Post: #26

(01-13-2014 05:44 PM)coolstorybro Wrote:  

(01-13-2014 02:04 AM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  I read a story that always stuck in mind. A guy rented a vehicle in a foreign country. Something happened to the vehicle that resulted in a total loss. The author claimed that it was the fault of the car rental company, but I cannot remember the circumstances.

But this is the important part of the story: the car rental company demanded full payment for the vehicle and arranged for the police to confiscate his passport until he made full restitution for the vehicle. This is more common than you might think.

He simply used his second passport to hop on a bus to a neighboring country, where he then caught a plane home. While he had to replace his primary passport, it sure beat being held hostage until he paid for an automobile.

This could only have been in the EU, because otherwise he'd have no stamp or record showing entry into the country on his other passport. That is a big no go in almost all countries. If you can't prove you entered the country legally - as in a stamp in your passport - then you are essentially an illegal alien in that country and would likely be detained.

That is not necessarily true. Could you imagine the international outcry that would occur if travelers were detained every time some bureaucrat forgot to stamp a passport upon entry, which is fairly common.

I know for a fact that you can leave the U.S. and travel to numerous countries on another passport and then re-enter the U.S. months later with no evidence in your U.S. passport showing that you ever visited another country. Americans who have dual citizenship are legally required to enter and leave the U.S. using only their U.S. passport, but there is no legal requirement to use their U.S. passport in any other country.

FWIW, I seem to recall that the incident occurred in a Latin American country, although I could be wrong.

Post: #27

(01-13-2014 01:14 PM)Sargon of Akkad Wrote:  From what I know, Russia does not. The German-Russians I've met all had to decide when they came of age. Switzerland, on the other hand, does alllow for DC.

Russia allows multiple citizenships; Ukraine, on the other hand, does not.

A huge potential benefit of having more than one passport is being able to easily leave a foreign country if you get into some sort of trouble, such as legal problems. One passport may be confiscated, or its number can be entered into a database that is checked against at airports (in some countries it's ridiculously easy to do). Having a second passport leaves you a way out.

Post: #28

I have an EU passport and American greencard. When traveling to Europe I've used the European passport to go to the EU citizens line (faster) and when coming back to the US I've used my greencard to go to the American citizens and Greencard Holders line (also faster).

I'll be able to apply for American citizenship in a few years and still keep my European passport as both my country of origin and the US allow for Dual Citizenship, but since the US taxes American citizens even if they're living and working in another country that is making me think about if I should do it or not as I plan on sometime in the future do some business outside the US. Fortunately I still have time to decide.

But yeah, dual citizenship might not benefit you in every single case but I don't see how it could harm you in anyway.

Post: #29

(01-13-2014 11:13 PM)Teutatis Wrote:  I'll be able to apply for American citizenship in a few years and still keep my European passport as both my country of origin and the US allow for Dual Citizenship, but since the US taxes American citizens even if they're living and working in another country that is making me think about if I should do it or not as I plan on sometime in the future do some business outside the US. Fortunately I still have time to decide.

But yeah, dual citizenship might not benefit you in every single case but I don't see how it could harm you in anyway.

You just provided an excellent example of how it can harm you. IMO, you should think long and hard before obtaining U.S. citizenship. The U.S. is one of only a few countries that tax all citizens on their worldwide income -- even if they live outside the U.S.

U.S. taxation can provide a huge drag on your income should you elect to work offshore at some point in the future. Just compliance costs for taxation can cost thousands of dollars per year. Many Americans are experiencing serious problems opening bank accounts in many countries because of FATCA. American citizenship has become a huge headache for American expats because of the despotic overreach of the USG.

Post: #30

Oh, I definitely agree with you, I didn't explain myself very well, I meant from an American citizen's perspective, if you're an American citizen, whose only nationality is American, I don't see how getting a second citizenship would harm you, but the opposite, acquiring American citizenship when you're an European for example, has the already mentioned drawback.

Post: #31

Funny story involving two passports.

2007 I'm visiting London with a group of Germans. We arrive and there are two lines: one for those entering the UK with EU passports and one for those with non-EU passports. I notice the latter is much shorter than the other, so I walk up to the woman and say I'm an American citizen, showing her my passport. "Right this way," she says, putting a stack of papers in my hands, "just fill out these papers." I look into a room where there are People sitting at desks with pens filling out pages of forms.

I think "fuck that" walk back to the woman and say "actually, I'm a German citizen, too," showing her my other passport. She rolls her eyes and gestures for me to go to the other line, which moves along much faster than the other.

Post: #32

(01-13-2014 01:59 AM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  I got this from an immigration law firm website. I hope it's correct. It's a list of countries that DO and DO NOT allow dual citizenship:

Dual Citizenships Allowed:

Australia, Barbados, Belgium, Bangladesh, Canada, Cyprus, United States, United Kingdom, Switzerland, South Korea, South Africa (requires permission) , Egypt(requires prior permission), Greece, France, Finland, Germany (requires prior permission), Iraq, Italy, Israel, Ireland, Hungary, Iceland, Sweden, Slovenia, Syria, Serbia, Armenia, Lebanon, Malta, Spain ( allows only with certain Latin american countries), Tonga, Phillipines, Sierra Leone, Sri Lanka (by retention), Pakistan (accepts only with 16 countries), Portual, Turkey (requires permission)

Dual Citizenships Not Allowed

Andorra, Austria, Azerbaijan ,Burma, Bahrain, Botswana, Japan, China ,Czech Republic, Denmark, Fiji,India,Indonesia, Ecuador, Estonia, Iran, Poland, Papua New Guinea, Brunei, Japan, Peru, Kuwait , Kenya, Kazakhstan, Chile, Kiribati, Poland, Korea, Kuwait, Denmark, Latvia,Singapore, Slovakia, Ecuador, Lithuania, Solomon Islands ,Fiji ,Malaysia, Mauritius, Netherlands, United Arab Emirates (UAE), Romania, Thailand, Mexico, Nepal, Venezuela, Norway, Zimbabwe, Mauritius, Myanmar, Nepal


Pakistan:
Pakistan allows dual citizenship only with the below countries
United Kingdom
Italy
France
Belgium
Iceland
Australia
New Zealand
Sweden
United States
Ireland
Netherlands
Switzerland
Canada
Egypt
Jordan
Syria


Spain
Allows dual citizenship with some Latin-American countries Argentina, Bolivia, Chile, Colombia, Costa Rica, the Dominican Republic, Ecuador, Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua, Paraguay, Peru and Uruguay, Andorra, Portugal, the Philippines and Equatorial Guinea.


If anyone has a link or links to the up-to-date, specific requirements for the countries that allow dual citizenship, please feel free to post it....

Mexico allows dual-citizenship. how do i know this? my mother has dual-citizenship. but this is a bit recent. when my father became a citizen of the US back in 1997, he had to give up his mexican nationality because the treaties that exist now didn't exist. however, if you have dual-nationality with mexico, you have to enter mexico with your mexican passport and you aren't allowed to seek consular help from the other country/ies that you have nationality to. http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Does_Mexico_al...p?#slide=5

Post: #33

An interesting book I've read brings up a good point (among many other good, but unrelated points.)

Assuming for simplicity that you are a US citizen, you get your dual citizenship with the desired country, go to there, file a legal name change and get an ID under the new name. You then are able to open a bank account under that name, again legally, and store your hoard.

Note that it is illegal according to Uncle Sam not to pay income taxes on all income you've earned as a US Citizen.

Post: #34

(01-13-2014 11:54 AM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

(01-13-2014 10:16 AM)ASOT Wrote:  My questions are for (my fellow) Canadians

I'm Australian, and live in Australia, but am also Canadian by birthright and hold a Canadian citizenship.

Does Canadian citizenship give any advantages for someone who wishes to work in the US?

And also, what benefits do yo am I able to claim (scam?) due to my situation? Free dental? Free or heavily subsidised education? Welfare payments? Ok well in seriousness I don't need or want any of these enough to warrant even looking, but I was thinking, to have Saudi or Kuwaiti citizenship (for the citizens pension), whilst living it up elsewhere with a foreign passport in greener pastures would be good. Being paid off the backs of IRT slave labour whilst you sit on a beach somewhere, ahh to dream

Having a Canadian passport doesn't make it easier to work in the USA. There is however, a visa called J1 that allows Canadians to work in the USA under certain conditions.
As for Saudi, they don't give out citizenship. You have to be a Saudi, a friend of mine was born in the country but was not entitled for citizenship. I am sure Kuwait would be similar to Saudi and other countries in that region.

I am also a dual citizen and yes it is very helpful, considering one of the passports allows me to live and work in Europe.

Education is one of the best benefit of being Canadian. Canada have some to best university in world (2 in top 50, 4 in top 100), you get alot for your money. My GF in University was from SA to Canadian mom. She and her brother both moved to Canada just to get an university degree.

For working in the US, it is easy if you have an university degree. TN-1 visa is renewable for 3years at a time indefinitely. All you need is a employment letter with the "right" job title/descripton. Hire a lawyer and cross the border with all of your paperwork (bring the lawyer with you is optional but it help greatly) and you get a stamp and it is done.


To the OP. You didn't state what citizenship you have now but list a long list of country that allow or not allow DC. Getting a second citizenship is either very easy or very hard. If your parent is from another country, just file the paper work BUT you still don't just get it. Most country require you to live there for so many years before granting you citizenship. If you don't have a parent from another country, then GoodLuck (it will take time and money).

I have a Hong Kong and a Canadian passport. I am currently waiting for my EU passport (2 1/2 more years). You don't really realize the benefit until you really need it. (after the 2 1/2 years is up, most likely I start the process of getting another EU passport)

Post: #35

(01-13-2014 08:21 PM)rover Wrote:  

(01-13-2014 01:14 PM)Sargon of Akkad Wrote:  From what I know, Russia does not. The German-Russians I've met all had to decide when they came of age. Switzerland, on the other hand, does alllow for DC.

Russia allows multiple citizenships; Ukraine, on the other hand, does not.

A huge potential benefit of having more than one passport is being able to easily leave a foreign country if you get into some sort of trouble, such as legal problems. One passport may be confiscated, or its number can be entered into a database that is checked against at airports (in some countries it's ridiculously easy to do). Having a second passport leaves you a way out.

Ukraine actually allow dual citizenship. Ukraine don't recognize dual citizenship. What that mean is that if you have Ukraine or getting Ukraine citizenship, you don't have to give up your second or third citizenship. If you have US and Ukraine citizenship, in Ukraine you will be treated as an Ukraine citizenship (you will not be allow to claim to be a US citizenship). Funny one is China. China also don't recognize dual citizenship. BUT you don't have to have china passport to be consider a Chinese citizen. The law state that if you have Chinese ancestry you will be consider a Chinese citizen. So, if you are in China and look Chinese, you ARE Chinese citizen. Only around this is to file paperwork to revoke a Chinese Citizenship that you don't have.

Differently, some other countries (ex. Singapore) don't allow dual citizenship. You have to revoke your other citizenship, if you don't and Singapore find out, your Singapore citizenship will be void.

Alot of countries that don't allow DC actually allow it under certain circumstance. (Estonia mention earlier allow DC if you are a natural born Estonia citizen and get a second citizenship. If you moving to Estonia and getting a citizenship, you are not allow DC)

There are lots of "if or but" when talking about dual citizenship.

Post: #36

(01-13-2014 01:05 PM)Courage Reborn Wrote:  Too bad Baltic states do not allow.

I'm thinking US + Estonian could be useful. All access pass to US, the EU, and the FSU? I'd be all about that.

The Estonian passport (or any Baltic state) won't help with getting access to the FSU. They need visas to Russia and Belarus just like all other EU country citizens.

One loophole to get a Baltic passport and also have an American passport, is if you have US citizenship by birthright. To get a Baltic passport, you need to renounce your US citizenship (this is done at the US embassy) and then show that proof to the Baltic country where you'd like to get citizenship. Then you'll get their passport. Then, walk back to the US embassy, and show your proof you were born in the US and apply for US citizenship again based on birthright.

I've never heard of anyone actually doing this, but in theory it would work unless in the process of renouncing you state you give up your right to reapply later.

Post: #37

The good thing is, if you have an EU passport, you will be able to work in EU and save a good money.

I'm trying to get a dual citizenship so I'll be able to work in UK for a time. The salary over there is pretty awesome for guys who work with IT.

Post: #38

Very useful. The one lets me work here, and enjoy travel without visas (which i could not do with the other). The other (my home country) allows me to own real estate and register a car and motorcycle on my name.

Post: #39

(01-14-2014 09:14 AM)paninaro Wrote:  One loophole to get a Baltic passport and also have an American passport, is if you have US citizenship by birthright. To get a Baltic passport, you need to renounce your US citizenship (this is done at the US embassy) and then show that proof to the Baltic country where you'd like to get citizenship. Then you'll get their passport. Then, walk back to the US embassy, and show your proof you were born in the US and apply for US citizenship again based on birthright.

That is completely incorrect. If you renounce your U.S. citizenship and want to regain U.S. citizenship, you must go through the time and expense of the entire green card process just like any other immigrant. Being born in the U.S. means nothing after you renounce your U.S. citizenship.

Post: #40

(01-14-2014 04:48 AM)TravelingDoc Wrote:  I have a Hong Kong and a Canadian passport. I am currently waiting for my EU passport (2 1/2 more years). You don't really realize the benefit until you really need it. (after the 2 1/2 years is up, most likely I start the process of getting another EU passport)

Just out of curiosity, why would you want another EU passport if you already have the benefits of EU citizenship?

Post: #41

(01-12-2014 07:53 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  Now, when you travel to a country that requires a visa, you'd need to get visas for both passports, right? Would that mean double the expense?

No, you don't need to use both at the same time, actually you can't, it is not officially recognized by any nation. You choose whatever one you want to use at any given time.

I use my brazilian passport just to get in and out of my local airport. Anywhere else in the world i just show my European passport, so i don't need visas virtually anywhere in the planet. Also get all other European benefits, including social ones if i ever need.

European countries also usually give benefits thru' the embassy where you live, i.e. they may pay your university if you can't.

Post: #42

(01-14-2014 03:50 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  

(01-14-2014 04:48 AM)TravelingDoc Wrote:  I have a Hong Kong and a Canadian passport. I am currently waiting for my EU passport (2 1/2 more years). You don't really realize the benefit until you really need it. (after the 2 1/2 years is up, most likely I start the process of getting another EU passport)

Just out of curiosity, why would you want another EU passport if you already have the benefits of EU citizenship?

Not all EU citizenship are equal because the bottom line is that they are different countries. I am getting Bulgaria citizenship (not the best country) but the easiest passport to get. I am thinking about UK or Belgium citizenship. To start the process, all you do is setup residence (ie file paperwork that you are in that country legally and have official start date)

My Hong Kong and Canada passport already give me most of the benefit that I need (visa free to most countries including FSUs). Getting a Bulgaria is just for backup access to EU (or future healthcare access). A Belgium or UK passport is just for "why not", the cost is minimal. The biggest thing for me is the tax implication of residence/citizenship. UK have non-dom and Belgium don't tax capital gain. The only "bad" things about all these citizenship is that my children (if I am getting any) will have to be born in HK. Hong Kong don't let you just pass your citizenship to your children, they just get the right to live there and have to apply for HK passport after living there for 7 years.

Getting to live in any country is easy, getting a passport from that country is HARD.

BTW. One of the Hardest and best passport to get is Switzerland. There are lots of people that are born there and live there all their life and still can't get it after applying multiple times. If you have or can get it, get it.

Post: #43

About the list of countries that do not allow, it is not that simple and you may be allowed. Just ask the embassy, not google. The country of my second citzenship does not allow as a general rule but i do have.

Post: #44

Quote:BUT you don't have to have china passport to be consider a Chinese citizen. The law state that if you have Chinese ancestry you will be consider a Chinese citizen. So, if you are in China and look Chinese, you ARE Chinese citizen. Only around this is to file paperwork to revoke a Chinese Citizenship that you don't have.

Source?

Post: #45

(01-14-2014 05:44 PM)hipster Wrote:  About the list of countries that do not allow, it is not that simple and you may be allowed. Just ask the embassy, not google. The country of my second citzenship does not allow as a general rule but i do have.

That is exactly right. For example, that list identifies Poland and Lithuania as nations that do not allow dual citizenship. That is true if you immigrate to those countries (you must give up your existing citizenship) or emigrate from those countries (you lose your Polish or Lithuanian citizenship).

But they both also allow a narrow exception for dual citizenship for persons whose ancestors fled the Soviet occupation.

BTW: Ireland, Italy, Poland, Lithuania, and Luxembourg all allow citizenship by ancestry under certain conditions. Greece may do so as well.

Post: #46

I was born with dual U.S/EU citizenship. It has been invaluable to me. I did an extended 9 month trip through Europe last year. Over the summer, I had some unexpected cash flows problems so I picked up a restaurant gig in Vienna. I couldn't have done that if I was just an American.

In the future, I will probably drop the American one as I don't like the idea of world wide taxation. If i'm not living in the country, im not paying taxes. PERIOD.

Post: #47

(01-14-2014 05:52 PM)Peregrine Wrote:  

Quote:BUT you don't have to have china passport to be consider a Chinese citizen. The law state that if you have Chinese ancestry you will be consider a Chinese citizen. So, if you are in China and look Chinese, you ARE Chinese citizen. Only around this is to file paperwork to revoke a Chinese Citizenship that you don't have.

Source?

Sorry, I should clarify that. It is too general a statement.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationality...c_of_China

http://www.clic.org.hk/en/topics/immigra...tionality/
(Chinese nationality is acquired primarily through ancestry, not place of birth)

http://www.gov.hk/en/residents/immigrati...se/law.htm
Article 3: The People’s Republic of China does not recognise dual nationality for any Chinese national.

Article 4: Any person born in China whose parents are both Chinese nationals or one of whose parents is a Chinese national shall have Chinese nationality.

Article 5: Any person born abroad whose parents are both Chinese nationals or one of whose parents is a Chinese national shall have Chinese nationality. But a person whose parents are both Chinese nationals and have both settled abroad, or one of whose parents is a Chinese national and has settled abroad, and who has acquired foreign nationality at birth shall not have Chinese nationality.

So, from the law you a not suppose to be a Chinese citizen from Article 5 if you are born oversea. From article 4, you are Chinese citizen if your parent are Chinese and this citizenship is given automatically. Article 3 state that China will not recognize any other citizenship if you are Chinese citizen. When you put all this together, if you get into trouble in China, you produce a oversea passport. Offices can said "No, you are Chinese and we don't recongize your other citizenship." You now have to prove that your parent settle into other country so that you not a Chinese citizen. Remember this is China, you can disappear into the system as easy as 123. In the english media, you don't ever hear about these. In the oversea chinese newpaper, I had came across story that people get into trouble and is treated as Chinese until they spend money and resource to prove otherwise. From these, I believe that there are other people that are treated as Chinese citizen when not and we never hear about it.

I treat China as what it is, a corrupt country that you have to watch your back because no one else will do it. Expect that your employee, business partner and official will stick a knife in your back.

Post: #48

(01-13-2014 11:13 PM)Teutatis Wrote:  I have an EU passport and American greencard.

US green card holders (permanent residents) are required to file the same tax forms as citizens.

At least according to everything I've heard and read on the matter.

Post: #49

(01-14-2014 03:47 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  Being born in the U.S. means nothing after you renounce your U.S. citizenship.

I have heard (from an immigration attorney) that someone who renounced was able to regain their US citizenship. He didn't give the details.

However, it was a rare case and was not easy.

That being said it would not be wise to count on it.

Post: #50

(01-15-2014 01:18 AM)buja Wrote:  

(01-13-2014 11:13 PM)Teutatis Wrote:  I have an EU passport and American greencard.

US green card holders (permanent residents) are required to file the same tax forms as citizens.

At least according to everything I've heard and read on the matter.

That is correct. The point is that you can simply give up your green card to eliminate your U.S. tax burden. That tax burden is not nearly so easy to eliminate once you become a U.S. citizen.