Swedish guy saying lot of sense:

(09-12-2015 04:26 AM)Troll King Wrote:  I just got caught up on this thread. Someone a few pages back mentioned a superstate. I hadn't really heard about that before, I don't follow EU politics that much.

It seems likely though. I think there are a lot of parallels between the current EU situation and the USA right before the Civil War. Obviously this isn't about slavery but at the time each state considered itself a separate territory with it's own history. Obvious the EU countries have a much deeper cultural heritage than the states did, but when the states seceded from the union the rallying cry was to keep the union together even if it meant killing large numbers.

What happens when half of the EU countries decide to leave the EU? We might find ourselves witnessing, or living through for my EU brothers, a massive civil war.

I'm not sure comparisons to the US Civil War are entirely accurate, thank God.

The states were in those days of course considered far more of a polity and culture unto themselves than they typically are today. Most Americans felt more loyalty to their state than the federal government, which is why Robert E. Lee refused to take command of the federal forces.

But those states did join in a Constitution with a very explicit supremacy clause. Wanting to leave unilaterally because you didn't like the laws of congress was seen by many as illegal.

To my knowledge the EU has no such supremacy clause. It is, despite what the technocrats try to do, still a voluntary association of sovereign states, each with its own embassy, laws, seat at the UN, etc.

Most importantly of all, the EU has no independent treasury with ways of raising revenues and no army.

Juncker (a telling name) recently proposed one, but I doubt he'll get it. They certainly won't get an army.

States leaving the EU would suffer a financial shock, of course, but again to quote Le Pen, financial setbacks can be recovered from.

The question would be in pure practical terms (setting aside the legal ones) how the EU can enforce its mandates. The answer is simple - Europe has by and large outsourced most of its defense to the United States since 1945. The question becomes whether the United States would come to the defense of the EU to prevent it from disintegrating.

I guarantee you that won't happen. Americans are very war-weary right now (a huge part of the reason why we aren't destroying ISIS). Anyone supporting such a measure would be committing political suicide.

So I think a civil war in that regard is unlikely, thankfully.

Oh by the way, one of those links to the Telegraph has the commenters saying that Hungary should use lethal force on the "migrants." 97% of those polled there said Britain should deploy its army to defend its borders.

I also came across this, which shows the guy that started the "Refugees" Welcome group.



Classic zero-T hipster faggot infesting New York City right now.

It's also telling that any article on that site disables comments when the "refugee" question is brought up.

An Australien interview with Tatjana Festerling, the protest leader of the German Pegida movement against islamization of the West. Complete text
here

The following texts are excerpts:

Quote: She [the protest leader of Pegida] says free speech to protest about the biggest issue — how Germans live their lives — is being curtailed, and likens it to the psychological brainwashing of the 1930s. She says the hearty ­welcome of the asylum-seekers at Munich airport — almost resembling a welcome home for heroic war veterans — was a symptom of this national self-condemnation.

“Germans always want to be the best, the world champions, in football in humanities; it’s OK, but now the Left and green domineering man 2.0 wants to show the world how to do welcoming ­culture so ‘right’,” she says. (...)

She says: “When it started with the refugees we thought it was all about Christians, Yazidis, secularists and liberal Syrians, about families and traumatised children from war zones, but our politicians are so damn stupid they keep borders wide open and bring in everything, lots of Islamists … hordes of young male invaders who have unleashed violence and rubbish like in Balkans and in Pakistan.”

Says a restaurateur in Dresden: “Germany doesn’t need to apologise for its history, I am proud of my Germany where I live and I don’t see why we need to be ­tolerant to these Muslims. Why don’t they go to other Muslim countries? Not here. They will not integrate.”

A 29-year-old female schoolteacher says PEGIDA support and broader concern about the migrants are increasing because people in this part of Germany aren’t often exposed to different cultures. “This is foreign to us and I fear that what the government is doing is pushing more people to support PEGIDA. I don’t support them, but the government is out of control being so overly generous and saying ‘come’. We have no houses to put the migrants, our district doesn’t have the money to pay for the migrants, they don’t know our language and they hang around doing nothing. I feel sorry for them (the refugees) because it is not their fault, but local people are upset. The migrants get money and free transport that not even the poorest German gets.” (...)

By the way, we're all, in a way, falling into a vicious globalists' trap:

Since the end of Summer holiday, obviously the whole mainstream media, and almost all politicians in Europe, have been talking about these Afghan illegal migrants (sorry, I mean "Syrian refugees") crossing into Hungary. Trying to portray them as nice "families" with young children and no desire to leech, yeah sure..., but in any case, talking about them all the time...

And meanwhile, something has disappeared from the media and public talks.... What? Well (as Sarkozy likes to say, in a dramatic tone): "I am going to tell you": the Lampedusa (and Ceuta) sub-Saharan illegal migrants!

For, it's as if Lampedusa (and Ceuta) had fallen from the surface of the earth. Not a single media picture or news anymore from Lampedusa, Melilla or Vintimille, where by the way hordes of sub-saharan young males still illegally cross into W. Europe every day...

So, the media first made the Lampedusa sub-Saharans disappear from the public eye, and then, they portray hordes of young penniless Afghans (crossing into Hungary) as... peaceful Syrian families with nice white little girls, or drowned defenseless little boys (the only pictures allowed in the media since the beginning of September).

The reality of the current illegal migrants' invasion (lol, they already have the colors of the Swedish flag painted on their boat hull, naughty bastards):


Compare with: The way mainstream media portray it:


So, to sum it up, actually the globalist assault against Europe has 2 fronts, it's a two-pronged, "Sherman-Grant" campaign:

1- Eastern front: EE has always been a pain in the neck of Globalism: countries far too homogeneous and White! So, let's send them a few hundreds of thousands of Afghan-Syrians (not African Blacks, because it would cause an immediate civil war), then some millions, to see how it works. Once they get used to Syrians-Afghans (in five, ten years?), we'll send in the African Blacks: end of game.

2- Western front: Western Europe is already weak, pussified and partially destroyed by globalism-leftism, so, we can send them the African Blacks by the million(s), Westerners won't dare revolt, and anyway (almost) all the Western media and politicians are ours.

So, please don't forget the main field of battle: Lampedusa, Vintimille Ceuta... Hungary is almost nothing but a military diversion!

I had heard though that the route from Libya was drying up a little bit because the crossing from Turkey was far safer.

At any rate, a crucial time is coming up, because I do expect that winter will dry the crossings up somewhat. The ones on the fence will probably wait until the next spring. We can expect to see maybe another month, month and a half of the big time crossings and then the cold weather will set in and slow them down a bit.

Those winter months will be crucial for Europe to get its act together, and we need to be proactive on our own end.

(09-12-2015 08:00 AM)Glaucon Wrote:  Swedish guy saying lot of sense:

I want to fund his insurgency

You know what, It's going to get only worse if Turkey gets destabilized. You may hate him, but Erdogan has similar traits to Gadhafi, he's doing his best to keep the country together. Yet the usual western media is calling him a dictator, sultan even though he got elected fair and square. Imagine Turkey becoming the next Syria, you're gonna have millions of thirsty guys crossing over the Ipsala border into Greece, and from there to rest of Europe. Considering that Turkey has a population of around 80 million, Europe might very well become the next hub of islam if this country is destabilized.

Don't believe the things the western media is throwing at you about Turkey, right now we're fighting a war against terror, everyday Turkish soldiers are losing their lives battling the Marxist-Leninist pro Kurdish terrorist organization, the PKK. Yet the PKK has a lot of support from Europe, these guys are playing with fire! I just hope that Trump gets elected, all of this mess happened because of USA's passive middle eastern policy.

Can't believe there isn't a topic on Turkey here, but this country is close to destabilization, bombs are blowing up everyday. If the government loses its authority at least 10 million people from Turkey will flee to Europe, this migrant crisis is nothing compared to what might happen in the near distant future.

(09-11-2015 09:24 AM)TonySandos Wrote:  Friends;

If this video is accurate and truthful, I am utterly ashamed and provoked by the state of my country. The lies we are fed are astronomical. The American people are more good intentioned and of great character for these actions to represent us.

It seems like nothing less than usurpation of our current leaders will remedy us from tyranny. This crisis has changed me more than I could've expected.

The US and Europe aren't beholden to guilt from the mid east, but there's barely anything we can do about it until we work under a legitimate government manipulated by moguls that wreck the world on behalf of their selfish interests.

My dad is a diplomat, he served in Libya in the late 90's. I spent 3 years of my primary school education in Libya. I can tell you that this video is very accurate. Housing was given by the govt, electricity was free, they did enjoy the highest standard of living in Africa. Yes he was a dictator, albeit not a cruel one like Saddam, his sons didn't pull women randomly out of the streets to rape them. He didn't pocket the oil money, he shared it with his people unlike the likes of Nigeria, Venezuela. He did not deserve an end like this one. I was shocked when I saw the video in which he got murdered violently. Heck I even had a picture with him. I liked the guy. If I had some type of terminal illness during the time Libya got destabilized I would of went there to fight with him side by side. He was the definition of a red pill leader.

Look at what he said 4 years ago.
http://www.businessinsider.com/qaddafi-w...cks-2011-3

It's slowly becoming a reality.

(09-11-2015 11:18 PM)CactusCat589 Wrote:  Where are the stats on Germany being 60% against the migrants from? It's very promising if true.

Not really. Over 80% of Americans are against mass immigration/illegals and yet look where we are. Hard to fight the status quo and system when both the right and left want more immigration (the left for votes, the business right for cheap labor).

(09-12-2015 07:34 AM)N°6 Wrote:  #refugeeswelcome rally in London by the Green Party.

For those outside the UK, north Surrey is very well off, upper middle class with a large commuter population who work in London's global financial firms.

It's incredible that "Greens" who supposedly support the environment and don't like people's incursion into nature can actually support immigration and/or mass migrant asylum. Have these idiots seen how bad the ecological environment in in your typical 3rd world country? Yet they want to import these people. Criminal.

Quote:Have these idiots seen how bad the ecological environment in in your typical 3rd world country?

That's not the primary issue here. The primary issue here is that moving a person from the 3rd to the 1st world is the worst thing you could do to the environment. Because his lifestyle changes, his consumption goes through the roof, ergo the "pollution" he creates goes through the roof.

If green parties were serious about their ideology, their primary platform should be:
a) no more migration to the developed world
b) spend batshit crazy money on providing and promoting contraception in the 3rd world
c) spend batshit crazy money on promoting feminism in the 3rd world as it will reduce the birth rate

Yet none of these are in their platforms and they don't fit in their current ideology (except possibly the third one - but even it may be culturally imperealistic for them).

And this is how you know the entire political spectrum has been bought.

(09-12-2015 10:18 AM)Turkish Republican Wrote:  You know what, It's going to get only worse if Turkey gets destabilized. You may hate him, but Erdogan has similar traits to Gadhafi, he's doing his best to keep the country together. Yet the usual western media is calling him a dictator, sultan even though he got elected fair and square. Imagine Turkey becoming the next Syria, you're gonna have millions of thirsty guys crossing over the Ipsala border into Greece, and from there to rest of Europe. Considering that Turkey has a population of around 80 million, Europe might very well become the next hub of islam if this country is destabilized.

Don't believe the things the western media is throwing at you about Turkey, right now we're fighting a war against terror, everyday Turkish soldiers are losing their lives battling the Marxist-Leninist pro Kurdish terrorist organization, the PKK. Yet the PKK has a lot of support from Europe, these guys are playing with fire! I just hope that Trump gets elected, all of this mess happened because of USA's passive middle eastern policy.

Can't believe there isn't a topic on Turkey here, but this country is close to destabilization, bombs are blowing up everyday. If the government loses its authority at least 10 million people from Turkey will flee to Europe, this migrant crisis is nothing compared to what might happen in the near distant future.

I'm not sure it would happen that way. If Erdogan (or another Turkish PM) was to lose control of the situation, the US/NATO would step in.
That's how Serbia lost Kosovo.

LaPD

Turkey will not fall. It's a key American pawn ally in the region and there are US bases there. Washington won't allow it to happen.

(09-12-2015 11:27 AM)La Palta Divina Wrote:  

(09-12-2015 10:18 AM)Turkish Republican Wrote:  You know what, It's going to get only worse if Turkey gets destabilized. You may hate him, but Erdogan has similar traits to Gadhafi, he's doing his best to keep the country together. Yet the usual western media is calling him a dictator, sultan even though he got elected fair and square. Imagine Turkey becoming the next Syria, you're gonna have millions of thirsty guys crossing over the Ipsala border into Greece, and from there to rest of Europe. Considering that Turkey has a population of around 80 million, Europe might very well become the next hub of islam if this country is destabilized.

Don't believe the things the western media is throwing at you about Turkey, right now we're fighting a war against terror, everyday Turkish soldiers are losing their lives battling the Marxist-Leninist pro Kurdish terrorist organization, the PKK. Yet the PKK has a lot of support from Europe, these guys are playing with fire! I just hope that Trump gets elected, all of this mess happened because of USA's passive middle eastern policy.

Can't believe there isn't a topic on Turkey here, but this country is close to destabilization, bombs are blowing up everyday. If the government loses its authority at least 10 million people from Turkey will flee to Europe, this migrant crisis is nothing compared to what might happen in the near distant future.

I'm not sure it would happen that way. If Erdogan (or another Turkish PM) was to lose control of the situation, the US/NATO would step in.
That's how Serbia lost Kosovo.

LaPD

Good point, but we saw what happened when US became involved in Iraq, Pakistan, Afghanistan, it only turned for worse. There is a guerilla warfare going on right now between the govt and Kurdish seperatists. Imagine them as vietcong, we saw last time how US faired against vietcong.

It's not an easy territory, thousands of caves for terrorists to hide in. We are fighting war on two fronts, one against ISIS, the other against the PKK.

Turkey is a controlled puppet country.

The west has always had them under their thumb.

(09-12-2015 10:56 AM)Turkish Republican Wrote:  

(09-11-2015 09:24 AM)TonySandos Wrote:  Friends;

If this video is accurate and truthful, I am utterly ashamed and provoked by the state of my country. The lies we are fed are astronomical. The American people are more good intentioned and of great character for these actions to represent us.

It seems like nothing less than usurpation of our current leaders will remedy us from tyranny. This crisis has changed me more than I could've expected.

The US and Europe aren't beholden to guilt from the mid east, but there's barely anything we can do about it until we work under a legitimate government manipulated by moguls that wreck the world on behalf of their selfish interests.

My dad is a diplomat, he served in Libya in the late 90's. I spent 3 years of my primary school education in Libya. I can tell you that this video is very accurate. Housing was given by the govt, electricity was free, they did enjoy the highest standard of living in Africa. Yes he was a dictator, albeit not a cruel one like Saddam, his sons didn't pull women randomly out of the streets to rape them. He didn't pocket the oil money, he shared it with his people unlike the likes of Nigeria, Venezuela. He did not deserve an end like this one. I was shocked when I saw the video in which he got murdered violently. Heck I even had a picture with him. I liked the guy. If I had some type of terminal illness during the time Libya got destabilized I would of went there to fight with him side by side. He was the definition of a red pill leader.

Look at what he said 4 years ago.
http://www.businessinsider.com/qaddafi-w...cks-2011-3

It's slowly becoming a reality.

Ghadaffi used to be way more radical. I remember in the 80s he was public enemy number one to the US. He was always mouthing off. Then he shot a passenger plane down over Scotland, killing hundreds of people [Edit: whoops, that happened after. The Libya bombing followed a terrorist act in Berlin]. Reagan bombed the shit out of Ghadaffi's compound, trying to kill him. I think some of his kids were killed in the bombing. Ghadaffi was pretty quiet after that.

Here's the bad news:
Europe migrant crisis: Germany readies for 40,000 arrivals
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34231905

But there is some good news.

Hungary deploys 3,800 soldiers at border with Serbia
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/region.php?y...v_id=95400

Europe migrant crisis: Hungary 'will arrest illegal migrants'
https://web.archive.org/web/201509121503...e-34224999

Viktor Orbán gives interview in German tabloid BILD
https://www.reddit.com/r/european/commen...n_tabloid/

From the interview:

Quote:You will close the borders on Tuesday. Where are the refugees supposed to go?
Back.

I am beginning to really like Orban. If Trump gets elected, I hope he shows the same decisiveness and obligation to preserve and protect the identity of a nation as Orban does.

Also, more delusion from the German government: Steinmeier warns Russia against sending military aid to Syria.
http://www.dw.com/en/steinmeier-warns-ru...a-18710867
I'm pretty sure this was Putin's reaction to Germany.


I forgot to mention that today marks the 332 anniversary of the Battle of Vienna.

(09-12-2015 10:18 AM)Turkish Republican Wrote:  You know what, It's going to get only worse if Turkey gets destabilized. You may hate him, but Erdogan has similar traits to Gadhafi, he's doing his best to keep the country together. Yet the usual western media is calling him a dictator, sultan even though he got elected fair and square. Imagine Turkey becoming the next Syria, you're gonna have millions of thirsty guys crossing over the Ipsala border into Greece, and from there to rest of Europe. Considering that Turkey has a population of around 80 million, Europe might very well become the next hub of islam if this country is destabilized.

Don't believe the things the western media is throwing at you about Turkey, right now we're fighting a war against terror, everyday Turkish soldiers are losing their lives battling the Marxist-Leninist pro Kurdish terrorist organization, the PKK. Yet the PKK has a lot of support from Europe, these guys are playing with fire! I just hope that Trump gets elected, all of this mess happened because of USA's passive middle eastern policy.

Can't believe there isn't a topic on Turkey here, but this country is close to destabilization, bombs are blowing up everyday. If the government loses its authority at least 10 million people from Turkey will flee to Europe, this migrant crisis is nothing compared to what might happen in the near distant future.

Yeah I read about this on one of the European reddit forums. It's scary if that comes true.

Could you give us some more background and context on what is going on Turkey?

Unfortunately, I know very little about Turkey and the Middle East.

(09-12-2015 11:33 AM)Turkish Republican Wrote:  

(09-12-2015 11:27 AM)La Palta Divina Wrote:  

(09-12-2015 10:18 AM)Turkish Republican Wrote:  You know what, It's going to get only worse if Turkey gets destabilized. You may hate him, but Erdogan has similar traits to Gadhafi, he's doing his best to keep the country together. Yet the usual western media is calling him a dictator, sultan even though he got elected fair and square. Imagine Turkey becoming the next Syria, you're gonna have millions of thirsty guys crossing over the Ipsala border into Greece, and from there to rest of Europe. Considering that Turkey has a population of around 80 million, Europe might very well become the next hub of islam if this country is destabilized.

Don't believe the things the western media is throwing at you about Turkey, right now we're fighting a war against terror, everyday Turkish soldiers are losing their lives battling the Marxist-Leninist pro Kurdish terrorist organization, the PKK. Yet the PKK has a lot of support from Europe, these guys are playing with fire! I just hope that Trump gets elected, all of this mess happened because of USA's passive middle eastern policy.

Can't believe there isn't a topic on Turkey here, but this country is close to destabilization, bombs are blowing up everyday. If the government loses its authority at least 10 million people from Turkey will flee to Europe, this migrant crisis is nothing compared to what might happen in the near distant future.

I'm not sure it would happen that way. If Erdogan (or another Turkish PM) was to lose control of the situation, the US/NATO would step in.
That's how Serbia lost Kosovo.

LaPD

Good point, but we saw what happened when US became involved in Iraq, Pakistan, Afghanistan, it only turned for worse. There is a guerilla warfare going on right now between the govt and Kurdish seperatists. Imagine them as vietcong, we saw last time how US faired against vietcong.

It's not an easy territory, thousands of caves for terrorists to hide in. We are fighting war on two fronts, one against ISIS, the other against the PKK.

I think you didn't get what I was trying to say.
If the Turkish government was to lose control over the Kurdistan issue, ethnic cleansing would be their next step. And it would not happen, because the US/NATO would not allow it. Kurdistan would then most likely gain autonomous status, which would be converted into independance several years/decades later.
As for the US bases in Turkey, I can only say that Serbia was humiliated, yet it's still doing what the EU wants them to do in order to join them.
Money rules.
The West's got the money.
The West rules.

LaPD

(09-12-2015 08:31 AM)Going strong Wrote:  Compare with: The way mainstream media portray it:


So, to sum it up, actually the globalist assault against Europe has 2 fronts, it's a two-pronged, "Sherman-Grant" campaign:

1- Eastern front: EE has always been a pain in the neck of Globalism: countries far too homogeneous and White! So, let's send them a few hundreds of thousands of Afghan-Syrians (not African Blacks, because it would cause an immediate civil war), then some millions, to see how it works. Once they get used to Syrians-Afghans (in five, ten years?), we'll send in the African Blacks: end of game.

2- Western front: Western Europe is already weak, pussified and partially destroyed by globalism-leftism, so, we can send them the African Blacks by the million(s), Westerners won't dare revolt, and anyway (almost) all the Western media and politicians are ours.

So, please don't forget the main field of battle: Lampedusa, Vintimille Ceuta... Hungary is almost nothing but a military diversion!

0- Central front: the minds of critically thinking, free Europeans.

(09-12-2015 11:39 AM)rudebwoy Wrote:  Turkey is a controlled puppet country.

The west has always had them under their thumb.

It's true Turkey is very much a pawn in a lot of ways.

They harbor uighur militants and have had some kind of role in fomenting unrest on China's western border. Probably CIA related activities with Turkey being involved.

They are also instrumental in being a U.S. base. Geographically speaking Turkey is strategically vital. It allows the U.S. to hit 3 different vital regions without carriers.

They also have some kind of role when it comes to economic sanctions in the area. I read that a lot of financial stuff from the middle east runs through Turkey first.

Now the whole migrant thing is being orchestrated though Turkey. More fuckery by the elites.

(09-12-2015 11:57 AM)El Chinito loco Wrote:  

(09-12-2015 11:39 AM)rudebwoy Wrote:  Turkey is a controlled puppet country.

The west has always had them under their thumb.

It's true Turkey is very much a pawn in a lot of ways.

They harbor uighur militants and have had some kind of role in fomenting unrest on China's western border. Probably CIA related activities with Turkey being involved.

They are also instrumental in being a U.S. base. Geographically speaking Turkey is strategically vital. It allows the U.S. to hit 3 different vital regions without carriers.

They also have some kind of role when it comes to economic sanctions in the area. I read that a lot of financial stuff from the middle east runs through Turkey first.

Now the whole migrant thing is being orchestrated though Turkey. More fuckery by the elites.

A lot of nonsense has been said in this thread but I actually agree with this. Turkey is a major American ally in the region and a major beneficiary of American aid for weapons. Them being involved in this likely means America is involved in this or at the very least supports it happening.

On another note as much as people complain about this from an cultural POV the fact that so many European countries are aging means these refugee's and their children will be needed from an economic perspective to work to help pay for the care of a large aging population in most of Europe's countries.

The key is to make sure that they find jobs that require them to put into those countries version of social security. If they go to Europe and just become part of a unemployed underclass then this will be a disaster from an economic standpoint.

EE is a whole other issue though

Quote:The process has begun, the process of self-destruction of the West


Writer and politician Eduard Limonov — about why the current migration to Europe in its consequences can be compared to 9/11

After September 11, 2001 the world changed for the worse.
Clearly we saw that it has changed at the airports. Passenger screening has become a routine as two drops of water resembling prison frisks. You've all been through it yourself. Therefore I will not try to describe for you the obvious.

Roughly speaking, the world has become less democratic. In response to the tragedy of 9/11 there is a lot more police and elements of totalitarianism. Everywhere: in the United States, and the old, but careless Europe.

USA in order to punish someone for the crime of 9/11, invaded Afghanistan, which nestled peacefully in its not particularly pugnacious version of the middle ages, under the pretext that Afghanistan is sheltering Bin Laden, and that this Saudi troublemaker organized the terrorist attacks in New York. I personally think that Bin Laden, the conceited leader of Al-Qaida simply took credit for the biggest terrorist act in history.

We all lived the last 14 years in the atmosphere of decreasing freedoms, and the elements of non-freedom that are very similar to practices from the book of George Orwell's "1984" are increasingly rooted in our lives. Not yet fascism, but a special kind of totalitarianism — from fear, of course — but it doesn't make it easier.

To compensate the citizens for limited political freedoms and implementation of prison practices, Europe and the United States began suspiciously emphasizing the secondary rights of the individual.

I relate the epidemic of sweet love of the European governments and heads of the United States to same-sex love, same-sex marriages, slobbering humanitarian gestures like swinging the rights of the disabled and adoption of sick and foreign children, etc. — you can continue the list — in particular with the tightening of political life in the West and the increase of police powers.

This is how we made it to the recent years. 2013, 2014 and 2015 brought us new surprises. And still will. Europe is faced with a choice: either become militantly nationalist with elements of Nazism and fascism, or be changed beyond recognition. The problem of invasion of migrants to Europe — is the most terrible challenge to Europe in its history.

What is the situation?

As a result of the predatory policy of the USA and Europe the statehood of several important countries was blown to hell. Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya — now finishing off Syria - were attacked by the West. The so-called "human rights" wars, the armed conflicts waged by the West, were and remain aggressions, only clothed in modern human-rights garments that hide their cannibalistic essence. Africa is destabilized, directly or indirectly, the clashes between "Good" and "Evil" in several African countries — Mali, the most glaring example - destroyed their statehood as well.

Ukraine broke its statehood seemingly by itself, but wasn't it encouraged by the Americans, the Poles, the Dutch, the Germans, the Finns, the French, the Balts, speaking to Ukrainians on Maidan? So the number of destroyed states is joined by Ukraine. Europeans and the Yankees systematically pit Maidan against Russia. Interestingly, now when Russia is not a Communist country and not Soviet, we are hated with the same zeal, therefore it has become clear, I hope, that anti-communism and anti-sovietism were only a camouflage for their russophobia.

It is clear that the peoples and tribes fled from their devastated areas.

And where to run?

The U.S. shores are far away, the fragile boats cannot make it across the ocean.

And from the ravaged coast of Libya the Italian island of Lampedusa is a stones throw away. And Greece is close.

No matter how sinister, clever, and rich is ISIS, however, it can not afford to arrange the exodus of an untold number of refugees. I do not support the hypothesis that the fiends of hell organised and delivered hundreds of thousands of refugees to Europe. It's not ISIS.

And that most barbarians flocking to Europe are young men, I see a simple pattern: just men are in better physical shape than women and children, they can overcome the difficulties and sufferings of the journey beyond the three seas to the rich Europe, into her heart — rich Germany.

Which of them run away from the war, others from ruin and poverty, which are the consequences of war, is difficult to sort out. And the biggest Professor at the Sorbonne cannot sort this out. Both are true.

You, Europeans and Americans, have stirred up the anthill by kicking it with your boots, so what do you want? Don't complain, don't creak, it's your fault! In order for the migrants not to flock to you, you must create for them unbearable conditions. But you will not do that. Well, not because you're kind, you're not kind, but your image of "well-wishers" is important, who just wiped their hands from the blood of citizens of the states shattered to pieces.

As on September 9, 2001, migrants (footage from the train station in Budapest is striking and strong, because this is the Middle East, Asia and Africa in photos and video, not Europe) will change the world beyond recognition. Already changing.

Either there will be another religion, black eyes and dark skin. God save us from accusations of racism (just in case), but the citizens of Germany will resemble the citizens of the Middle East. Or there will be fascist and racist states, hiding behind barbed wire, walls and machine guns. There is no third option.

In Russia, I learned today, there are 2.5 million refugees from Ukraine (or rather, 2 503 680 people), but they can not be distinguished from Russians. So assimilation is not threatening us. We will have the same eyes, same skin, the same religion. We will not have a problem of adaptation of Ukrainians. We happened to be in a better position than the unfortunate Europe, doomed to disappear in the form in which it existed for half a millennium.

I care. I would prefer old Europe. But if another option is impossible and Europe is hostile to Russia, let it disappear.

And last.

The process of self-destruction of the West is already irreversible. As Gorbachev used to say, "the process started".

We watched the process of self-destruction of the USSR. Now it's Europe's turn. To each its own.

http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/09/edu...ction.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eduard_Limonov

(09-12-2015 12:20 PM)Clyde Rules Wrote:  On another note as much as people complain about this from an cultural POV the fact that so many European countries are aging means these refugee's and their children will be needed from an economic perspective to work to help pay for the care of a large aging population in most of Europe's countries.

You are assuming that culture and economics are not related to each other as well as that an analysis from a single point of view will yield an adequate representation of reality. However, that is incorrect. When assessing a situation such as the migrant crisis, all aspects - namely, culture, politics, economy, science and technology, geopolitics, history - must be covered in order to understand what is really going on.

Nonetheless, even from a purely economic viewpoint your argument fails to be consistent with reality.

For example, you failed to measure the economic value of the immigrants that arriving to Europe.

Lets measure their economic value.

• Most immigrants are young men from countries that have not yet modernized or are in the process of modernization.
• People from less modern and industrial countries tend to be less intelligent and have less education than people from industrial countries.
• Consequently, this mean that most immigrants from less industrial do not have high level skills. Most are low level skill workers.
• Low level jobs are beginning to disappear in industrial countries due to automation or outsourcing.
  

In conclusion, the West is basically importing a lot of low skill workers despite the fact that the supply for low level jobs is decreasing. Now if you analyze the current situation from a other viewpoints, you will find out that the West is in big trouble.

Quote:On another note as much as people complain about this from an cultural POV the fact that so many European countries are aging means these refugee's and their children will be needed from an economic perspective to work to help pay for the care of a large aging population in most of Europe's countries.

As a person who has a grasp of the basics of machine learning and AI (admittedly, only university-level; no practical experience in the field) and who knows some people working in the area, I can assure you of this:

Every job that fits a certain 'pattern' or that can be substituted for large-scale data analysis + automated feedback systems will be automated in (my conservative estimate) the next 3 decades. Soon, the economies will struggle to create enough jobs and technological unemployment will be the issue, not dependency ratios.

The economic argument for immigration is actually the only one that makes any sort of sense and that's why it's so important to dispell it. Fact is, this issue has become mainstream in the past few years yet it does not fit the narrative of the elites (not only immigration, but taxes, the social system, free trade, etc.) For more basic info on the matter you can check out Brynjolfsson and McAfee's book or Martin Ford's. Just be wary of the progressive political gibberish mixed in the message.

Turkey may be a puppet of Nato and the US but stranger things have come and gone in the past decade. With the Middle East dismantling itself along religious and political lines it will be interesting to observe how they and Nato deal with the PKK.

Turkey is bombing the Kurds in Iraq and Syria which if you think about it from a military point of view is ridiculous. They're fighting ISIS with the backing of the US but Turkey wants them dead. US assets are inside Turkey as we speak.

The White House has boxed itself into a corner here and I wouldn't bet on them finding a clean compromise. Russian military presence in Syria will rule out attempts to remove Assad and they're not going to stop supporting the Kurds.

I reckon if Turkey destabilizes we will never see an end to it.