Post: #801

She'd looked at me a couple of times yeah, but then she was completely fixated on her phone in her bag like in the picture for about 5 minutes before I opened her.

Post: #802

(05-27-2013 01:21 PM)GreenGranted Wrote:  3 approaches last 2 days:

I was one my bike and in quite a hurry, .........

At a busy intersection:
I get off my bike. Walk up to her as if lost (I almost had to run to keep up with her).
ME: excuse me, do you know where the nearest pet shop is?
HER: no, no clue, sorry!

This leads to me accounting an approach I did a few days ago.
This is one where you "practically had to run" seems like it was set up badly for you: "How fast is she moving?"

I'm trying to make some rules, sort of like checklists, because I miss simple shit, both good and bad. I'm 50+, I only do day game. I don't like drunks.

I'll break them up into Pre-Approach Phase 1 and Post-Approach Phase 2 screenings. I want to put women through a screening and only try to number close the ones that pass x out of x phases. I don't like pushing because I'm always 2x their age. Sometimes 3x. I want to avoid constant blowouts and screen for those who send positive cues not and lack negative cues. If you want to say "Man up and approach everyone" please wait 'til you're over 45 and see if you feel the same. If I just say a few things and ditch when she isn't escalating cues, I feel less dejected.

Here are some ideas I will be using to screen for direct candidates, some by Roosh :

PRE-APPROACH INDICATORS:

1) Eye contact. # of times-1,2,3,4 is important. EC1, EC2..Longer than x seconds ( eye-fucking) is in a separate category, if you are eye-fucked, imagine a fat, tattooed feminist screaming at you "Approach her you idiot, if only to thwart MEEEEEEEE!"

2) How fast are they moving? HFISM. (Roosh) This is a key negative. If they're moving real fast they're either late or don't want to be bothered. Also, how purposeful are they? Are they walking with head sort of down, moving in a particular direction without looking to the side?

3) Some attention to appearance. ATA. Depends on the circumstances, but sweats and unbrushed hair when she goes to a coffee shop to study indicate she is not thinking "I hope I meet a guy today." I want women who are consciously thinking "I'm horny and I want attention" Of course if she is a mess because of coming back from a bike ride, I love it. Exercising counts as sex-positive indicator of ATA

4) She creates earbud-free openings. EFO. If she is consciously hoping someone will talk to her, she'll at some point de-encapsulate.

5) In group of 2 or less.

PRE-APPROACH SELF-STATEMENTS:

1) If you open your mouth and say ANYTHING, you are immediately ahead of 99% of guys who walk around like robots. Be superior to the robots.
2) You will probably never see her again if you don't move. (Roosh)
3) Sex isn't a big thing when you're getting it, it's a big thing when you're NOT getting it. Even if she has a guy, she's dissatisfied in some way.

POST APPROACH:

3) Do they ask questions, or respond to statements that don't require a response? These are indicators that she is putting energy into the interaction. If she just wants you to go away, she will probably do neither.

Questions is really key and I still have trouble noticing it. I'm so busy thinking of what to talk about I miss it.

College town, discount food store, Asian 7, about 20, me 50+.
She was walking around looking at everything. Obviously did not have to be anywhere particular for a few minutes.

Me: They have so much good stuff in here I can't decide.

Her: Looked at me and smiled, pretty friendly.

She was looking at salad dressing.

Me: (Loking at a salad dressing.)

She was looking at salad dressing. I decided to screen for enthusiasm by making a comment without looking at her and seeing if she responded. Hahha, she didn't

Me: ( Looking at salad dressing) I'm looking for salad dresisng too, I'm trying to find one without garbage in it.

Listening not looking at her. She didn't say anything.

I realized I was being negative and left. But I think if she was real interested she would have said _something_.

I want to go more direct too, but only after cues. This one hadn't looked at me, but she was bored.

Post: #803

Echo chamber here, but that's OK. The more I think about approach analysis, the more I'm doing it every day. I want more data.

I'm moving towards following the advice of pros. Own apartment in center of college town.
Need to get a couch and a TV.

Yesterday, used the EC theory to NOT approach. Sacrilege, I know.

Starbucks, Filipina (in USA) 7. Made eye contact once. I kept checking her out and she NEVER made eye contact again-- I sensed she was aware of my interest, and was deliberately avoiding EC. Next. She looked sort of depressed. Why bother?

Today:

On line In Discount Food Store: Latin Spinner, 8/9 body, tiny tiny waist, well proportioned, 5 face, seemed like she had some acne problem. Got pretty close to me and you could just tell she was wired in general. Skin tight jeans and crop top. When I asked her if the hair gel she was buying was good she started giggling and squirming.

New indicators:

1) When I asked her about the hair gel she started giggling, shifting weight from one foot to other, touching things, including the hair gel. Your attention should make her happy but nervous. She's embarrassed she's ready to fuck right at the time. Contrast: If a chick just sort of stands there and doesn't animate.

2) Slutty clothes but no tattoos. Contrast: Tattoos are disgusting hipster expressions of anger and/or narcissism. I don't see women who see themselves as feminine getting tattoos.

3) I'm blond and she's Latina. (I'm grey dyed back to my natural blond anyway.)

She was so energetic it actually sort of made me nervous. I could imagine her just coming like 10 times in a session. She had some accent, didn't sound Mexican but I don't know what she could have been.

Pretty much fucked up and didn't try to close. But I am getting better at doing my daily approach. Last week I got at least 6/7 days.

Things I am noticing:

1) There are a LOT of foreign women in America, the great majority of whom are more open and less suspicious of random approaches. It kind of leads to the fact that even if you think the MurkaBeest is a horrible, horrible creature, there's no excuse for not approaching at all. Something common to foreign women: If they are in need sexually, they dress provocatively, because they are not averse to enabling Rape Culture.

2) The variance in female response is SO huge, up to about 8/9, above which they have a systematic old-guy-repellent in place. But below that some are obviously really happy to engage you, and other won't say hi. It's really more about them than me.

Post: #804

Great breakdown of Pre-Approach screening IKE, You put it down on paper what I do Subconsciously and then added some, only thing I would differ about would be opening girls with earbuds or girls who look closed.

I have been pleasently surprised many times in the past where a Girl looked closed but as soon as I open it was as if she was dying to talk to someone of value etc etc like here is an Approach in post # 566

The better looking the Girl the more closed she might act but can be gamed just like any other. You got nothing to loose Approaching even the closed vibe Girls, Give it a try.....

Busy at work right now but we need to talk about this Centrally located Apt in a University town .........

Post: #805

[attachment=12665][attachment=12666][attachment=12667][attachment=12668]

(06-13-2013 04:05 PM)Lothario Wrote:  The better looking the Girl the more closed she might act

Ever since Mystery codified the psychology of different levels of chicks this idea has been around and it's got to be true to some degree. ( He also said don't neg mediocre chicks or they may be wounded and freeze)

(06-13-2013 04:05 PM)Lothario Wrote:  but can be gamed just like any other. You got nothing to loose Approaching even the closed vibe Girls, Give it a try.....

That's easy to say if you're under 40, and I appreciate the encouragement, but
I'm well into my 50s, so I want to pick my battles. If she's less than half my age--maybe 1/3 my age-- and not cuing at all, I want to try to keep the ratio of positive responses high enough so I keep approaching.

(06-13-2013 04:05 PM)Lothario Wrote:  Busy at work right now but we need to talk about this Centrally located Apt in a University town .........

The whole issue of Whalism is not bad at all at good State schools.
I have repeated elsewhere, the anti-carb cult has taken hold in the middle class homes and a lot of these 20 years olds are really cute, some very firm and gorgeous.

All these pics were taken from a business window, not saying which town, but it's in the Western US.
These are only mildly cherry picked, maybe I left out one fatty out of 5 overall, obesity rate looking out the window is less than 20-30% among the students.

Post: #806

(06-13-2013 02:51 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  I'm moving towards following the advice of pros. Own apartment in center of college town.

Exactly.

Can you think of a more efficient strategy???

I can't.

(06-13-2013 04:05 PM)Lothario Wrote:  we need to talk about this Centrally located Apt in a University town

I'm ready when you are..

(06-12-2013 10:15 AM)iknowexactly Wrote:  4) She creates earbud-free openings. EFO. If she is consciously hoping someone will talk to her, she'll at some point de-encapsulate.

I actually think its good to approach girl with earbuds in her ears. It shows her that you have courage and you go after what you want. Also, it sometimes sort of shocks or surprises them which puts them into a little emotional state. I like to tap them on the shoulder or forearm. I've done this thousands of times and no ne has called the police on me yet, knock on wood!

Seriously:

I have been experimenting with different things..

Eye contact and smile - Like saying "hi" without speaking. If she smiles back, go open her. If not, you can still walk over and verbally say "hello".

Be a little louder - Sometimes the volume on their headphones is very low. I have opened girls wearing headphones and they answered me without hesitation. I don't even think they had the thing turned on.

Fake it - Move your mouth like you are saying something, but don't actually make a sound. Does that make sense? Just "mouth" it, pretend to say something. Often times, they will take off their headphones and say "what", or "were you talking to me", or "excuse me". This is a good test to see if she is really listening to something or not.

The shoulder/arm tap - Risky, but ballsy. She has to respect your confidence for doing this, but it could scare her if your not careful. Don't do it from behind her. I like to use it when she is walking past me in the same direction. Probably should be your last option.

There is a time for all of these. Sometimes I use more then one in a single approach. Just ignore the fucking headphones and open her gently.

There are addicted to their phones because it simulates them. Facebook, internet, email, text, twitter, music, pics, all in the palm of their hand. They love that power on their fingertips. Also, They might be doing it to scare away alot of beta males.

Overcoming Earphones

Post: #807

I went out with a forum member last week. We played some basketball then went to Trader Joes.

Not many targets on a Friday at 2pm but we did see a cute Asian. I put myself in her line of sight so she would see me, but, I ignored her.

We stopped near the free coffee, guess who walks right up literally right between myself and the other forum member..

She pours herself a cup of coffee..

me: do you work here?
her: ha no, i don't but everybody think i do right?
me: ya why are you wearing that green apron? Oh I see you work at a pet store..
her: yes, but i look like a trader joes employee
me: you do but working with animals is better then working with people.
her: i think so
me: definitely
her: i just come here on my lunch break
me: just to steal free coffee
her: ya, and buy a few things
me: you are in great shape, you must have a good diet
her: oh i don't know, i try
me: i can tell,
her: lol
me: do you have a little accent?
her: oh yes
me: where is it from?
her: im from taiwan
me: oh cool i love taiwan
her: do you know it
me: yes, i have a friend who is a native taiwanese indian
her: we call them aborigines
me: ok, are you native also
her: yes a little

Blah, blah, blah.. We chat a little more until I get a little bored and pretend to start walking away..

me: my name is gio, nice meeting you
her: im lulu
me: enjoy your lunch
her: thanks

We walk away. I explain to the forum member that I will re-approach this girl in a more aggressive manner.

This is an example of a "Fragmented Appraoch"

We walk around the store looking for more targets and we keep an eye on the Asian girl.

She gets in line. I decide that I will go wait for her near the front entrance. The forum member (at350zguy) signals me that she is coming.

She exits the store. I am standing there smiling and holding a watermelon. I am not facing her directly but more looking at her over my shoulder so that I don't appear overly eager.

me: hey
her: hey

Now, I turn and face her more directly.

me: nice chatting with you
her: you too
me: i know this is a little random but do you wanna exchange numbers and maybe get coffee or a drink sometime? I mean, if you are single..?

her: are you drunk or high
me: haha what?
her: haha
me: i seem like that huh? I'm just very alive and happy
her: haha do you wanna take my number
me: yes, but, i don't have my phone, why dont you call me
her: ok


Cute, thin, Asian with nice skin and long hair. We'll see what happens

Post: #808

Disappointed, Gio. She told you she works in a pet store and you didn't ask her where it is!

Post: #809

what do you guys do when there is no response to at all to a number from a direct daygame approach? I got my first direct daygame number today and texted a few hours later, no response.

Post: #810

(06-23-2013 07:51 PM)NewGamer Wrote:  what do you guys do when there is no response to at all to a number from a direct daygame approach? I got my first direct daygame number today and texted a few hours later, no response.

Try again in 2 days then write it off if she doesn't reply to that one.

Call them out on not replying. Tom Terero texts something like this, or the same concept: "no reply? That's it, I'm divorcing you and I want the cat".

Post: #811

Quote:imagine a fat, tattooed feminist screaming at you "Approach her you idiot, if only to thwart MEEEEEEEE!"

Unpleasant to imagine, yet hilarious.

I can hear that voice in my head like the fat white woman in the McDonald's beat down clip yelling "Stopppppppppppppp!"

Post: #812

(06-23-2013 07:56 PM)MattC Wrote:  

(06-23-2013 07:51 PM)NewGamer Wrote:  what do you guys do when there is no response to at all to a number from a direct daygame approach? I got my first direct daygame number today and texted a few hours later, no response.

Try again in 2 days then write it off if she doesn't reply to that one.

Call them out on not replying. Tom Terero texts something like this, or the same concept: "no reply? That's it, I'm divorcing you and I want the cat".

I wouldn't call them out on that. She doesn't reply, you simply move on, she doesn't have to reply.

Post: #813

(06-23-2013 07:56 PM)MattC Wrote:  

(06-23-2013 07:51 PM)NewGamer Wrote:  what do you guys do when there is no response to at all to a number from a direct daygame approach? I got my first direct daygame number today and texted a few hours later, no response.

Try again in 2 days then write it off if she doesn't reply to that one.

Call them out on not replying. Tom Terero texts something like this, or the same concept: "no reply? That's it, I'm divorcing you and I want the cat".

thats lame IMO, just move on to the next one.
why you wanna play entertainer for some chick that doesnt even bother to reply?

Post: #814

(06-23-2013 07:51 PM)NewGamer Wrote:  what do you guys do when there is no response to at all to a number from a direct daygame approach? I got my first direct daygame number today and texted a few hours later, no response.

I wait 48-72 hours and then text again.

If she doesn't respond to that text, then I move on.

Give her 2 chances to get back to you.

I like the Tom Terero line:

(06-23-2013 07:56 PM)MattC Wrote:  Call them out on not replying. Tom Terero texts something like this, or the same concept: "no reply? That's it, I'm divorcing you and I want the cat".

I never give up on a number just because she doesn't return my first text. Sometimes, they respond to the 2nd text.

Just be sure that the 2nd text is more emotionally engaging then the 1st one you sent.

I like to try and "re-engage" them. Every number you throw away is a potential bang that you are throwing away.

Give them 2 chances, but not 3.

Sometimes, not returning your first text is just a shit test. Sometimes, the girl is confused or shy or in a weird mood, etc. It never hurts to text her again, it will sometimes work. Again, the 2nd text should be more emotionally engaging then the first.

Post: #815

Grocery store yesterday. I see 3 cute girls all standing close to each other. I'm wondering which one I should approach and is there a possibility that I can approach all of them individually..?

One of them starts leaving the store, a beautiful, young Latina with a great body, tight jeans and a form fitting top, great round ass. She looks young so I forget about her. A guy walks up and is obviously the boyfriend of the 2nd girl, a cute European looking girl in yoga pants.

This leaves only a cute mixed looking girl, black and white looking, light skinned, nice body, form fitting jeans, thin, fat ass.

I put myself in her line of sight, but I ignore her. I just want her to notice me and observe me before I approach her. This is something I have been doing a lot lately. I call it a "Pre-Approach Evaluation"..

I am giving the girl a chance to observe me before I approach. This way, it's not such a surprise when I come talk to her. I want her to see that my body is in shape, my skin is healthy, my fashion is decent and my body language is strong. I want her to observe all of these things before I even talk to her.

I just stand about 15 feet in front of her and pretend like I'm shopping. I might glance at her 1 time just to see if she makes eye contact with me or smiles at me. If she makes solid eye contact with me, I would softly smirk or smile at her.

A little eye contact is good before approaching.

She doesn't really make eye contact with me, but, I'm sure that she has noticed me.

She walks right in front of me. She is wearing a little wool hat that says "MK"..

me: whats mk?
her: oh (smile) its micheal koors
me: michael koors, where have i heard that name before?
her: he's a designer, have you ever seen "americas next top model"
me: ya i've seen it a few times as i was flipping thru the channels
her: he also makes watches
me: oh ya, thats where i have seen the name

She starts to sort of walk away..

me: hey can i ask you something
her: (just turns a looks at me)
me: do you date spanish guys?
her: no
me: no?
her: i mean, i never have, but i dont discriminate
me: my name is gio, whats yours
her: im alise
me: thats a nice name
her: thanks, so what do you do?
me: well, i just quit my job as a teacher
her: really, why?
me: i didn't like fixing other peoples problems all day
her: hmmm
me: how about you?
her: im in college
me: where
her: university of san francisco
me: oh cool, i went there for summer school once, what do you study?
her: fashion design
me: ya i can tell, you got a unique style
her: lol

We are walking and talking. We kind of look at each other and smile.

me: so, do you wanna get coffee or a drink or something sometime?
her: um, okay
me: why don't you call me from your phone so i have your number, i'll text you in a few days
her: ya okay

She looks about 20 or 21. She lives in my neighborhood. Perfect.

Post: #816

(06-23-2013 04:03 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  Now, I turn and face her more directly.

me: nice chatting with you
her: you too
me: i know this is a little random but do you wanna exchange numbers and maybe get coffee or a drink sometime? I mean, if you are single..?


Cute, thin, Asian with nice skin and long hair. We'll see what happens

Gio, I admire how you devote so much time and energy to daygame. I believe daygame trumps it all. Night venues are a distant second, street game at night is third, and finally online is last in my book.

I have a question, why do you oftentimes say "i know this is a little random," before asking for the number. I know you don't truly believe it is random. Men are attracted to attractive females and want to bang them. Do you do it to sort of mindfuck the girls into them thinking it is random and therefore any future sex would be random? Are you in some ways planting a plausible deniability seed in their minds at that point?

Post: #817

(06-24-2013 12:55 PM)RougeNoir Wrote:  I have a question, why do you oftentimes say "i know this is a little random," before asking for the number.

Great question. I was just talking to Menace and gandt about this.

I do it for a number of reasons, they are all sort of related. let me try to explain..

I want to make the interaction seem "random". If I am too smooth about it, she might think that I do this all the time. I am pretending to be a little nervous. I am pretending that I don't do this everyday.

I want it all to seem "serendipitous.

I want it to feel spontaneous and not pre-planned or rehearsed.

I also say it to acknowledge the fact that most people don't do it. I have enough social awareness to know that.

I am basically just pretending to be a normal guy who might be a little shy about approaching.

If we are too smooth and slick they start thinking that we are hardcore players. I'm just trying to soften my player vibe.

Post: #818

^^^

Funny that you guys are discussing it and I am remembering Girls questioning me , Do I hang out in the Grocery Store to hit on Girls ? which means I am on too much of an Auto Pilot to Approach and proceeding on with the Approach with out realizing it's going a little too smooth.

Thanks Gio for reminding to intentionally stumble a little during the Approach .

Post: #819

Not to thread hijack, but I was skimming through this and saw you guys talking about texting after not getting a reply from the previous attempt.

It's important that the text has undertones that will engage either her emotions/vanity, and/or spike her curiosity.

Especially for the early-mid 20's type girls that are so engrossed in social media attention.

Variations that have been successful for me, even weeks after meeting a girl:

"I just remembered something interesting about you/you told me..."


This also creates open format to calibrate based on her response

Post: #820

(06-24-2013 04:35 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  I want it all to seem serendipitous.

I want it to feel spontaneous and not pre-planned or rehearsed.

I also say it to acknowledge the fact that most people don't do it. I have enough social awareness to know that.

That's a great way to describe it. Women want to think it "just happened" and when you acknowledge that it's not the "normal" thing that would happen it makes it more okay for the woman because she's just being presented with a unique opportunity, not being too forward by giving you her number (and you're not just a sleazeball trying to pick up girls in the grocery store like we know you are...kidding...mostly).

The one thing that women LOVE is the ephemeral. Men don't really get into the fantasy stuff nearly as much as women do. When you can inject some fantasy into their reality (or bring them into your awesome reality) they are blown away.

Post: #821

Budget grocery store again.

This time I have designs on a chubby clerk in Discount Grocery 30 years my junior.

She's asking questions. I usually don't give myself an approach credit for hassling a worker since they have to talk to you , but my energy was low today.

Here's the spy novel account:

I first stalked her in the vegetable section.

Her: "Hello, how are you?" as she knows me.
Me: "Good thanks. Do you work here or something? I see you here all the time."

This was a line I came up with spontaneously at another store. It worked then, but here I was just floundering and it didn't come off that well.

Lesson 1: Chicks want you to be in the moment with them, they are super sensitive to conversational subtlety, because all they do is run their mouths all day. Obviously, from watching them, they are unconcerned with whether conversations have any meaningful content. It's all about how it feeeeeels.

Then when I went to the register she was checking things out. Obviously stalking me. They can't help themselves.

She made some comment like, "I keep seeing you again"

I gestured to my cheese and single green pepper.

"I'm making an omelet."

"For tonight or breakfast tomorrow"

She's having a conversation with me. Great.

More later, I have to try to close her.

Post: #822

(06-24-2013 04:35 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  

(06-24-2013 12:55 PM)RougeNoir Wrote:  I have a question, why do you oftentimes say "i know this is a little random," before asking for the number.

Great question. I was just talking to Menace and gandt about this.

I do it for a number of reasons, they are all sort of related. let me try to explain..

I want to make the interaction seem "random". If I am too smooth about it, she might think that I do this all the time. I am pretending to be a little nervous. I am pretending that I don't do this everyday.

I want it all to seem "serendipitous.

I want it to feel spontaneous and not pre-planned or rehearsed.

I also say it to acknowledge the fact that most people don't do it. I have enough social awareness to know that.

I am basically just pretending to be a normal guy who might be a little shy about approaching.

If we are too smooth and slick they start thinking that we are hardcore players. I'm just trying to soften my player vibe.

I get what you're saying. You should make a thread on "not being to smooth" while approaching.

Post: #823

(06-24-2013 06:25 AM)w00t Wrote:  

(06-23-2013 07:56 PM)MattC Wrote:  

(06-23-2013 07:51 PM)NewGamer Wrote:  what do you guys do when there is no response to at all to a number from a direct daygame approach? I got my first direct daygame number today and texted a few hours later, no response.

Try again in 2 days then write it off if she doesn't reply to that one.

Call them out on not replying. Tom Terero texts something like this, or the same concept: "no reply? That's it, I'm divorcing you and I want the cat".

thats lame IMO, just move on to the next one.
why you wanna play entertainer for some chick that doesnt even bother to reply?

You make it sound like it's a massive inconvenience to send a text that will take 30 seconds tops to write and send. What if it works? I'm sure it has for Tom, hence why he wrote about it.

I always send another text if the first one didn't get a reply. Not necessarily in this way, however.

Post: #824

(06-26-2013 10:06 AM)MattC Wrote:  

(06-24-2013 06:25 AM)w00t Wrote:  

(06-23-2013 07:56 PM)MattC Wrote:  

(06-23-2013 07:51 PM)NewGamer Wrote:  what do you guys do when there is no response to at all to a number from a direct daygame approach? I got my first direct daygame number today and texted a few hours later, no response.

Try again in 2 days then write it off if she doesn't reply to that one.

Call them out on not replying. Tom Terero texts something like this, or the same concept: "no reply? That's it, I'm divorcing you and I want the cat".

thats lame IMO, just move on to the next one.
why you wanna play entertainer for some chick that doesnt even bother to reply?

You make it sound like it's a massive inconvenience to send a text that will take 30 seconds tops to write and send. What if it works? I'm sure it has for Tom, hence why he wrote about it.

I always send another text if the first one didn't get a reply. Not necessarily in this way, however.

its not about the effort of sending a text its just a really lame line to me. it is for me totally out of character to say somethign like that and feels degrading so I dont do it. IME if a girl likes me she will be eager to meet up and if she doesnt reply I take it that shes just another timewaster and move on instead of trying to get a reaction out of her with lines like that. I have no problem with firing off a second message a while later though usually its a waste of time.

Post: #825

(06-24-2013 07:23 PM)Lothario Wrote:  Funny that you guys are discussing it and I am remembering Girls questioning me , Do I hang out in the Grocery Store to hit on Girls ?

I have had girls ask me the same thing. Sometimes, when we are still developing our game, we can come across as too rehearsed. We literally can sound rehearsed, like we have said the exact same thing to 10 other girls on that day. Girls can sense this.

We have to pretend that each approach is just random and spontaneous. Never pre-planned.

I often pretend that I am nervous.

(06-25-2013 04:36 PM)AneroidOcean Wrote:  Women want to think it "just happened" and when you acknowledge that it's not the "normal" thing that would happen it makes it more okay for the woman because she's just being presented with a unique opportunity

Well said.