts

-----

John Roberts was the highly conservative Supreme Court Justice who shocked everyone by casting the Affirming Vote that allowed Obamacare to be created.

The memo is probably more death by a thousand paper cuts than will be a huge revelation.

I'm just laughing at the Democrats shutting the government down over illegal immigrants. You could not ask for a better story for persuasion heading into the midterms. This is absolutely hilarious.

I disagree with the idea that scandals are trivial.

These scandals are, objectively speaking, HUGE because they reveal a state of affairs in which the government is an almost entirely corrupt entity controlled by a bevy of shady parties including but not limited to intelligence & defense bureaucrats, shady party fundraisers, corrupt law enforcement/judges, and organized crime.

What isn't going to be huge is the consequences for those responsible.

(01-19-2018 06:41 PM)MMX2010 Wrote:  

Higgs Boson Wrote:The impending budget shutdown, for one thing, deserves much more attention and could have much larger consequences depending on which side caves.

The Jim Acosta gets owned video from less than two hours ago already predicts what should happen.

Jim Acosta took the idiotic position that, "The Republicans couldn't even prevent a government shut down, even though they control the entire Congress and the White House."

The Republican in a suit (whose name I forgot) made Jim Acosta admit that the continuing resolution requires SIXTY votes, but there are only FIFTY-ONE Republicans in the Senate.

So unless the American people think 51 is greater than 60, the Democrats are fucked. Even today, a FOX News Babe declared a shutdown as the Democrats protecting illegals instead of upholding the Constitution and/or serving the American people.

This is the full clip of Marc Short & Mick Mulvaney answering the reporters' questions in regarding to the shutdown blame including DACA.




Edit. Oh Jimbo...you are such a drama queen.




Meanwhile...

(01-19-2018 11:53 AM)MMX2010 Wrote:  In what sounds like the preamble to a joke (but isn't a joke at all), an Australian guy, a Chinese guy, a Black Canadian guy, and one American citizen are wholly skeptical of President Trump's hyper-long-term operation to indict many members of multiple American intelligence communities.

Should I explain the situation in words they'll understand, or should I not?

This is why girls stand on the bus, even when there's an empty seat next to you.

Who's the Chinese guy in the joke? I guess Suits will have to do.

Interesting how the government shuts down before the memo is released. I wonder if that will effect it being released or not. Twitter has Trumpshutdown trending even though Democrats were needed to prevent the shut down.

(01-19-2018 08:18 PM)Suits Wrote:  

(01-19-2018 12:54 PM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(01-19-2018 10:03 AM)Suits Wrote:  

(01-19-2018 09:55 AM)MMX2010 Wrote:  

Suits Wrote:Agreed. If this was a game changer, why not sit back, pour yourself a beer and wait for the deep swamp state to drain itself?

Why spend time on the Internet repeatedly posting "this is big!"?

Because the media is complicit in covering up all Democrat crimes.

And because this particular string of crimes leads to one important target: Barrack Obama.

Are the American people psychologically ready to indict Obama? Not yet. But as President Trump continues to prove that Government can be beneficent, he will also slowly build the case that Obama and his cronies need to be arrested. This case will be built day by day, street corner by street corner, one person at a time.

-----

Oh, and asserting that "the swamp will drain itself" is just

OK, so the media is complicit in covering it all up, so the guilty democrats are just going to skate.

Great.

Remind me what the point is of posting "this is big!" every time something that would lead to anything doesn't actually occur?

At this point, what difference does it make?

I am busy with business stuff, but I can take a break and answer this.

I posted about this way back about how big of a deal this is, and so far there is every indication that this is going to change the country forever, much like how Watergate did.

Except for one thing. This is even bigger than Watergate.

There will be at least one new law after this is over with.

Watergate was so damaging to Republicans and conservatives in America, that Gerald Ford could not even beat a skinny low energy Georgian governor named Jimmy Carter. They thought back then that the race would be close, but it ended up being 297-240 beatdown. Up till then Conservatives ran the country for a long time with JFK being the only president that disrupted what is technically conservatism, and even he was fairly conservative and racist, time has revealed. Lyndon B. Johnson who took over after he was killed was a deep South Democrat and very conservative for most things.

Some Dems fought against Jimmy Carter in the primary, because they thought he would be another Deep South conservative, and he ended up carrying Southern states in the election, because it looked like he would be a compromise for conservative voters that used to support Nixon. He ended up be pretty damn liberal to everyone's surprise, not to mention other issues, and got bounced by Reagan after 4 years. Basically everyone realized that even if Nixon was a crook, we fucked up by putting a wimpy Democrat in office.

Now I bring all this up because this time, the Watergate-ish offenders are Democrats and they just got blown out in the election and lost badly to begin with. We are not looking to see how Pence can win re-election like with Gerald Ford. We are looking at the loser party, using the FBI, CIA, and DOJ to get embroiled in this massive Watergate-ish scandal attempting to put forth a candidate to challenge a standing president for 2020 that was the target.

We are looking at the equivalent of an NCAA Death Penalty for an American Political Party. For those of you that do not follow or watch American College Football, just about every university that ever got the death penalty by the NCAA for scandals and violations, pretty much never ever recovered. The Death Penalty typically means no football for one year at least and they take away scholarships. College Football programs are only as good as their current momentum. Take it away and the school will take decades to recover from the damage, if ever, with the only exception being super rich alumni stepping in to fix it.

If any political party takes a hit this hard, it could take them 5-10 years to recover, probably more if Obama/Obama Cabinet members or a Clinton gets indicted or charged either in the same or similar scandal (Clinton Foundation Investigation). Do not forget the DNC is currently under an FBI investigation for other things.

There were people, newspapers, pundits, and editorials that dropped news stories back in the 70s saying that Watergate was a big nothing burger too. When the axe came down, they got blown away hardcore just like the Republican party at the time did. Gerald Ford suffered partly because of poor conservative turnout too. This too is going to massively affect the midterm elections.

The bottom line is that someone is going to jail.

Actually Pound-Me-In-The-Ass federal prison (not a mere state prison).

It might be just Peter. It could be just 3 dudes. It could be 20. Comey might even go too. Lynch could go. Susan Rice could go. Obama himself? Possible, but I somehow doubt it, might depend upon if these women flip on him because they are scared of a Federal Prison. You can easily bet on at least one person striking a deal for immunity to flip on the others.

This is not mere politics anymore. Some people abused our secret terrorism court warrant system just so that they could wiretap a presidential candidate and worked with an MI6 guy to forge the probable cause evidence. That's very illegal. That's not an opinion. This is a fucking crime.

I took the time to dig out all possible federal charges that are likely to be handed down and the ones that apply to this case, as well as the Clinton email case that Peter obstructed.

1. Sedition
2. Treason
3. Election Tampering
4. Obstruction (Court Orders, Justice, and Criminal Investigations)
5. Counts of Perjury/Filing False evidence
6. Federal Civil Rights Violations
7. Fraud Against the Government
8. Possession of False Papers to Defraud the U.S.
9. Public Corruption Crimes
10. RICO (possible but could be too broad)
11. Searches Without Warrant
12. Unauthorized Removal of Classified Documents
13. Destruction of Records in Federal Investigations
14. Conspiracy
15. Conveying False Information
16. Computer/Hacking Crimes (possibly at play)

Still think someone is not going to jail? Peter Strozk might catch half of these just by himself. Many of these charges carry at least 5 years prison time, some are 10-20 years, and one carries up to the death penalty. This is serious stuff folks.

Steele might even get extradited, but I can see the UK trying to block it, which could trigger another large political mess with a major ally. I cannot even predict how bad that could end up being.

Anyway, this will be a major test for our judicial system if they can successfully bring all these charges to all those involved. It is not rocket science, but bringing the cases is going to take a ton of long hours and hard work getting all the facts together to present to a grand jury and then to successfully argue the case in court. This will not be quickly done.

Oh yeah, this time, Trump will not be giving a pardon to the perps either. Ford pardoned Nixon, which no doubt affected his ability to get re-elected. He did not want the country to suffer but it backfired badly. Reagan pardoned one of the burglars. Dems would have to wait for another Democrat president to pardon Peter and Obama's gang. If Obama ends up needing a pardon that deserves it's own thread to discuss the advantages and disadvantages of that. We can cross that hill if/when we get there.

Yes, we know the government does bad things. We also know that the members of the government also tend to get away with doing those bad things.

I'd be overjoyed to see corrupt government officials go to jail and be replaced by honest politicians. However, I'm not going to hold my breath.

So, I'm going to bookmark your post and let's see if anyone other than a fall guy goes to jail.

Because as it currently stands, these repeated statements of "this is big!" are nothing more than individuals giving their own lives false importance.

ABOVE we see righteous hope for Truth and Justice faced down - smacked down? - by weary cynical realism. And the latter spanks the former as naive.

Unfortunately, it is much too early who will prevail, nor is it possible to say what constitutes victory over shorter timescales. (The former might be realistic, while the latter dismisses and rationalizes all evidence of partial victory as "temporary" and signs of being "duped." And he may be correct.)

The reason why all conventional GOP candidates failed in the face of a True-outsider onslaught is because the US is in the midst of a full-on Marxist culture war, the one that issues from the Media who organize the (objectively rejected) Democrats counter-force.

Trump wasn't the best candidate for US President, but he was the one we needed - and we are fortunate to have him as our leader.

What will happen over the next seven years, few can tell. I take solace, however, in that "master persuader" Scott Adams has had the most consistent foresight - both into Trump, as well as his (our) enemies. If he can see the inner logic of this conflict externalized, perhaps we can, too?

Put more simply, the future depends on how much of the federal funding of enemy Marxist camp - eg, Obama era "sue and settle" corrupt funding of the Left, ie, three Leftist group benefited from bank-lender settlements to the tune of $640 million (https://nypost.com/2017/09/23/how-obama-...istance/), while DOJs AG settled the IRS violations of civil rights (which may have turned the 2014 election for Obama) for less than chump change - ie, for a few millions for hundreds of aggrieved groups.

Given my example, advantage Higgs Bosun, et al. - ie, the cynics.

IT's the corruption of the culture, stupid! to Update the James Carville-DNC line explaining why they defeated George H. W. Bush in 1992 (ie, "the economy).

Has there ever been a concerted culture war to defeat legacy and Enlightenment tradition before?

THAT'S WHY THE OUTCOME IS IMPOSSIBLE TO KNOW in advance. The best, we can argue for is the salience of our chosen indicators. The best one right now is Trump's First Year itself!

Four years ago, I was planning a permanent escape from the USA. I had given up. The election of criminal Hillary would have sealed that deal; Trump's wrench in the works of the Swamp (to mix metaphors) and fresh breath of Libertarian radicalism (eg, move fed agencies out of DC to the hinterlands!) has put that permanent escape on long-term hold.

I'm watching - I'm waiting. I'm cynical. But the Trump administration's openness to radical moves has me thinking that Trump is obviously a greater president than Reagan! But so much more must be accomplished to get that giddy in advance of a winning a culture war no one has had to win before.

To reiterate, argue for the salience of your cynicism, Higgs et al! Or are we all reduced to bloviating nullities by our presumptions?

Brutal

This ought to get interesting.

Stiffing the military is traditionally a good way to end up in front of a firing squad.

America is not quite there yet but you'd think the Dems on #TeamFederalTyranny would make more of an effort not to piss off the people they need to enforce martial law.

Signs and all, right away at midnight...



And those poor chubby white kids being used as props, ironic given that their handlers are intent on legislating their specific demographic into irrelevance, and the spending bill Dems rejected included the needed funding for the Children’s Health Insurance Program (CHIP).

As someone who is personally affected, pay wise, by this shutdown I say...

Hold the fucking line. Do not budge, do not give an inch, do not let them think they can use this tactic as a negotiating tool.

edit - for those who aren't aware. Those, like myself, that are affected by this, get backpay when the government starts up again. Sure, it sucks in the meantime. But so does have 30 million illegal immigrants sucking up my tax dollars. Hold the line.

Today's tweets by President Trump and his son, Our War God, prove why Twitter-based pro-Trump people need to get the word out. No one in the media will formulate the potential Government Shutdown as Democrats preferring illegals over American citizens, because the media is an activist wing of the Democratic Party.

Over-enthusiastic and/or poorly timed assertions of "This is big." are a small price to pay for by-passing the corrupt media.

(01-20-2018 03:08 AM)GlobalMan Wrote:  Signs and all, right away at midnight...



And those poor chubby white kids being used as props, ironic given that their handlers are intent on legislating their specific demographic into irrelevance, and the spending bill Dems rejected included the needed funding for the Children’s Health Insurance Program (CHIP).

Absolutely perfect.

They're openly and deliberately advertising the shutdown as orchestrated to protect illegal immigrants, thereby preferring them over American citizens.

This is wonderful!