Post: #226

I feel sorry for any manager not managing a top-4 club. I think it is impossible to prove yourself these days unless you are managing a big club.

There is no way of knowing if Roy Keane, Steve Bruce or even Sam Alladyce could be great managers until they get a shot with a big club.

Even Kevin Keegan shows this. He did fantastic with Newcastle Utd in the mid 90's. And then 10 years later - the premier league had moved on too much (ie everything was 5 times more expensive) for him to build a squad capable of competing.

Also - at the very highest levels. The difference between defeat and glory is so slender that luck plays a big part.

For instance - Ferguson was lucky that his team managed to score twice in injury time (back in 1999) to win his first European trophy. And he was lucky again when his team won the final on penalties back in 2008 against Chelsea.

Similarly - Mourinho was unlucky back in 2007(?) when Barcelona beat Chelsea in the semi-finals after some outrageous refereeing decisions.

And equally - look at Avram Grant. He was one penalty kick away in 2008 from winning the European Championship. Which would have meant achieving the one prize in his first season with Chelsea that Mourinho had never gotten his hands around. Does that mean Avram Grant was 18 inches away from being a better manager than Mourinho?

And look at Roberto Di Matteo - he won the Champions League with Chelsea. And ended up getting fired. And is now without a job.

I know it isn't a fun thing to say - but it is all completely random once you get to the semi-finals.

At least with the premier league it is a fairer test. But then the strength and depth of your squad is the most important factor. Throughout a season it is rare that the manager makes a crucial decision which can clearly be shown to have affected the outcome of the match. Especially since - week in/week out - the team mostly picks itself.

One other thing. Even a manger's ability to sign good players is largely random. Every manager makes just as many disappointing signings as they do good ones. Yet - only the good ones get remembered. And because of that - managers get praised for an ability which is largely a statisical illusion.

Post: #227

One of the best writers in football is 'The Secret Footballer' who writes for the Guardian. He is a current premier league footballer who writes anonymously for the newspaper.

All of his columns are worth checking out.

Here he is discussing what made Ferguson great.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/...son-legend

Post: #228

^^ Agree with most of this. Only it wasnt Mourinho with Chelsea that was lucky it was Hiddink in that semi-final in 2009 I think. Also Mourinho was extremely lucky when he won it with inter against Barca in the semis.

Post: #229

The luck factor in football is what makes it so great. Because a single kick can win a game due to the importance of a single goal. And becausesgoals are so precious - luck becomes a factor. It always intrigues me that the greatest goal you have ever seen - would never have happened if a tackle was successfully made on the guy who passed the ball to the scorer a minute earlier. In football - any one action - changes the exact composition of the rest of the game.

In no other sport can a single action win a game. In most sports you have to successfully convert dozens and dozens of 'points' before you win a match.

Not in football - a single mistake or piece of skill can win you the game. Only boxing is similar. But even then most fights are won because one fighter is dominating the other. It is rare that a lucky punch wins the fight.

But it is still thrilling when it happens:

Post: #230

Another great columnist, to add to cardguy's recommendations, Barney Ronay at the Guardian

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/...mas-muller

That article concerns the great Thomas Muller


EDIT: his most recent article on the departure of Ferguson
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/...x-ferguson

Post: #231

Rumor: Falcao will sign for Monaco !

Post: #232

If so it must be bc he needs more money for the rent... Not a chance I think! Probably Chelsea will ship out Torres and buy Falcao. Romans wallet is always ready for the flavor of the year.

Post: #233

Apparently Monaco will pay 55M for the transfer but the player will be free to leave for Real Madrid as soon as January... Weird...

Post: #234

Wigan just defeated City for the FA cup.. last minute winner from a corner.

Didn't follow the FA cup much this year, but this was a surprise.

Post: #235

(05-11-2013 01:12 PM)Nascimento Wrote:  Wigan just defeated City for the FA cup.. last minute winner from a corner.

Didn't follow the FA cup much this year, but this was a surprise.

I wish I'd bet on this. Apparently the odds were 9/1 and I just had a feeling that Wigan would win/ City wouldnt be at their best.

Post: #236

(05-11-2013 01:12 PM)Nascimento Wrote:  Wigan just defeated City for the FA cup.. last minute winner from a corner.

Didn't follow the FA cup much this year, but this was a surprise.

it wasn't a surprise if you watched the game the game tonight. the wigan players were much more hungrier the out run and out fought the man city players.you could see that some of the man city players the didn't give a fuck, except for milnar.i think that's the end of mancini.
this proves again that

Post: #237

Neymar to Barca is pretty much a done deal according to reports. Should be fun to see is he has the same success playing in Spain vs. the weak defenders he had been facing in the Brazilian defenders.

Post: #238

(05-11-2013 01:47 PM)pirate player Wrote:  

(05-11-2013 01:12 PM)Nascimento Wrote:  Wigan just defeated City for the FA cup.. last minute winner from a corner.

Didn't follow the FA cup much this year, but this was a surprise.

it wasn't a surprise if you watched the game the game tonight. the wigan players were much more hungrier the out run and out fought the man city players.you could see that some of the man city players the didn't give a fuck, except for milnar.i think that's the end of mancini.
this proves again that

Yeah, I thought that it seemed as though man city just didnt care/ didn't want to be there particularly. Also I dont think that the speculation of pellegrini replacing mancini would have helped the players focus on the match and not next season.

Post: #239

(05-11-2013 01:51 PM)iWin Wrote:  Neymar to Barca is pretty much a done deal according to reports. Should be fun to see is he has the same success playing in Spain vs. the weak defenders he had been facing in the Brazilian defenders.

That's interesting. On first glance, I don't see a good reason for Neymar to leave Santos.

In Brazil (thanks in large part to the ascendant economy), Neymar is making almost as much as he could in any European league. Reports have put his annual income from football at about $870,000 a month, and his sponsorhip income doubles this amount (bringing his totals to around $20 million annually).

That puts him on a level with the likes of Wayne Rooney, Fernando Torres, and Sergio Aguero. He's supposedly outearning the likes of Kaka, Drogba, and Ibrahimovic, among many other huge names (Lampard, Terry, Schweinsteiger, etc, etc).

He's getting to have his cake and eat it-he can stay at home in his comfort zone and still take home big baller money with global fame to go with it. So why leave? Why bother taking on La Liga?

I suppose the best explanation would come from his drive as a competitor. Neymar has already made as much as he can make in Brazil and, as good as life is there, he may have the itch to prove himself on the pitch next to bigger names in the game. Perhaps his family and his agents also believe he could increase his financial potential even further with greater exposure in Europe. Neymar is only outearned by a handful of stars in Europe, but some of those stars (ex: Ronaldo, $43.5 Million estimated 2012 income) are doubling his annual earnings. Perhaps they believe that Neymar is one of the few who can reach that income level, and can only do so at a global super club like Barca or Real Madrid. Perhaps Santos also could really use the $90 million they'd get for selling him.

Whatever the reason, I'm sure that Brazil's Serie A will be very sad to see him go.

Post: #240

(05-11-2013 01:52 PM)Cyr Wrote:  

(05-11-2013 01:47 PM)pirate player Wrote:  

(05-11-2013 01:12 PM)Nascimento Wrote:  Wigan just defeated City for the FA cup.. last minute winner from a corner.

Didn't follow the FA cup much this year, but this was a surprise.

it wasn't a surprise if you watched the game the game tonight. the wigan players were much more hungrier the out run and out fought the man city players.you could see that some of the man city players the didn't give a fuck, except for milnar.i think that's the end of mancini.
this proves again that

Yeah, I thought that it seemed as though man city just didnt care/ didn't want to be there particularly. Also I dont think that the speculation of pellegrini replacing mancini would have helped the players focus on the match and not next season.

They haven't been hungry ever since Mancini publicly conceded to Man U about a month or so ago. As a result, Man City has played beneath their potential--I don't get why coaches make public statements like that. I believe a significant portion of Newcastle's woeful performances stems from when Pardew declared that "we are safe now with X pts and we can go on and focus on Europa". The minute he made that statement, Newcastle began to play shittier with their new recruits...and now their entire season depends on their performance tomorrow, along with Wigan's at Arsenal.

Pellegrini will be a great replacement for Mancini; unfortunately, Malaga will suffer. I've loved watching them this season and last season rise to the top, and Pellegrini making stars out of young guns (Isco), and underrated vets (Santa Cruz, Saviola).

Post: #241

Neymar will be horribly shown up in Europe. That's just my opinion of course. He's not that good a player. The Brazilians hype players up to a crazy level, Robinho for example.

Post: #242

I reckon Rafa will go to City. He'll have them winning the league and Champions League in the next 3 years if so. Mancini is a fraud, he's done an absolute torrid job at City given the players at his disposal. He should've walked the league last year and he can't even get out of the group stages of the Champions League. His excuse? He needed more attacking players.

Bullshit. They had the best front 4 IN EUROPE. Tevez, Aguero, Dzeko and Balotelli. I'm glad Wigan won, even though I want them out of the Premiership. Fucking shithouse fans can't turn up for their home games but they can all get to Wembley, can't they?

Post: #243

(05-11-2013 04:11 PM)MattC Wrote:  I reckon Rafa will go to City. He'll have them winning the league and Champions League in the next 3 years if so. Mancini is a fraud, he's done an absolute torrid job at City given the players at his disposal. He should've walked the league last year and he can't even get out of the group stages of the Champions League. His excuse? He needed more attacking players.

Bullshit. They had the best front 4 IN EUROPE. Tevez, Aguero, Dzeko and Balotelli. I'm glad Wigan won, even though I want them out of the Premiership. Fucking shithouse fans can't turn up for their home games but they can all get to Wembley, can't they?

to be fair he had to deal with REAL, DORTMUND and AJAX in the champions league. the only thing i can fault mancini with is, after winning the league he did not improve his first eleven.he bought Rodwell, Sinclair, Maicon ,Javi garcia,all of whom were not an improvement to the players he let go, except Nastatic.While Man Utd went out and bought RVP and Kagawa 2 world class players

Post: #244

(05-11-2013 04:04 PM)Teedub Wrote:  Neymar will be horribly shown up in Europe. That's just my opinion of course. He's not that good a player. The Brazilians hype players up to a crazy level, Robinho for example.

Always knew Robinho would be a flop. Another player I always thought was overrated was Samuel Eto'o.

Post: #245

(05-11-2013 05:50 PM)cardguy Wrote:  Always knew Robinho would be a flop. Another player I always thought was overrated was Samuel Eto'o.

I don't think its fair to mention Eto'o in the same breath as Robinho if we're discussing overrated player. Samuel has been way more productive for club and country.

Post: #246

(05-11-2013 02:34 PM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

(05-11-2013 01:51 PM)iWin Wrote:  Neymar to Barca is pretty much a done deal according to reports. Should be fun to see is he has the same success playing in Spain vs. the weak defenders he had been facing in the Brazilian defenders.

That's interesting. On first glance, I don't see a good reason for Neymar to leave Santos.

In Brazil (thanks in large part to the ascendant economy), Neymar is making almost as much as he could in any European league. Reports have put his annual income from football at about $870,000 a month, and his sponsorhip income doubles this amount (bringing his totals to around $20 million annually).

That puts him on a level with the likes of Wayne Rooney, Fernando Torres, and Sergio Aguero. He's supposedly outearning the likes of Kaka, Drogba, and Ibrahimovic, among many other huge names (Lampard, Terry, Schweinsteiger, etc, etc).

He's getting to have his cake and eat it-he can stay at home in his comfort zone and still take home big baller money with global fame to go with it. So why leave? Why bother taking on La Liga?

I suppose the best explanation would come from his drive as a competitor. Neymar has already made as much as he can make in Brazil and, as good as life is there, he may have the itch to prove himself on the pitch next to bigger names in the game. Perhaps his family and his agents also believe he could increase his financial potential even further with greater exposure in Europe. Neymar is only outearned by a handful of stars in Europe, but some of those stars (ex: Ronaldo, $43.5 Million estimated 2012 income) are doubling his annual earnings. Perhaps they believe that Neymar is one of the few who can reach that income level, and can only do so at a global super club like Barca or Real Madrid. Perhaps Santos also could really use the $90 million they'd get for selling him.

Whatever the reason, I'm sure that Brazil's Serie A will be very sad to see him go.

I'm with you there. However, there is a pervasive sense that Neymar is all flash and no substance, as well as unproven by many in football circles. In fact, many conjure up comparisons to Robinho or Pato(who have been severely underwhelming in Italy), when people talk about his impending move to Europe. This is also due in part to his perceived lack of maturity and slight build. I'm sure he's gotten wind of these criticisms and would like nothing more than to prove everyone wrong. He is seemingly stagnating from a skill standpoint in Brazil and could use the inspiration to realize his full potential.

The other thing is that he really wants to play with Messi. Hell he just rejected a 100 Euro move to Real, and appears to be getting significantly less to sign with Barca. His goal scoring talents will be much needed for Barca who's wingers struggle to consistently produce goals. A disproportionate burden is put on Messi to produce every game. Financially, Barca will make the money they spent to get Neymar back many times over due to his marketing prowess. Its a great move and both Neymar and Barca stand to gain alot should they be as successful as expected.

Post: #247

(05-11-2013 05:50 PM)cardguy Wrote:  

(05-11-2013 04:04 PM)Teedub Wrote:  Neymar will be horribly shown up in Europe. That's just my opinion of course. He's not that good a player. The Brazilians hype players up to a crazy level, Robinho for example.

Always knew Robinho would be a flop. Another player I always thought was overrated was Samuel Eto'o.

His current form with Anzhi has been very up and down(although he just scored the goal to send Anzhi to the Russian League finals), but he's not very happy there and it seems to be affecting his play. However with Barca and Inter he was simply sublime and one of the top strikers in the world, with great pace, great skill with both feet and great movement in the box.

He has also been able to adjust to three different leagues and has been a very prolific with goal scoring at different times in his career. For instance , like his last season in Inter where he basically carried the offense. Lastly, he's a winner.

Post: #248

(05-11-2013 06:16 PM)iWin Wrote:  

(05-11-2013 05:50 PM)cardguy Wrote:  

(05-11-2013 04:04 PM)Teedub Wrote:  Neymar will be horribly shown up in Europe. That's just my opinion of course. He's not that good a player. The Brazilians hype players up to a crazy level, Robinho for example.

Always knew Robinho would be a flop. Another player I always thought was overrated was Samuel Eto'o.

His current form with Anzhi has been very up and down(although he just scored the goal to send Anzhi to the Russian League finals), but he's not very happy there and it seems to be affecting his play. However with Barca and Inter he was simply sublime and one of the top strikers in the worlds, with great pace, great skill with both feet and great movement in the box.

He has also been able to adjust to three different leagues and has been a very prolific with goal scoring at different times in his career. For instance , like his last season in Inter where he basically carried the offense.

He's not been playing his usual all out striker for Anzhi. He drops deep a lot and is almost doing what Rooney does for United.

Post: #249

All the people mentioned are good players. I am just trying to distinguish from the hype that is put about which says they are great players.

Another player I never liked was Alessandro Del Piero. He seemed to be like some kind of Beckham figure - where his image was more important than his ability. I never really rated him.

Post: #250

Scholes is retiring (again) too then.

If England managers had any sense, they would've played a 4-2-3-1 with Scholes and Carrick holding, and Gerrard/Lampard playing in front of them.