Post: #26

(04-08-2018 09:41 AM)Bienvenuto Wrote:  1. What is the forum's tolerance for journals/ logs focusing on self improvement that are not approach / gym-related? Say eating disorders or what-not. Is it encouraged even if nobody else is interested in the posts -or- discouraged for clogging up the forum with what could be seen as mostly notes-to-self?

I'd defer to a mod, but so long as it's in good faith, self-improvement logs are valued. The "life" and newbie forums are fairly broad, and various logs and discussions can add value to others with similar interests or issues.

Post: #27

(04-08-2018 01:22 PM)kbronik Wrote:  

(04-08-2018 12:10 PM)Steelex Wrote:  The real problem here is that you are not as good as you think you are. You say you're smart and logical but how's that working for ya?

Some people cant come to terms with reality. You're essentially saying "I look good, I have a good personality, I know how to talk to girls" when that's obviously not the case. If it was true you wouldn't be writing this.

You need to do some solid introspection and figure out what is holding you back. My guess is that you are shitty at talking to girls and your social skills suck.

Na man I have no reason to lie and I am not delusional. I think my problem is not having met enough girls. In the past 8-9 months I met like 5 girls in real life in the right context to ask them out, but none were interested, even though I acted alpha and made them laugh and stuff. Well actually 1 was interested but due to my luck, due to a retarded and weird circumstance that was not either of our choices it couldn't work out.

I think it comes down to the fact that I don't have a social circle. It is such a tough choice.. I might be able to get a girlfriend if I become social but then as an introvert I would hate that life. I am stuck between 2 shitty options. But it seems like even with a big social circle it is hard to meet girls. It seems like every year girls get more picky in terms of chad only, and also every year online dating becomes more mainstream, so that also makes girls chad only because once a girl uses online dating she will never give real life non chad guy a chance again.

What the fuck is a Chad? A guy who isn't you? A white guy? Are you Indian or Muslim or Asian?

You ARE being illogical. Your statement is as follows...

1. You want a girl.

2. You know actually being social and meeting women is what you need to do.

3. You don't want to be social because you have introvert/social anxiety issues.

4. You realize the dilemma, and continue to beat your head against a brick wall.

To do the same thing and expect different results is the DEFINITION of insanity.

The common denominator between you and all your success and all your failures is YOU. More specifically it's your mentality regarding them. You can do something about it through force of will or beat off into your grandma's socks till you're 55. You may not like being social but it beats the fuck out of not getting laid.

Post: #28

Women, even the ones dumber than a bag of hair can smell neediness a mile away

Fix that

Maybe find some interesting hobby and get good at it to develop some confidence

If you’re doing fun interesting things, the social circle (and girls) will soon follow

Post: #29

(04-08-2018 08:20 PM)polar Wrote:  Take the advice in this thread with an open mind. The advice is generally consistent...because most of us have been there, in one way or another.

OP hasn't hit ego death / rock bottom yet. I've been there myself. Actively sheltering your ego, hamstering, to maintain illusory superiority. You'll hopefully realize sooner than later that the people who do (or don't) want to be in your life are a more accurate grade of your worth than you are yourself.

I suggest others not to waste their time with additional suggestions...let's get a post from OP that basically says "thank you all, I'll try this, this, and this advice for <noticeable length of time> and report back."

I do appreciate the advice. I mean I have thought of all this stuff myself before. But the thing is any time I actually tried to apply it, it blew up in my face. When rejection happens so much, your faith/motivation in something decreases. I have to remain very strong to not give up but my rational mind tells me "if something doesn't try 99 times what are the chances the 100th time will." I know I have no choice but to go on, but I got super frustrated and needed to vent so I came on here and wrote this stuff. I still believe in everything I wrote: i.e. alpha fucks beta bux is true, game is overrated, etc... but I am also reasonable. I am not extremist or black/white like those lookism guys. I have said that I did see non-chads with girlfriends, which means it is at least theoretically possible. I am just frustrated because the odds are so stacked against me and it feels like it will take an eternity even with maximal effort, to finally find a gf. Then every time I fail I get more frustrated because I see guys who are non-chads and even uglier than me with girlfriends and they didn't have to put effort they just got lucky. So the frustration makes it harder to focus. I mean it is easy to tell people to not give up but constant rejection combined with being in a constantly frustrated state really fucks with your mind and makes it a chore to continue. Every additional rejection makes you feel like a clown like "who am I trying to kid why did I even bother I am wasting my time."

But see now I don't know if it is worth it to put all the effort and as an introvert become a social guy and put myself out there. This is because I am only a few years away from having a stable good career, and at that point the girls my age or a few years younger will only be looking to settler down with a rich provider. So then I can just pump and dump those girls by luring them with the idea of marriage. I already said I put a good job on bumble and got matches with decent looking girls. And by then I will be too old to bang girls in their late teen early 20s anyway so no point in trying to be a social chad. I don't know maybe I am wrong about this. Does anyone have any reasons that I should actually try to be a social chad from now on, in light of this paragraph?

Post: #30

(04-08-2018 10:42 PM)kbronik Wrote:  I do appreciate the advice. I mean I have thought of all this stuff myself before. But the thing is any time I actually tried to apply it, it blew up in my face. When rejection happens so much, your faith/motivation in something decreases. I have to remain very strong to not give up but my rational mind tells me "if something doesn't try 99 times what are the chances the 100th time will." I know I have no choice but to go on, but I got super frustrated and needed to vent so I came on here and wrote this stuff. I still believe in everything I wrote: i.e. alpha fucks beta bux is true, game is overrated, etc... but I am also reasonable. I am not extremist or black/white like those lookism guys. I have said that I did see non-chads with girlfriends, which means it is at least theoretically possible. I am just frustrated because the odds are so stacked against me and it feels like it will take an eternity even with maximal effort, to finally find a gf. Then every time I fail I get more frustrated because I see guys who are non-chads and even uglier than me with girlfriends and they didn't have to put effort they just got lucky. So the frustration makes it harder to focus. I mean it is easy to tell people to not give up but constant rejection combined with being in a constantly frustrated state really fucks with your mind and makes it a chore to continue. Every additional rejection makes you feel like a clown like "who am I trying to kid why did I even bother I am wasting my time."

You have NO clue what effort somebody really puts into a girl. I know of plenty of "chads" that work their ass off just to keep a girl's attention.


sounds to me like you'll rather complain than actually do something. you're more of a theorist than an actual scientist. That's for the MGTOW people and most MGTOW guys were once successful with women.


TAKE THE ADVICE THAT WE GAVE YOU, CREATE A LOG AND CONSTANTLY KEEP US UPDATED AND I BET YOU WILL SEE RESULTS

Post: #31

Are you socially awkward at all during the dates? Try to make good eye contact, have good body language and don't come off too needy. Just act like you're listening to the stupid shit shes saying using active listening techniques. With good logistics you should be good to go. Maybe take a few shots before the dates to loosen you up, or if you want I could actually pm u a supplement I developed that lowers social anxiety, works pretty well for me. Girls can sense if you're needy so you gotta just fake it until you get enough pussy to not feel needy.

Post: #32

(04-08-2018 05:19 AM)kbronik Wrote:  I don't know if I am doing anything wrong or I am just unlucky. I have been trying to get a gf and/or sex for the past 8-9 months. There are no girls at my job, I am out of school, I don't have friends (willingly), and clubbing and cold-approaching only work if you are chad or lower your standards to own hand>girl levels.

So I tried online dating. Tinder, bumble, POF, you name it. It has been months. I messaged dozens of girls on POF, a good portion of them replied, but then they would randomly stop talking for no reason. I tried everything: asking for whatsapp right away, being direct right away, waiting a bit then asking for whatsapp, waiting a lot then asking for whatsapp. Nothing worked, except for this 1 girl (ironically, she was the best looking of all the ones I messaged) who gave her whatsapp and then we dated. But she wasted my time.. we went on a date it went well and she was interested. Then a few days we chatted before setting up the date which is when she just lost interest through no fault of my own as our chat went fine. Obviously she found someone better.

I got 0 dates from tinder and bumble. I don't know how any guy succeeds, you must be a top 20%er. On tinder I got a decent number of matches the first 2 days, after that 1 match per month. I am a 6/10-7/10, have a good profile, good pictures, etc.. so I can't think of any problem. The girls who did match with me in the beginning were 3/10-4/10, but barely any of them replied, 1 replied but then stopped talking randomly. Same experience on bumble.

On bumble I listed a good job on my profile and suddenly I started getting more matches and also better looking girls. Still a low number of matches overall though, and only 1 of them said hi. I didn't bother replying as I don't think she would have let me fuck her prior to finding out that is not my real job. Then I took the job away and again back to 0/1 match from a fugly entitled bitch per month.

So yea. This online thing just doesn't seem to work unless you are a top 20%er. I already read about this before but I just wanted to try it myself. Well I can confirm it now.

I guess the only way for me to meet a girl is in real life, but that will take something like 5-10 years to find one. Cold-approaches are same as online dating: if you are not chad she will automatically say no; no girls at my work; I don't go to school. I even tried volunteering several places but it just made me more frustrated because single girls my age were rare and if they were there, there was no chance to talk to them, like I couldn't go to another group while they were working on something then randomly introduce myself to a girl in front of everyone. So I said fuck that I already wasted so much time on that shit.

I guess the only way is through a social circle, but I am an introvert, I would rather die than be who I am not 24/7 and deal with 100s of annoying dumb people and fake friends daily.

What really pisses me off is, on a daily basis, seeing guys uglier than me with decent looking girlfriend. Talk about luck. I just feel like I have been singled out to be excluded from the laws of the universe because every single girl that I even met in real life is a chad only type. Yet I see all these ugly non chad guys with decent looking girlfriends. How come 0% of the girls I happen to bump into through random luck end up being chad only, just like online girls. I am a smart and logical guy.. I usually figure most things out using logic... but this I cannot.

You have a poor attitude. I'm not sure you understand to what extent this can hurt you. You really need to work on that first, people tend to stay away from people who exude negativity and are drawn towards people who are positive.

My sincerest advice is to read How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie. The book teaches how to interact with people effectively, it is not a book about pick up artistry.

Here is direct download of the pdf
https://archive.org/download/BooksOfArsl...hlQY07Wyy_

You can read the Amazon reviews here
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/reviews/0...op?ie=UTF8

I will actually promise you this will solve your problems if you read it. This book profoundly impacted my life personally. It is "fuck I wish I understood that earlier" 101.

Good luck to you.

Lastly, I would like to appeal to the moderators not to ban our new friend who is currently stuck in the trap of negativity, as long as he doesn't make new threads this frequently. this forum may be a valuable resource to him and I fear he will reject the advice if he is cast out of the forum.

Post: #33

(04-09-2018 12:42 AM)bigolteddies Wrote:  Are you socially awkward at all during the dates? Try to make good eye contact, have good body language and don't come off too needy. Just act like you're listening to the stupid shit shes saying using active listening techniques. With good logistics you should be good to go. Maybe take a few shots before the dates to loosen you up, or if you want I could actually pm u a supplement I developed that lowers social anxiety, works pretty well for me. Girls can sense if you're needy so you gotta just fake it until you get enough pussy to not feel needy.

Not at all. My dates go very well. My problem is that I don't meet enough girls, and online dating is extremely difficult unless you look like chad. I dated one girl through online dating, we went on 2 dates, she was def interested after the first one but then she just started to lose interest for no reason, well I know the reason now she obviously found someone better online and monkeybranched.

Post: #34

Read up on everything Omega, because that is honestly how it appears you are conveying yourself. You want to then distance yourself from this attitude/behaviour.

Concurrently, casting ego aside do some serious introspection whilst working on your openness - to learning, about yourself, others, social interactions/hierarchies.

Accept that failure is part of growth. In 2 years you’ll look back and see how far you’ve come.

Post: #35

(04-08-2018 10:42 PM)kbronik Wrote:  

(04-08-2018 08:20 PM)polar Wrote:  Take the advice in this thread with an open mind. The advice is generally consistent...because most of us have been there, in one way or another.

OP hasn't hit ego death / rock bottom yet. I've been there myself. Actively sheltering your ego, hamstering, to maintain illusory superiority. You'll hopefully realize sooner than later that the people who do (or don't) want to be in your life are a more accurate grade of your worth than you are yourself.

I suggest others not to waste their time with additional suggestions...let's get a post from OP that basically says "thank you all, I'll try this, this, and this advice for <noticeable length of time> and report back."

I do appreciate the advice. I mean I have thought of all this stuff myself before. But the thing is any time I actually tried to apply it, it blew up in my face. When rejection happens so much, your faith/motivation in something decreases. I have to remain very strong to not give up but my rational mind tells me "if something doesn't try 99 times what are the chances the 100th time will." I know I have no choice but to go on, but I got super frustrated and needed to vent so I came on here and wrote this stuff. I still believe in everything I wrote: i.e. alpha fucks beta bux is true, game is overrated, etc... but I am also reasonable. I am not extremist or black/white like those lookism guys. I have said that I did see non-chads with girlfriends, which means it is at least theoretically possible. I am just frustrated because the odds are so stacked against me and it feels like it will take an eternity even with maximal effort, to finally find a gf. Then every time I fail I get more frustrated because I see guys who are non-chads and even uglier than me with girlfriends and they didn't have to put effort they just got lucky. So the frustration makes it harder to focus. I mean it is easy to tell people to not give up but constant rejection combined with being in a constantly frustrated state really fucks with your mind and makes it a chore to continue. Every additional rejection makes you feel like a clown like "who am I trying to kid why did I even bother I am wasting my time."

But see now I don't know if it is worth it to put all the effort and as an introvert become a social guy and put myself out there. This is because I am only a few years away from having a stable good career, and at that point the girls my age or a few years younger will only be looking to settler down with a rich provider. So then I can just pump and dump those girls by luring them with the idea of marriage. I already said I put a good job on bumble and got matches with decent looking girls. And by then I will be too old to bang girls in their late teen early 20s anyway so no point in trying to be a social chad. I don't know maybe I am wrong about this. Does anyone have any reasons that I should actually try to be a social chad from now on, in light of this paragraph?

You still don't get it though. Think of game as strategy and logistics. Let's say you know game theory optimal strategy for tennis, and you know how to adapt ideally to every player on the tour. It's all worthless if you don't also have thousands of hours of motor memory experience, a well trained body, and seasoned mental game to execute. Think of looks, money and status as the physical attributes of the athlete and the social/game experience as the strategy component. The former physical attributes are necessary but not sufficient for success. Obviously if you are top few percent physically you won't need as must strategy, but with little or none you will still fail.

Thinking you will start succeeding once you have a better career is like a tennis amateur thinking he just needs more jacked legs and biceps to be like the Chads on tour, so he just gives up practicing skills and strategy until then. There are countless millionaires who can't get laid to save their lives because they don't have the game and aren't socially apt enough to execute. Money and career are important, especially to keep girls around, but they are not going to compensate for bad game unless you are mega rich or celebrity status. Even then, game would improve your results dramatically.

Post: #36

(04-08-2018 10:42 PM)kbronik Wrote:  But see now I don't know if it is worth it to put all the effort and as an introvert become a social guy and put myself out there. This is because I am only a few years away from having a stable good career, and at that point the girls my age or a few years younger will only be looking to settler down with a rich provider. So then I can just pump and dump those girls by luring them with the idea of marriage. I already said I put a good job on bumble and got matches with decent looking girls. And by then I will be too old to bang girls in their late teen early 20s anyway so no point in trying to be a social chad. I don't know maybe I am wrong about this. Does anyone have any reasons that I should actually try to be a social chad from now on, in light of this paragraph?

Yes. Here are several.

1) First, nobody said you need to be a "social chad", as in going out at night 6 days a week. Get that stereotype out of your head. There's a wide spectrum of socialization, and in fact the majority of people would qualify as "social" without falling into that stereotype. Playing pick-up basketball, going surfing/Crossfit/hiking, and doing volunteer work with an organization would all qualify as social things. Having a circle of like-minded friends and acquaintances is human nature, and is beneficial for a man's health and sanity.

2) Being social opens up opportunities to meet women in an organic way, and these relationships tend to last the longest. The vast majority of young, quality women in enjoy being social. Again, I will stress - this does not have to be through the "social chad" stereotype. Furthermore, imagine you actually meet a quality girl online. If you start to date seriously, she'll want to introduce you to her friends (yes, quality girls tend to have friends, if she doesn't its a red flag). You're going to have to be social then. There isn't really a way to have a serious relationship without having basic social skills.

3) If you have no desire for marriage/kids at all and just want to pump/dump sluts, that's fine. But, when you're older and want to fuck younger girls consistently, being socially adjusted is pretty useful as well. Don't think that it magically becomes easier when you're older. The older guys who are successful here have put in a ton of work into their careers, the gym, and their social skills. Having "a stable job" doesn't qualify as successful especially if a guy is socially awkward and not in great shape.

4) People who are complete introverts and show no desire to even work on their social skills are not usually very successful financially either. The exceptions are those who build very successful businesses and are able to delegate other tasks such as marketing, etc. But, in general, high powered careers also require being socially aware, and many people get good jobs through "networking" (ie: this is a guy who is awesome to have a beer with).

There's a lot of great advice earlier in the thread about how to improve your social skills. The main advice I can give is -- talk to people, not just hot women. This will help you in many ways.

Post: #37

OP, there's not much to add to what's been written already. You've been given top advice: swallow your pride, drop the defenses, and act on it.

It seems clear that your self perception is out of whack. If you are an introvert who has trouble building a social circle and is constantly consumed with negative emotion towards poor old Chad Thundercock, yet you think that your game and alpha-ness are great, even though you aren't sealing the deal, I can tell you from here that you are giving lots of incongruent /negative vibes towards the girls you meet without realising it.

Meeting girls should be a hobby. I happen to enjoy fishing. When I go out and catch nothing, I don't feel bad, I enjoy the process, I learn something every time (even if it's just that I'm fishing in the wrong place) and besides, it's not the most important thing in my life, it's just a game.

IMO, the most important benchmarks for you are improving yourself as a person, expanding your social network, learning about the world and women in particular, and having a fun romantic time.
If you have the attitude that it's only about getting the bang, and make yourself feel shitty and jealous when you don't get it, you can easily turn an enjoyable hobby into something that makes you bitter and thus less attractive.

Before anyone calls me a game denialist, allow me to elaborate: getting a bang will barely help you get the next one, beyond making you a bit more confident. If it did help you, then you could just bang a whore, then hit the club. If you go out and all you do is get lucky with a drunk slut, a right time right place deal, you will get a bang for the night, but your game won't improve. If you go out, socialise with lots of different people, have fun, dance, organise a meetup to play scrabble, flirt with several girls, get some numbers that go nowhere etc etc, your notch count won't improve, but your game will.
Learning about and/or improving yourself/women/life/social interaction in general, and having flirty fun in particular, well, that's what game is, and that's what will help you get future bangs and hotter girls.

I second reading How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie. Apart from reading that, however, it does sound like you spend too much time autistically reading about game etc.

Try a detox from all game/MGTOW/red pill articles and videos. Yup, even this forum, excellent as it is. Keep notes by all means and then give us the best bits here after a month. Bear in mind that game, politics, red pill stuff in general are usually terrible conversation choices with most girls. If you are drinking them in daily, it's not good for your banter. Take Roosh's advice and absorb Seinfeld for a month instead.

Challenge yourself to a month of going to social events/places (not just clubs/bars) and schmoozing indiscriminately with everyone you can. Stop scanning the room for ratios and sets and hot girls, just act like you are partially responsible for hosting the event and making sure that everyone has a good time, gets introduced to each other, you get the idea.

Post: #38

Reading is great, I spent a long time reading and listening to everything I could about game.

Going out and taking action is even better, but the most improvement happened for me when I combined both things.

After an interaction with a girl, successful or not, I would look for the most relevant articles I could that related to the situation I was in. Roosh's books, blog, Heartiste even Return of Kings if neccessary.

I would then plan what to do next, do something and then again read more to see how I could have done better.

I would repeat this many times. I would read with my previous actions still fresh in my mind. Then I would act with my previous reading still fresh in my mind. Repeating the advice to myself if necessary.

Eventually the most important parts of game such as not turning girls off with needy beta behaviour became firmly drilled into my brain and second nature to me.

I could have asked for advice here, but I was having many lightbulb moments working at it on my own and reading that I never felt the need to.