(09-17-2018 05:32 PM)10119 Wrote:  Indonesia in general took almost no effort to pull 7s all day long , and all night long for that matter. The local girls are really sweet and eager to please , not just sexually but cooking , caring etc.

Back 5-10 years ago it seemed most treated a meetup/date as a marriage interview almost . These days girls are more promiscuous and into sport fucking etc . A lot of "bule hunters" but they were always around. Just seems more prevalent lately.

I never bothered with online game or twitter there. Just went to the mall or even the supermarket and chatted. These days is even easier , as far more girls speak English than they did in years past . Dont be shy and I guarantee you will be crawling in it . Girls here expect the man to approach.

When was the last time you experienced this? Do you think this also applies to girls from other cities in Indonesia? Thanks.

(09-17-2018 01:21 PM)Skyway Wrote:  So my Tinder’s been active – sorta. First time I put myself out in the Jakarta scene, I instantly got about 5 to 6 matches within a few hours. All of them responded to chat. 2 were “where you stay?” “you want massage?” types (call girls). The rest we transitioned to WA right away. I try not to waste time, so I escalate quick. They seem to respond well to that. I am 30, biracial (black, white and a dash of in betweens). People generally can’t tell what I am. I don’t look black, no black features except for my hair (induction cut so you can't tell) and skin color, which is not dark but rather tannish. I also don’t look white although I have caucasian features. In the US people will generally assume Hispanic since that’s the box you tend to end up in if you don’t distinctively look black or white.

Of the 4 I asked to join me for coffee, 3 were down, but only 1 materialized. 1 said she had some work to do and sent me a picture of what she was doing. 1 wanted to get together but when she asked when and where, I slacked because I was starting to feel like I was biting off more than I can chew. So I backed off a little for her to chase - she didn’t. Another 1 was very interested, same thing, she wanted to know what time and I said I would let her know. She wasn’t too happy about that and teasingly tried to get me to commit to a time, but I never did. It’s what I usually do. Because I know it’s in a girl’s nature to flake, I make more than one “appointment” all at the same time, kinda like how airlines do. They sell more tickets than they have seats because they know people cancel, and in the rare occasions that everyone shows up…well, it’s an overbooking. Although of course, I don’t book at the same place. In Indonesia though, I’m feeling like I need to change my strategy.

The girl I was meeting kept on asking me to send her a pic of me when I’m at the meeting place. She wanted me to be there first, for some reason. So I did and she said she was on her way. Later I changed my mind and went to another place close by because I felt in case she turned out to be an embarrassment, the other place wouldn’t be too embarrassing. Again, she asks me to send her a selfie. Weird.

She shows up and she’s not the girl in the tinder pictures. Fake pictures. But get this, she was actually much hotter than the girl in the pictures. I never called her out. It didn’t even dawn on me until we parted. She came dressed really nice. Her English was really good - but something weird, she spoke fluently and listening to her you would think English is her 2nd language, how she spoke it with ease. But whenever I spoke, she had a hard time understanding me. She obviously would have preferred to come straight to my place, given how many times she asked me, in different ways, where I was staying. And also when we were having coffee, she was waiting for me to say let’s go to my place - the blind and deaf could tell. I didn’t take her home, however, because I honestly wasn’t feeling it at the time. I was just there to test the waters, although there was always the possibility that she would be luring enough for me to change my mind. But she wasn’t, or I was being too picky. Nice girl though, she even insisted to drop me off, and did.

One thing I’m noticing with Indo girls is that they are much, much more whole in their personality traits than Thai girls, which I have dealt with more. I could easily get a banter going with an Indonesian girl. They are receptive to teasing - they tease back (although to a westerner it could come across as too direct, thus rude, but fun when you know the intension). They are affectionate, and just generally more fun than their SE Asian counterparts. I wrongly assumed that they would be similar to Thai women – they couldn’t be more different, looks and personality wise. Honestly, Thai girls don’t got diddly squat on Indonesian girls from what I can observe. I can actually have a conversation with an Indo girl and find it to be very enjoyable – especially the teasing and banter part. They get it and it bounces back. With a Thai girl, I might as well have a more intelligent conversation with a cat.

Next day I got several more matches. 1 I teased with slight sexual innuendo and she didn’t respond back. 3 never replied. 1 was engaged but not enthusiastic. And 1 was a bit dull and seemed too much of a good girl. I’ve been exhausting my like limits every day, but I swipe left much more than right. I am very picky I’ll admit. Also, I haven’t really gone all out with the matches. I honestly believe if I had, I would have gotten at least 3 meets. No idea how many lays. The 1st one is a definite though. So 4 days on tinder, 15 matches, 1-3 lays? However, I am starting to notice results are dwindling. It’s like each day yields lesser prospects. So I decided to experiment with something. I made another profile. A white guy – let’s call him John. About the same age as me. I didn’t embellish his profile. Kept it very minimalistic, similar to mine. Looks wise, just to play it safe, I chose a picture of someone - off google - who is about 2 points “less” better looking than me. Well...HOE-LEE-DURIAN!! The white God factor is real, alive and kicking! Like, DAMN! I got 11 matches in 1 day and the girls were the ones initiating the conversation. They were actually hitting me up first, eager to get to know me. It wasn’t even simple Hellos but rather thought out, invested comments. Not only that but they were also the ones asking for my whatsapp. And I wasn’t even trying - giving short answers and not asking anything back. If I did volunteer a comment, it would always be responded with “hahahah” - anything I said was funny. Responses came faster, they were more engaged and they were the ones who wanted to escalate - fast! I was overwhelmed! The funny (or sad) part is that I am considerably much better looking than the white guy I put up - at least by western standards. In the US, I know, from experience, that my market value would be much higher than that of John’s. It was a truly eye opening experiment.

Another thing I noticed, going through the list of matches of both mine and John’s is that John’s girls are predominantly hotter - much hotter! A good portion of them are tanner, not dark, but bronzish and definitely curvier, taller, and just sexier all around. Basically, exactly the girls I was looking to get with. While mine were average to less than average looking, a mixture of complexions and look neither Chinese Indonesians nor pure Javanese/native but rather a mixture of both, and a little bit more refined at times – except one who is the epitome of freakydom and loonatry. %0 Chinese Indonesians.

John was definitely getting much hotter girls than me. Lots of them, judging by the pics. Look like they got money too. So more educated? IDK. I’m jealous, I’m not gonna lie. I bet John can get at least 1 fresh “quality” lay a day without lifting a finger. No game needed. Looking at John’s feed right now, almost all matches initiated chat. They are sending hearts, Hi, what’s your WAs? Yay it’s a match!, and creative pickup lines(?) based off what’s on his profile. And if John doesn’t reply – which is most of the time – they follow up with more msgs. It’s crazy!

Almost no matches on my account initiated a chat and the 3-4 that did, half were call girls. Also, about %95 of who John swipes right is a match! I’m guessing the other %5 haven’t got to his profile yet. Vs. only 4-5 for me, before I exhaust my daily limit (free account). And super likes! John gets an average of 6-8 (a guesstimation) super likes a day! Me?...Zero! Not 1 thus far. Another thing is, what’s up with Tinder showing John the hot girls and me mostly 1-4s, very rarely 7s?! When I’m in John’s account, I’m swiping right faster than I can say Damn! Every girl is hotter than the other. I can without a doubt say all the ones that I see on John’s account are 7+ (at least body wise). A good portion of them are 8s. Just absolute hotties. It’s like I’m in a totally different country. While for me, Tinder is presenting me prospects from the bottom of the barrel. I’m sensing a bias/discriminatory(?) algorithm here. I find myself swiping right to %90 of the girls that Tinder shows me on John’s account, while on mine I’m swiping left most of the time! Cold sh*t!

White god factor is real all over Asia, get over it. I'm as black as they come, and I still got laid plenty in Jakarta

(09-19-2018 09:54 AM)Lechon Wrote:  So basically it's a bit of a shithole, which makes most tourists go away, so your SMV skyrockets. Gotta admire the dedication to quality pussy in this thread.

It is a shit hole but it can really serve its purpose. I came here to chill somewhere cheaper than Europe and really get into work. I live in a place called Thamrin residence and I pay $30 USD a night for one of the better places I saw on airbnb. Its not luxury but it has a good view and good bed.

It is 3 minutes walking from The Grand Indonesia Mall. Inside this mall I have everything I need. I arrive in the morning and choose from one of the 100s of restaurants to eat. Then I sit down and work from one of the many coffee shops here. When I get stressed I walk down and get a massage for $10. Basically I never leave this mall and My productivity has skyrocketed. Very optimized lifestyle.

Throughout the day ill invite tinder girls to come have coffee. Really they are just giving me a break from my work when they arrive. If they are hot I walk around the mall with them and then walk them to my place.

I have found a really good groove here. I think you will like it to.

(09-19-2018 11:24 AM)Irish Wrote:  message the airbnb hosts if they're interested in a discounted long term booking, generally they're happy to offer a decent discount to have their place rented out for a few months and remove the hassle of dealing with leaving/coming guests etc.

Yeah, that seems like a good bet. Airbnb doesn't like it of course, but they're deplatforming and I already gave them enough cash, so who cares what they like. Otherwise just rent for a month via airbnb, see if I like it there and look around for apartments. I just had another look and the monthly offers aren't that bad, especially for just 1 month.

(09-19-2018 11:24 AM)Irish Wrote:  And generally nobody gives the slightest shit if you're bringing girls home or not so no need to worry about that. Only if its bottom of the barrel tinder garbage from the kampung you might have an issue (which to be fair is a staple of most guys who come to jakarta)

I'm not that into night life or high mileage girls, more into nice, younger girls. The girl I'm talking to now looks like an absolute peach, is a devout Christian and probably a virgin, looks like she hasn't been to a bar in her life and hasn't either. Security guards or receptionists won't get anything like that once in their lifetime. If I'm bringing her and then more high quality girls, I bet they'll be like "Oh, here's that foreigner again, spoiling another one of our finest girls... What a guy, eh."

Fucking and leaving high quality nice girls can get you into serious trouble in many parts of the world, especially as a foreigner. On the one hand it seems like Indonesia has a somewhat sex-positive macho-culture and (white) foreigners are rare and welcome and Jakarta is a huge city and people generally don't care too much there, but on the other hand it's a religious country with rising fundamentalism. But I take it it's no worse than the rest of Asia, then.

Vancity, it looks like you've found a nice groove indeed. Shithole might sound bad, but I've lived in large Asian cities most people who would call anything a shithole would call shitholes for 10 years and I've really enjoyed it, so I'm not against shitholes or anything, I'm pro shithole. :-) Don't care about the dirt and can live with the traffic, as long as I have my pool deck, my gym, a nice desktop view, a good supermarket not too far away and the odd entertainment once in a while. And the girls, of course.

You have a good point about nothing much to do, it can actually work for you in a lot of ways. Fun attracts competition, and that reduces your SMV. Distractions take time and cost money, and I mostly want to work and meet girls too.

So after a couple of dozen different girls, it doesn't raise any eyebrows when you walk through the reception with a new one?

(09-19-2018 11:14 PM)Lechon Wrote:  So after a couple of dozen different girls, it doesn't raise any eyebrows when you walk through the reception with a new one?

Not at all. Every time I walk in or out I smile and wish them a good day and they are smily and respectful back. I think if anything they are a little jealous but not in a resentful way. More in an astonished kind of way. I am bringing in respectable girls though who dress well and don't look like hookers.

I think it all depends on your frame. If you walk in with cute girls and your head high then they will just wish they were you but they wont feel like you are doing anything wrong. They are just doormen. Who cares what they think anyways.

(09-19-2018 11:45 PM)Vancity29 Wrote:  

(09-19-2018 11:14 PM)Lechon Wrote:  So after a couple of dozen different girls, it doesn't raise any eyebrows when you walk through the reception with a new one?

Not at all. Every time I walk in or out I smile and wish them a good day and they are smily and respectful back. I think if anything they are a little jealous but not in a resentful way. More in an astonished kind of way. I am bringing in respectable girls though who dress well and don't look like hookers.

I think it all depends on your frame. If you walk in with cute girls and your head high then they will just wish they were you but they wont feel like you are doing anything wrong. They are just doormen. Who cares what they think anyways.

Yeah, I'm probably overthinking it/feeling excessively guilty etc.

(09-19-2018 11:45 PM)Vancity29 Wrote:  Not at all. Every time I walk in or out I smile and wish them a good day and they are smily and respectful back. I think if anything they are a little jealous but not in a resentful way. More in an astonished kind of way. I am bringing in respectable girls though who dress well and don't look like hookers.

This is true.

I have spent some time in an Indonesian 2nd tier city and I was staying in an Airbnb in a condo building there. So it's not Jakarta, but the culture is the same / similar.

I was driving my own motorbike at the time and my go to game was to pick the girls up on my bike, take them for a coffee or a drink and then just drive home.

The condo building required me to stop and get a parking ticket every time I entered and pay it when I left. They sometimes saw me drive out with one girl on the back and then return a couple hours later with another one on the back. You'd see them look at each other thinking "wait, was that the same girl or not?"

I must admit things got a bit tricky when 2 of them ended up becoming regulars, so they were around a lot, and at the same time I was still bringing in new ones too. I made sure to be on good terms with all the staff and always smile etc. but every time I passed them I was still thinking to myself "you better keep your mouth shut" lol.

The people here seem to be very respectful. All I ever get from people are smiles and polite treatment. I get the disgruntled local treatment in thailand and phils but that is because its been overrun with degenerates for years. People here still seem to feel the novelty of having a younger styled foreigner in their presence. The WGF isnt just with the women here. Everyone has it.

(09-19-2018 11:14 PM)Lechon Wrote:  I'm not that into night life or high mileage girls, more into nice, younger girls. The girl I'm talking to now looks like an absolute peach, is a devout Christian and probably a virgin, looks like she hasn't been to a bar in her life and hasn't either. Security guards or receptionists won't get anything like that once in their lifetime. If I'm bringing her and then more high quality girls, I bet they'll be like "Oh, here's that foreigner again, spoiling another one of our finest girls... What a guy, eh."

I wish I was still naive enough to believe that kind of stuff.

(09-19-2018 11:14 PM)Lechon Wrote:  I'm not that into night life or high mileage girls, more into nice, younger girls. The girl I'm talking to now looks like an absolute peach, is a devout Christian and probably a virgin, looks like she hasn't been to a bar in her life and hasn't either. Security guards or receptionists won't get anything like that once in their lifetime. If I'm bringing her and then more high quality girls, I bet they'll be like "Oh, here's that foreigner again, spoiling another one of our finest girls... What a guy, eh."

Fucking and leaving high quality nice girls can get you into serious trouble in many parts of the world, especially as a foreigner. On the one hand it seems like Indonesia has a somewhat sex-positive macho-culture and (white) foreigners are rare and welcome and Jakarta is a huge city and people generally don't care too much there, but on the other hand it's a religious country with rising fundamentalism. But I take it it's no worse than the rest of Asia, then.

And how are you meeting these "high quality" girls?

Please don't say tinder...

If that that nice innocent girl is coming back to your room for a shag, and you barely know her, then you're likely not her first or last rodeo.

Visa situation doesn't seem convenient for longterm stay. So you would have to do visa runs and leave the country every 1-2 months, and pay for a new visa each time? Sounds pretty shitty.

What long-term visa options are available in 2018?

(09-20-2018 09:34 AM)asiaslayer Wrote:  Visa situation doesn't seem convenient for longterm stay. So you would have to do visa runs and leave the country every 1-2 months, and pay for a new visa each time? Sounds pretty shitty.

What long-term visa options are available in 2018?

You can pay an agency to arrange a business visa for you. With this visa you'll still need to leave the country every 2 months, but you won't need to arrange a new visa every time you return.

You can also go for a "social visa", which gets you 2 months initially, and can be extended up to 6 months while in country. This visa is single entry and expires whenever you leave the country.

So with the first long term option you have to leave every 2 months and with the second long term option you can't leave for 6 months unless you want your visa to expire.

Pick your poison.

(09-20-2018 07:39 AM)Irish Wrote:  And how are you meeting these "high quality" girls?

Please don't say tinder...

Lots of experience in picking them out when I see girls online or in person, and my looks and personality match "nice girls". I go through hundreds of girls a month from lots of different channels (yeah, including Tinder!) and end up with a few high quality ones. Online dating like Date in Asia, Badoo, and Tinder, meet girls through friends, cold approaches. I have a couple of nice pics with high ratings taken with a good camera (Huawei p20 pro).

I don't tan and I'm naturally pale, which helps. I work out almost daily and dress okay. I'm about 80 kilos, 175 cm with maybe 15% bodyfat. I live in Cebu or other places with high foreigner/WGF-factor. I'm not so old I'm visibly decaying, but old enough to know what I'm doing. I live in a nice apartment with good food in it. I have a decent income.

So here's a story. I once dated a hopeless girl in Bangkok from Vietnam. Hated Viet guys and first time abroad. She squealed when I just touched her arm lightly at the end of the date, but still wanted to see me again. Think it was my worst date ever (so far). But she said something funny. She was travelling with her controlling mom and her mom did this and that and wouldn't let her do this and that. So I was like how come your mom let you out on a date alone, then. And she pretended to be her and pointed at her cell phone and said "You can date this one". Mom approved! Mom approved is good.

I just try to be a nice guy but still pull off some basic game tactics just to keep the girls eager and not bored. Nice guys do well in Asia, you don't need to be an asshole to get laid here. I'm open to wifing up the peachy Jakarta girl and any similar quality girl, and she will respond to me as a serious guy, not someone who just wants to fuck her. For quality fun girls, I just treat them really nicely without making any promises or lying excessively. If you're jaded and cynical, it usually shows.

(09-20-2018 07:39 AM)Irish Wrote:  If that that nice innocent girl is coming back to your room for a shag, and you barely know her, then you're likely not her first or last rodeo.

Most likely, yes. And I usually put in work for quality girls. But you could be that one guy nice girls like to shag. Nice girls need cock too, they just don't take it from a lot of different guys.

(09-20-2018 10:14 AM)Lechon Wrote:  So here's a story. I once dated a hopeless girl in Bangkok from Vietnam. Hated Viet guys and first time abroad. She squealed when I just touched her arm lightly at the end of the date, but still wanted to see me again. Think it was my worst date ever (so far). But she said something funny. She was travelling with her controlling mom and her mom did this and that and wouldn't let her do this and that. So I was like how come your mom let you out on a date alone, then. And she pretended to be her and pointed at her cell phone and said "You can date this one". Mom approved! Mom approved is good.

I once went on a date with an 18 year old virgin who still lived with her parents. She insisted I pick her up at her place because her mom wouldn't let her leave the house otherwise. This was an Indonesian girl in Indonesia who had never left the country, never seen a bar and never had a drop of alcohol.

I showed up and bantered a bit with the mom and she liked what she saw so she let her daughter come with me for a coffee. During the date this girl was very shy and behaving like a typical 18 year old virgin would.

I saw this girl 2 more times and am sure I could have taken her virginity and enter a relationship. I knew I wasn't going to stick around with her, and while she was very cute and part of me wanted to do it to satisfy my ego, I decided to "do the right thing" and let her go.

Fast forward 6 months without contact, and this girl randomly adds me on Facebook. We start talking and it turns out she now works in the tourism industry in Bali and is exposed to Western tourist on a daily base. I take a look at her profile and there's an army of white guys orbiting her and several pics of her partying and drinking with "her new lover" (also a white guy).

Her English has improved significantly and her entire attitude towards me is now more entitled and bitchy. I didn't ask her if she was still a virgin, but I am pretty sure what the answer would be.

Now I'm not hating on you and I'm sure you've met some "high quality" girls, but the reality is that all of them become like this if exposed to the degenerate environment at a young age. All. Of. Them. Just having a smartphone is enough.

Should've done it.

I agree that one can find high-quality girls in Tinder by reading the profiles and swiping selectively. By high-quality, I mean university students and/or educated women with good jobs at 7 or 8 -as I hardly see any 9s in Tinder. Actually, I prefer day and night game but when I think of it, I use Tinder more recently.

When I was in Jakarta, I was with a beautiful engineering student. She was wearing a hijab. She told me that she had never been to a bar. After we were "done", I took her to SKYE bar. Because of the way she behaved, I believe that she was telling the truth. I bought her a non-alcoholic beverage. She stayed in my place that night. If you see her on the street, you would think that she is a virgin --but she did not blink to come to my room.

(09-19-2018 11:14 PM)Lechon Wrote:  I'm not that into night life or high mileage girls, more into nice, younger girls. The girl I'm talking to now looks like an absolute peach, is a devout Christian and probably a virgin, looks like she hasn't been to a bar in her life and hasn't either.

(09-20-2018 10:34 AM)Winston Wolfe Wrote:  Now I'm not hating on you and I'm sure you've met some "high quality" girls, but the reality is that all of them become like this if exposed to the degenerate environment at a young age. All. Of. Them. Just having a smartphone is enough.

Sure, they won't stay like that for very long. But in my view this girl seemed to be high quality, now she's a regular girl who likes to screw around. Which can still be good too, of course. So yeah, timing is everything. :-)

(09-20-2018 10:34 AM)Winston Wolfe Wrote:  Should've done it.

Yep. Hope you get a new chance! Have a similar story with a very shy 18 year old now who told me her friends are fucking, but she wanted to save herself for the man she loved. First she was too shy to come and meet me a few times, then came with her friend and then finally alone. And then right after she told me she loved me, and we were playing around in bed, I tried fucking her. Got about 1 cm inside so far. It hurt her, but she was still so eager to try.

I did feel a bit bad about lying and saying I loved her too, but realistically she'll get a lot more from me than from screwing local guys like her friends do, so it doesn't bother me very much. Next week we're going to Palawan. I'm going to meet a friend, she's just tagging along. Cheap tickets and $35/night hotel, but she's never been anywhere, so I think she's going to love it. Hopefully we'll find a nice beach where we can be alone for a couple of hours...

Interesting stuff guys

I would argue against becoming the corruption that you hate.

If you do not like it that girls become jaded and entitled due to getting on the caroussel, do not deflower a girl you won't stick around for.

Behaving morally is a bigger ego boost than actual smashing.

On "WGF": I've been trying to pipeline to see what kind of talent I can work with and come prepared, and honestly I'm not doing too hot so far. Matter of fact, I get more and better quality matches in Bangkok, Manila, Saigon... basically every other major city in SEA.

Not sure if this is an algorithm problem, or if girls can see I'm not in the city yet so they swipe left or some shit. Or maybe my pictures just don't mesh well with Indo girls for whatever reason (been told I should smile more in them by girls). But if WGF is so insane there, shouldn't I be matching with every other girl? haha

But uh, do I need to keep swiping and play the numbers game or what?

I have met lots of really nice, high quality girls from Tinder all over the world. Irish seems to have a hate on for Tinder and the girls on it but I think it is unfounded. There are plenty of great girls on Tinder. I think its silly to sit at home and swipe and do nothing else but Tinder has continuously provided me with great girls I would have never met otherwise. Of course a few grenades too. Tinder is a great addition to day/night game and to not use it is a handicap.

Yes Tinder is also full of ladyboys, hookers and 3s dressed up as 9s. Sometimes they sneak passed the filter system and I end up on a date with them. I just chill for 20 mins and then excuse myself. Most of the time you can see through the bullshit before a date though and avoid that.

(09-20-2018 02:38 PM)asdfk Wrote:  I would argue against becoming the corruption that you hate.

If you do not like it that girls become jaded and entitled due to getting on the caroussel, do not deflower a girl you won't stick around for.

Don't be jaded or cold, but don't pedestalize these girls either. Just because she's a virgin doesn't mean she's a saint. If all her friends are fucking, she will be fucking soon too. The question is if you can be a better guy for her than the other guy.

(09-20-2018 10:14 AM)Lechon Wrote:  Most likely, yes. And I usually put in work for quality girls. But you could be that one guy nice girls like to shag. Nice girls need cock too, they just don't take it from a lot of different guys.

Those girls definitely exist. You won't find them in clubs or on ANY online dating sites. If a girl is online in indonesia and chasing white guys that only tells me she's good at manipulating guys, it doesn't tell me that she hasn't taken miles of cock. If you want to meet nice innocent girls, don't look where the sluts hang out.

(09-21-2018 12:43 AM)Shimmy Wrote:  Those girls definitely exist. You won't find them in clubs or on ANY online dating sites. If a girl is online in indonesia and chasing white guys that only tells me she's good at manipulating guys, it doesn't tell me that she hasn't taken miles of cock. If you want to meet nice innocent girls, don't look where the sluts hang out.

I disagree. I have a forum member friend who continuously pulls virgins off tinder. Its his thing. Its become a running joke with us. These girls show up innocent and leave with bloody bed sheets to prove it. I have met enough girls from tinder who are not sluts. They Just joined Tinder to see what it was all about. Tinder is so wide spread you can find all types of girls on it.

How come you're all so lucky to be the first one from tinder whom they go out with and lose virginity to.
Not trying to be sarcastic, just genuinely curious. And y'all are just probably damn coincidentally lucky.