Post: #326

(08-19-2014 06:27 AM)MaleDefined Wrote:  This is a men's self-improvement forum and we're sitting around discussing how to obtain fake ESL teaching certifications.

Maybe something is lost on me.

Good point, I understand how it sounds. I only plan on teaching English for a year or two though, so dropping $1800+ on a CELTA would be a pretty poor investment, especially when some of the highest paying countries don't even require it. I looked into getting one of the less expensive certificates, but the reviews I read were mainly negative, and many of these certificates are pretty worthless in the TEFL world.

I do plan on returning to the US within the next few years to get certified as a teacher so that I can work at an international school. For me English teaching is just a way to get a break from the US for a few years before moving on to a more legitimate career.

Post: #327

Apologies if I missed it earlier in the thread, but does anyone know how much a TEFl/CELTA helps in Colombia?

Thinking about teaching as a way to stay down there longer, but not sure the time/money on a certificate is worth it.

Post: #328

(08-19-2014 10:42 PM)Hedonistic Traveler Wrote:  

(08-19-2014 06:27 AM)MaleDefined Wrote:  This is a men's self-improvement forum and we're sitting around discussing how to obtain fake ESL teaching certifications.

Maybe something is lost on me.

I do plan on returning to the US within the next few years to get certified as a teacher so that I can work at an international school. For me English teaching is just a way to get a break from the US for a few years before moving on to a more legitimate career.

Start working on your teaching degree today! Escape the US? You'll have to come back eventually, so why put it off? The only thing better than living abroad on a small budget is living abroad on a large budget.

Post: #329

I'm in a dilemma with that. May as well share my story with regards to TEFL/PGCE

I could double my wage if I went back to the UK for a year, did a PGCE and came back to teach Maths/Physics at an International School

I was initially booked in to do the Maths PGCE when I was 21 but I opted out in order to get out quicker.

In the UK it's usually one year for qualification plus a year getting experience at a rough school (perhaps more if job applications fall through/don't pop up). I didn't want to wait around at the time.

I may not need to get that year's experience in England anymore, but the problem is, at 23, I really cannot bring myself to opt out of this lifestyle for a whole year. It's like coming back to the family home after three days at a manic music festival.

I hate the idea of it so much that I have nightmares about the place regularly.

So yes, getting the teaching qualification will give you a fantastic lifestyle that eclipses that of a TEFL teacher by leaps and bounds. But keep in mind there are a few guys that absolutely cannot stand the idea of being in the anglosphere for even a(nother) year.

Post: #330

Anybody ever teach Business English? Is training for this an entirely different avenue than getting a normal ESL certification?

Post: #331

(08-20-2014 01:14 AM)MaleDefined Wrote:  

(08-19-2014 10:42 PM)Hedonistic Traveler Wrote:  

(08-19-2014 06:27 AM)MaleDefined Wrote:  This is a men's self-improvement forum and we're sitting around discussing how to obtain fake ESL teaching certifications.

Maybe something is lost on me.

I do plan on returning to the US within the next few years to get certified as a teacher so that I can work at an international school. For me English teaching is just a way to get a break from the US for a few years before moving on to a more legitimate career.

Start working on your teaching degree today! Escape the US? You'll have to come back eventually, so why put it off? The only thing better than living abroad on a small budget is living abroad on a large budget.

I definitely considered that for a while. In the end I decided to do the coursework for certification while abroad before returning to the US to finish it up and do the student teaching. I want to try living abroad for a year or two before I commit to becoming a teacher, because if for some reason I completely hate it I don't plan on teaching in the US.

Definitely good advice though, thanks for it. Do you teach at an international/diplomatic school?

Post: #332

(08-20-2014 11:56 AM)NomadofEU Wrote:  Anybody ever teach Business English? Is training for this an entirely different avenue than getting a normal ESL certification?

I did this in China. Like just about any other work in China, your official training and education is largely irrelevant.

They were just happy to have someone white who was willing to make the 2 hour round trip to the factory-warehouse complex three days a week.

Post: #333

When American women teach English in Asia.

Post: #334

It's pretty comical how all these Chinese 'employers' ask for a scanned copy of your passport page, copy of your degree, etc etc when you apply for jobs in China, before you even meet them in person.

Is it safe to assume that all of these people are identity thieves?

Post: #335

No, they want to see if you are actually where you say you are from. A lot of guys go to China from Nigeria or Iraq claiming they are American in hopes of getting a teaching job. You don't really need a degree as long as you have some type of diploma to send them.

I know 3 white people from Latvia/Lithuania and a couple Russian guys posing as Americans with fake passports... I know of 2 black guys from Africa posing as Americans and a guy from Afghanistan...same deal. A lot of guys from the middle east pose as Americans/Canadians/British. I was speaking to a guy who was a defensive prick in one school who claimed to be from Ireland. When I outed him, he was pretty pissed... shouldn't have tried to shoot me down in front of my students, though... I can be aggressive... anyway yeah, they just want to make sure you are who you say you are.

Post: #336

if theyre giving you a real visa then they need all these things

Post: #337

I think I might be going back to South China.. anyone else heading out?

Post: #338

I've read a few stories and warnings out there of guys giving up scanned copies of their passports while applying for jobs and then getting fucked for it while in China. Identity stolen and everything. And most websites and people I've spoken to about it seem to advise against giving it out.

I don't really trust Chinese for anything these days, so I'd tend to believe them.

Post: #339

(09-21-2014 06:18 PM)Global_Cocksman Wrote:  I've read a few stories and warnings out there of guys giving up scanned copies of their passports while applying for jobs and then getting fucked for it while in China. Identity stolen and everything. And most websites and people I've spoken to about it seem to advise against giving it out.

I don't really trust Chinese for anything these days, so I'd tend to believe them.

How do you secure a job beforehand while overseas if you don't provide these documents that prove your identity and eligibility?

Post: #340

(09-21-2014 06:35 PM)Nascimento Wrote:  

(09-21-2014 06:18 PM)Global_Cocksman Wrote:  I've read a few stories and warnings out there of guys giving up scanned copies of their passports while applying for jobs and then getting fucked for it while in China. Identity stolen and everything. And most websites and people I've spoken to about it seem to advise against giving it out.

I don't really trust Chinese for anything these days, so I'd tend to believe them.

How do you secure a job beforehand while overseas if you don't provide these documents that prove your identity and eligibility?

Sooner or later, they will need them. One option is to send the passport copy, but black out certain details until you have a firm job offer.

I'm not sure how much of your identity can be stolen just off of a passport ID page. I'm sure there is a bank somewhere that will let people open an account on just a passport copy.

My rule is that I only provide the copy for legit full-time jobs that come with a visa. Everyone else just gets a flash of my passport and that's it. I explain to them that working part-time is technically illegal and that I'm not going to identify myself in the process of breaking the law and they usually back off.

Once the prospective clients have met me and seen a demo, seeing my passport seems less important.

That being said, what those above me have been saying is correct. For everyone legit native English speaker with US/British pronunciation, there are 4 or 5 people who don't but are trying to cash in on the jobs offered to those who are actually qualified.

Those liars are correct that it is unfair that no one wants their kid to spend the rest of his life using correct Nigerian pronunciation, but they sure make things tougher for those of us who do speak the preferred accent.

Post: #341

I will say this: My wife hired a guy from Pakistan, Chinese unless they are fairly well educated, can't tell the difference in accents... just like you probably wouldn't be able to discern a Xuzhou accent from a Nanjing or Wuhan but there are subtle differences. People laugh at my wife when she speaks, apparently she has the equivalent of a 'redneck' accent in mandarin.

Anyway, she hired this dude and she said that he couldn't speak English even as well as her. He kept making mistakes that she had to correct but the school was in desperate need of a 'foreign face' so they went with him. The guy apparently spent the majority of class on his smartphone and generally ignored the children... the fact of the matter is that, schools, especially public schools will take whatever they can get just to get the govt' grants that they dole out for English classes.


Really you can only get a job if you are black or white and usually preferential treatment is given to white men (not always but most of the time) because of the huge influx of Nigerians and Africans. They are starting to also have a problem with Russians, Ukrainians and various other 'white' races crossing in. And if you think about it, would you want to blow $50/hr for your kid to learn English from a guy that can barely speak it?
It's kinda like going to a Chinese restaurant and getting served by Mexicans or White people...you'd be looking at the food cockeyed. ABC/CBC's also won't get jobs as English teachers, doesn't matter if you speak the Queen's English, they simply can't market you to Chinese people... in China perception is everything. If you are a black dude, I would recommend hamming it up a little as far as the typical American thing goes. Show a picture of you playing basketball or break-dancing or something... Chinese are really interested in hiring the 'stereotypical' American. I spent a bit of time in Japan and the school I was at hired a CBC. When the parents met him, they flat out refused to have him teach the children cause of his background and he was let go shortly after. This is the way Asia works.

Women are a whole different problem, generally Chinese prefer not to hire them as they create WAAAAY too much drama, perhaps I'll start collecting photos of ESL women so you can see what I mean. I can count on one finger the number of hot/nice, woman, ESL teachers from America I've met in my entire time abroad... oh wait no she was from the Ukraine... well there you have it.



Welcome to China.

Post: #342

Off topic a little bit but for all the guys out there, I just discussed this with my wife. Do you consider yourself quiet or shy/nice? Are you the guy reading a book when everyone else is out partying? Have you ever spoken to a woman outside of China?

If you answered NO to any of these, don't waste your time as a teacher.

These guys unfortunately make up the large majority of teachers in the ESL industry and they are some of the most boring people you will ever meet, outside the classroom. The best way to get a job in this field is to learn interesting group activities that everyone can enjoy. If you are one of those people who gets 'embarrassed' easily, this is not the job for you. I guess my wife met this one guy on the job who threatened to kill all the children and cut off their heads... usually I would give him props for keeping the kids in line but I guess he scared them so badly they hid under their desks when class started.. my wife said it was due to the class asking him if he could make the classes 'less serious'. I mean certainly you need discipline in the classroom but there is a line. I wish I could say he was the exception but I've met my fair share of nut jobs.

So if you get asked for your passport or what have you, its also a good idea to throw in some pictures of you out having a blast with your mates. HR girls are looking for guys who aren't suffering from shell shock and want to see that you're a personable guy. Lots of pictures of you in the company of other smiling people... warm/entertaining personalities trump qualifications every time.

Post: #343

(09-22-2014 10:16 AM)BadWolf Wrote:  Off topic a little bit but for all the guys out there, I just discussed this with my wife. Do you consider yourself quiet or shy/nice? Are you the guy reading a book when everyone else is out partying? Have you ever spoken to a woman outside of China?

If you answered NO to any of these, don't waste your time as a teacher.

These guys unfortunately make up the large majority of teachers in the ESL industry and they are some of the most boring people you will ever meet, outside the classroom. The best way to get a job in this field is to learn interesting group activities that everyone can enjoy. If you are one of those people who gets 'embarrassed' easily, this is not the job for you. I guess my wife met this one guy on the job who threatened to kill all the children and cut off their heads... usually I would give him props for keeping the kids in line but I guess he scared them so badly they hid under their desks when class started.. my wife said it was due to the class asking him if he could make the classes 'less serious'. I mean certainly you need discipline in the classroom but there is a line. I wish I could say he was the exception but I've met my fair share of nut jobs.

So if you get asked for your passport or what have you, its also a good idea to throw in some pictures of you out having a blast with your mates. HR girls are looking for guys who aren't suffering from shell shock and want to see that you're a personable guy. Lots of pictures of you in the company of other smiling people... warm/entertaining personalities trump qualifications every time.

I enjoyed reading your post but I am not sure I am following you as to me it seems almost contradictory. Are you saying that most successful teachers are, or are not, quiet and shy people? Or that they should / should not be? It sounds like you are saying most of them are (?).

Also regarding "nut jobs" -- I would have thought that shy and quiet folks are usually classified as nutters or oddballs (unfortunately), while extroverts usually get seen as the likeables. I haven't been to China yet so I'm not sure how to read what you wrote. Thanks.

Post: #344

(08-20-2014 11:56 AM)NomadofEU Wrote:  Anybody ever teach Business English? Is training for this an entirely different avenue than getting a normal ESL certification?

Japanese companies will sometimes hire you, put you on their salary and they expect you to make up your own lessons and teach. It's hard work. If you go with a dispatch company sometimes you can teach business English on the side, after you finish working at the school. You don't need an ESL cert if you want to do this in Japan. But it wouldn't hurt either.

Post: #345

Most teachers are shy, they are also the ones that don't make a great deal of money. Schools want 'Genki/Energetic/Fun' teachers and those are the guys that can make money? Does that help or has that just confused you more?

Post: #346

Been in Korea four years now so I let me speak on that a bit.

I have a CELTA... aaand I don't use it. Didn't use it when I was teaching adults either. (Certificate for English Language Teaching for Adults- pardon if someone already mentioned it.) I still have the materials but I'd have to go through them again to re-apply it in the classroom.

Teaching abilities aside, if adult students like you they will keep coming to your class. If you're a good teacher that lacks appeal then you have a problem. Adult students in Korea tend to fall into the same habits they made in high school and college of being okay with the teacher doing most of the talking, when it should be the opposite.

Most any TEFL cert will work for getting a gig in Korea, so don't bother with the CELTA unless you're dead set on teaching adults, preferably in other countries where they actually care that you have one. Also, be ready for the split shifts.

Post: #347

(09-27-2014 10:26 AM)glarkcable Wrote:  Been in Korea four years now so I let me speak on that a bit.

I have a CELTA... aaand I don't use it. Didn't use it when I was teaching adults either. (Certificate for English Language Teaching for Adults- pardon if someone already mentioned it.) I still have the materials but I'd have to go through them again to re-apply it in the classroom.

Teaching abilities aside, if adult students like you they will keep coming to your class. If you're a good teacher that lacks appeal then you have a problem. Adult students in Korea tend to fall into the same habits they made in high school and college of being okay with the teacher doing most of the talking, when it should be the opposite.

Most any TEFL cert will work for getting a gig in Korea, so don't bother with the CELTA unless you're dead set on teaching adults, preferably in other countries where they actually care that you have one. Also, be ready for the split shifts.

This is true. One person who had been working in Japan longer than me told me, "You're in the entertainment business, not really teaching." This applied to working at most schools in Japan. Being entertaining will get you hired over someone with certifications in some instances. Usually when you "demo" a lesson for them is when they decide.

Post: #348

(09-26-2014 09:52 PM)BadWolf Wrote:  Most teachers are shy, they are also the ones that don't make a great deal of money. Schools want 'Genki/Energetic/Fun' teachers and those are the guys that can make money? Does that help or has that just confused you more?

Well I guess so. I guess I was being a bit finicky as I haven't been to China yet, but am looking into it and want to set things up right.

I tend to be a bit introverted & reserved in my free time, but a couple days a week certainly do "turn the lights on." Problem is, that's only when I feel like it. (I also workout / jog / run / lift / walk a lot, which helps too). I taught ESL in the past and I generally concur on the fact an ESL "teacher" needs to constantly have an almost are-you-on-something high vibe to keep the students intrigued. In fact I pretty much concluded many of them were on something. I also recall drinking a lot of coca-cola & pepsi just before my classes, in addition to my regular coffee, just to keep my pace up.

Speaking of the somewhat quieter types, mind telling what is an average to high-average wage one should expect in China? When I get there I probably won't be my knock-out best for several months, adapting to culture / language / food / weather, and will need to be "realistic." Or any other advice. Thanks.

Post: #349

(03-08-2012 10:00 PM)jdreise Wrote:  

(03-08-2012 02:02 AM)AlphaTravel Wrote:  It was something I considered for a while but never went through with it, the generally low pay and what the job entails puts me off. Plus working with kids is not my idea of fun.
A friend of mines is flying out to Thailand next month to do a 3 week course down in Phuket, costs about $1,100 USD but he gets put up in a nice resort during the course, then a guaranteed job for at least 4 months somewhere in Thailand (a village in the sticks with little to keep you entertained), free apartment and $1000USD a month in pay. The only stipulation is that if he doesn't complete that 4 months placement he doesn't get the TEFL certificate and has to pay around $500USD for non completion. Anyone interested the name of the company is American TESOL institute Thailand.

Actually, if you’re looking to stay somewhere longer than 3 or 4 months, teaching can pay pretty well after you get some experience. A coworker from my school just got hired by an oil contractor to teach Physics in Equatorial Guinea. He’s going to be making $20,000 a month, working your typical 28 on, 28 off shift. That’s $120,000 a year, tax free for 6 months of work. He has no teacher’s license btw, just a Bachelor’s in Computer Science and about 4 years of teaching physics and math in a Thai public school. Obviously you’re not going to land this type of job with a TEFL paper and no experience. Like most things, you have to put in some work and do some networking.

Right now I’m teaching in Thailand (I’ve also taught in Korea) so this is something that I can lend my “expert opinion” on. If I were to advise your friend, I’d say just skip the TEFL. If you’re just starting out then the only thing it’s good for is to make connections. That 3 week course is not going to prepare you for the chaos and culture shock of a Thai classroom. If you want to stay in teaching a bit longer and head to a country that requires one for visa purposes like Vietnam or Indonesia, then do it after you have some experience. It’s unnecessary in Thailand, Japan, China, and Korea.

I don’t have a TEFL and I work at one of the better public schools in Thailand teaching English grammar and PE (yeah, it’s fucking easy). I have a pretty sweet deal here; salary that allows me to save a fair amount, excellent administrative support, 8 weeks paid vacation, health and dental insurance, accident insurance, housing allowance, and on top of that I only teach 14 periods a week. We also take 4 all expense paid school trips a year. At the end of this month we’ll be spending 4 days at a five star resort in Hua Hin. Basically, I just have to show up around noon everyday and do an hour of activities with the students, then I’m free to do whatever I please with the rest of the afternoon and night. After those four days, I have 5 weeks of paid holiday that I’m going to use to hit up some of the islands in the south and Burma.

If anyone is thinking about starting out teaching, then Korea is definitely more lucrative. I was there 15 months and saved $21,000. I worked my ass off though-- doing private lessons, not blowing money in casinos like many of my friends, cooking for myself, finding the cheapest grocery stores, taking the bus instead of taxis. At one point, I had a private lesson paying 80,000 won an hour ($75) where I’d just go in and talk about getting drunk and chasing women with Korean businessmen—no joke. Our conversations never really got past sex, money, cars, gambling, drinking, hookers, billiards, and travel. It was the easiest money I’ve ever made.

Generally speaking, I was frugal but not cheap. I do spend money but not on stupid, useless crap. Everything adds up. I just looked at it as a year to make money and have fun chasing women but I know some foreigners in Korea that can’t save a dime. They just have no idea how to manage their money.

Korea was a good year and I used the coin that I earned there along with about 35k in other savings that I had to go cash in with my brother on a duplex in a college town in Minnesota. Right now it’s looking like a wise investment as each unit nets us about $720 a month after insurance, prop mgmt, water, taxes, etc.

Anyway, I realize I’m rambling. If there’s any interest I can break down how to find a quality job in Korea and Thailand and what to expect in terms of working conditions, pay, benefits, how to find housing, women, culture, regions, etc.

Oh, one more thing I wanted to throw in: if you’re going to start out teaching you might as well just swing for the fences and try to get into an international school. You’ve gotta be licensed to do it however and one way you can do that is through taking the MTEL by the Massachusetts DOE. Look it up. It’s easy. I’m considering doing it myself when I finish here in September.

Is this kind of thing still possible? That's some decent money. (Not that I'd want to go to West Africa now given the Ebola outbreak, but still...)

I'm looking to make some changes in my (stagnant) career trajectory and I have a B.S. in Physics. Teaching overseas could be an interesting way to shake things up.

Post: #350

(08-20-2014 03:26 AM)LeightonBlackstock Wrote:  I'm in a dilemma with that. May as well share my story with regards to TEFL/PGCE

I could double my wage if I went back to the UK for a year, did a PGCE and came back to teach Maths/Physics at an International School

I was initially booked in to do the Maths PGCE when I was 21 but I opted out in order to get out quicker.

In the UK it's usually one year for qualification plus a year getting experience at a rough school (perhaps more if job applications fall through/don't pop up). I didn't want to wait around at the time.

I may not need to get that year's experience in England anymore, but the problem is, at 23, I really cannot bring myself to opt out of this lifestyle for a whole year. It's like coming back to the family home after three days at a manic music festival.

I hate the idea of it so much that I have nightmares about the place regularly.

So yes, getting the teaching qualification will give you a fantastic lifestyle that eclipses that of a TEFL teacher by leaps and bounds. But keep in mind there are a few guys that absolutely cannot stand the idea of being in the anglosphere for even a(nother) year.

I was looking into this a while back and I believe that you can take that qualification in Singapore, You'd have to look into it though.