Post: #26

(04-23-2017 05:04 AM)Speculation Wrote:  The problem with .50 cal is being able to quickly mount an M2 to face the approach vector. Cargo ships are big and theres no guarantee that any particular emplacement would have an effective field of fire on the approaching boats.

Still, if you had one in place you could walk the shots in like SlickyBoy said, and the rounds are big enough to tear through light vehicles (like the attacking boats).

I agree...

On top of that these guys likely aren't a full-time security solution for this specific boat. They probably board just before the ship passes through the pirate-infested area and then get off once it's done and get on another ship to make the route back.

Considering the rules of engagement they appear to be under where they aren't allowed to engage until the last second, the M4 seems like a fine choice. On top of that if enough pirates were able to board and the ship turned into a close-quarters combat environment they want something that isn't going to destroy the ship they're on and be suitable for CQB.

Claiming these guys should be dragging .50's on and off the different ships they go to or bringing heavier weapons is clearly overkill for pretty much the entirety of the threats they are expected to face.

The gear they're using is fine.

Post: #27

Once word gets around that there is a chance that you will be met with withering fire at close range in an open top boat.... there will be a lot less piracy.

Great deterrent, and a good job those guys are doing.

Post: #28

(04-22-2017 09:56 PM)Atlanta Man Wrote:  Notice that the private security were only using iron sights, no ACOG or EOTEC, just straight irons shooting 100 plus yards- hardcore way to go, I just have irons in case my EOTECH batteries die but I never use them, I am going to practice with straight irons for awhile.

I run a set of 45 degree offset sights and a LPVO (Vortex Strike Eagle, to be exact) on my rifle. Best of both worlds.

Post: #29

(04-23-2017 05:24 AM)achromaticmike Wrote:  Claiming these guys should be dragging .50's on and off the different ships they go to or bringing heavier weapons is clearly overkill for pretty much the entirety of the threats they are expected to face.

The gear they're using is fine.

So it begs the question; why did it take the worlds largest shipping companies this long to outfit their ships with this basic level of protection? Also, is it fair to assume the bad guys will up their game and bring bigger guns? I am guessing international law and the risk involved in engagement prevented them doing anything lethal in the past.

Post: #30

I wonder how a security team such as this would handle pirates armed with an RPG. If I were going to try to hijack a boat, I would have one speedboat sit off in the distance with heavy weapons such as RPGs, ready to fire if the crew resists the boarding party. So either let us take over your boat, or our friends sink all of you.

Post: #31

RPG wont sink a cargo ship, even if you scored a million dollar shot right at the water line.

I went kneejerk to "take a bigger caliber" but then I thought "why not go the other way".

Use a long barreled 22lr with an insanely large magazine and walk spitballs all over them.





Even at stupid ranges a 22lr will still punch through a dingy, and if you put an otherwise absurdly long barrel on it then you'd be able to pepper them from a long way out.

At least one such gun would make a barrage of "warning shots" turn into a perpetual shitstorm as they got closer.

Besides, a 22lr machine gun with an otherwise impracticably long barrel is not going to make the port's authorities shit themselves as much as a SAW or some other belt fed death-hose.

Post: #32

(04-23-2017 02:55 AM)porscheguy Wrote:  

Quote:wanton destruction of ports is just barbaric...

Not if you kill every person in those ports. Old Russian saying: no person, no problem. Kill every fucking one in the port and on the high seas, burn the port to the ground, and I assure you it will be quite a while before the problem resurfaces.

Well if thoroughness is the goal...

Post: #33

(04-23-2017 08:40 PM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  RPG wont sink a cargo ship, even if you scored a million dollar shot right at the water line.

I went kneejerk to "take a bigger caliber" but then I thought "why not go the other way".

Use a long barreled 22lr with an insanely large magazine and walk spitballs all over them.





Even at stupid ranges a 22lr will still punch through a dingy, and if you put an otherwise absurdly long barrel on it then you'd be able to pepper them from a long way out.

At least one such gun would make a barrage of "warning shots" turn into a perpetual shitstorm as they got closer.

Besides, a 22lr machine gun with an otherwise impracticably long barrel is not going to make the port's authorities shit themselves as much as a SAW or some other belt fed death-hose.

Agreed. Theyre miles out in open ocean. The second they get shot at with anything they've got whole list of worries in addition to getting shot. Holes in the boat, engine, or gas tank will take longer but out there,... could be just as fatal as a hole in the head.

Post: #34

I don't understand why these pirates would only use once vessel to approach/board?

If I was in the pirate game, I'd have two dinghys approach at first to draw attention/fire, with another to arrive a minute or so later from another direction - objective being to to get guys on board whilst the ship is distracted by the other two.

What they employed was 2/10 pirate game.

Post: #35

(04-23-2017 04:55 AM)Chris Brown Wrote:  Still waiting for Pirates of Somalia, the movie.

Here you go.

Post: #36

(04-23-2017 08:29 PM)Repo Wrote:  I wonder how a security team such as this would handle pirates armed with an RPG. If I were going to try to hijack a boat, I would have one speedboat sit off in the distance with heavy weapons such as RPGs, ready to fire if the crew resists the boarding party. So either let us take over your boat, or our friends sink all of you.

RPG's have a relatively short range so by the time they are in position they'd be within rifle range. Also they'd have to hit below the waterline to get the ship to take on water, which wouldn't happen because most container ships have double hulls, if the rocket doesn't just explode when it hits the water. Furthermore, RPG's are designed with a shaped charge to punch a small hole (probably less than 10") in armor plate. You're not going to sink a 500-1000 foot freighter with a 10" hole.

Post: #37

(04-23-2017 08:51 PM)Windom Earle Wrote:  I don't understand why these pirates would only use once vessel to approach/board?

If I was in the pirate game, I'd have two dinghys approach at first to draw attention/fire, with another to arrive a minute or so later from another direction - objective being to to get guys on board whilst the ship is distracted by the other two.

What they employed was 2/10 pirate game.

The average Somali IQ is 68. These guys aren't Sun Tzu.

Post: #38

(04-23-2017 08:51 PM)Windom Earle Wrote:  I don't understand why these pirates would only use once vessel to approach/board?

If I was in the pirate game, I'd have two dinghys approach at first to draw attention/fire, with another to arrive a minute or so later from another direction - objective being to to get guys on board whilst the ship is distracted by the other two.

What they employed was 2/10 pirate game.

Not necessarily bad game, just tactic-selection.

It's like "LJBF" game vs. "Direct Game."

You're a Somalian pirate and approach with one dinghy, maybe these idiot white guys will think: "ah, it's just some nice black people in a dinghy... maybe they can get close, we let them on board, and we can get some good selfies for Corporate's Year-End Report and we'll get a nice bonus." Meanwhile, you take advantage of their White Guilt and/or naivete and board their ship.

You approach with five dinghies, and you'll definitely trip their ASD's: "Oh wow, we're not that kind of ship, we never do this... this is a dangerous situation..." and they immediately organize and start spraying bullets in all vectors from the ship. They're smarter despite their simultaneous idiocy, they're better-trained, they're better-equipped. Everyone from your squad, dead.

Post: #39

Would an RPG not be effective even if the boat was an oil tanker?

Post: #40

The razor wire seems like a bad move to me. Anything that keeps people off the boat, can also keep you on the boat.

Your last available option might be to jump, but then you get all tangled and hang, or land in salt water covered with thousands of tiny cuts on your body.

Aloha!

Post: #41

If you wanted a quasi political solution you just tell the country the pirates are operating from that they'll be charged for all losses due to pirates operating from their territorial waters, and that if they don't cough up the cash their ports will be blockaded and they'll be blacklisted from international trade.

They would handle their own pirate problem pretty damn quickly after that.

Post: #42

(04-23-2017 09:11 PM)J. Spice Wrote:  The average Somali IQ is 68. These guys aren't Sun Tzu.

The IQ range for morons is 51-70. Are you saying that the average Somalian is a moron? How dare you! That's not a politically correct thing to say.

Post: #43

(04-23-2017 09:30 PM)Brodiaga Wrote:  

(04-23-2017 09:11 PM)J. Spice Wrote:  The average Somali IQ is 68. These guys aren't Sun Tzu.

The IQ range for morons is 51-70. Are you saying that the average Somalian is a moron? How dare you! That's not a politically correct thing to say.

What are you Klan members trying to imply?

Africa has the greatest genetic diversity and we're all Africans--I read so in Time for Kids when I was 10.

Thus, Sun Tzu was obviously African too. QED.

Come at me, racists.

Post: #44

Seems like the Russian navy has a good solution to this issue.





normalno blin)

Post: #45

(04-23-2017 09:09 PM)J. Spice Wrote:  

(04-23-2017 08:29 PM)Repo Wrote:  I wonder how a security team such as this would handle pirates armed with an RPG. If I were going to try to hijack a boat, I would have one speedboat sit off in the distance with heavy weapons such as RPGs, ready to fire if the crew resists the boarding party. So either let us take over your boat, or our friends sink all of you.

RPG's have a relatively short range so by the time they are in position they'd be within rifle range. Also they'd have to hit below the waterline to get the ship to take on water, which wouldn't happen because most container ships have double hulls, if the rocket doesn't just explode when it hits the water. Furthermore, RPG's are designed with a shaped charge to punch a small hole (probably less than 10") in armor plate. You're not going to sink a 500-1000 foot freighter with a 10" hole.

You could set the RPG to airburst and use a HE instead of a HEAT round which is what you're talking about.

Edit: Just realize you guys were talking about from the pirates perspective. In that case it would make no sense, they're not trying to sink the ship?

Post: #46

This is about protecting the ship, the crew, and the cargo with minimal force necessary. They did their jobs and repelled the attackers. It's not the job of the security force to shoot people in the face or take them prisoner unless they come on board. These are rules in place by the shipping company and their insurance carrier.

These guys did what they were supposed to.

And anyone that needs a scope at 100 yards should stay at home and play with his vagina and house full of cats.

Post: #47

It's not that hard to move an M2HB to a pintle mount. Receiver + barrel is only like 85 pounds. I've done it many times alone. With two guys it's no big deal at all.

The ammunition is what's heavy as fuck. 35 pounds per 100 round can. So leave 500 rounds at each permanent mount firing point and move the gun where you need it, depending on where they're coming from. Mark the barrel with the number of clicks back for correct headspace and timing, or just leave the barrel installed. You could easily have the gun in action in less than 2 minutes if you didn't have to haul it all the way from one end of the ship to the other.

I'd probably want at least one M2HB and one M240. Then carbines for supporting fire, or in case the pirates got so close the machineguns couldn't depress and hit them.

Some claymores strapped to the side of the boat aiming down at a 45 degree angle wouldn't hurt either, but I doubt the shipping company would go for that.

Post: #48

After watching the video again I don't think they were pirates at all. I think they saw the ship and were coming to offer some of their goods for sale








Got their shit shot up...

Post: #49

(04-23-2017 08:51 PM)Windom Earle Wrote:  I don't understand why these pirates would only use once vessel to approach/board?

If I was in the pirate game, I'd have two dinghys approach at first to draw attention/fire, with another to arrive a minute or so later from another direction - objective being to to get guys on board whilst the ship is distracted by the other two.

What they employed was 2/10 pirate game.

I think they should at least go for something with style.

Four or five smaller dinghies with parasailers in tow would have a certain shock and awe effect. It would also give them a raised firing platform, and once they were close enough they could detach from the towlines and glide onto the deck like winged condors of economic justice!

Post: #50

Is kind of funny and ironic how life tends to repeat itself, we are fighting pirates oversea just like we did hundreds of years ago just with better weapons.

On a related note, I can't remember well, but one of the founders fathers in USA made a letter to authorizing the use of cannons in cargo ships due to pirates attacks, before that only military ships were allowed to use cannons.