Had to bring out the popcorn for this one. This last bit of the thread is why I love RVF and will never join another forum like this if I end up leaving or getting booted out. Please keep the discussion rolling I'm already taking notes.

One little spark and this thread goes into Wild fire mode. Love it!

Couple random things I'd like to add. Whether in Europe or the US ...

1) If you're black and keen on getting laid on a night out ... avoid going out with a bunch of other brothers. The more black guys in a group, the less likely any of you will get laid. A group of 5 or 6 black dudes entering a club without women looks like a gang. That's just how it is. Even more so outside after last call when you're scanning for some last minute pussy. I see it so many times it's painful to watch. Girls are noticeably intimidated.

Best bet would be going out with one other black guy, two max. A white guy would be ideal in the west however. Disarms girls like crazy ... voodoo level.

2) If you do insist on going out with a bunch of brothers however ... try having fun with each other.

When white guys go out in big groups they'll be buying shots at the bar, talking to each other, high-fiving each other , singing etc ... You rarely see black men doing the same. Most black men at clubs swag it out on a wall around the dance floor area with a mean gangsta' attitude occasionally singing along and dancing to "Trap Queen" or whatever. Many look at every passing girl with a hungry hyena gaze.

I'm sure most of you guys are not like that but still.

3) Coverdoc that was an awesome post.

(04-13-2016 09:01 PM)Anabasis to Desta Wrote:  One little spark and this thread goes into Wild fire mode. Love it!

Couple random things I'd like to add. Whether in Europe or the US ...

1) If you're black and keen on getting laid on a night out ... avoid going out with a bunch of other brothers. The more black guys in a group, the less likely any of you will get laid. A group of 5 or 6 black dudes entering a club without women looks like a gang. That's just how it is. Even more so outside after last call when you're scanning for some last minute pussy. I see it so many times it's painful to watch. Girls are noticeably intimidated.

Best bet would be going out with one other black guy, two max. A white guy would be ideal in the west however. Disarms girls like crazy ... voodoo level.

2) If you do insist on going out with a bunch of brothers however ... try having fun with each other.

When white guys go out in big groups they'll be buying shots at the bar, talking to each other, high-fiving each other , singing etc ... You rarely see black men doing the same. Most black men at clubs swag it out on a wall around the dance floor area with a mean gangsta' attitude. Many look at every passing girl with a hungry hyena gaze.

I'm sure most of you guys are not like that but still.

3) Coverdoc that was an awesome post.

1) if you're trying to pull non-black women at a non-black club. Otherwise rolling heavy is fine

2) I don't know who you guys are hanging with.

I get the sense that a lot of you guys are living in an entirely different world than me.

Where I'm at, most black guys that go to the things I like have real jobs, nice places, and cars. So do the black women. It's called being gainfully employed. And amongst the "glitterati" there are ratchets and dummies of course, but a lot of them black women I see have decent bodies crammed into Eurocentric pantsuits and Ann Taylor. It's actually one of my favorite things to see a professional sister have to struggle with what Mama Africa gave her, cause J. Crew was designed for Scandinavian frames...

Now there's an entire other side of folks who have basically been locked out of the economic system and society in general. I don't go to those places and hang out with that crowd. Them chicks don't look in my direction, and I don't often look in their's.

Bitches talking about Malbec and Merlot, not Maybach and Mercedes.
The Michelle Obama types aren't really looking for Future. They want a clean cut rugged Idris Elba or Jesse Williams.





And they often end up just talking to a Wendell Pierce.

Archie is dropping that real.

Yeah I guess location matters. I take it you're either in D.C, Atlanta or Houston.

I'm in a city where less than 5% of the population is Black and less than 20% of us have Professional jobs so scenarios like i described are more common.

My thing is, a lot of guys like to generalise the entire country based on experiences in their city. Traveler, for instance, has made claims about America based on living in Houston which is the Wild West and a city swarming with Nigerians. One would get a different experience living in a cosmopolitan area. In the pods, we have harped on travel, travel, travel especially for guys who do not live in places like DC or New York and have a rich culture of different people to tap into. I would like to hear a breakdown summary from those who have lived all over the country. From as far as Montana to as South as Keywest. Even in London, peeps used to start to complain about the high standards of London gyal but I started this trend amongst my circle of checking for lizards from out of London like Norwich, Southhampton, Birmingham. It was very rewarding. Remember my market has been black for a long time so the requirements were steeper.

The reality is, a lot of people are scared of the unknown. Even the hardest man will falter when you just mention buying a ticket to some unknown country. People still look at me as an alien cos I just busted out of England. Same ting with Canada. This fear makes one justify mediocrity. You don't need to travel as far as Europe. Sometimes, you need to just try something new. There are a lot of hidden niches to be uncovered. Mingle with some immigrants. Get some fresh eyes.

(04-13-2016 06:51 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  You're making that much of an investment, uprooting your life, because?...

Because the return on your investment is higher.

For example, when average American Joe orders a mail order bride - and doesn't even meet her beforehand - the success rate clocks in at 80% (source: http://www.returnofkings.com/4658/dont-b...ign-brides ). But, when average American Joe marries average American Jane, the success rate is only 50%.

And that's just average American Joe. Imagine what the average RvFer who learns Game and actually meets the girls can do.

(04-13-2016 06:51 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  I'll give you notches.
I'll even give you hotter chicks.
....
Sergei knows that Olga's shit stinks. Red Pill Chad is clueless at best, delusional at worst.

Sergei knows that Olga's shit still stinks because some aspects of the Game are universal, as TravelerKai said, and which you imply by later saying, "women are women everywhere." If "Red Pill Chad" doesn't know that he needs Game everywhere, he's not "red pill."

However, Olga's shit stinks less than Becky's. You even implied that, noting more notches and hotter chicks.

(04-13-2016 06:51 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

(04-13-2016 02:07 PM)262 Wrote:  Return on investment is the wrong metric? Be right back guys, I'm going to implement "Compliment and Cuddle," since the results I get for my effort don't matter. I'm also going to major in feminist dance therapy, since again, the results I get for my effort don't matter.

Oh cause that's clearly what I said.

"Return on investment is the wrong metric" is indeed what you said. I just applied the same logic to Game and to money.

(04-13-2016 06:51 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  Women are women everywhere.

Women are not exactly like women everywhere, just as men aren't. But what your logic implies is that SJW girls are exactly the same as Mormon girls, or that players are exactly the same as simps. There are some commonalities, which is why I stated that Game is needed everywhere, but there are definitely differences.

(04-13-2016 06:51 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  But going to Belarus or Borneo or Bolivia because the chicks are easier, SOLELY because you get some sort of exotic value is wrong headed.

Again, I'll take your logic, and apply it elsewhere:

"But going to City A.B.C. or College S.T.D. or learning Game P.I.M.P. because the chicks are easier, SOLELY because you get some sort of value, is wrong headed."

(04-13-2016 06:51 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  How do you apply Western Style Game in a place that doesn't have the same cultural cues.

You have to invest in learning that culture.

Yes, you have to invest in learning that culture, but it's not as hard as you imply. As TravelerKai said, you take basic Game, then learn the Game for that culture. Plus, I doubt anyone is going to say learning Game for Western chicks is easy, unless they're basically a big-baller troll.

(04-13-2016 06:51 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  If you just run English game in Istanbul, who can you really get at? The Westernized chicks that you're trying to get away from.

These girls may be partially "Westernized," but they're still subject to their local sexual markets. Even within the West, we have anecdotes and evidence that certain places are better than others. For example, you're generally - but not strictly - more likely to find wife material in Utah than in DC.

(04-13-2016 06:51 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  Good convo so far

WIA

Agree.

(04-13-2016 11:32 AM)DimeBait Wrote:  Excelsior mentioned that he often feels disconnected as an outsider to "stereotypical" black culture. I feel you brother, however, I would argue that there is no such thing as a stereotypical mass black culture. Unfortunately, lower socioeconomic blacks get more airtime than the ones who live and work like any other group of Americans. As a result, people, including are own think this is what it's like to be black. Oddly, there are an onslaught of sisters that feel the same way you do, who date white guys because they have difficulty connecting with the same groups you mention. Quite frankly, you need to hit the spots a trap bitch wouldn’t be caught dead in, I.e., campus lectures, book clubs, poetry sets etc.

There are many of us who grew up in suburbs, attended great schools and are 2nd and 3rd generation post-secondary degree holders, who have never set foot in the "hood" and couldn't tell you the first thing about growing up poor. I suspect, as they get older, they'll start to see there are many, many more folks out there with similar backgrounds.

My problem is culture, not class.

I am intimately familiar with the kind of black people you speak of. In fact, my observations and conclusions are based primarily on my interactions with that group, since my contact with "the hood" set and time spent in any area where you're likely to find a "trap bitch" is rather limited.

I didn't meet a lot of blacks before college. My town was about 2% black at most and you could count the number in my graduating class on one hand.
College was where I received my first significant exposure to black American culture. I went into college excited about the fact that, for the first time in my life, I'd be in an environment where there were literally hundreds of others "like me". I thought I'd easily mesh well with other educated blacks and finally fit in somewhere.

I was wrong. I learned this the hard way as I got to college and started exclusively approaching black girls and going to all of the black parties/social events. I felt like an alien at the parties and couldn't connect with the girls. I didn't fit. The way everyone talked, moved, interacted, and the things they said - it was all alien to me. They were coming from a completely different point of view. It was in college that I first started realizing that I was on the outside of black American culture and was most certainly destined to stay there.

My exposure to said culture has only increased in the years since graduation via work and graduate school, and I've only become more certain of the disconnect. This reality tore me up at first (I went into college expecting to leave with a black LTR/future wife), but I've come to accept it now.

Keep in mind that, during all of this time since high school, I have only really been exposed to highly educated, accomplished black American women of the kind you describe. I went to a top undergrad and go to a top school now as well. My work experience has come in white collar environments filled with some of the most educated black people in the country, some of it in internship programs designed specifically for and filled entirely with high-achieving minorities. My time spent socializing among them after hours in the major cities I've worked in took me to locations filled with other black professionals - no trap chicks, just lawyers, accountants, graduate students (studying medicine, law, business, education, etc), doctors, and the like. These are the only black women with whom I've had extensive interaction. All of the black women I've gotten remotely serious with have been those I've met on the campuses of Ivy League schools.

I am not exaggerating when I say I have about as much exposure to the type of black american woman you're talking about as I could possibly have. It is this exposure that has led me to the conclusions I'm making.

The meat of the issue is this: there is a wavelength that black american women are generally on, one that tends to transcend class. It is a cultural understanding, a perspective, a way of being and interacting that is uniquely theirs. It is this intangible (yet, in a sense, strangely tangible) wavelength that makes all the difference. I've seen it and I've felt it.

Black american women tend to strongly favor black men, and they do so because they value the brand of masculinity they offer. This is a brand of masculinity that exudes the cultural understanding, perspective, way of being/interaction I mentioned above. In short, it is a masculinity that is very much in tune with the wavelength. It is something that most of my black peers, highly educated and professional as they were, were in touch with (thanks to their upbringing), at least to a significantly greater extent than myself. This is what allowed them to build rapport and progress to actual relationships with black American women in a way I could not.

I am one of the small minority of blacks raised in America who is simply not on the wavelength. That is the issue. For black men in this position (men who are often labelled "corny" or "too white"), it is essential to branch out. I have gotten better at coping with my distance from this wavelength over time and it probably impacts me less now than it did when I was an undergraduate. That being said, that distance will probably keep the odds of me connecting and building anything with a black American woman low.

That's a reality that bothered me greatly once. I just accept it now.

(04-13-2016 01:44 PM)azulsombra Wrote:  If you are going after attractive AA women you don't have to go the dopeboy route but you better not be "corny" black women are the fastest to call someone corny. So you either have to be/look very athletic or have an insanely good gift of gab and some shit to back it up. Attractive black womens hypergamy has zero tolerance for "corny or normal" guys.

Very accurate assessment.

Frankly, even some of the factors you mentioned (athletic build, gift of gab, etc) won't help if you give off a vibe that is too corny/normal (the black men far from "the wavelength" I mentioned above are the ones who most strongly give off this vibe). This is why so many of the black men who fit this description date outside of the confines of black america.

(04-13-2016 10:56 AM)rhodey Wrote:  Another option could be finding a non stereotypical black women, they are out there.

I've spent the better part of a decade on that wild goose chase here in the states and I'm no longer dedicated to it. TravelerKai did an excellent job outlining the futility here, so I'll not belabor the point.

Needles in haystacks may exist, but the time and effort necessary for me to find them is limited. I just can't be bothered anymore.

(04-13-2016 02:56 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

(04-13-2016 12:27 PM)Moma Wrote:  262- there is no magic bullet. You have to compromise certain things to get the other. Most of the regions listed EE, SEA are nice for lizards because they are poor. Let me modify the location, location rant with this: Region, region, region!

People don't like to admit this is the reason for alot of things.
Despite many people across the globe hating Americans, being an American is a big plus and many of these foreign chicks would sell their mother's for a chance to visit or live in America.
Being a black American is even a bigger draw, you are the epitome of cool. Due to my accent, most people assumed I was American in my travels. Needing "game" in EE involves showing up in clean clothes and smelling nice. Christ, I wore dirty converse shoes in a night club in Croatia and got IOI's from hot chicks.

Racism exists in every country, do not be fooled and think it does not just because you did not experience it.

Where we fall short as black men, is getting our money right. Everyone understand the power of money, they can hate me all they want but they will respect me.

One of the biggest shortcomings I see in discussions regarding game is the failure to recognize just how big of a role money can play. Your wealth is the most powerful weapon in your arsenal. The older I've gotten and the more I've seen of the real world, the closer I've come to the "Money>Game" perspective. I'm not quite there (game is very important), but money is an incredible tool that one must leverage at every opportunity. Success in this regard (either via accumulating a lot of wealth here or leveraging your western income/status in a place that is much less affluent) can alleviate a lot of the problems we complain about here in the states.

Excelsior, money plays a major role which is why a lot of the travel discussions involve developing countries when it comes to getting sex and multiple relationships. It's no coincidence that the rampant tales of debauchery dwindle when the individuals hit up developed countries. I'm not saying game doesn't matter at this point but what makes us think we will land in some country and have stronger game than the locals? The American factor/Western factor is very very strong. Do not underestimate the power of that citzenship. Jamaica is no exception to the foreign lure either. Been there before and 'drawing gyal' was as easy as ordering another shot of Jancrow batty.

I very much agree that American black women, even highly educated and upper class, are looking for a certain kind of black guy and if you don't fit that mold you'll have a tough time. Not to mention that a lot of American black women who are looking for an ambitious black guy are frustrated that they can't find one and give up trying to find one and date non black guys further reduces the pool.

Despite being black American and my family living here for generations, I never felt that connected with American black culture. When growing up I was shy, quiet, spoke "proper" English, tried to do well in school, dressed conservatively and didn't mind have white friends. That was enough to make be separate from American blacks culturally despite my far left, pro black political beliefs at the time and love of rap music. I suppose my disconnect from American black culture was so apparent that a few times in my life people said I looked liked the kind of black guy that would have a white girlfriend.

To be honest, I wanted a black girlfriend but I couldn't relate to a lot of them. The really attractive ones have never been interested in me and the only ones that seemed to express any interest were average, nerdy ones that I had no attraction to. I remember women in my family saying that there were all kinds of black women out there and there's no need to date non black women. That may be true but the vast majority want a particular kind of black guy. Further, one you subtract the ones that are taken, act ghetto, looking for a thuggish black guy, are "strong"/non traditional/"don't need a man", have attitude problems, are angry, are obese, and have kids, the options aren't that great.

A lot of these problems diminish the older you get since you have money, can travel to different places, and don't have to associate with the black community at all if you don't want to. But it sucks when you're young.

It's important to mention when dealing with American Black women, that they are very impressionable when it comes to this current western culture. They are among the biggest consumers in any given group study that you read. They also take a lot of their cues from their peers, often leading to a lot of misguided thinking. I've had to verbally reprimand more than one of my ex's about seeking relationship advice/counsel from a person who is as ill qualified as herself.

The issue many of us have encountered (or will) is that the weight with which many women place on each other's word versus that of their partners.

WIA made an excellent point some time ago about adjusting a women's thinking, changing her perspective on things and the reprogramming that often needs to take place in order for her to be a suitable LTR candidate.

Of course this isn't limited to the sisters, but for the purpose of our discussion it is an important consideration. In the end, most of us don't want to have to assemble our ideal mate from damn near scratch. They don't come with typed instructions like that IKEA furniture.

We want the floor model.

Excelsior - that was the point I was making earlier.

I didn't want the thread turning into a money vs game discussion.

262 - Are you the asian dude who re-located to Poland?

(04-13-2016 09:35 PM)Moma Wrote:  My thing is, a lot of guys like to generalise the entire country based on experiences in their city.

Exactly. Furthermore, many people generalize cultures and specifically black women based on their limited experiences as well. There's a saying that goes "Inside every cynic is a disappointed idealist," which rings true when things aren't going our way.

Listen, I can tell you till you're blue in the face that the world is not flat, but until you get a chance to experience it on your own, my words mean nothing. I can wholeheartedly relate to some of the frustrations our young brothers are voicing. I too, attended a small predominately white high school and had limited access to diverse genres of black women. I too, dated everything else to fill the void. Admittedly, once I ventured out, I was intimidated by the black women I encountered.
It wasn't until my nuts fully descended and I realized my self-worth that I truly possessed the seemingly higher level of confidence needed to approach and pull the quality of black women that have been mentioned in this thread. In my opinion, a woman, especially a black woman has defense mechanisms setup to weed out weak men. These defense mechanisms come off as bitchyness, attitudes, or superiority, but once you become self-aware you can see right through them.

(04-14-2016 09:00 AM)therealpoder Wrote:  The really attractive ones have never been interested in me and the only ones that seemed to express any interest were average, nerdy ones that I had no attraction to

Don’t let rejection from black women who get hit on 34 times a day with the same BS game shape your perception of black women overall. We all get rejected by those, until we learn to come correct, and that is where wisdom, confidence and knowledge of game comes into play. Everybody on this board has banged 4-5’s before working their way up to dimes. My unsolicited advice is to get to know many different women and learn the many different nuances between them first. Once you hit, flatly ask what was it about me that attracted you (I forget the terminology for this). One of the very first dimes I banged (who was truly out of my league at the time) told me she was attracted to me because I ignored her. Simply put, you’d be amazed at how women’s phycology works.

(04-14-2016 09:11 AM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  WIA made an excellent point some time ago about adjusting a women's thinking, changing her perspective on things and the reprogramming that often needs to take place in order for her to be a suitable LTR candidate.

Of course this isn't limited to the sisters, but for the purpose of our discussion it is an important consideration. In the end, most of us don't want to have to assemble our ideal mate from damn near scratch. They don't come with typed instructions like that IKEA furniture.

We want the floor model.

Deep down inside, in my experience, most of these “maculated women” just need to be told to sit the fuck down and shut the fuck up the right way at the right time. I cannot tell you how many times I’ve had bark at a yapping ass chiwawa to restore social order. I was not born with this bark and subsequent bite, but I did learn it through years of social game.
One of the reasons I love this particular thread so much is because “black game” is so much more different from white boy game. Magic tricks and cube routines will get your ass pounced on by many black women. Knowing how to exclude yourself from the countless other black cats with baseball caps and air force 1’s will make all the difference in the world.

I'd say that white game at its best focuses on self.51/49

Black game focuses on how the chick thinks. 49/51

Black game let's you drive a chicks car to pick up your side piece.

White game let's you convince people to invest in your Uber for tacos start up or that Iraq has nuclear weapons.

WIA

(04-13-2016 02:56 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

(04-13-2016 12:27 PM)Moma Wrote:  262- there is no magic bullet. You have to compromise certain things to get the other. Most of the regions listed EE, SEA are nice for lizards because they are poor. Let me modify the location, location rant with this: Region, region, region!

People don't like to admit this is the reason for alot of things.
Despite many people across the globe hating Americans, being an American is a big plus and many of these foreign chicks would sell their mother's for a chance to visit or live in America.
Being a black American is even a bigger draw, you are the epitome of cool. Due to my accent, most people assumed I was American in my travels. Needing "game" in EE involves showing up in clean clothes and smelling nice. Christ, I wore dirty converse shoes in a night club in Croatia and got IOI's from hot chicks.

[/quote]

(04-14-2016 07:43 AM)Moma Wrote:  Excelsior, money plays a major role which is why a lot of the travel discussions involve developing countries when it comes to getting sex and multiple relationships. It's no coincidence that the rampant tales of debauchery dwindle when the individuals hit up developed countries. I'm not saying game doesn't matter at this point but what makes us think we will land in some country and have stronger game than the locals? The American factor/Western factor is very very strong. Do not underestimate the power of that citzenship. Jamaica is no exception to the foreign lure either. Been there before and 'drawing gyal' was as easy as ordering another shot of Jancrow batty.

I feel the bolded is true, but overstated.

Of course there are poor women around the world that would love to come to America or any developed country. Yet, I think this becomes more of a factor when you are living in a foreign country long term compared to just visiting.

While visiting a developing country for a few weeks this has never been my experience but I almost never hit up the favelas/barrios/or whatever equivalent in country looking for poor chicks, in much the same way as I avoid hood chicks in the West. Just because I'm in a country that is "third world, developing or poor" that doesn't mean the female I am hollering at is going to be in dire straits. Its also kind of arrogant to assume every non-poor, non-western woman is dying to come to the West, many already enjoy a quality of life that would be hard to duplicate in the West and they wouldn't really want to leave their family and friends anyway.

Although I am from a "rich" country I personally come from a humble economic background, yet I've banged chicks in "poor" Latin American countries who were raised in a life of leisure compared to me. I'm talking about girls with multiple passports that traveled to Europe and the US before they were sixteen and drove me around in their cars when I visited their cities at a time when I didn't even own a car! If these girls were attempting to use me to extract resources, citizenship, etc, then they were playing the game ass-backwards.

As for tales of debauchery that happen in poor countries but dwindle elsewhere, huh?

My biggest tales of debauchery took place in Las Vegas! My experiences in poor countries like Colombia, Romania and Cambodia were much more tame by comparison. Actually in those countries the women that were going out their way to sleep with me were not the poor locals trying to come to America, they were relatively uninterested. Instead, it was the British tourists who were down to get slayed! And no, I never stayed in a single resort.

I would even wager that the average American brotha with a modicum of game would pull more AND higher quality AND more debauchery given a week in London or Copenhagen vs a week in Ho Chi Minh city or Tirana. So many factors go into why you have to work harder in some environments and yet breeze through others and go far beyond just having a blue passport so dem third world chicks should come running. Culture is probably number one.

^ We are not saying ALL girls are seeking a passport to the West.

Yes, "some" do have a nice life in their home countries. The reality is I have seen droves of EE girls leaving their countries for work in the UK, the only thing keeping them in the UK was the money and lack of opportunities in their own countries.
I did manage to date many of these girls with relative ease, no game needed. I have no delusions that what made me attractive to them was I was from Canada/America and could return home at any time. A friend of mine even married one of these girls, upon receiving her UK passport she asked my friend what about getting a Canadian passport. This from a girl who has never been to Canada or crossed the Atlantic.

I did date one EE girl and was considering her to be Mrs Rudebwoy. I bought her to my home in Canada and she was overwhelmed by my nice surburbia lifestyle. I did not pull the trigger and this same girl is now living in America, which is funny because she was anti-american.

You like many are from the "richest" country in the world. I have met taxi drivers in NYC working 20hr days and living in a shoebox, but yet they are happy to be living the american dream.

As I have mentioned countless times, I have used the "i'm from NYC" line many times in my travels, girls eyes will light up when I say this.

I talk to many guys from this forum offline, one dude in particular was complaining about getting flaked on by average looking single mom's when he was back home in America. Compare that to the talent he is dating in Europe, would be like comparing a used Pontiac Fiero to a brand new Ferrari FF.

I would gladly take your wager about an average American brotha with a modicum of game pulling more tail in London vs Ho Chi Minh city. Copenhagen is a great place for the brothas, so I left it off the list. Again I talk about Europe, Latin America I have no experience but somehow I find it hard to believe that would be any different.

(04-13-2016 12:40 PM)SuS Wrote:  They are out there...and most of them are dating white and other non-black men from the get-go.

I might agree if you were talking about the white washed sisters. But from my experiences there's a healthy portion of non stereotypical sistas that are not necessarily white washed. Especially in places like NYC.

(04-14-2016 12:39 PM)DimeBait Wrote:  Listen, I can tell you till you're blue in the face that the world is not flat, but until you get a chance to experience it on your own, my words mean nothing. I can wholeheartedly relate to some of the frustrations our young brothers are voicing. I too, attended a small predominately white high school and had limited access to diverse genres of black women. I too, dated everything else to fill the void. Admittedly, once I ventured out, I was intimidated by the black women I encountered.
It wasn't until my nuts fully descended and I realized my self-worth that I truly possessed the seemingly higher level of confidence needed to approach and pull the quality of black women that have been mentioned in this thread. In my opinion, a woman, especially a black woman has defense mechanisms setup to weed out weak men. These defense mechanisms come off as bitchyness, attitudes, or superiority, but once you become self-aware you can see right through them.

I can definitely cosign this, many don't make it to this point due to frustration...quality fine Sistas will put you through the ringer to make sure you are what they hope you are. And I that doesnt necessarily include being:

a professionalize athlete
a dope boy swagged out to the gills
or a thugged out rapper wanabee

Just a brother with some confidence , some style, conviction, and social skills. Ofcourse age does play a part...and the re is a distinct lack of role models for what I call "Renaissance" type of brotha. A couple fo you ...Jariel, West Indian Archie , and others here seem to fit that mode. But you never really see these types in the media.


It's up to the individual to decide whether they are worth it. IMO a lot of this is just brothas confusing cute hoodrats with true quality.

(04-14-2016 12:47 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  I'd say that white game at its best focuses on self.51/49

Black game focuses on how the chick thinks. 49/51

Black game let's you drive a chicks car to pick up your side piece.

White game let's you convince people to invest in your Uber for tacos start up or that Iraq has nuclear weapons.

WIA

Could you expand on this?

As a white guy, what can I learn from "black guy game?"

I only read this thread sporadically but the takeaways seem to be:

-Don't go out, post up on the wall with ten guys, and mean mug
-Don't let girls walk all over you (what would Patrice O'Neal do)
-Play up exotic factor
-Find your own style, don't follow trends (fashion and game)

(04-13-2016 09:01 PM)Anabasis to Desta Wrote:  One little spark and this thread goes into Wild fire mode. Love it!

Couple random things I'd like to add. Whether in Europe or the US ...

1) If you're black and keen on getting laid on a night out ... avoid going out with a bunch of other brothers. The more black guys in a group, the less likely any of you will get laid. A group of 5 or 6 black dudes entering a club without women looks like a gang. That's just how it is. Even more so outside after last call when you're scanning for some last minute pussy. I see it so many times it's painful to watch. Girls are noticeably intimidated.

Best bet would be going out with one other black guy, two max. A white guy would be ideal in the west however. Disarms girls like crazy ... voodoo level.

2) If you do insist on going out with a bunch of brothers however ... try having fun with each other.

When white guys go out in big groups they'll be buying shots at the bar, talking to each other, high-fiving each other , singing etc ... You rarely see black men doing the same. Most black men at clubs swag it out on a wall around the dance floor area with a mean gangsta' attitude occasionally singing along and dancing to "Trap Queen" or whatever. Many look at every passing girl with a hungry hyena gaze.

I'm sure most of you guys are not like that but still.

3) Coverdoc that was an awesome post.

I do co-sign this 100%, that strategy has disarmed alot of lizards in Toronto. I roll with a white dude, a latin dude and myself.
Countless times girls would come straight out and ask how we knew each other. The latino dude would say we are pilots, sell the dream. lol

Rolling deep with many black guys doesn't work where I live, unless I am going to some black jam.

(04-14-2016 09:19 AM)rudebwoy Wrote:  262 - Are you the asian dude who re-located to Poland?

(04-14-2016 02:55 PM)redbeard Wrote:  Could you expand on this?

As a white guy, what can I learn from "black guy game?"

I only read this thread sporadically but the takeaways seem to be:

-Don't go out, post up on the wall with ten guys, and mean mug
-Don't let girls walk all over you (what would Patrice O'Neal do)
-Play up exotic factor
-Find your own style, don't follow trends (fashion and game)

A white guy needs not worry about mean mugging. Toning down the mean mug look is usually for black guys who pierce mixed crowds which was 90 something percent of the guys on this forum are about. For those black guys hitting up black events, smiling too much pegs one as a sucker. I have a tendency to look mean when I'm not smiling or when I'm thinking about the demographics when out.

I think a white guy game and black guy game principles are the same from a fundamental level, the necessary tweaks only have to be implemented due to cultural (race) perception.

(04-14-2016 02:55 PM)redbeard Wrote:  

(04-14-2016 12:47 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  I'd say that white game at its best focuses on self.51/49

Black game focuses on how the chick thinks. 49/51

Black game let's you drive a chicks car to pick up your side piece.

White game let's you convince people to invest in your Uber for tacos start up or that Iraq has nuclear weapons.

WIA

Could you expand on this?

As a white guy, what can I learn from "black guy game?"

I only read this thread sporadically but the takeaways seem to be:

-Don't go out, post up on the wall with ten guys, and mean mug
-Don't let girls walk all over you (what would Patrice O'Neal do)
-Play up exotic factor
-Find your own style, don't follow trends (fashion and game)

We've touched on this before, but traditional Black American game is a low-grade version of what pimp's do.

So the basics
- John's want sex, so they pay prostitutes
- Prostitutes want love from a man that they think is alpha - the pimp, so they bring him money
- The Pimp doesn't care about sex, or love, he only cares about money. He gives the girl his game, in exchange for the money she earned from the john.

There are plenty of books and youtube books on this.

The Pimp's game is splendiforous.
- he attracts the eye with peacocking
- he notices chicks coming into his proximity, and takes that as interest.
- he's funny, he's charming, he says things that stick in her brain (it's why they're fond of rhyming), he makes cold reads about who she is
- The looks and the jokes, get her attention. But it's his understanding of who she is (or the story he tells her that she falls into) - that's what gets the hook in.
- and little by little she falls in love.

A girl that is in love with you, will do anything for you. Anything.
I'll let you google how a pimp then takes a chick that's in love with him, and puts her on the street.

The Player/the Mack - he's in love with the pussy. He doesn't want to give women money for it, like the John. He doesn't want to put her in the streets, he doesn't want money that badly.

She gives him pussy because he gives her game.

This is different than the relationships she has with squares.

When she meets a regular guy, she uses her brain and makes him wait for sex - because she's going to extract money, time, effort, and commitment from him. And she knows if that if she appears like she can be unfaithful, he won't do that.

I'm not saying she won't cheat, or she will cheat - but chicks who aren't necessarily pro's, will (used to?) keep their whorish tendencies to a minimum. (not any longer)

When she's with a true player, he gives her structure, life advice, encouragement, admonishment. He seems to care, and he doesn't care.

She thinks that he sees her in a special way, or has some special insight.

Her boyfriend/husband will try to tell her what to do, but she doesn't see him in the same light as she sees the player.

So the black guy who's a player is finding and filling this weird emotional hole that most women have.

Everyone wants to be understood, and the pimp has a window into her soul - so she thinks.

One of my favorite ones from that style of game, is

- set up - polite chit chat, and a few laughs
- slow down the tempo

- "you look like you're carrying something"

And since a lot of chicks believe in body/mind connections, that's often how they see the world - they think that whatever is bothering them is showing up on the surface.

Not all of them, but enough of them.

A chick hears that, and sometimes the dam breaks.

So in the space of 5 minutes, she went from indifference, to amusement, to telling a some perceptive stranger her life's anguish.

In PUA terms
- attraction material
- banter
- gear shift
- deep comfort
- overall emotional rollercoaster

Naturals, Jocks, Alphas, Famous Guys, Pretty Boys, guys that she finds hot and chooses to fuck - they don't do this to her.

She basically stays in the typical head space that she always does when she deals with those guys.

PUA's - do this in their version, but arguably there are built in fail safes - because the typical 'white boy' game guy is not thinking on this level.

If people found out that a famous game guy lived off his GF, they'd be appalled.

When I'm at the barbershop and cats brag about having this GF by him some J', this one give him money for a hair cut, driving this other one's car - they're giving each other high fives.

White Boy game is about development of self, and at the highest levels - you believe in yourself so much - that the country will rally around the flag and bomb the shit out of some place they can't pronounce.

So arguably the guys in the community aren't doing what black player's are doing, because they aren't really trying to get into a girl's head. They just want to get into a girl's pants.

Black players get into the head first, the pussy and everything else comes later.

Having said all this, it's not like women are defenseless.
Far from it.

PUA's say that they just backwards engineered what guys good with women do.

Players backwards engineer what women do to men.

- The peacocking
- Life lessons from casual incidents - that only make sense in the time, but not objectively
- Not taking chicks seriously
- Changing the subject when things get hot
- going hot and cold
- focusing on body language, positioning over verbal content

If you extrapolate, you'll see how classic PUA strategy can put you in the White House. Black players are more likely to end up with harems.

The john is a slave to pussy
The prostitute is a slave to game
The pimp is a slave to money

Once you get exposed to the basic transactional nature of these relationships, and understanding how much a woman values the sort of emotional things that a man can bring to her life - then you start to understand everything else.

If I was a white guy wanting to learn low grade pimp game - I'd focus less on logistics, one liners, custom suits, and more talking a to chick and getting her to invest in you. Not just compliance with your wishes, but her actively doing shit for you in the moment.

Over the years, different white guys in the game have touched on this - but black dude game puts this at the forefront. Since I studied a lot of both schools, I tend to see how they are different.

Black guys that know black guy game don't fuck with white guy game at all. They see a lot of that shit as corny. White guys are not really aware of black guy game, and think that prostitutes are less than human and were probably drug users or molestation victims. Never crosses their mind that a pimp can turn a square chick into a pro, or that some pro's just want to bring money home to their man.

But Black guys who know the basics of black game and then learn white boy game, will see lots of parallels, and connect the dots on how they operate.

Even in that case, no black guy is going to walk up to a mixed set and try to get the one cute girl to come with him. Middle class white kid with a professional job might show up in a set, things get heated and then calm down. At worst a fist fight breaks out (promptly broken up by bouncers).

A misunderstanding in black clubs, someone is gonna go the parking lot, pop the trunk, come back and shoot the club up.

However, learning how to game guys/win their trust/defuse situations - that's essentially what (white) society is built on.

Obama, Vernon Jordan, Stan O'Neal - countless other black guys have figured out how white guys operate. You still have to sneak into the card game, but once you're there and show that you can play - they pony up the funds (and grumble about security later)

I've said too much.

WIA

These posts too heavy!

Let's get back to the fun!

I been on my DuoLingo for the past 2 months, prepping for this trip to Latin America.

Still haven't bought the ticket - but here is what I'm thinking

1) 3 weeks in 3 cities in Colombia
2) 3/3 in Mexico
3) DR, Mexico City, Bogota

I'm outgoing enough in ingles, but Espanol? Ay Caramba.

WIA