^ Yes and yes, in my experience, as a US citizen. Some important points:

1) Make sure those 3 months are 90 days or less. Not 91, 92, etc.

2) On coming from outside Poland: make sure your first stop in Schengen is in Poland. In other words, for example, if you fly from NYC to Poland but connect in Germany (which is in Schengen), German immigration will turn you away.

3) On traveling from Poland to France: make sure you stay within Schengen. In other words, for example, if you fly from Poland to France but connect in the UK (which is not in Schengen, but still is in the EU), French immigration will turn you away.

4) Also note that some countries are in Schengen but not the EU, like Norway.

How strict are countries outside the Schengen that also happen to have the 90 day policy?

(11-30-2016 09:37 AM)262 Wrote:  ^ Yes and yes, in my experience, as a US citizen. Some important points:

1) Make sure those 3 months are 90 days or less. Not 91, 92, etc.

2) On coming from outside Poland: make sure your first stop in Schengen is in Poland. In other words, for example, if you fly from NYC to Poland but connect in Germany (which is in Schengen), German immigration will turn you away.

3) On traveling from Poland to France: make sure you stay within Schengen. In other words, for example, if you fly from Poland to France but connect in the UK (which is not in Schengen, but still is in the EU), French immigration will turn you away.

4) Also note that some countries are in Schengen but not the EU, like Norway.

Thank you.

I will make straight flight from JFK => Warsaw and then Warsaw to Paris.

I need to enter EU from Warsaw and exit from Warsaw as well. I get it but hopefully customs won't make a problem saying I already spent my 90 days in EU.

(11-30-2016 05:30 PM)renotime Wrote:  How strict are countries outside the Schengen that also happen to have the 90 day policy?

Just to make sure you aren't waiting for an answer from me - unfortunately, I don't have any experience with that.

But to help others answer your question, can you say which countries you're specifically asking about?

Serbia, Romania, Bulgaria, Ukraine.

I figure border patrol guys in those countries don't really give a shit. At least when it comes to departure.

I could be wrong though.

^ Obligatory "search function," but this one comes off the top of my head for Ukraine. TL;DR - Ukraine enforces. If relatively-poorer Ukraine does, the others probably do too.

(01-25-2016 06:13 AM)NomadofEU Wrote:  I'll switch gears now and tell you about my recent trip to Moldova.
I arrived in Ukraine back in August on a tourist visa which gives me ninety days to stay in Ukraine. Everyone had told me that this rule is loosely enforced when applied to Americans so when I stayed past my ninety days I wasn't too worried about it ("just pay the 850 hrn fine and it's no problem"x10). I had been meaning to apply for my temporary residence permit which would allow me to stay here legally for one year. To begin this process I must go to a Ukrainian consulate outside Ukraine. A friend of mine had done this a couple months earlier by going to Moldova and because Moldova is the closest and least expensive option it seemed logical that I should do the same.

I decided to take a bus from Kiev to Chisinau, however the bus was delayed because the road was too icy and we ended up sliding to a halt on the shoulder on the way there. We had to wait a couple hours for trucks to arrive, salt the road, and pull the bus back onto the tarmac. When we finally arrived at the Ukraine/Moldova border the bus driver collected the passports and gave them to the customs officer.

After waiting nearly an hour in a bus which was as hot as a sauna I finally hear some angry yelling, "American!" "American you come out here now!" Everyone on the bus looked shocked when I got up to go outside. The customs officer told me that I had to get my bags and get off the bus.

After sitting me down in an empty room without heat and sending my bus to Chisinau without me they asked why I overstayed my visa and told me (in broken English) that I had committed a major violation of their law. They said that because I overstayed the ninety days of my tourist visa I was not allowed back into Ukraine for six months. When another bus finally arrived (3 hours later) they gave me back my passport and sent me on my way to a country I had never been to with only a single bag of my belongings which I had packed to last me two days at most. Everything else was back at my apartment in Kiev.

Luckily I had brought all the necessary documents for my temporary resident permit. I went to the Ukrainian consulate the next day and they approved my visa within twenty minutes. I decided to take a train back to Kiev in order to avoid the officials I originally encountered when I traveled by bus, but it did not matter. As soon as we reached the border to Ukraine the customs officials saw my passport with the dates when I had first arrived and departed from Ukraine. Again they told me I could not enter Ukraine so I showed them the visa in my passport which seemed to frustrate them. Technically I had to stay out of Ukraine for six months as a tourist, however I was not re-entering the country as a tourist but as a temporary resident. They held up the entire train of two hundred plus people for an extra thirty minutes while they argued with each other until begrudgingly stamping my passport and allowing me entry.

(12-01-2016 06:11 PM)renotime Wrote:  Serbia, Romania, Bulgaria, Ukraine.

I figure border patrol guys in those countries don't really give a shit. At least when it comes to departure.

I could be wrong though.

Aren't Bulgaria and Romania member of EU? I was in Romania actually when they joined to EU as a first day. If I remember correctly, it was January 1, 2008 or 2009.

Just so you know, both countries are crazy corrupted. They search luggages like crazy, so they can hold you at customs (of course, for bribe)

When I was entering Romania, they made me open my luggage and they found my watches, I think there was 3 and they said I can't get these watches into country because all 3 value more than $10,000. They thought I was gonna sell them, of course they knew I wasn't going to, they just wanted bribe.

^ Bulgaria and Romania are in the EU, but they're not in Schengen yet.

Remember, EU != Schengen.

Any suggestions on what might constitute as proof that I was outside Poland?
Obviously no issues getting to Prague but I'll be going back to Poland in a couple days, and then leaving to Ukraine almost immediately
I tried searching online a bit but I've seen no other suggestions aside from, a passport stamp and the Hotel receipt that 262 suggested.
The problems being I'm still in Schengen, so i'll have no stamps in my passport(none since June), and so far the bus ticket I've bought and the hostel I'm staying at hasn't given me anything that has my name on it.

(01-11-2017 06:09 AM)cromanishere Wrote:  Any suggestions on what might constitute as proof that I was outside Poland?
Obviously no issues getting to Prague but I'll be going back to Poland in a couple days, and then leaving to Ukraine almost immediately
I tried searching online a bit but I've seen no other suggestions aside from, a passport stamp and the Hotel receipt that 262 suggested.
The problems being I'm still in Schengen, so i'll have no stamps in my passport(none since June), and so far the bus ticket I've bought and the hostel I'm staying at hasn't given me anything that has my name on it.

Hostels,like hotels,are obliged by law to take your passport if you're a non EU client so they have to write it down and keep a registry.
You could ask for a copy or a certificate,if you're asked why you can always say it is a proof expense for your company,school.etc

These "tricks" seem dicy to me. Playing this game of over staying visas, bribing officials, paying fines, etc. seems crazy to me. I don't know about you guys but the system always come down to f*ck me hard if I don't cross my Ts and dot my Is.

I'm more interested in getting fully legal work sponsorship and a path to honest to goodness citizenship or indefinite leave to stay LEGALLY.

I don't have a side business nor do i have any inclination currently to try to do something like that.

I know a lot of you guys play the immigration system, but has any one tried legitimately to get the proper paperwork to either stay indefinitely or even work?

(01-11-2017 06:57 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  These "tricks" seem dicy to me. Playing this game of over staying visas, bribing officials, paying fines, etc. seems crazy to me. I don't know about you guys but the system always come down to f*ck me hard if I don't cross my Ts and dot my Is.

I'm more interested in getting fully legal work sponsorship and a path to honest to goodness citizenship or indefinite leave to stay LEGALLY.

I don't have a side business nor do i have any inclination currently to try to do something like that.

I know a lot of you guys play the immigration system, but has any one tried legitimately to get the proper paperwork to either stay indefinitely or even work?

I have a fair bit of experience,and results may vary with your original nationality but mostly its a pain in the ass that usually requires obscene amounts of cash (no problem for the saudis!),insider connections (also known as immigration rackets) and a labyrinth of catch 22's which I initially thought were set to discourage people but then came to the conclusion that it is just daft stupidity.

You can always discard your passport and claim to be a refugee,but maybe you should get some practice rape first just in case they want proof of your status.

(01-11-2017 06:57 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  These "tricks" seem dicy to me. ....

I know a lot of you guys play the immigration system, but has any one tried legitimately to get the proper paperwork to either stay indefinitely or even work?

I got EU citizenship through my ancestry. I don't go into the details ( which country) for anonymity reasons, but each country has an independent method for allowing citizenship.

Genealogists have told me some people have gotten citizenship from ancestors as far back as great-grandparents.

It took me seven years ( not full time, just off and on contacting of officials and getting documents. ) .

It's nice having a passport. You can't be questioned as far as just being in the country, , but you're subject to the laws and taxes.

(12-01-2016 06:11 PM)renotime Wrote:  Serbia, Romania, Bulgaria, Ukraine.

I figure border patrol guys in those countries don't really give a shit. At least when it comes to departure.

I could be wrong though.

Wrong.

I overstayed in Ukraine and cute airport immigration officials sat me down for about two hours filling out forms.

They were polite, friendly and flirtatious, and they made sure I made my flight. I also didn't have to pay the fine right away, I wired money to a friend later to pay so I wouldn't have trouble going back.

(01-11-2017 06:57 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  These "tricks" seem dicy to me. Playing this game of over staying visas, bribing officials, paying fines, etc. seems crazy to me. I don't know about you guys but the system always come down to f*ck me hard if I don't cross my Ts and dot my Is.

I'm more interested in getting fully legal work sponsorship and a path to honest to goodness citizenship or indefinite leave to stay LEGALLY.

I don't have a side business nor do i have any inclination currently to try to do something like that.

I know a lot of you guys play the immigration system, but has any one tried legitimately to get the proper paperwork to either stay indefinitely or even work?

If you're referring to the OP, I posted in this thread that it's official, at least for Poland: https://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-31412...pid1449592

But I do know a few US citizens who are legally working in Europe (Poland and France).

When we exchange notes on our visa issues, they all agree that OP's method is easier, with the caveat that you can't work (though obviously you can still work online).

Just did a border run yesterday. Based on the reassurance I felt from the DC Polish Embassy website I mentioned, I again tried direct same-day flights between Gdansk and London (the UK never joined Schengen). This time it went off without an air of hesitation, and instead with an amusing anecdote and some info to boot:

The anecdote: when the border guard on my way out saw what was likely my crossing history on his computer screen, he amusingly looked over to his buddy, in a sort of "hey, this is cool, check this out" kind of way. Still in the same amused mood, he then asked me, "So, you are counting the days?" I said yes, and he said, "Cool, I have never seen it before," before stamping my passport with a smile.

Also of note is that London Stansted airport has an M&S grocery store in it, outside security, so there's no need to get robbed eating overpriced fast food junk there. Burger King will upgrade your adult meal drink to a beer for two pounds more though, based on the ads they had there.

Electric plugs outside security at London Stansted are hard to come by, and are UK plugs, rather than the European ones. Inside security there are red sitting areas, which you can also identify due to their lack of back support, that have European plugs, as well as USB plugs, though those didn't work for the plug I picked.

One issue with London Stansted is there's no way to transfer between flights without going through immigration and security. So you have to give time for that, which can obviously vary based on traffic, especially when picking arrival and departure flights. There was no line for non-EU immigration when I arrived, but that was early in the morning on a Monday, coming off a flight from a second-tier Polish city, meaning I was the only non-EU on that flight. In the evening security took about fifteen minutes, but I'd budget at least thirty before departure, since they make you walk through endless corridors of stores, restaurants, and halls to get to the gates.

(01-24-2017 05:16 AM)262 Wrote:  Just did a border run yesterday. Based on the reassurance I felt from the DC Polish Embassy website I mentioned, I again tried direct same-day flights between Gdansk and London (the UK never joined Schengen).

262, thanks a lot for posting your updates.

As I understand the thread, all you have to do is show a hotel receipt from a country outside of Poland every 90 days. Is there a reason why you chose to go to the UK, where your passport is stamped out, then stamped in again? ... as opposed to a train or bus somewhere in the Schengen, where your passport is not stamped out/in ?

^ I prefer to keep my records of leaving Poland in my passport as stamps, rather than making sure I don't lose the receipts.

I have a friend who's been doing this in Hungary for 8+ years in Hungary with zero problems I initially got a residency which was a pain in the ass the first time the second damn near impossible due to the migrant issue. So for the past two years Ive just done a border run out of Hungary every 90 days and haven't had any issues whatsoever. I regularly travel all over the schengen have been on trains and plains multiple times durning passport control checks never an issue in any other countries. These border agents know the countries with the 90 day rules and never have given me a hassle once so if you want to stay in the Schengen and don't have a residency or a valid reason to get one this is your work around.

Do you guys "know anyone" who've had a Schengan visa rejection, and then tried to visit the U.S after? I know someone who has two applications in the country he's in but one of them was recently rejected but the other is still in process and he's got a bridging visa allowing him to travel. Was curious if their is a database of some sort that'd raise flags.

^ Like this post if your answer to the above is "I don't."

This is great travel info. You literally can't find this shit anywhere.

For anyone who has experience with this in Hungary.....

Have anyone stayed 89 days in the Schengen (lets say Germany for fun)

then go to Croatia for outside the zone for a week, then re-enter through Hungary?

These rules make my head fuzzy.

(01-29-2017 02:02 PM)godzilla Wrote:  This is great travel info. You literally can't find this shit anywhere.

For anyone who has experience with this in Hungary.....

Have anyone stayed 89 days in the Schengen (lets say Germany for fun)

then go to Croatia for outside the zone for a week, then re-enter through Hungary?

These rules make my head fuzzy.

I think what matters most is your port of entry/exit but feel free to try it and post here what happens, I'm curious as to what happens. Would you exit the Schengen through Germany via a flight?

Basically, I am entering France in two weeks for about the month, I don't have any concrete plan yet, (i was going to go to ukraine or serbia outside the schengen initially, but I'm re-thinking). I would then exit Schengen from some country around probably what would be around DAY 85-89, I would stay out the zone for about 1 month or so, then re-enter through Hungary, I will probably have no problem entering, as technically, I would have some days left. But, when I leave (I would probably stay in Budapest for 2 months), would they count my previous 85 days in the zone, even though I did exit in between.

Who knows, but maybe ill play it safe and go through Poland

Im gonna try to call the embassy when I have time. But this is also printed on the website...

http://washington.kormany.hu/general-inf...ng-hungary

^ My guess, based on ElJefe1's experience, is that you'll be fine, since you're leaving and coming back via Hungary.

They seem to be like Poland, in that they only care that your current stay is 90 days or less, regardless of past stays.