Seadog,

Here is what I believe. This kind of public drunkenness and making a fool out of yourself in front of others is completely fine when a man is under 25, and just about acceptable, although increasingly less so, when a man is between 25 and 30. The moment you turn 30, it has to end, or -- no matter how successful you may otherwise be -- you are on your way to being a loser; and that is not a path you want to be on.

The antics that bespeak youthful intensity and charm when a man is young begin to sour very rapidly, like bad milk, as he puts on the least age. You never want to hear other people start referring to you as a "turning into a monster" because of the way you are when drinking in public. That is when you know that the twenties bye you have been given is past its expiration date, and it's time for a change.

As far as your friendships go, it is a good question and here is my experience. Serious friendships between men cannot be maintained past this age -- early thirties -- if drinking is their absolute base and foundation. Attempting to maintain a friendship that rests on that foundation alone is a lie, and alcohol is an increasingly bad and stumbling liar. A friendship cannot continue by remaining the same; for it to survive and thrive, it has to deepen as it changes. You can continue being drinking buddies with someone and maintain the illusion of friendship, but it will increasingly not be the same thing as the genuine article.

If you take a long break from drinking, your friendships that were primarily based on it will be tested, and some may not survive -- but that will mean their roots did not go quite as deeply as they might have seemed to in the first place (and that is completely fine and does not detract from the worth the friendship might have had at the time). But the friendships that will survive and thrive even when the crutch of alcohol is taken away are ones you will be able to enjoy ever more deeply for a long time to come -- the rest of your life, if you and your friends are lucky.

I'm going on the wagon as of today. I've been a heavy drinker for about 8 years now, and it's done a lot of damage in my life (I won't go into any details, as my case is pretty universal).

I've also had a lot of amazing times with alcohol (and drugs), and while I've been craving a change for a while (I've had a constant feeling of guilt and regret over my drinking for a long time), I find it hard to imagine ever being able to have anything close to the times I've had when drinking or doing drugs. I also drink to help with my shyness, and I'm pretty sure I've never pulled when sober, so that's going to be another hurdle for me.

Anyway, reading through the thread has been motivating and I feel pretty optimistic right now. I expect the depression and anxiety to hit me by mid-week though, so hopefully re-visiting the thread will help me stay motivated. Thanks for all the posts.

Kieran, are you in for the full year?

Yeah I'm in for the full year, and hopefully more. Cheers.

(12-07-2014 06:16 AM)micha Wrote:  A word of "warning" about the book from me:

Don't trust it as blindly as the "quit smoking" counterpart written by him (if you read it before). By that I mean, the book about smoking is a tremendous piece of work and I would pay people that I care about money just to read it. I know they would quit 99% chance and it would be totally worth it.

However, the book on drinking is a tad weaker I find. On multiple occasions I wanted to put it down because it's too whacky or exaggerates greatly. THEN AGAIN, it does have truth in it. You just need to absorb that truth and ignore parts that don't resonate with you. So it is important to keep reading, and finish the book, even through parts you don't like.

It's not a magic pill (whereas his book on smoking is as close to a magic pill as you can get) but it may help you.


I'm approaching my fourth month sober and I can tell you that it is absolutely worth it. The hard part is trusting the process in the beginning where life seems absolutely meaningless without booze.

If we were doomed to feel like we do during the first month of sobriety for our entire life, then by all means, we should continue to drink and eventually pay the price. BUT WE ARE NOT. We will start to feel good without alcohol. The cravings will go away. We will find new hobbies and passions. We will accept that it was a part of our life and that it is over now. Like our childhood. Sure, maybe we miss it - but we don't gloom over it every minute wishing it back. We take on our new challenges and thrive. That is part of being a man - or maybe part of becoming one

I agree. Still I think it is a lot more valuable than AA literature. I only go to AA to do my 13th step lol.

Yes, definitely do read it. Absolutely recommended; just with some caveats.

(12-08-2014 03:28 AM)Kieran Wrote:  Yeah I'm in for the full year, and hopefully more. Cheers.

Kieran, welcome aboard as of December 7th, and hope to hear more from you on the thread over time.

Thank you Lizard of Oz.

I'm one month completely sober as of today.

Long story kind of short: I quit herb nearly two years ago now. Used to smoke herb heavily and loved how it would take you out of the mental sewer for a couple hours, but DAMN if my smoking the weed didn't contribute to some wasted years. Around this time last year, the only substances left were nicotine and alcohol... as everyone knows, those two go well together. So, this year I'd be doing well with my quit, start smoking again, and eventually convince myself that, "Eh, fuck it, I'm going to quit again on Sunday, might as well go booze on Friday night." I'm not a person who can really drink in moderation so it was like roll the dice what would happen.

Fortunately nothing too outlandish happened apart from some wicked hangovers (they do get worse in your 30's...).

I made real progress (quit booze and cigarettes) after reading this post in early November and taking action: http://www.dangerandplay.com/2014/11/02/kill-mr-maybe/

In the past month I've lost 8 pounds, get way more shit accomplished, and generally enjoy life more. While this year's challenge has has been unsuccessful for me on paper, this change in mindset great. I am all in for 2015 and will report back.

Thank you again Lizard of Oz for this thread.

Everything Lizard has said in this thread has been absolute gold. Lizard thank you for putting so much time into it and really helping so many out.

I'm not going to go through the threads and see when my start date was but it was about a year ago. I <strike>fucked up a couple times </strike> chose to drink a couple time and rationalized the reason. I don't regret those times as long stretches of sobriety followed by a crippling hangover really demonstrates how it can be poison. I thought about the effects and lack of benefits every time. After enjoying the benefits of not drinking for months it took almost a week every time to get my head back to where it was. It was also very difficult to talk myself in to getting back on the wagon at those times, the inner beast kept saying "you already jumped off, enjoy it for a couple weeks and then you can start again"

In all it was about 360 out of 365 days in the last year on the wagon. Certainly nothing to brag about but something to improve upon in the next year.

To those reading and thinking about jumping on I strongly suggest reading Allen Carr's book as many others have suggested. Another book that goes hand in hand with Carr is Rational Recovery. It helps you to recognize your thought on alcohol and drinking and knocks them right out. Here is a free crash course on it. http://rational.org/index.php?id=115

Rollin' up on the 3 month point in four days. Feeling (and looking tsk tsk) damn good.

Hyped as ever.

I hate alcohol but love marijuana (got a medical card) and some angel dust here and there so i don't qualify. That said alcohol is pretty much the worst drug for you physically and i can feel my testosterone drop significantly if I drink too much or too often.

Just noticed I hit 60 days a few days ago. I'm not even counting this time around.

Fuck it, I'm in. I've been trying to limit my alcohol consumption with varying degrees of success. But booze is definitely holding me back in life in a number of ways.

I'll have a couple of whiskeys at the airport lounge tomorrow, and then after that, my next drink will be January 1st 2016.

My start date is 19 December 2014.

12/17 - In for a year, starting today.

As a born introvert, alcohol has been my crutch in social situations for almost half my life now. My early experiences getting drunk were eye openers—in one of his books, Bukowski recalled thinking "this is going to help me for a long time" after his first drink, and I know exactly how he felt.

Now that I'm no longer the inexperienced, unconfident 16 year old I once was, it's probably time to adjust to a new mode of socializing. I also run competitively and drinking has started taking an obvious toll on my performance there. I plan to use this year to work on both areas.

Thanks to Lizard and all the others in this thread for the encouragement to do it.

I had a nightmare that I was hanging out at a party, someone handed me shots and I just took them. Then I was drunk and all of a sudden remembered that I was on the year long challenge. The rest of the dream I was trying to decide if I should just keep drinking or stop right there.

I had the same feeling when I've had dreams about showing up to class but without my homework, or there was a test and I had no idea what the answers were etc.

I had a dream about alcohol as well (that I drank it, and only afterward realized I wasn't supposed to). Not a full blown nightmare, but the kind of "Oh fuck feeling" in a dream.

Anyway, I'm wide awake now.

2 days until 4 months sober.

Lately, I've noted a tendency to overdrink on the rare occasions that I go out, and the consequences of doing so affect me for days afterwards. I have a lot of family members on both sides of my family who have been addicted to various substances. I'm not an expert on the subject, but I am strongly inclined to believe that I may be at a genetic risk for being addicted to things, so I'm going to jump on this 1 year challenge starting now and go through until the end of 2015.

It's probably going to be weird being sober at my semi-formal and my formal, but fuck it, I've accepted that college hasn't been and probably never will be the "best time of my life". I did too many things wrong and there's no point in trying to make up for all the opportunities I missed in the first two years. Right now I just need to focus on finishing up my fucking degree and getting out so I can move on with my life.

No more booze from now through the end of 2015.

^ Clear your head and have more patience.

Don't give up on your last college years. You can do a lot in one semester let alone 2 years. Make them the best you can.

Get rid of the negatives, and the neutrals (usually time-wasters). Use the positive.

4profit, lots of companies don't give a shit about your first couple years anyways, the key is to perform well in your upper level major specific courses. Crush those and your past will almost be erased.

(12-17-2014 05:27 AM)Horus Wrote:  Fuck it, I'm in. I've been trying to limit my alcohol consumption with varying degrees of success. But booze is definitely holding me back in life in a number of ways.

I'll have a couple of whiskeys at the airport lounge tomorrow, and then after that, my next drink will be January 1st 2016.

My start date is 19 December 2014.

Horus, welcome aboard as of December 19, 2014. Hope to hear more from you here over time.

(12-17-2014 05:40 AM)LouieG Wrote:  12/17 - In for a year, starting today.

As a born introvert, alcohol has been my crutch in social situations for almost half my life now. My early experiences getting drunk were eye openers—in one of his books, Bukowski recalled thinking "this is going to help me for a long time" after his first drink, and I know exactly how he felt.

Now that I'm no longer the inexperienced, unconfident 16 year old I once was, it's probably time to adjust to a new mode of socializing. I also run competitively and drinking has started taking an obvious toll on my performance there. I plan to use this year to work on both areas.

Thanks to Lizard and all the others in this thread for the encouragement to do it.

LouieG, welcome aboard as of December 17, 2014, and please post some updates as time goes on.

4profit -- 20 or 21 years old (which I assume is your age) is awfully young to be jumping on a wagon, except in really unusual circumstances. The wagon is really more appropriate for guys who have been drinking hard some years already. Committing to a whole year is a serious decision, and you might feel differently about things in a couple of months.

Rather than going in for the full year, maybe you should consider just taking a little time off from drinking (say, a month) if you feel like it, and in the meantime, focus on making your time in college as enjoyable and productive as it can be.

The past always matters less than most people imagine, and that is laughably true when you're young. There are probably a few simple things you can do that can make your time there go much better. Figure out what they are, and do them.

Fisto and micha, wagon drinking dreams of this kind -- where you are drinking and then suddenly realize that you're not supposed to be -- are normal. I still get them once in a blue moon, after almost 8 years.

Allen Carr mentions these dreams in his book. He talks about how you shouldn't worry they're a sign that they're missing alcohol - the fact that it feels like a nightmare proves how realistically you now see the predicament you once were in.