Post: #176

Problem is I don't really see pick ups. What I do see:

1. Guys getting tables and inviting girls to drink with them.

2. Girls throwing themselves at club staff.

3. Guys doing approaches to girls who give almost no response, so the guy does 95% of the talking, sometimes 100%.

4. Guys already coming to the club with hot girls.

5. Guys getting cockblocked pretty hard.

6. Lots of dancing. This seems to be the best way to pick up in the club. You don't really see hookups from this though, just number exchanges.

I still haven't figured out this place.. and may never. It remains that 6s and lower are very receptive, but above that I don't have a clue.

I'm curious at to the talent level Kamaki pulls. By what I'm seeing here, pulling above a 7 from a random club pickup is somewhat---I hate to say it---impossible. I would honestly pay money to a guy who can do it.

Post: #177

Hey Roosh, don't give up so fast. You're just having trouble understanding the culture. It's like you're a big newbie all over again.

Maybe take a week vacation back to Poland to refresh your spirits?

Post: #178

(03-30-2012 06:15 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Problem is I don't really see pick ups. What I do see:

1. Guys getting tables and inviting girls to drink with them.

2. Girls throwing themselves at club staff.

3. Guys doing approaches to girls who give almost no response, so the guy does 95% of the talking, sometimes 100%.

4. Guys already coming to the club with hot girls.

5. Guys getting cockblocked pretty hard.

6. Lots of dancing. This seems to be the best way to pick up in the club. You don't really see hookups from this though, just number exchanges.

I still haven't figured out this place.. and may never. It remains that 6s and lower are very receptive, but above that I don't have a clue.

I'm curious at to the talent level Kamaki pulls. By what I'm seeing here, pulling above a 7 from a random club pickup is somewhat---I hate to say it---impossible. I would honestly pay money to a guy who can do it.

Roosh, we know you are the king of the night club one night stand. But have you tried putting real time on internet game. I know, you arent particularly fond of it because of the quality. But, if you put more effort in and pre screen alot, maybe you would pull some 7 or 8s. As you know, some countries like Colombia or even the easy Philippines, the best night game wont get you more than numbers.
I dont have any idea how internet game is in the industrial shit hole, but it doesnt sound any worse than going to a club there.

Post: #179

I swore no internet game. I feel like it's cheating.

Quote:It's like you're a big newbie all over again.

Yup, I'm pulling out moves I haven't done in years. All my recent moves are ONS geared, so I've had to remember what I used to do on dates (fake palm read, strawberry game, etc). I think I may read Bang again.

I have taken 5 days off and that has helped energize me somewhat for this weekend. But as if right now, this place is harder than Argentina, which has previously been the hardest place I've tried to pull.

I think every player needs to come here for a pilgrimage, sort of like how Muslims go to Mecca.

Post: #180

Roosh it might be worth doing the whole table thing.

I prefer to hunt at the bar, but sometimes you dance with girls and then they say "I'm tired, do you have a table", I have been caught with my pants down on a couple of occasions.

I can get ONS in nightclubs here, they are usually not much higher than 7 though. As i'm living here long-term to be honest I don't care so much whether a girl puts out same night, as I make sure I always have some regular sex.

Yes it's a one way conversation with girls here most of the time, they will ask you a few questions but that's about it.

I would suggest cockblocking the cockblocking cocks, most guys where I am at least are too passive to do anything, even if they did, they are not a threat, they fight like girls.

Post: #181

I have really the feeling you do sth terribly wrong.I am now tempted to come to Ukraine to help maybe it has to do with knowledge of Russian.It is not difficult at all to get bangs and one night stands.

1.Tables.I do this only in case girls ask for this.

2.Girls throwing themselves at club stuff.It happens mainly to get narcotics or free drinks.It does not affect the chances of club visitors.

3.This is true.You have to do most of the talking.Actually you have to do talking on point and very pressed be 100% accurate.I cannot describe it properly.However it is not that difficult.It is like walking on a rope.

4.This is also true.However this does not mean other hot girls are not available.If you hit on girls accompanied there may be serious problem.

5.Cockblock.Natural.I do not have a problem with it.I have described the methods used to avoid and foresee cockblock.The only thing that can stop me is attempt of choking.

6.Dancing is not a good way to pick up chicks in Ukraine.This is no Poland.

The quality you pull depends strictly on the region and the budget you are on.It is totally possible to pull 8s,9s in eastern Ukraine and 7s,8s in Lvov.In Kiev you may pull even 10s if you are willing to spend heavily.

In my opinion you simply give very wrong messages about yourself.If I saw you in action I would tell you what you do wrong.Really now I am thinking very seriously to come for a weekend maybe since the weather must have improved.

Post: #182

A basic principle is that Ukrainian women do not facilitate you.In Poland you may do an awful lot of mistakes but still the girls give a chance because they understand the right to make mistakes especially if you are foreigner.Ukrainian girls do not forgive at all any misconception no matter how absurd it may be.

In an extreme case I remember an Ukrainian girl asked me where I wanted to take her in her city to which I had landed one hour ago and had no idea about.She wanted me to know everything about the city better than herself.So the level of abrdities can reach extreme levels I just go by.I expect the most absurd the most irrational and the most out of place reactions when dealing with these girls it is part of Slavic mental nature.This nature is covered by Germanic elements among Czech girls and polish women try to suppress it at first when dealing with foreigners to let it later explode in full force.Ukrainian have no problem to make it obvious from first moment it is the real shit one has to deal with from day one.

To say it differently polish women pass themselves they adapt to the foreigner’s mannerisms and culture while Ukrainian women expect the foreigner to adapt to their mannerisms and culture they make no effort to make things easier for him.

Post: #183

(03-30-2012 06:15 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Problem is I don't really see pick ups. What I do see:

1. Guys getting tables and inviting girls to drink with them.

2. Girls throwing themselves at club staff.

3. Guys doing approaches to girls who give almost no response, so the guy does 95% of the talking, sometimes 100%.

4. Guys already coming to the club with hot girls.

5. Guys getting cockblocked pretty hard.

6. Lots of dancing. This seems to be the best way to pick up in the club. You don't really see hookups from this though, just number exchanges.

I still haven't figured out this place.. and may never. It remains that 6s and lower are very receptive, but above that I don't have a clue.

I'm curious at to the talent level Kamaki pulls. By what I'm seeing here, pulling above a 7 from a random club pickup is somewhat---I hate to say it---impossible. I would honestly pay money to a guy who can do it.

it almost sounds like you're back in DC...

Post: #184

(03-30-2012 07:09 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  I have really the feeling you do sth terribly wrong.I am now tempted to come to Ukraine to help maybe it has to do with knowledge of Russian.It is not difficult at all to get bangs and one night stands.

1.Tables.I do this only in case girls ask for this.

2.Girls throwing themselves at club stuff.It happens mainly to get narcotics or free drinks.It does not affect the chances of club visitors.

3.This is true.You have to do most of the talking.Actually you have to do talking on point and very pressed be 100% accurate.I cannot describe it properly.However it is not that difficult.It is like walking on a rope.

4.This is also true.However this does not mean other hot girls are not available.If you hit on girls accompanied there may be serious problem.

5.Cockblock.Natural.I do not have a problem with it.I have described the methods used to avoid and foresee cockblock.The only thing that can stop me is attempt of choking.

6.Dancing is not a good way to pick up chicks in Ukraine.This is no Poland.

The quality you pull depends strictly on the region and the budget you are on.It is totally possible to pull 8s,9s in eastern Ukraine and 7s,8s in Lvov.In Kiev you may pull even 10s if you are willing to spend heavily.

In my opinion you simply give very wrong messages about yourself.If I saw you in action I would tell you what you do wrong.Really now I am thinking very seriously to come for a weekend maybe since the weather must have improved.

1. By that time you are too late and look like a muppett
6. Girls almost always ask me to dance, I think it helps your chances and gives you a chance to molest them

Post: #185

(03-30-2012 06:15 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Problem is I don't really see pick ups. What I do see:

I still haven't figured out this place.. and may never. It remains that 6s and lower are very receptive, but above that I don't have a clue.

I'm in a different part of EE, but I have been somewhat similarly baffled.

I feel like I'm on to something however, which I'll describe.

I've had two experiences in the last few days where women openly they were completely inferior in knowledge in certain areas in a way that would NEVER happen in Murka.

I was working on a short movie and an actress asked if the results would be good quality.

I gave a brief technical rundown on the format."1920 by 1080, 24 frames per second, progressive" they just reponded "Okay." in a sort of deadpan way and then both started laughing.

"Woman answer", one of them seiad as they laughed.

They just admitted they knew fuck-all about video and had no discomfort admitting they were not as smart in a technical area.

Then today I asked a cute receptionist at a gym if she knew a good place to buy a TV, using Roosh's dumb guy technique, something I seem to be able to execute with great ease.

She wanted to be helpful, and said."Wait, I'll as one of the guys." referring to her co-workers. A big athletic guy came and very politely and dererentially to her and me listed a few places to go.

THese things may not be related to pickup, but what I DO think they point to is much more acceptance of very traditional sex roles, in a goodl way. I met a smart gil who's acdtually weaseling her way out to a college in Canada and she does EMBROIDERY, and she's an upwardly mobile power chick for this area.


SO: I think there may be something unthinkable in MurkaL

Unlike Murka, cads are viewed as predatory not powerful.

Unlike Murka, upper betas are viewed as he BEST marriage material.

Unlike Murka, the feel best about a long, drawn-out courtship process consisting of MAKING FRIENDS with you, and then waiting for some night ( maybe the 8th or 10th date)when you just end up alone... and it just happens.

Post: #186

Would you guys call Ukrainian girls "simple minded"?

I don't mean that to insult, but from a Western perspective, that's the first word that pops to mind.

Post: #187

(03-30-2012 08:24 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Would you guys call Ukrainian girls "simple minded"?

I don't mean that to insult, but from a Western perspective, that's the first word that pops to mind.

Yes,they are simple minded and a bit primitive.Russians have figured it out long ago.Gogol's Taras Bulba contains accurate descriptions of Ukrainians.

Post: #188

(03-30-2012 08:24 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Would you guys call Ukrainian girls "simple minded"?

I don't mean that to insult, but from a Western perspective, that's the first word that pops to mind.

I dont think simple minded would be the right term - more geared towards gender specific roles. you are so used to places like DC where equality where women are self sufficient in so many ways that traditional gender roles get mixed. its not uncommon for a wife to make more then the husband, and the husband to cook and do some cleaning and laundry. EE countries still have clearly defined roles. Men provide, women cook, clean, fuck, and raise the kids. Because its somewhat hard to find a provider in those economically poor countries there is much more competition. most americans who do well in the corporate world would probably starve if they had to be entreprenurial and survive away from the corporation paying their salaries. combine that w/genetic features that make the women beautiful and a large number of genetically attractive women fighting for a limited pool of men. one problem EE women have is the men have so much leverage in the relationship (they cant suck you dry in divorce court) that having a couple of girls on the side is largely ignored. thats why i think in some ways portraying yourself as some kind of super alpha is negative in that the girls realize if you are 'overqualifed' you'll just end up fucking around with other girls and you aren't relationship worthy. its almost kind of ironic to hear you call them simple minded - in some ways you are in a place that has what you always dreamed about - beautiful, sexy, thin, feminine girls, and its almost as if now that you've found the pussy nirvana you haven't quite figured out how to handle the situation you've always dreamed you're in.

Post: #189

(03-30-2012 08:48 AM)Brian Wrote:  

(03-30-2012 08:24 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Would you guys call Ukrainian girls "simple minded"?

I don't mean that to insult, but from a Western perspective, that's the first word that pops to mind.

I dont think simple minded would be the right term - more geared towards gender specific roles. you are so used to places like DC where equality where women are self sufficient in so many ways that traditional gender roles get mixed. its not uncommon for a wife to make more then the husband, and the husband to cook and do some cleaning and laundry. EE countries still have clearly defined roles. Men provide, women cook, clean, fuck, and raise the kids. Because its somewhat hard to find a provider in those economically poor countries there is much more competition. most americans who do well in the corporate world would probably starve if they had to be entreprenurial and survive away from the corporation paying their salaries. combine that w/genetic features that make the women beautiful and a large number of genetically attractive women fighting for a limited pool of men. one problem EE women have is the men have so much leverage in the relationship (they cant suck you dry in divorce court) that having a couple of girls on the side is largely ignored. thats why i think in some ways portraying yourself as some kind of super alpha is negative in that the girls realize if you are 'overqualifed' you'll just end up fucking around with other girls and you aren't relationship worthy. its almost kind of ironic to hear you call them simple minded - in some ways you are in a place that has what you always dreamed about - beautiful, sexy, thin, feminine girls, and its almost as if now that you've found the pussy nirvana you haven't quite figured out how to handle the situation you've always dreamed you're in.

Just because they maintain traditional gender roles in the society doesn't mean the women aren't simple minded. Contrariwise, women can be feminine, cultured and sophisticated, e.g. France.

Post: #190

(03-30-2012 06:15 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Problem is I don't really see pick ups. What I do see:

1. Guys getting tables and inviting girls to drink with them.

So have you tried this? How much does it cost? If it's cheap why not?
Here is a sample featured deal from a Bulgarian bar on a week night - weekends it would cost x2 but still dirt cheap (as a reference, 1 lv = 0.5 EUR)

Just get one and ask girls to do shots with you.

Post: #191

Quote:So have you tried this? How much does it cost? If it's cheap why not?

No because I roll solo.

Post: #192

Also bear in mind that this is not a good time for nightclubs, girls in Ukraine are very religious and are giving up things for Lent. This includes nightclubs(many girls have told me this already) and probably includes being fucked by strange foreigners.

On the subject of ONS, to be honest i'm kind of glad that too many girls don't put out the same night. Ukrainian men are not into condoms. Why spend 25 UAH for a packet of Contex(Ukrainian condoms, real shit), when he can spend that money and buy a bottle of Vodka

As with most women, when you get a ONS in Ukraine she will say stuff like "I can't believe i'm doing this, i never do this etc" LIES

Post: #193

Brian I really like your post, very, very astute, Greek, I ve read 6 books by N. Gogol, and yes he writes alot about Ukraine because he's from the Poltava Region,and his Russian readers (his main audiance) love to read about Ukraine because they find Ukrainians and their customs kind of humorous, but for the life of me I cant place this Taras Bulba, what book is he mentioned?

I have lived in Ukraine for almost 6 years, and the best success I have in clubs is when I am with some cool young local guy, we get a table, order a bottle of wine, cognac, a fruit tray, when we see who we like, the local will invite girls to our table, of course we offer them something to drink, a salad to eat or what ever, in provicial Ukraine, clubs are not that expensive. and with me, if I am having a good time, I really dont mind spending money, the last thing I want to do is appear cheap, these girls hate cheap guys. we talk, dance, eat drink and have a great time, I have the most succes in clubs when I am with a local guy, and I would have took that girl bowling, this is a great date, you could have shown her how to bowl, get close, show off, she would had had a lot of fun.

Post: #194

"Unlike Murka, upper betas are viewed as he BEST marriage material."

That chimes in with the Power of Mediocrity game ,adapted from Lerner's Bagel's business model!

How about trying another less shit Industrial Shithole for research purposes.

Post: #195

(03-30-2012 08:48 AM)Brian Wrote:  I dont think simple minded would be the right term - more geared towards gender specific roles. you are so used to places like DC where equality where women are self sufficient in so many ways that traditional gender roles get mixed. its not uncommon for a wife to make more then the husband, and the husband to cook and do some cleaning and laundry. EE countries still have clearly defined roles. Men provide, women cook, clean, fuck, and raise the kids. Because its somewhat hard to find a provider in those economically poor countries there is much more competition. most americans who do well in the corporate world would probably starve if they had to be entreprenurial and survive away from the corporation paying their salaries. combine that w/genetic features that make the women beautiful and a large number of genetically attractive women fighting for a limited pool of men. one problem EE women have is the men have so much leverage in the relationship (they cant suck you dry in divorce court) that having a couple of girls on the side is largely ignored. thats why i think in some ways portraying yourself as some kind of super alpha is negative in that the girls realize if you are 'overqualifed' you'll just end up fucking around with other girls and you aren't relationship worthy. its almost kind of ironic to hear you call them simple minded - in some ways you are in a place that has what you always dreamed about - beautiful, sexy, thin, feminine girls, and its almost as if now that you've found the pussy nirvana you haven't quite figured out how to handle the situation you've always dreamed you're in.

Great post,learnt a lot from it.

(03-30-2012 09:37 AM)timmy21 Wrote:  I have the most succes in clubs when I am with a local guy, and I would have took that girl bowling, this is a great date, you could have shown her how to bowl, get close, show off, she would had had a lot of fun.

Agree with both points.

To me having a local wing ( local as in same nationality as the girls we are chasing not necessarily from same town as we are in ) is indispensable. From my experiences girls there just feel more chilled talking to me when I'm with a local guy. They will often ask him "and your one of our's right?" and when he confirms he is they visibly relax and the proceedings usually go better after this. I've written about it in my 'Belarus: The Provinces' thread I believe.

As for the bowling date,yup agreed. Been on lots of bowling dates in China/FSU ( I do them a lot here in the UK too ). Would much rather do that then coffee shop dates where I have to rely on my language skills more. Bowling is fun,girls there like it as they can't afford to do it all the time and it's a good way to get to know the girl and have some good banter and teasing.

Post: #196

(03-30-2012 07:09 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  I am now tempted to come to Ukraine to help maybe it has to do with knowledge of Russian.

Go! Make it happen. Contact Roosh, find out where he is and set things up. You have some doubters of your Balkan power on here. Here's your chance to shut them up.

Post: #197

(03-30-2012 11:09 AM)Big Nilla Wrote:  

(03-30-2012 07:09 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  I am now tempted to come to Ukraine to help maybe it has to do with knowledge of Russian.

Go! Make it happen. Contact Roosh, find out where he is and set things up. You have some doubters of your Balkan power on here. Here's your chance to shut them up.

I am seriously tempted.I will go there at middle of April for a weekend.It will be great I am sure rooshv will adapt very quickly and we will apply insane speeds.It is important to have a wing who understands.

Post: #198

(03-30-2012 11:49 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

(03-30-2012 11:09 AM)Big Nilla Wrote:  

(03-30-2012 07:09 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  I am now tempted to come to Ukraine to help maybe it has to do with knowledge of Russian.

Go! Make it happen. Contact Roosh, find out where he is and set things up. You have some doubters of your Balkan power on here. Here's your chance to shut them up.

I am seriously tempted.I will go there at middle of April for a weekend.It will be great I am sure rooshv will adapt very quickly and we will apply insane speeds.It is important to have a wing who understands.

I may join, will be interesting to see the Kamaki machine in action

Post: #199

(03-30-2012 11:53 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  

(03-30-2012 11:49 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

(03-30-2012 11:09 AM)Big Nilla Wrote:  

(03-30-2012 07:09 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  I am now tempted to come to Ukraine to help maybe it has to do with knowledge of Russian.

Go! Make it happen. Contact Roosh, find out where he is and set things up. You have some doubters of your Balkan power on here. Here's your chance to shut them up.

I am seriously tempted.I will go there at middle of April for a weekend.It will be great I am sure rooshv will adapt very quickly and we will apply insane speeds.It is important to have a wing who understands.

I may join, will be interesting to see the Kamaki machine in action

Yeah, make it happen. You sound bored going through the motions there and meeting up with those 2 would be interesting. Seems you 3 have different styles/looks.

Would be cool to see you guys meetup and then plan follow-up meetups in different cities (Lliv, Kiev, etc).

Post: #200

We can do an April meetup in Industrial Shithole.