Post: #51

This thread has had me thinking a lot...

I'm reminded of a quote from a holocaust survivor that I read once, to the effect of that it wasn't the smartest or the strongest that survived the holocaust; actually, there was no logic to who survived. Weak, pathetic men sometimes survivied; strong, hopeful men sometimes died.

I'm guessing in the event of a serious collapse event, that there would be many preppers who would die/fail, and a lot of people who were unprepared who would survive/prosper.

The biggest cause of death will probably be infectious disease, rather than violence. Disease will kill both the worthy and the unworthy without discrimination. Polio and maybe even smallpox will make a comeback.

Also, I doubt there would even be much in the way of riots/violence. Most people are passive. If the electricity and water go out, I'm guessing 80% of people are going to sit at home staring at their blank screens, waiting for government, or someone, to come save them. What riots will occur will burn out as people go hungry, although gangs of cannibals were known to arise in periods of famine during European history, so that might be an issue.

Societies do have a spontaneous need for order; in the event of the collapse of central government, local police and military officers will probably take control. Everyone (except for the new ones in power) will be starving and thirsty, but some semblance of order will probably exist. The people that will take control will probably be unexpected. Grant was a drunkard shopkeeper before chaos propelled him to the position of leader of the Union Army; Cao Cao and Liu Bei were low ranking aristocrats at the beginning of the Three Kingdoms period of civil wars in China. I'd expect the same to happen.

Since there are only 2 groups of people that can eat in times of crisis - namely priests and soldiers - it may be better to integrate as rapidly as possible into one of those 2 groups rather than going it alone.

In other words, don't assemble a team, assemble the nucleus of an army, and like Cao Cao and Liu Bei or one of the countless Roman generals who suddenly arose to prominence in various Roman civil wars, go forth, recruit and try to conquer. It's pointless to just hide out with a small group - disease might annihilate you or the local warlord will come gunning for you. And there will be a huge population out there waiting for someone, anyone, to come and tell them what to do and be and say, so go recruit them.

If civilization collapses, it's not an opportunity to merely 'survive' - it's an opportunity to become a Warlord/Saviour/Conquering Hero. And if you fail in the attempt and your competition kills you, well, there was a good chance of dying anyway.

Failing that, be a priest. People will flock to your banner in times of crisis. Warlords may even have to bend their knee to you, in order to appeal to the religious inclinations of their followers.

These are just random thoughts, don't take me too seriously...

Post: #52

(08-18-2017 02:55 AM)Thomas the Rhymer Wrote:  This thread has had me thinking a lot...

I'm reminded of a quote from a holocaust survivor that I read once, to the effect of that it wasn't the smartest or the strongest that survived the holocaust; actually, there was no logic to who survived. Weak, pathetic men sometimes survivied; strong, hopeful men sometimes died.

I'm guessing in the event of a serious collapse event, that there would be many preppers who would die/fail, and a lot of people who were unprepared who would survive/prosper.

The biggest cause of death will probably be infectious disease, rather than violence. Disease will kill both the worthy and the unworthy without discrimination. Polio and maybe even smallpox will make a comeback.

No - that won't happen unless we get WWI level of vaccines that are leftovers after the war or we spray heavily with DDT and 1960s pesticides again:

http://www.theecologist.org/investigatio...ccine.html

http://www.whale.to/vaccine/sf1.html
https://spktruth2power.wordpress.com/200...d-disease/

----------------

But what might make a comeback after several years are diseases caused by malnourishment and lack of nutrients - for example diseases like diphtheria. However even with that I doubt it will reach the same proportions at least in the West, because we know far more about nutrition.

WWII like environment may motivate people to chew dandelion leaves and roots as well as other simple herbs. It does not taste well, but it has some basic nutrients in it. Essentially you can feed yourself off herbs, roots - so as not to get basic diseases which are caused by lack of nutrients - and there were a lot of them in the past - a great many. Also even if hygiene suddenly took a dip, then we would not unlearn what we know about basic stuff like wound treatment. In addition we might have access to some basic supplements for some while.

I don't think we will experience a total collapse of our system. Riots will only shortly disrupt law and order.

The only thing that I expect is WWIII with Islam and that is relevant only in certain hot zones where you have huge armies of them - but that is more a conventional war.

Post: #53

I still wonder, what kind of scenario are we talking about? An invasion army? A cyber attack that turns out the system? An EMP blast? Roits in the big cities? Downfall of law and order because of civil unrest and riots? Terror attacks on a larger scale? I agree with the hot zones in big cities, more attacks, riots scenario. Not with a complete collapse of the system. This maybe comes after in the long run. Still the elites will manage to jump on the top fast again.
It seems like most here think about a Yugoslavia civil war scenario. All the migrants here are not armed like an official military. They maybe have sticks, knifes, some have guns. They can form a mob, I'm sure some can even rule a district. Still they have no unification. They come from all over the world, you often have fights among then. Lebanese with Afghanis, Kurdish with Turkish, Russians with Chechens. Those people bring their conflicts with them.

What set our society apart from theirs? What made it possible that a few of our soldiers can often beat an army of theirs? Its our organisation and our possibility to cooperate. We don't think in the clan way. I can go to a store here and know no body will rip me off even that I don't know or maybe not even like the guy that works there. I read the stuff about the Bosnian civil war, that strength comes in numbers. The strength isn't the number alone. Its the way of communication, organisation and discipline. This is the true idea of the A-Team. This is the point mention here before, find people you know and trust. Also experience build trust. Not go out and have some drinks. To some other stuff, hiking, sports. This forms a spirit of trust. Then bring in some communication, some basic rules of understanding.
How to communicate when the power grid turns off? How in an emergency? Just look at the new years eve and how mobile devices break down. All the other stuff about food and weapons are right, store it, use it. I read some people stock stuff for the worst case, but they stock stuff they normal never eat. What's worth when you have some "great" preper stuff but after two meals you have to vomit? It is mention here before, make with your budys some kind of test. It will be fun to do this at the weekend. Start at Friday evening to Sunday or so. Kind of a role play. One of you has the story to tell. They only know that they have to keep a weekend free and that you will to a test. So Friday you pick them up, then you drive / walk somewhere. Or you have a meeting point. A safe house. Then you start.

What to you need?
- Weapons and ammo: Keep it basic and simple
- Food for some period of time: Store stuff you can eat and build the stock up
- Water: Don't underestimate this, maybe a water cleaner that you can get some stuff from a river or so and boxes to carry
- Clothing: Some stable stuff
- People: There you have to find trustworthy ones and build up a group spirit
- Communication: A radio with solar panels, stock batteries, some walki talkies, some CB funk station maybe
- Hygiene and medial stock, candles, towels, stuff for cold times


I consider a passport - El Gostro mention it also very valid. Even more have some foreign bank account when the Euro or the Dollar hits the fan. Mostly the money will be worthless in the current crisis but it will be big advantage when you have to escape and you know you have some money stocked.

Post: #54

(08-18-2017 09:26 AM)Parzival Wrote:  I still wonder, what kind of scenario are we talking about? An invasion army? A cyber attack that turns out the system? An EMP blast? Roits in the big cities? Downfall of law and order because of civil unrest and riots? Terror attacks on a larger scale? I agree with the hot zones in big cities, more attacks, riots scenario. Not with a complete collapse of the system. This maybe comes after in the long run. Still the elites will manage to jump on the top fast again.

I dont really think we'll need to worry about the West becoming like something out of Road Warrior in our lifetimes. Even if it does there'll be Uber-Armored Supply to deliver bullets, fuel, beer, sushi, and biznitches...you know...all the basics.

Post: #55

When it comes to water, you may want to stock up on some lifestraw products.

Or a Sawyer mini - https://sawyer.com/products/sawyer-mini-filter/

Post: #56

I start to see more ways this can pan out.

"Conflict" does not have to mean "war" - there could be SJW mobs who act like SS to round up men like us.

"Survive" does not have to mean "live off the land" - it could mean "to be not seen by the wrong eyes"

If the above is true, we are in a "conflict" right now.

A fresh look at this gives us new paths.

---

Hide your face - there are many vids on Gulag Tube on film-level make up. Some cloth balls in your mouth will alter the shape of your face. Wear a hat.

Buy at alt-shops - the web has made life very easy for us, but we have given them control. Take it back. Go out and have a walk. There are shops in all areas that sell all items. A few weeks ago I went to a china town - men with a stand on the side walk who sell cheap stuff but prob just as good as brand name items. Pay cash. Maybe you will even chat with new men and make your team this way.

Gift cards - if you must buy on the web and you fear the SJW squad linking to your CC, load up a gift card and use that. Down side is you are going to have to pay to use your own money, due to their fees.

-----

These are just a few ideas. I think the key is to ask "will an SJW be angry at what I want to do?" (but they will piss their pants at all things, so the point is moot).

Then ask "how can I hide what I do?" - while you try to keep your life as much the same as you can.

Post: #57

My practical advice is to start turning camping, hiking, hunting, and fishing into your hobbies. I'm finally at the point where I can leave my office for days at a time and stay out in the bush with very little needed. It's taken a few years, but my packs are at the point where I know I have everything I need to survive for weeks.

If you make outdoors a hobby, you'll put together a "bug out bag" by virtue of necessity. "Damn, wish I had brought a can opener." "It sure would be nice if I had a bic lighter" etc. etc.

Learn how to start a fire, pitch a tent (in the dark), have a sleeping bag, and all the gear you need readily available. It's best you go with someone who knows what they're doing. After a few nights you'll pick up on it.

Start small and do a weekend trip, then build up. A lot of places have tent sites with potable water and electricity, but that, in my view, is glamping. Go somewhere rustic and see how long you can cut it in the woods with a few of your friends. Just don't be an idiot and start wandering around the woods.

Also, state game lands often have a range where you can shoot guns. You can build all the survivalist knowledge and gear you need by just engaging in hobbies. Your camping bag can be your bug out bag.

Chicks also dig doing this stuff.

Post: #58

(08-19-2017 09:53 PM)HankMoody Wrote:  My practical advice is to start turning camping, hiking, hunting, and fishing into your hobbies. I'm finally at the point where I can leave my office for days at a time and stay out in the bush with very little needed. It's taken a few years, but my packs are at the point where I know I have everything I need to survive for weeks.

If you make outdoors a hobby, you'll put together a "bug out bag" by virtue of necessity. "Damn, wish I had brought a can opener." "It sure would be nice if I had a bic lighter" etc. etc.

Learn how to start a fire, pitch a tent (in the dark), have a sleeping bag, and all the gear you need readily available. It's best you go with someone who knows what they're doing. After a few nights you'll pick up on it.

Start small and do a weekend trip, then build up. A lot of places have tent sites with potable water and electricity, but that, in my view, is glamping. Go somewhere rustic and see how long you can cut it in the woods with a few of your friends. Just don't be an idiot and start wandering around the woods.

Also, state game lands often have a range where you can shoot guns. You can build all the survivalist knowledge and gear you need by just engaging in hobbies. Your camping bag can be your bug out bag.

Chicks also dig doing this stuff.

I want to second this. Pick up some useful hobbies so that you will actually be practicing these things. Learning how to hunt isn't something you can just do overnight. You need to learn about where to hunt different animals, what they eat, when they breed, how they behave.

Don't be exclusive to big game. Learn how to harvest small game, rabbits, squirrels, birds, grouse, turkey, etc. Also learn how to butcher the animals you kill and process the meat yourself. Figure out how to extract every bit of usable meat from the animal.

This is something I have taken up myself over the past year or so. You will accumulate a lot of survival type gear just by doing this.

If you have a girl get her learning skills that will be useful. Gardening. Canning food. Soap making. Whatever.

Even if you never have to use these skills in a survival situation they are still great hobbies.

Post: #59

I'm still thinking of this thread.

Ever notice how when a civilization collapses, art and writing output dramatically drops?

That's because in a crisis, artists, actors, writers, historians, academics, painters, sculptors, etc are all useless mouths to feed.

So in a crisis, they all starve, because they do not provide a meaningful contribution to the survival of society.

In other words, if you want to survive a crisis, be able to do contribute something useful to society, and be flexible enough to learn and adapt your contribution to a society that has been knocked down a few pegs.

If you make a living blogging or stock trading and have no other tangible skills, you will suffer in the next crisis. But if you can make agricultural implements out of scrap, then you might be able to eke out a living.

So I'd say the first step to surviving a crisis is: don't be useless in the first place.

Post: #60

I think that a solid understanding of mechanics and electricity will come in handy. In a SHTF situation you will be a hero if you can hold your own in these disciplines.

Does anyone have any good resources on where to start getting a full, practical understanding of the following:

-Vehicle mechanics: flow diagram of how basic engines work, common errors and diagnosis, most important tools to have on hand. Likewise, basic boat knowledge in terms of two stroke and four stroke outboards

Electricity: off the grid. Most common is solar or a gen set. For solar, the conversion of DC to AC through an inverter, battery care, etc. For generators (which crosses into mechanics), how they work, troubleshooting, most reliable systems, and even understanding the complex science of electricity -- you can use an analogy to water

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydraulic_analogy

...to understand the basics of you are a neophyte but putting it together in a practical manner will do you well. What other electricity sources besides solar (expensive) and gen sets (cumbersome especially if you aren't mechanically skilled) come to mind?


Anyways who here is good in trades and can suggest a resource to better understand these skilled abilities?

Post: #61

I'm not sure if this has been adressed... I think learning how to grow food yourself is a great idea. Say... you find yourself way out in some good arable soil location far from people in general. If you know what sort of fruit and vegetables and grains that are native to the region, if you have enough time, you can plant a decent sized garden. Do canning and drying if you have the equipment and stockpile enough preserved food to last the winter. I have farmer ancestry and even more recently family that grew up on a homestead/farm. Its in my blood. They made the most out of every space they could find during the war and great depression. They survived by being smart and planning for the winter. Where my base is the climate is actually rather warm, grapes can be grown easily, even kiwi, and many, many other types of plants. Best thing to do is research plants that are wild that you can gather seeds from and also what other people have been growing in the area for the last few generations. You won't get much protein from a lot of plants but they are essential.

Lettuce is easy, cabbage is easy, tomatoes relatively easy, potatoes are easy, find an apple tree or other fruit trees if you can. Stock up on seeds of all kinds. Grow, grow ,grow. Having gardening as a hobby or even in my case a small part of my food supply is an excellent idea. Beans are easy as well. If you have a large enough supply of water that you can use in the summer you can grow quite a lot. Compost is a great idea if you need better soil. Stock up on topsoil, peat moss, mushroom manure. Get shovels and rakes, watering cans. Its foreign to city boys but gardening is easy provided that you have these 4 essentials:

Nurtrient rich black soil
Irrigation for dry spells
Plenty of sunlight depending on the plant type
Seeds or seedlings.


If you have a community garden thing in your town or city check it out and gather information from the gardeners for growing food and knowing what kinds are easily grown in your region. I was raised to grow things, being free labor, lol on my family's garden plots. I even had two of my own when I moved out. There are plants too that compliment each other. If you do grow food for survival and eventually later on after the happenings, DO NOT do monoculture. That means do not grow just one crop. If your one cash crop gets decimated by disease of critters you are FUCKED. Cover all your bases and have a few patches for personal feeding and then set up your crop for bartering or cash.

It can be a boring job gardening but the fruits, (hah) of your labor are worth every bead of sweat.

Also, If you have a good supply of food make sure to guard it some manner from roving bands of retards or make sure it is not easily found by them.

And if you can hunt in the woods or plains, whatever do that.

If you need an outdoor fire, DO NOT, burn anything too green. It makes smoke which other people can see. Do not burn massive bon fires. Make small compact ones for cooking. If you're with family and your pals do not make yourself easy to find.

And even now in the present if you have a balcony or some space inside your place that gets plenty of sun you can buy some cheap containers, garden pots, and plant easy veggies and plenty of seeds and grow and grow new sets of lettuce for example as long as you have a good supply of water and good soil.


That's it for me!

Post: #62

(08-20-2017 10:59 AM)Thomas the Rhymer Wrote:  I'm still thinking of this thread.

Ever notice how when a civilization collapses, art and writing output dramatically drops?

That's because in a crisis, artists, actors, writers, historians, academics, painters, sculptors, etc are all useless mouths to feed.

So in a crisis, they all starve, because they do not provide a meaningful contribution to the survival of society.

In other words, if you want to survive a crisis, be able to do contribute something useful to society, and be flexible enough to learn and adapt your contribution to a society that has been knocked down a few pegs.

If you make a living blogging or stock trading and have no other tangible skills, you will suffer in the next crisis. But if you can make agricultural implements out of scrap, then you might be able to eke out a living.

So I'd say the first step to surviving a crisis is: don't be useless in the first place.

Art is useful and worthwhile, but it is just higher on the survival scale.

You have to have food and security first, then plumbing, electricity and fixtures.

Some occupations just come into play with a large civilization, greater numbers and development. Mechanical engineers, IT and robotics experts may not appear to be useful at first, but they are from a bigger viewpoint.

I don't think that society is going to end up in a Walking Dead scenario - this is just a quick emergency team contingent that helps you survive small and medium disaster before either order is restored or the whole country descends into a prolonged war. A prolonged war would bring different problems for such a crew - it won't be the Balkan civil war in most cases.

Post: #63

(08-20-2017 04:14 PM)komatiite Wrote:  Does anyone have any good resources on where to start getting a full, practical understanding of the following:

-Vehicle mechanics:

Electricity

There is a website run by a madman who is trying to build an entire library of schematics on how to build all your own farm equipment, including power sources, engines, etc.
http://opensourceecology.org/gvcs/gvcs-machine-index/#

The guy built multiple prototype tractors from scratch:
https://opensourceecology.dozuki.com/c/LifeTrac

Post: #64

(08-20-2017 10:59 AM)Thomas the Rhymer Wrote:  Ever notice how when a civilization collapses, art and writing output dramatically drops?

That's because in a crisis, artists, actors, writers, historians, academics, painters, sculptors, etc are all useless mouths to feed.

....

So I'd say the first step to surviving a crisis is: don't be useless in the first place.

No reason why you can't do both.

Anyway, this famous theory tries to explain this. You can't build the upper levels of the pyramid unless the lower ones are in place. I've never been entirely-convinced by the validity of it, but I think it functions as a useful thought construct.



Bonus Social Justice Historical Revisionism: I've never, ever seen 'Lack of Prejudice' in the Self-Actualisation level before.

Post: #65

^^^^^

I think the pyramid does work at a macro level, though. John Adams, two hundred years ahead of Maslow:

I must study politics and war that my sons may have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy. My sons ought to study mathematics and philosophy, geography, natural history, naval architecture, navigation, commerce, and agriculture, in order to give their children a right to study painting, poetry, music, architecture, statuary, tapestry, and porcelain.

God save us from people who mean well. -storm

Post: #66

(08-21-2017 05:55 AM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  No reason why you can't do both.

Anyway, this famous theory tries to explain this. You can't build the upper levels of the pyramid unless the lower ones are in place. I've never been entirely-convinced by the validity of it, but I think it functions as a useful thought construct.



Bonus Social Justice Historical Revisionism: I've never, ever seen 'Lack of Prejudice' in the Self-Actualisation level before.

Typical relativist bullshit. Civilization building is one thing, hierarchy of human needs another. (Though of course - there is some basic truth to the hierarchy.)

Humans without love/close affection grow up stunted. In fact - they can have shortage of food and safety and grow up into decent beings - but leave them in a warm barrel during children and throw food down and you will see what will come out at age 10. (One French enlightenment philosopher tried this with his son - don't remember who - and the son turned out to be a complete moron and degenerate.)

Also humans quickly require some kind of religious or social explanation of things - this is where priests, fables, basic cultural myths come into play. That happens actually pretty soon - a population can live in caves and subsist on hunting, but will still want to believe in a God/higher purpose - even something more benign like ancestors watching them from above.

The SJWs just get their atheist materialistic multicultural marxist utopia as some kind of nebulous goal.

Art also in terms of music and basic expression comes in very soon - practically as soon as some initial basic needs are met. Suddenly the guy with the guitar and a good signing voice becomes very valuable.

Lack of prejudice is funny - like desire for diversity.

Post: #67

(08-21-2017 06:15 AM)Paracelsus Wrote:  ^^^^^

I think the pyramid does work at a macro level, though. John Adams, two hundred years ahead of Maslow:

I must study politics and war that my sons may have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy. My sons ought to study mathematics and philosophy, geography, natural history, naval architecture, navigation, commerce, and agriculture, in order to give their children a right to study painting, poetry, music, architecture, statuary, tapestry, and porcelain.

That's more concerned with civilization building - would be interesting to create a diagram of what needs to be done for civilization to take steps forward - like no slavery (holds back advancement), public schools, meritocratic advancement open for geniuses, universities for open collection of knowledge etc.

Of course if you have barbarous hordes going through your country and they are burning libraries, burning women for reading, then you will have a very limited civilization.

Post: #68

(08-21-2017 06:15 AM)Paracelsus Wrote:  ^^^^^

I think the pyramid does work at a macro level, though. John Adams, two hundred years ahead of Maslow:

I must study politics and war that my sons may have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy. My sons ought to study mathematics and philosophy, geography, natural history, naval architecture, navigation, commerce, and agriculture, in order to give their children a right to study painting, poetry, music, architecture, statuary, tapestry, and porcelain.

This is a truly nice quote, but after the red pill I can not help but think that it means some thing else today - the man will raise the man who will raise a fag...

Brings to mind a new quote, after a look at not-Gulag:

http://www.barrypopik.com/index.php/new_...ccess_and/

Quote:“The first generation builds the business, the second makes it a success, and the third wrecks it”

Post: #69

A skilled gardener can feed themselves year round with no less than an acre of suitable land in a non-hostile climate, and that assumes no unexpected setbacks like a late frost killing all your spring seedlings or birds getting into your crops and destroying everything they can't be bothered to eat.

Gardening is a useful tool to supplement stored food but it's a dangerous plan for providing your whole diet.

Post: #70

(08-21-2017 08:31 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  A skilled gardener can feed themselves year round with no less than an acre of suitable land in a non-hostile climate, and that assumes no unexpected setbacks like a late frost killing all your spring seedlings or birds getting into your crops and destroying everything they can't be bothered to eat.

Gardening is a useful tool to supplement stored food but it's a dangerous plan for providing your whole diet.

Post: #71

^ Notable that gardening is something you typically have to do outside.

One thing survivalist novels never seem to contain is someone getting sniped on their homestead while dusting tomatoes with pesticide.

One more reason why I maintain that homestead survivalism is a sham and a death-trap. Raider Leonard could kill homestead Leonard and his whole family five times before breakfast.

Post: #72

(08-21-2017 09:21 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  ^ Notable that gardening is something you typically have to do outside.

One thing survivalist novels never seem to contain is someone getting sniped on their homestead while dusting tomatoes with pesticide.

One more reason why I maintain that homestead survivalism is a sham and a death-trap. Raider Leonard could kill homestead Leonard and his whole family five times before breakfast.

At 1:33-2:03 Bill Burr agrees with you.

Post: #73

(08-21-2017 09:21 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  ^ Notable that gardening is something you typically have to do outside.

One thing survivalist novels never seem to contain is someone getting sniped on their homestead while dusting tomatoes with pesticide.

One more reason why I maintain that homestead survivalism is a sham and a death-trap. Raider Leonard could kill homestead Leonard and his whole family five times before breakfast.

That reminds me of this quote from The Road Warrior's opening narration-

Quote:On the roads it was a white-line nightmare. Only those mobile enough to scavenge, brutal enough to pillage would survive. The gangs took over the highways, ready to wage war for a tank of juice, and in this maelstrom of decay ordinary men were battered and smashed — men like Max, the warrior Max. In the roar of an engine, he lost everything and became a shell of a man, a burnt-out desolate man, a man haunted by the demons of his past, a man who wandered out into the wasteland. And it was here, in this blighted place, that he learned to live again.

Post: #74

(08-21-2017 12:32 PM)Charles Martel Wrote:  

(08-21-2017 09:21 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  ^ Notable that gardening is something you typically have to do outside.

One thing survivalist novels never seem to contain is someone getting sniped on their homestead while dusting tomatoes with pesticide.

One more reason why I maintain that homestead survivalism is a sham and a death-trap. Raider Leonard could kill homestead Leonard and his whole family five times before breakfast.

That reminds me of this quote from The Road Warrior's opening narration-

Quote:On the roads it was a white-line nightmare. Only those mobile enough to scavenge, brutal enough to pillage would survive. The gangs took over the highways, ready to wage war for a tank of juice, and in this maelstrom of decay ordinary men were battered and smashed — men like Max, the warrior Max. In the roar of an engine, he lost everything and became a shell of a man, a burnt-out desolate man, a man haunted by the demons of his past, a man who wandered out into the wasteland. And it was here, in this blighted place, that he learned to live again.

   

And your random neighbour becomes the gang leader. Sometimes we need the extremes to explore what's inside us...

Post: #75

That is why Zelcorpion's team is in the woods:



2 guys going shopping


We are not growing tomatoes: