Post: #251

(04-01-2012 04:29 PM)LifeBeginsAt40 Wrote:  

(03-31-2012 08:56 PM)Subotai Wrote:  I feel strange making a compliment about American girls, but at least at some level, due to all the human rights shit in the USA, a girl will recognize you as a human and can eventually, with much trouble, feel guilty for using a guy. With the Russians, a lot of the girls have an exploitative/extractive mentality. There's no guilt at all for trying to exploit the guy. On the other hand, we're trying to exploit the girls to get laid, so it's a big game really -- who can exploit the other more -- you have to drop a lot of your own Western upbringing and values to go native there -- once you do that, the right path to take with these girls becomes more clear.

I still maintain there's a lot less of this in Western Ukraine than in Eastern Ukraine. The Western girls seemed more genuine, but harder to get for quick lays. But 90% of my experience is with the Russian speakers. The Russian speakers were easier if you're more willing to spend money. They'll always try to extract more shit from you by calling you greedy "Zhadnii" if you're unwilling to spend money on them. The money component is important enough with the Russians that if she goes and makes the comment to her girlfriends that this guy is "zhadnii" they'll all agree that he's not worth it. I tried to find a balance with spending money and getting what I wanted in return. They will push you hard for every last kopek you have if you don't put limits on them. You have to show them you are willing to spend money -- but only when she pleases you and at no other times.

Spot on here. During my time in Russia I encountered this behaviour very often. I ended up marrying a Russian woman and this behaviour doesnt change in marriage. My soon to be ex constantly drained the bank account dry with no consideration about the prospect of a rainy day in the future. Only time savings were ever made is when she wanted a trip back to Russia.

The 'zhadnii' mentality I was explained was that Russians like to live for the day and not worry about the future. This means you got it now, you spend it, and worry about tomorrow when tomorrow comes. They dont have the savings mentality of Western cultures and many have a huge distrust of the banks after an incident where the ruble collapsed against the greenback and the banks closed their doors, letting the people take the loss rather than themselves. In my 6.5 years of marriage the 'zhadnii' mentality has been done consistently to me, to demean and belittle me into spending beyond my means.

Sorry to hear it didn't turn out well...but is the memory of fine Poontang a consolation at least??

Post: #252

(04-01-2012 03:23 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  Here's another view, as you can see, perfect for running. In fact if the surfaces were uneven that would be more beneficial that running on a totally flat surface. I more prefer trail running.

Sure for you Yugoslavs it is not a problem - there are no landmines, no Croatian snipers or Albans with AKs around, and no gypsies, must be a perfect area to run! But let's say our idea of the surface which is perfect for running is very different from yours, and this is why you do not see many people running there

(04-01-2012 03:28 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  Ok let's get this straight, you are now saying that a guy who confronts you is not a real threat?

You obviously didn't read my whole post.

Post: #253

(04-01-2012 04:29 PM)LifeBeginsAt40 Wrote:  Spot on here. During my time in Russia I encountered this behaviour very often. I ended up marrying a Russian woman and this behaviour doesnt change in marriage.

Expecting one's behavior to change for better after marriage is quite naive.

Quote:My soon to be ex constantly drained the bank account dry with no consideration about the prospect of a rainy day in the future. Only time savings were ever made is when she wanted a trip back to Russia.

She clearly wasn't into you, my friend, and you were not in her future. You were her temporary ticket from poverty/country/whatever else. I wouldn't be surprised if she had another account which she filled up while draining yours. This happens very often when a guy marries a foreign girl significantly younger than him - she takes from him, she cheats on him and eventually she leaves him.

Quote:The 'zhadnii' mentality I was explained was that Russians like to live for the day and not worry about the future. This means you got it now, you spend it, and worry about tomorrow when tomorrow comes.

This is definitely not the case as the conditions there are much harsher (for example one's salary may be delayed up to six months or even years so relying on timely paycheck may mean starvation), so I'm afraid you've been played.

Quote:They dont have the savings mentality of Western cultures

This is a joke.

Post: #254

(04-01-2012 09:07 PM)oldnemesis Wrote:  Expecting one's behavior to change for better after marriage is quite naive.

Yep, realise that now. Learnt this the hard way.

(04-01-2012 09:07 PM)oldnemesis Wrote:  She clearly wasn't into you, my friend, and you were not in her future. You were her temporary ticket from poverty/country/whatever else. I wouldn't be surprised if she had another account which she filled up while draining yours. This happens very often when a guy marries a foreign girl significantly younger than him - she takes from him, she cheats on him and eventually she leaves him.

Yep. A meal ticket for her and her mother. Age difference was only 7 years. Not significantly younger. I was 36 and she was 29 when we married.

(04-01-2012 09:07 PM)oldnemesis Wrote:  This is definitely not the case as the conditions there are much harsher (for example one's salary may be delayed up to six months or even years so relying on timely paycheck may mean starvation), so I'm afraid you've been played.

Definitely played. But life's full of lessons - some good, some bad. Learnt a lot through the marriage and although they were hard lessons, they have prepared me better for future relationships.

Post: #255

(04-01-2012 08:28 PM)oldnemesis Wrote:  

(04-01-2012 03:23 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  Here's another view, as you can see, perfect for running. In fact if the surfaces were uneven that would be more beneficial that running on a totally flat surface. I more prefer trail running.

Sure for you Yugoslavs it is not a problem - there are no landmines, no Croatian snipers or Albans with AKs around, and no gypsies, must be a perfect area to run! But let's say our idea of the surface which is perfect for running is very different from yours, and this is why you do not see many people running there

(04-01-2012 03:28 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  Ok let's get this straight, you are now saying that a guy who confronts you is not a real threat?

You obviously didn't read my whole post.

Do you ever stop?

I've got better things to do than argue over running surfaces in Lemberg

Post: #256

(04-02-2012 04:33 AM)LifeBeginsAt40 Wrote:  Yep. A meal ticket for her and her mother. Age difference was only 7 years. Not significantly younger. I was 36 and she was 29 when we married.

This happens very often in the foreign relationships. Accept it as long as you get what you want.

Quote:Definitely played. But life's full of lessons - some good, some bad. Learnt a lot through the marriage and although they were hard lessons, they have prepared me better for future relationships.

You'll be very successful with this kind of attitude. I'm pretty sure if you ever try it again, you'll have a much luckier relationship. Especially if you mentioned the one you had - she'll be inclined to prove she is not like "that bad girl".

Post: #257

does charm get you anywhere in FSU?

Post: #258

(04-03-2012 03:01 PM)theoogabear Wrote:  does charm get you anywhere in FSU?

Not one bit.

Post: #259

(04-03-2012 03:01 PM)theoogabear Wrote:  does charm get you anywhere in FSU?

It depends what you mean by charm.

Post: #260

Well I think telling an FSU girl you like her hair, her clothes etc will not get you far. It will probably arouse her paranoia, she might also think you are gay.

They prefer being bought gifts, if you like a girl there is no need to be indirect, you should wait for IOI's and then grab her. They are not used to charmers here, which is no surprise watching an FSU guy in action

Post: #261

For example the typical macho Serbian guy is very charming according to Ukrainian standards.The same happens with the Russian mofo etc.I think they mostly view Westerners as weak,gayish etc.And Hollywood MTV standards concerning women do not hold a candle in Ukraine they look totally fake and unsexy compared to the local women.Men however in western movies seem in Ukraine like they are worthy but they suffer a lot due to the cold blooded manipulative and uncaring western women sth like that.You realize in Ukraine that western men offer and suffer a lot and not rightly so.So an Ukrainian woman thinks she can easily get the upper hand if compared to a western woman in offering.

Post: #262

(04-03-2012 04:29 PM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  They are not used to charmers here, which is no surprise watching an FSU guy in action

Because those guys know very well charm brings them nowhere. Compliments are cheap.

Post: #263

Just saw this date site advertised on the RT channel,the English language Russian news channel.
Possibly be more English speaking girls here for you guys based in Russia and FSU countries.
Anyone have experience of it?

http://www.meetfriends.rt.com/

Post: #264

Okay I'm figuring this shit out...

The best game here is to pretend the girl is a dead body. Do 90% of the talking, don't wait or expect for any signs, and just start escalating even though the corpse will not give you any love or encouragement. The content of your conversation doesn't matter a whole lot. Just pretend she's dead and you're talking to something inanimate that isn't capable of giving you responses and feedback.

Indicators of interest: the corpse hasn't disappeared (i.e. she's still standing next to you).

Post: #265

(04-06-2012 09:20 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Okay I'm figuring this shit out...

The best game here is to pretend the girl is a dead body. Do 90% of the talking, don't wait or expect for any signs, and just start escalating even though the corpse will not give you any love or encouragement. The content of your conversation doesn't matter a whole lot. Just pretend she's dead and you're talking to something inanimate that isn't capable of giving you responses and feedback.

Indicators of interest: the corpse hasn't disappeared (i.e. she's still standing next to you).

heh, sounds like something from "Weekend at Bernie's"

I have learned the best thing is to just grab girls here, if I did that back in Serbia I would get my ass kicked.

After I have explained for the 1000th time what I am doing here, my hand goes on her leg, on her arse etc. If she doesn't like it then I will repeat with another girl until I get a favourable reaction.

Post: #266

Weekend at Bernies game



But yeah you're right about touching. Finding out it's a great screening tool.

Post: #267

This is what Russian men do.They behave to women like they are cats or dogs.Do you ask a pet if she wants to be caressed? You just do it or give orders.

Post: #268

Wow, this thread is bringing back memories. I got massacred in Ukraine as well. Would put it up there with Argentina as the worst ROI as well. I found Russia to be significantly easier for some reason, despite having similar cultures. I think it was because I was in St. Petersburg and the girls there were more educated and westernized.

The only tip I can give you is kind of what you've found out, conversation means nothing. It's literally worthless. They don't really care that much. They give you boring answers. Unless they've been to the west, you might as well be talking to a wall. Everything is physical. I had one girl tell me that talking is boring and that sometimes she expects a man to force himself onto her, even if she doesn't want him to. Shit that would flat out be called rape in the west, some girls were telling me they more or less expected out of men.

So yeah, just molest them and see what happens. Sometimes they don't reciprocate. Other times they do a little. But as oldnem has always said, if they're still sitting there, they like you.

I didn't get laid in Ukraine although I came close with one girl. But I'll say that even with the girls I banged in Russia, there were large gaps of time where I had no clue what I was doing. They just give you such little feedback for your actions it's impossible to know if what you're doing is working well or not. So I just adopted the rule of when in doubt, just go for it.

I did find that once you banged them, they opened up quite a bit more though.

Post: #269

Communication is very important actually.In my opinion if you often go caveman you will have some encounters with the local dudes.The girls in FSU are a little perv they like guys bleeding for them etc.

Post: #270

(04-06-2012 11:22 AM)Entropy4 Wrote:  Wow, this thread is bringing back memories. I got massacred in Ukraine as well. Would put it up there with Argentina as the worst ROI as well. I found Russia to be significantly easier for some reason, despite having similar cultures. I think it was because I was in St. Petersburg and the girls there were more educated and westernized.

The only tip I can give you is kind of what you've found out, conversation means nothing. It's literally worthless. They don't really care that much. They give you boring answers. Unless they've been to the west, you might as well be talking to a wall. Everything is physical. I had one girl tell me that talking is boring and that sometimes she expects a man to force himself onto her, even if she doesn't want him to. Shit that would flat out be called rape in the west, some girls were telling me they more or less expected out of men.

So yeah, just molest them and see what happens. Sometimes they don't reciprocate. Other times they do a little. But as oldnem has always said, if they're still sitting there, they like you.

I didn't get laid in Ukraine although I came close with one girl. But I'll say that even with the girls I banged in Russia, there were large gaps of time where I had no clue what I was doing. They just give you such little feedback for your actions it's impossible to know if what you're doing is working well or not. So I just adopted the rule of when in doubt, just go for it.

I did find that once you banged them, they opened up quite a bit more though.

This is very true, molestation is a significant part of my repertoire.

The women here are generally meek and mild. They often say things to me like "oh I had to dance with that horrible guy", and I would ask why she didn't say no, she would say "he was very forceful, I couldn't say no"

Don't ask her permission for anything.....Don't compliment her.....Don't ask for her opinion.....Don't give her your life story......

You must always dictate the terms, where you will meet, what you will do, men are the the dominant force here.

Girls prefer groping to kissing here, stroking her thigh or grab her arse and usually she won't even flinch, but with kissing it's 50/50.

Post: #271

(04-06-2012 11:40 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  Communication is very important actually.In my opinion if you often go caveman you will have some encounters with the local dudes.The girls in FSU are a little perv they like guys bleeding for them etc.

This is most true for the Balkans, if you go in too alpha with these girls you will be faced by ten Serbians who will beat you into oblivion. You cannot mess around with Balkan chicks

Post: #272

Fuck, this thread just keeps getting better and better. Weekend at Bernie's game

Honestly, it sounds completely alien to me as a western man. I'd be more than willing to roll with it, but I am not interested in bleeding for any woman.

From what I gather, Ukraine: straight caveman, if she likes it, she stays. Russia: mostly caveman, if she likes it, she stays. Balkans: direct power game, caveman can get you killed.

This forum probably just saved some dude the beating of his life.

Post: #273

(04-06-2012 09:20 AM)Roosh Wrote:  The best game here is to pretend the girl is a dead body. Do 90% of the talking, don't wait or expect for any signs, and just start escalating even though the corpse will not give you any love or encouragement.

That is more or less correct. To give you the idea, the amount of "encouragement" a typical American chick gives is not only a major turnoff for me, sometime it even freaks me out. It just looks very unnatural: how could someone even pretend to look interested in a dude she's been talking to for fifteen minutes about some crap I wouldn't even talk to my 4yo son? To me women are not even supposed to behave like that. Yet again the cultural difference I think.

Quote:The content of your conversation doesn't matter a whole lot.

Considering she probably doesn't understand at least half of what you're saying, and in the loud club it is probably close to 90% it indeed doesn't matter. It is like talking to someone over a cell phone with a really bad connection.

Quote:Just pretend she's dead and you're talking to something inanimate that isn't capable of giving you responses and feedback.

This isn't particularly true, but unless you speak fluent Russian and know the culture, it would be very difficult to keep the conversation light and funny. Imagine a conversation you'd have with an American chick when you know you absolutely cannot make her laugh for real.

Quote:Indicators of interest: the corpse hasn't disappeared (i.e. she's still standing next to you).

Yep. Just need to add that this interest still might not bring you anywhere.

Post: #274

If Weekend at Bernie's game is the key for this area what I would ask myself is "do I want this". Doesn't matter how hot the girls are, if I'm seducing a girl who's dead inside then the physical act is not really going to do anything for me. It's the equivalent of saying a prostitute and many pros often have the business sense to put on an act at least. Shame! I had high hopes for this area of the world for the future.

Post: #275

(04-06-2012 02:17 PM)Vicious Wrote:  If Weekend at Bernie's game is the key for this area what I would ask myself is "do I want this". Doesn't matter how hot the girls are, if I'm seducing a girl who's dead inside then the physical act is not really going to do anything for me. It's the equivalent of saying a prostitute and many pros often have the business sense to put on an act at least. Shame! I had high hopes for this area of the world for the future.

yeah, I think some girls here equate passivity with being good in bed.
but not all