(05-26-2014 01:56 AM)Flint Wrote: I like Freud as a cultural critic but psychoanalysis ispseudo-science at besta rock solid predictor of behaviour and most of his theories have beendisprovenattacked and ridiculed by feminists to thorougly discredit him because they arelargely unfalsifiablehugely-applicable to the type of neurotic, low-resilent upper-class woman who attend universities, and they're incapable of the intelligence required to truly understand his work, and of accepting the uncomfortable truths he speaks of, so run the hamsters with their own idiotic theories to reduce cognitive-dissonance. Meanwhile, these same critics, firmly-entrenched in their mundane +1 SD thinking start theorising about unfalsifiable crap like 'innate privilege' and 'the social construction of gender' and the herd moos uncritical approval because of feels. In the meantime, the majority of girls I've fucked call me 'Daddy' during the act of their own accord, and my current girlfriend gets soaking wet whenever I growl that she's 'my baby girl' in her ear.

(05-25-2014 08:49 PM)TheFinalEpic Wrote:(05-25-2014 08:47 PM)draguer Wrote: It's provoking an outpouring of White Knights on Twitter.
The poor kid has no chance
Is there any happy medium with people anymore? Absolutely pathetic that this guy can hold his SON while supporting that. Good luck having grandchildren.
(05-26-2014 01:56 AM)Flint Wrote:(05-26-2014 01:36 AM)2Wycked Wrote: This is why I fucking hate sociology. Sociologists start with the whole of society and then draw conclusions from there. As such, they draw up ludicrous theories of why society is the way it is (misogyny).
Psychology is a much better way to explain society, as you start with individuals and see patterns of behavior recurrent in society. The Freudian analysis would be that common psychological issues in a given society would tell you about the psychological posture of the society.
If men think that masculinity is nothing but a performance every day and anxiety undergirds this, then the issue is narcissism, not "problematic masculinity."
I think you misunderstand a lot of what modern sociology actually does. It is actually necessary to look at the big picture with a quantitative analysis and long-term studies in order to understand social trends and changing attitudes.Also, it is becoming more and more common in sociology to include findings from evolutionary psychology, neurobiology and other sciences into the studies.
That you cite Freudian analysis to explain is society must be a bad joke. I like Freud as a cultural critic but psychoanalysis is pseudo-science at best and most of his theories have been disproven because they are largely unfalsifiable.
(05-26-2014 01:16 AM)placer Wrote:(05-26-2014 12:56 AM)Wadsworth Wrote: prospect . org/article/how-pick-artist-philosophy-and-its-more-misogynist-backlash-shaped-mind-alleged-killer
I refuse to hot link to these kinds of ultra-left-wing sites. From that article:
Idiotic article at Prospect Wrote:pick-up artistry argues that men who can鈥檛 get laid are fine the way they are, and it鈥檚 women鈥攖he entire lot of them鈥攚ho are broken
No, that's what the now-down website PUAhate, which devoted countless posts attacking all of the regulars here, said. We've been telling men that want to get laid that they have to change and improve themselves to get there.
It was around there that I stopped reading Amanda Marcotte's nonsense. Speaking of Amanda Marcotte:
4/10. Old hag, ugly tattoo. Psycho look to her face. Would not bang.
(Image source: Wikipedia)
The issue here is that the left keeps propping up straw men about the pick up community because they don't want to accept our fundamental message about self-improvement. There's a lot of people on the Internet who post a lot of rationalization bullshit about why they can not or will not improve.
(05-26-2014 02:11 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote: This white knight is actually right, though not in the way that he thinks he is. Let me explain:
Quote:
I have suffered a great deal because of not being able to achieve any contact with women for years. No sex, no relationship, no kiss, not even a single touch. All of this, naturally, made me extremely anxious. I was anxious because of my loneliness, and I was anxious because of feeling inadequate as a man, yet not having a clue what I was doing wrong.
Here is where he is wrong, though. The source of that anxiety wasn't patriarchy, misogyny or some other fictional construct. It was women and feminism. With natural constraints removed from them, women suddenly wanted far more dominance from me as a man than what I was capable of providing at that moment, let alone than what I had ever been taught to provide. I was taught to be a gentleman who brings flowers and chocolates to first dates and his main concern is if he is boring someone. Women wanted a bad boy on a motorbike who could throw them around and give them drama and tingles.
Yes, that made me anxious. Even though I am now able to provide vastly higher levels of dominance then before, it still manages to bother me from time to time. But it wasn't the the patriarchy or misogyny that forced me to be that way - it was women and feminism.
If I was in an actual patriarchal society (and some misogyny that allegedly goes with it), I wouldn't be anxious. I'd just be a gentleman, work hard and I'd end up with a woman. Problem solved. Anxiety = 0.
The greatest irony of Michael Kimmel's delusional argument is this: the more that he harps about it, blaming men for everything and providing a free pussy pass to women, the more dominance will be needed not to feel anxious in the future. So much that future guys similar to me will be unable to adjust to it, because the gap they will be facing will be even more larger and even darker than the one that I had faced.
Their anxiety will be through the roof exactly because of what this white knight is saying. And while that won't be an excuse to reach for a gun and start shooting, don't color me surprised if they do. He will have only himself to blame for that.
(05-25-2014 01:32 PM)darklightdispatch Wrote: Yeah, absolutely. In addition, boys and girls are both socialized exactly the same these days (as female, more or less.) This is both bizarre when you think about and, for young men, hugely confusing.
Young guys who play team sports or maybe join the military are saved from this to some extent because they are shown an alternative to the 100% feminization they get in school. They get a chance to interact with other males without having to stifle and censor themselves to appease female sensibilities. More importantly, they (hopefully) develop some concept of what it means to be a man and have a male identity. A guy with a strong, involved father also has a good shot at escaping the feminist matrix of public schools and TV programming.
A lot of young guys, such as Rodger, have no such luck. They literally have zero guidance when it comes to what it means to be a man. They've been taught to be girls, essentially. Be nice, be polite, look pretty, buy crap and good things will just come to you because you're a special snowflake.
Females ARE taught, accurately for the most part, that they're entitled to love, attention, sex, etc. just for existing. I say accurately because all they have to do is not be repulsive and those things will be given to them just for being there and being young and passably attractive.
Women feel 100% entitled to men's bodies, to use their own awkward language. And they should, reality supports this idea entirely. Any decent-looking young woman can get sex from men more attractive than her just by showing up and making herself available.
We should remind ourselves of the simple truth: women are valued for what they are, men are valued for what they do. Feminists confuse this idea with the whole pretending-to-be-men-with-aggressive-careers-and-oh-so-many-degrees act. Consciously, they may believe that their education and title, etc. affects their attractiveness and SMV the way it does for men. On a deeper, more accurate level, though, they realize that just being a female of reproductive age makes them inherently extremely valuable in a way that men can only become via marked accomplishments.
Do you see the fatal error in socializing men to be women? Young men today don't understand that masculinity hinges on accomplishment, struggle, and, well, just doing shit. They've truly been taught/brainwashed to think that just showing up and being pretty is how you succeed and find happiness.
Yes, this Roger guy had personal mental issues that lead to what he did. Most guys in his situation will just fade into the background and live miserable, empty lives and eventually die alone. A few might figure shit out and improve.
People aren't just born knowing what to do. Society is not a "natural" arrangement, we can't just go by instinct. Without culture, tradition, rights of passage, people are lost. A few exception will figure things out on their own but it's not realistic to think that most will be able to.
Feminism and liberalism in general has destroyed the majority of what could legitimately be called culture in the west. The closest thing many young guys have to culture today are increasingly radical feminazi schools, feminist TV, and music scenes that are dominated by anti-masculine far-left whackos of various stripes.
Here's what things are like for a large percentage of young American guys in the 21st century:
Absent or distant fathers. No male role models worth shit. Being told they're sooo privileged and abusive when they're actually confused, lonely, timid, lost, and anxious 90% of the time. A society that disparages the male role or downright insists it doesn't exist. "I don't need a man." Constant, intense sexual titillation via ubiquitous pornography, revealing fashions, and sex-focused pop culture.
These guys are told that, if they happen to be born handsome, have perfect bodies, and play be all the right rules, they'll be rewarded with casual sex. If you can't quite measure up, though, politely fade away and down make anyone feel awkward by being creepy. In earlier times, being able to find a wife of similar attractivess level was a given for nearly all men. You might have to work hard and do certain other things, but it was all clear and unambiguous.
Today, the impression young guys get is that if you happen to be born "hot" or be a star athlete or super rich or something, then a world of sexual delights is automatically given to you. If you're not one of those guys, though, you're a born loser reject and should just give up. Obviously, this does not bode well for societal stability. One of the fundamental ways civilization was able to happen was be getting the majority of men to feel invested in the group by having families. As we've destroyed that by unleashing hypergamy to an extreme degree (minority of men get all the women) and removing male authority over the family via the courts, society is quickly moving back to primitive, pre-civilization patterns, only with advanced technology and vastly higher populations.
So, two big issues: One -- society has become a nihilistic wasteland where sex and love is governed exclusively by the fickle whims of spoiled young women. Two -- countless young men are given NO guidance how to navigate this brave new world.
It's not accurate to say that Elliot Roger was "just a nut." He embodies his time and place. Countless young men throughout the West, who would never do what he did, never-the-less can somehow relate to his feelings and experience. Even for the men on this forum, who have gone in the opposite direction and turned the 21st century into something dramatically positive rather than dramatically negative, his story still seems to strike a nerve. He's not a bizarre headcase, he's the extreme, but somehow still logical and predicable result, of liberalism/cultural marxism/feminism/whatever you want to call it.
The current social climate here in the U.S. can be an incredible time to be alive if you've cracked the code and figured out how to take advantage of it. We're the tiny, tiny elite, though.
(05-26-2014 02:12 AM)Roosh Wrote: The Daily Mail completely ignores the Asian victims: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...in-22.html
Pictures of them can be found here: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national...-1.1805488
(05-25-2014 10:48 PM)Blunt Wrote: I don't know if this has been mentioned before, but I'm starting to notice some similarites with a troll we recently had here, who was interested in ways of destroying his father's marriage with his stepmom:
-claims his dad was weak
-claims his stepmom was "spreading rumors" about him in town
-lack of concern for even his own father
Probably just another young entitled narcissist, but good thing he was banned. The troll detecting ability of the RVF is very sharp.
(05-25-2014 09:18 PM)darklightdispatch Wrote: Well, yes and no. A fundamental characteristic of any large-scale, prosperous society has been that men and women, as long as they remain within the law and customs of the society, can expect to find a mate. They'll be a few exceptions, sure, but just being average should pretty much guarantee not being alone or an outcast.
In modern, what I would call post-cultural, societies, we're all atomized individuals that don't owe one another anything. This is actually a very strange way to live, historically speaking, and almost certainly doesn't mesh very well with human psychology.
The results of this sort of thing are what Elliot recognized in the above chart he made and what Roosh and countless others have observed, as well. Namely, letting women do whatever they want -- ensconced in a legal, academic, and cultural bubble that protects them from both physical and social consequences -- results in run-away, every-increasing hypergamy.
Fewer and fewer men get the lion's share of the women. A huge, and growing, percentage of men are shut out of the game completely or close to it. Getting laid consistently will require ever more extreme and heroic efforts. Life will be amazing for the minority of alphas at the top but, by definition, few men will reach that level.
Giving women the sort of radical autonomy (only possible as long as we have an excess of wealth, high technology, can manage with sub-replacement birthrates, and the majority of men agree to pay and work to support it) is very much incompatible with sustainable civilization. Men won't continue to invest in society, such as:
-- pay taxes,
-- build businesses,
-- do all the dangerous jobs like military, firefighting, law enforcement
-- and all the dirty ones like plumber, construction, sanitation, oil extraction
unless they feel "entitled to women's bodies." This doesn't mean any woman's body at any time (no man thinks that, anyway) but it does mean that, unless men believe that all their hard work and risk-taking means a reasonable expectation of sex and love, you can't have a (good) society for very long.
When you remove the incentive for men to invest in society, they either leave, become depressed drop-out incels, become players, or otherwise find a way to live a life as detached as possible from society. They have little connection to any community, certainly won't protect it and, occasionally, one of the endless, faceless rejects like Elliot will take out his rage and frustration in a violent way.
Are these guys crazy and abnormal? Sure. But does this sort of society that intentionally removes a huge portion of young men from meaningful participation (and leaves them clueless about their role as men) absolutely guarantee that we will have a small but steady stream of them? YES.
(05-26-2014 02:20 AM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:(05-26-2014 01:56 AM)Flint Wrote: I like Freud as a cultural critic but psychoanalysis ispseudo-science at besta rock solid predictor of behaviour and most of his theories have beendisprovenattacked and ridiculed by feminists to thorougly discredit him because they arelargely unfalsifiablehugely-applicable to the type of neurotic, low-resilent upper-class woman who attend universities, and they're incapable of the intelligence required to truly understand his work, and of accepting the uncomfortable truths he speaks of, so run the hamsters with their own idiotic theories to reduce cognitive-dissonance. Meanwhile, these same critics, firmly-entrenched in their mundane +1 SD thinking start theorising about unfalsifiable crap like 'innate privilege' and 'the social construction of gender' and the herd moos uncritical approval because of feels. In the meantime, the majority of girls I've fucked call me 'Daddy' during the act of their own accord, and my current girlfriend gets soaking wet whenever I growl that she's 'my baby girl' in her ear.
I fixed that for you.
(05-26-2014 03:35 AM)Roosh Wrote: I think this is the first time that cultural commentators pored through our words so quickly after a national event. It's like they are waiting to see what we say so that they can construct an outrage article.
Also, this thread definitely has the best analysis of the shooting out of anywhere on the internet. Newbies are revisiting it often.
(05-26-2014 03:49 AM)draguer Wrote: I had been taking it for granted just how good the level of discourse is here, subconsciously thinking that RVF has had the best analysis of this issue that I know about. Really thinking about it, I challenge anyone to find a more civil and reasoned discussion of this issue anywhere on the internet.
Thank you Roosh and Tuthmosis for providing this fantastic platform and everyone for your well thought-out contributions.
This place is a sanctuary of reason in a world of hysteria.
(05-26-2014 01:21 AM)Wadsworth Wrote: I swear feminists age poorly due to the constant anger, resentment, and (often) hate they live with.
Quote:We don't know whether Elliot Rodger was mentally ill. What we do know is that he was a Men's Rights Activist, or MRA.
He was an active member of the "PUAhate," an online forum (which has been down since the shootings) dedicated to

(05-26-2014 04:23 AM)Roosh Wrote: I'm no friend of MRAs but this truly is a disgusting article:
The Men's Rights Movement Taught Elliot Rodger Everything He Needed to Know
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/anne-theria...86818.html
Quote:We don't know whether Elliot Rodger was mentally ill. What we do know is that he was a Men's Rights Activist, or MRA.
He was an active member of the "PUAhate," an online forum (which has been down since the shootings) dedicated to
Quote:We have no evidence yet that he suffered from any kind of mental illness
Quote:The threat of violence is the main reason why many women feel unable to leave an abusive relationship -- because after leaving is when they are at their most vulnerable.
Quote:We can't just write this one off -- we need to talk about all of the fucked up parts of our culture, especially the movements that teach men that they have the right to dominate and intimidate and violate women
Quote:"Why do men feel threatened by women?" I asked a male friend of mine. So this male friend of mine, who does by the way exist, conveniently entered into the following dialogue. "I mean," I said, "men are bigger, most of the time, they can run faster, strangle better, and they have on the average a lot more money and power." "They're afraid women will laugh at them," he said. "Undercut their world view." Then I asked some women students in a quickie poetry seminar I was giving, "Why do women feel threatened by men?" "They're afraid of being killed," they said.'
(05-26-2014 04:45 AM)2Wycked Wrote:Quote:We have no evidence yet that he suffered from any kind of mental illness
He has a 140 page manifesto, a whole gang of YouTube videos and a clearly dysfunctional relationship with his parents and had multiple therapists, but no, we have no fucking evidence of mental health issues.
These are the same pieces of rancid shit that run to the breach to proclaim their understanding of and devotion to mental health issues.

