Post: #1

Last evening I went to a sort of a meeting house associated with the local congregation; a place run by very young workers associated with the church and providing activities for adults of all ages, most of it religiously neutral.

I went in a with a slightly shitty attitude, not expecting to discover much but as soon as I entered my eyes met with a girl I had not seen before and she seemed curious. I took off my shoes and coat and sat down to be with the few people who were not occupied with games and their own groups too much and started picking their brains with the new girl in attendance. I had some social proof from a hot worker saying she was happy to see me there (surprising compliment though probably born out of kindness more than anything else) and had a good chat with the people in close vicinity except for the mystery girl who hardly uttered a word.
When everyone else was busy doing something else for a moment, I immediately introduced myself to the new girl and started inquiring subtly about her reasons for being there and finding out whether or not she's a part of the staff or if she's associated with someone as in possibly dating a guy from there; most attendants were male. I had a hard time hearing her through everyone else's chattering so I went for a strategic move of saying I'll get something to drink, which I did and then sat close to her so as to prevent myself from being blocked from her immediate vicinity and attention.
My mind was lethargic and I ruminated for minutes while trying to think of something to say. Then asked her for the time and not soon after I suggested we go and catch some fresh air. She asked if we would be going farther or just outside the building and I suggested the latter, which I believed to be smart as it would be a smaller investment on her part since I had not managed to build that much comfort yet or so I thought. To my positive surprise she complied and we chatted in private, in the cold, for a moment until I suggested we go somewhere to snack as I knew she was tired and the house would close its doors soon. She hesitated a bit, saying she had recently eaten, but I dodged this by suggesting that we could just drink something. She still seemed a bit hesitant, I tried to play it cool and comforted her by saying that I know she was confronted with the suggestion quite quickly but she eventually went to get her stuff and off we went. What impressed me the most about this is that she did all this in the plain view of everyone else which left no question as to the fact that there was some chemistry between me and her and I imagine that the rest of them might have chattered about it as we left. I never had a choice anyway as she was pretty much glued to her seat prior to this and I had to do my initial talking despite everyone else witnessing it more or less.

We talked as we went and I offered to pay for her order and she had a simple drink out of courtesy I believe, not wanting to burden me financially. Even as we were indoors her hands were trembling and she seemed nervous; having previously hinted that she was temporarily laid off work and was doing some sort of rehabilitative work practice on a weekly basis. Instead of seeing this as some sort of a red flag I felt relieved as I'm not particularly succesful, on paper, for my age though I do have some accomplishments to my name. A lot of the time her speech was only barely intelligible to me which I took to be a sign of shyness and could not really see her as having any cognitive issues but could imagine her scoring high'ish on the aspergers spectrum. She sort of rambled in her speech where she seemed to back out mid sentence at times and then start off anew.

She had earlier hinted about going to her parents for the night as her apartment was quite farther away and as we left the fast food joint for the street she sort of asked for my permission to call for a ride, which I was fine with of course. My apartment was only hundreds of meters away but given her timid nature and the fact that I already sort of went on a 'date' with her out of the blue and had her show a lot of initiative, on the female scale, left me feeling hopeful and content and I decided not to push it. What I did was have her type my number on her phone as I did not have a phone, paper or a pen and after some initial confusion she did just that. I let her know in no uncertain terms that I would be expecting a text message from her and that I would give her a call upon receiving it, not specifying the time. I said that I enjoyed meeting her and shook her hand; could have perhaps gone for a hug especially as she was quite cold but, again, did not want to push her perceived boundaries too much in such a short time.

I did not receive a text message from her that night, which I put down to her saying that she would be sound asleep as soon as she got back to her parents' place but will be heavily disappointed if I won't hear from her in a few days.

Post: #2

1 Congratulations on running some good escalation and venue bouncing game. This is fundamental and it's good for you to have pulled this off
2 I think you are in danger of overthinking this whole thing. Take a bit of a chill pill and pride yourself on what you did that went well (you seem to know this)
3 Demanding a text from her, especially when she already seemed somewhat nervous was probably too far, even if you said it in a warm tone of voice in this context
4 I suggest cooling off and getting over the fact that she didn't text back. So what? Never bring it up to her. Ever. Unless you've been banging her for months and you just want something to talk about in that aftersex refractory period.
5 Once you get over what you perceive as a diss, which could very well be her being nervous as hell and wanting you to actually make a move, send her a text. Don't immediately ask her out on the date, get her a little warm and comfortable with the idea
6 Get her on a date and continue escalating until you get what you want out of this
7 Don't forget to hit on other girls in the mean time to keep your mind off of this one until you do some deal signing

Post: #3

(12-09-2016 11:16 PM)philosophical_recovery Wrote:  1 Congratulations on running some good escalation and venue bouncing game. This is fundamental and it's good for you to have pulled this off
2 I think you are in danger of overthinking this whole thing. Take a bit of a chill pill and pride yourself on what you did that went well (you seem to know this)
3 Demanding a text from her, especially when she already seemed somewhat nervous was probably too far, even if you said it in a warm tone of voice in this context
4 I suggest cooling off and getting over the fact that she didn't text back. So what? Never bring it up to her. Ever. Unless you've been banging her for months and you just want something to talk about in that aftersex refractory period.
5 Once you get over what you perceive as a diss, which could very well be her being nervous as hell and wanting you to actually make a move, send her a text. Don't immediately ask her out on the date, get her a little warm and comfortable with the idea
6 Get her on a date and continue escalating until you get what you want out of this
7 Don't forget to hit on other girls in the mean time to keep your mind off of this one until you do some deal signing

I appreciate the response. Thanks.

Looking back at my initial post I do recognize that my comment about me expecting a text message from her was misleadingly written. I did not really demand a message from her but, using the above mentioned warm tone, mentioned that I would be happy to receive one and even said that I would give her a call then if she would not be bothered by it and I believe she smiled (she did indeed show an unmistakable smile upon the moment of parting where there was a tiny bit of physical contact) and said it would not bother her (at all). In that sense I did perhaps come off as a bit too nice or 'beta' as some might say but I believed it to be necessary given her apparent timidness and I suppose that the harsh climate conditions might have had something to do with me wanting to sound a bit more soft and perhaps less than overconfident as she was not really comfortable standing there in the cold.

I do somehow have a hard time seeing this girl as someone who might strategically delay messages so as to avoid coming across as needy as she seemed almost awkwardly genuine about her current condition career/status wise (not that it's equally important for girls) instead of trying to be elusive or sugar coat it but I could see her as being too self-critical to write a message before reviewing and revising it a thousand times. Or perhaps I'm just ascribing myself value that was never there in her eyes and overanalyzing as warned.

Post: #4

(12-09-2016 11:34 PM)SegaSaturn1994 Wrote:  In that sense I did perhaps come off as a bit too nice or 'beta' as some might say but I believed it to be necessary given her apparent timidness and I suppose that the harsh climate conditions might have had something to do with me wanting to sound a bit more soft and perhaps less than overconfident as she was not really comfortable standing there in the cold.

Relax. Do not worry about this. When you get her out next, physically escalate. When she starts giving in to you and being receptive, do not think about whether that was beta or alpha. When you're kissing her or sleeping with her this will be the furthest from your mind.

Always be escalating.

Just worry about closing.

Always be closing.

Post: #5

After 1,5 days of silence, the girl sent me a cheerful text message, to which I replied in an hour and ultimately tried to give her a call as I thought "why not" as I promised to call her the night I met her and thought she might be paralyzed by analysis when scribing a response. Strangely have not heard from her since but I expect her to get back to me tomorrow or I'll just call her again. If she seems oblivious to all this, I'll go into radio silence (is that what it's called here?) this week and just wait and see until the dam bursts properly or we'll just forget one another.

Post: #6

(12-11-2016 06:58 PM)SegaSaturn1994 Wrote:  thought she might be paralyzed by analysis when scribing a response.

Never think this. Bitches are way more social than any man. Don't become beta thinking she's a good girl lost in this harsh world.

Post: #7

Well places like Church, volunteering, etc. have three layers of personality you need essentially.

On the outside(Layer 1) and what shows to everyone around you should be the face of a genuine good person. Crack a few corny jokes, smile a lot, and be a good sport. Engage everyone around you and make everyone feel welcome. Self-censor heavily as well by not talking much and thinking for a good few seconds about how to respond to the flow of the conversation.

Layer 2 is sub-communication. The vibe to any girl you're into should be that of a smug confidence. By dropping a few hints here and there by playing around you can get her more curious about how you "actually" are(which is wherever her mind rationalizes it). It should co-exist and act in tandem with Layer 1.

Layer 3 should be grateful and humble towards any success you attain. That's on the inside. The more you psyche yourself up the better Layers 2 and 1 will look.

That's for any future encounter.


Messaging a girl via text afterward should all be like Level 2. Be playful and keep her guessing, but don't be impolite or vulgar yet. Gotta bring that out of her on a date with her doing it to a degree first, but that's a game lesson for another time.

Post: #8

Thanks for the replies. After a full day of silence from her, I called her and she picked up in a second or two, which is good I guess. This time she sounded more confident than before and I think that our age difference (might well be more than a decade) was starting to become more apparent to me, though I don't know her age; she had a certain fickleness or coyness about her speech that I cannot quite put my finger on or perhaps it was just the high pitched voice that you recognize as the voice of a girl in the prime of her youth. When I gently said that I was not sure if she had responded to my text, referring to my phone breaking down (no lie), she did not exactly go out of her way to rationalize the fact but sort of mumbled some broken sentence or two that I could not really make out properly and I switched the subject to maintain positivity. I suggested a date (going to a free culture event) for this week and she seemed to agree to it, saying she would message me.

Post: #9

We went out yesterday and as we were attending the group event, she seemed very uncomfortable and nervous, which I took note of and decided to haul her away from there earlier than originally intended. As soon as we got out of the place and into a more private environment (even if it was the street) her symptoms (constant fidgeting, shifting, jerky body language) seemingly disappeared. The event was quite lame anyway and stuffed with senior citizens.

I had preplanned to take her home to my place, though with the implication that I'd simply be building comfort and familiarity at this point; showing her my place and what not and also seeing out if she's down for it and more later. She did not hesitate to answer my suggestion positively and seemed reasonably comfortable. I had cooked for her and she seemed happy with the food and said as much. Perhaps the only moment of contention was when she was checking out buss schedules on her phone, looked at me inquisitively (or that's just my interpretation) and listed the various buss departure times, possibly all the way to the morning, which might have been a subtle attempt at letting me know that she would be OK with spending the night at my place although it's difficult to say given her unique and confusing style of speech. I had earlier hinted at bringing her back again, which she smirked at.
All in all I reached my objectives, almost, for what was the first 'official' date but could have done better. As she rushed to the bus, I could no longer establish proper physical contact with her in a smooth manner and thus could not give her the kiss or a minimum of hug I was planning to and should probably have been a bit more physical while still in the apartment.

Post: #10

After a rather strange blow-out last night, where we agreed to meet again over the phone and go to her or my place, and where she then somewhat insensitively cancelled it at midnight, I had a nap in the afternoon and got a message from her saying she had changed her mind and was up for meeting. Only this time she had shifted the attention to us meeting in a public place; going for a coffee or eating.
Groggy and somewhat annoyed by this time, given the detail and sensitivity I had expressed in my communication with her, I said that it would be fine and she called me for the first time ever and we agreed to meet near my apartment.

I had to come with a quick emergency plan and I suggested that we go shop for some snacks instead of going to some less private cafeteria (which would constitute regression in terms of intimacy). She seemed hesitant but somewhat reluctantly agreed to my suggestion but things were reasonably jolly and normal as we went and ultimately reached my apartment again. She was practically hyperventilating as I had her sit on my sofa and I politely tried to loosen the situation by noting her heavy breathing verbally, which I believe helped make her relax as she eventually started breathing normally again.
We had some juice and snacks and I basically did not have any plan at this time other than try to keep the conversation going and try to extract some indications of interest her, briefly referring to the conflicting messages (literally) that I had received from her. She sort of mumbled it off; seemingly happy to let me get her away with it.

As I knew that time would eventually draw to a close, I asked if she would be OK with sitting close to me as she came back from washing her hands and she did, though I had to ask her to draw closer to me and she questioned the reason as to why it should be done saying "Why?" but then sort of came to her senses, mumbled something indicating that she got the point and there we were. I ultimately asked if I could touch her and she became a bit alert again, asking where I'd touch her and I proceeded to rub her shoulder; her body language did not show any signs of opening. I also stroked the back of her neck a bit and asked her about it and she said that she found it a bit irritating or anxiety inducing or tickling but sort of tried to play it off soon after whether it was out of courtesy or just her being too proud and uptight to admit to something else. This was the most hurtful moment for me however.

I asked what she thinks of massage and this led to her sitting on the floor between my legs and me massaging her shoulders and back, which she was mostly OK with, though I remember hearing that she once again questioned the nature of the massage and would not want to lie down. It was during this moment that her phone rang and she was very polite and apologetic about having to answer and having to leave, as a family member had just arrived to pick her up, more or less as intended; I knew myself to be short on time.

I initiated a hug and she seemed cool as she went her way.

After all this I'm feeling a good bit confused. Our age difference came up (a full decade) and she was not overly crazy about the intimacy. Yet when she was on the phone with a close relative she referred to me by my first name, indicating that she had shared knowledge about me and it seemed very natural for her to do so.
I do honestly wonder if she might just figure me for a harmless sap and sort of keep me hanging on for attention, something that may be relatively novel for her, despite not being attracted to me at all or if she's just slow to warm up. At this point I honestly cannot see her coming over again or even meeting me, regardless of how socially retarded she might be, without her intending to either do it for inner laughs and ego stroking or her being genuinely attracted on some level and understanding what's up. I don't have a problem with her being insecure about intimacy if she could simply admit to some of this without me having to pry information from her.

I have revealed some intimate details about myself and my lifestyle, a lot of it coming with me bringing her to my home no less than twice, something that has barely happened for years, and I will feel quite gutted if all of this was just to amuse her and would sort of need to take a very long emotional bleach bath after being played like that. If that's what happens, I honestly might forget about 'good girls' for a good damn while and stick to clubbing where mutual hots are at least expected from the start and leaving with someone carries with it some real expectations to be fulfilled.

Post: #11

OP, the way you describe her isn't very appealing : cold, socially retarded and anxious about every move you make.
Does she have such a great body, to counter-balance that?

Anyway, you asked if you could touch her, if she could sit closer to you, if you could massage her shoulders, ...
This doesn't project much confidence, nor creates tingles in her.
You could for example, rather than asking, have gently pulled her to you when she sat back : it makes you appear more masculine, in control of the interaction and of your desires.

It must make her think you're used to be in contact with women, so that touching them in no big deal for you.
It happens to you on a daily basis, with very beautiful women, that's why you don't even think about treating her like a precious fragile princess.

At this point, I think she's not attracted to you, because you treat her too well and don't show enough male desire.
If there's a next meeting, make your intentions clear : you're not looking for a friend, you enjoy the presence of beautiful women and want to be intimate with them.
If she tells you she doesn't see you like that, don't take it personnally : just tell her that's a shame, as you simply found her attractive and call her a cab, with no hard feeling.

You could also go silent on her and begin talking to other young girls, at the meetings you see her (and in front of her).
This'd show her my last point, without the need to directly word it.