Post: #26

^ this is exactly why I do not "online game" it is not real human interaction.

Live I get to work on tone of voice, body language and mess with my style of dress.

Can't do that with cookie cutter photos online.

Also I can't get a date online with a bangable chick, lol! Tried every single online idea from D&P to all the treads here.

Post: #27

Isn't there a thread about this already?

Speak slowly.
Finish your words.
Use a story to make salient points. (Instead of saying it's important to be resilient, share a story about resiliency. Better yet tell a story that engages the listener to think of a time when they were resilient.)
Take a xanax.

But seriously, you can't be good without practice.

Post: #28

Knowing what you are about makes you a better speaker.

Believe it or not, I became a better speaker by arguing online, anonymously. Create your world and defend it. If it gets torn down, think your way around it or change it and argue it back up again.

It forces you to speak in complete thoughts, directly address your adversary, create proper sentences and be persuasive and articulate. Once you get good at it, it doesn't matter who is in front of you. It could be a thousand people or one person. What do you care? You've heard it all before and sorted it, dismissed it or countered it.

You should spend hours and hours doing this. I call it "creating a Socratic personality." It just forces you to be sure of what you believe and why, and be able to properly defend it. It's essential to good communication.

The thing is, your friends or teachers aren't going to sit there bullshitting/arguing endlessly about life, God, politics, philosophy, game, race, law or whatever you want and it probably wouldn't be a positive experience even if they would. But that is what it takes to create a Socratic personality. So the online community, with its anonymity and sheer numbers, is perfect. You can do that crap all night long, taking on anyone that comes at you. I did it on craigslist politics forum when I was in law school (and figured out what the Socratic method was all about) and it was one of the most memorable times of my life.

I feel like I could get a stadium going like Hitler if I had to. Just from arguing online.

Verbal Advantage is also good.

Post: #29

The two best spoken people I know, my tenth grade english teacher and my college dropout cousin only have one thing in common: and that is reading a shitton and writing a shitton. If you read 40+ books per year, you will be in the top 5% of speakers, if you add that to writing a book, top 1%, and if you regularly do public speeches, you're in the top 0.1% of speakers. Read a lot. I know my speaking has improved greatly just because I'm reading (books, not online articles) for 30+ minutes a day now.

Post: #30

The lead in Rodger Dodger is very-well spoken. I've picked up little mannerisms from watching this movie a couple of times.





He takes his time and every word comes out with strength and care. Every word he says has meaning even if it's just fluff. Notice the use of pauses before he gets to a main point in a sentence.

Post: #31

Great Thread I will leave this Gem , which was recommend on another thread on RVF. It is a wonderful book written by a voice Coach for singers.



My problem is a little different, I will start another thread on it .......

Post: #32

http://www.amazon.com/The-Quick-Easy-Eff...e+carnegie

Post: #33

(01-26-2014 11:08 PM)Tytalus Wrote:  Now, what this means depends on the individual, so I will define what I'm looking for here.

1.) Not using "um, er, ah, uhh" etc when speaking. I've gotten worse in the last couple years about this and don't know why. Probably lack of sleep and stress.

2.) Using correct pronunciation of words. My context is that I read a lot, and I read tons as a kid. Which meant that I learned many words that I had never heard before. Naturally, I developed my own pronunciation for them, and most of the time correctly. But there are still some words that i'll just say wrong.... Because I formed the incorrect pronunciation at age 11 or something. Once I learned the wrong way to say it, unless I heard the word frequently I didn't necessarily hear the word when it was said a different way.

3.) Good grammar. I think I'm fairly good on this one, but doesn't hurt to throw it in.

4.) Using the big words you know correctly.

Any resources, perhaps audiobooks? Would be helpful. Thanks.

@ #4

Using the big words you already know correctly comes from reading them being used correctly.

As an editorial note, most people are more convincing with smaller, simpler, and more digestible terms.

You don't need to sound like a country bumpkin or good ol boy, but writing and speaking benefit from using 5 or 6 easily understandable words, rather than 1 perfect word that is 4-6 syllables and has a Latin origin.

WIA

Post: #34

Am I the only one here that saw the title and thought "more well = better"?

Post: #35

Do you have to pay for toastmasters or is it like a club?

Post: #36

(02-05-2014 10:55 PM)one-two Wrote:  Am I the only one here that saw the title and thought "more well = better"?

I believe well-spoken is a compound word. He could have also said How to become more "eloquent".

Post: #37

(02-06-2014 02:30 AM)Valhalla Wrote:  Do you have to pay for toastmasters or is it like a club?

It's $50/yr

Post: #38

(02-05-2014 10:55 PM)one-two Wrote:  Am I the only one here that saw the title and thought "more well = better"?

Post: #39

(02-05-2014 01:10 PM)Lothario Wrote:  Great Thread I will leave this Gem , which was recommend on another thread on RVF. It is a wonderful book written by a voice Coach for singers.



My problem is a little different, I will start another thread on it .......

Got this book today on your recommendation. About 20 pages in, it's an easy read so far and I'll let you know my thoughts. Good to hear it worked so well for you.

Post: #40

Surprisingly simple way: get a job waiting tables at a high end restaurant.

The difference between making $ and $$$$ is often how you sale yourself, the restaurant and the specials of the evening.
Your intonation, manners and vocabulary make a huge impression on people (and thus, sales).

You'll be forced to interact with rich, famous, twats and really nice people. Game on.

Post: #41

Learn how to speak English to non-native speakers.

I used to speak REALLY fucking quickly with a strong London accent.

I.e "Maybe we should go and sit over there for an hour" Would be "Maybee we-shh-gowan sidovaathere foranowaa"

I spoke so quickly my friends used to say "Huh?" after like every sentence. I remember having to repeat the sentence "Matt, I saved you a donut" over the phone FIVE TIMES, because my friend couldn't fucking understand me.

Me: "Matt, I saved you a donut"
Him: "Go Kart?"
Me: "No. I saved you a donut"
Him: "A donut? what?"
Me: "I saved you a donut"
Him: "You gave me one? when did you give me one?"
Me: "I JUST BOUGHT A FUCKING PACK OF DONUTS. YOU MAY HAVE THE PLEASURE OF ONE"
Him: "Heather has one?"
Me: "NO. I JUST WENT TO TESCO. I PURCHASED DONUTS. THERE ARE SIX IN THE PACK. I LIKE SHARING. WHEN I ARRIVE HOME, YOU CAN HAVE ONE OF THE CUNTING THINGS"

Well it went something like that....

I then did a CELTA English course. My first lesson the whole class stared at me like I was speaking Russian.

So, Speak slowly.

Now you're speaking slowly? WELL THAT'S NOT SLOW ENOUGH, speak EVEN SLOWER! At first it'll feel daunting as hell.

But yeah, when I teach my students I speak perfect Queen's English. Learn how to speak coherently to people form other countries then you'll find you speak very clearly to fellow native speakers. And you can also speed up a little.

Post: #42

1) meditate --when you know what it FEELS like to be 100% present to the moment and to be in a state of FLOW, everything just happens

2) learn to breathe deeply by default and breathe from the diaphragm, slow inhale/slower exhale and only speak on the exhale

3) speak slowly but not so slow that people are unsure of whether you are going to continue speaking, you should have a smooth flow of speech

4) face your fears, lean into your edge and progressively expand your comfort zone-- this will do wonders for you

5) train your mind to relax, stop over analyzing/micromanaging and being self-conscious as these are all charisma killers

Good luck.

Post: #43

There is a lot of good info on this thread, but what I believe the OP is getting at is more along the lines of diction, and the content of speech, rather than the non-verbals of speech such as body language, vocal tonality, etc.

As others have mentioned, there are good audio programs out there that focus on improving your vocabulary. There are many books as well on the topic, just do a quick google or amazon search.

Read a contemporary author who employs the types of idiomatic phrases and words you want to incorporate into your own conversations. You can use Anki software, or notecards.

-Write down every unknown word in a challenging book and review every day. Don't apply this method to archaic english.

I actually tend to swear a lot, but I also have very intellectual conversations at the same time. I enjoy mixing both big words and cuss words. While being an intelligent conversationalist is generally a good thing, I don't think it's that great for being better with the opposite sex.

Having a dominant vocal tonality is much more important than improving your diction. Likewise, being a captivating story teller will win you far more female admirers. Practicing stand-up comedy would provide a better return on your investment in terms of dating. Women don't care for intelligence too much.

Post: #44

A tip I read once said to find an author or speaker you like and want to emulate, and read their books/speeches out loud.

Post: #45

Bump.

This has been on my mind a lot lately.

I find that just recording thoughts and random notes in my smartphone is helping. I think a lot of people are just nervous about letting what goes on in their minds come out of their mouths. Filtering that process plays an important role for social creatures like us.

You'll obviously still need to talk more with other people, but I think recording yourself spontaneously speaking is a big step in becoming more comfortable with using that filter faster, if that makes sense. As you grow more comfortable with talking outloud, you can start doing so more with worthy company.

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Rudyard Kipling

Post: #46

(01-27-2014 07:05 PM)FrenchCanadian Wrote:  I think reading/writing is by far, the best answer to this question.

This is stellar and succinct advice. I am surprised it was not further discussed.

As a trial lawyer and experienced orator, I can tell you that enrolling in Toastmasters and practicing in front of a mirror will only moderately develop your oratorical skills. Writing your thoughts down on paper and rereading them aloud organizes your thoughts. Further, reading books of various genres and difficulties increases your vocabulary and exposes you to organizational and style techniques.

While apparently inconsistent, speaking does not a great orator make; reading and writing do.

-TheWisdomOfMyFather

Post: #47

You can become more well spoken by

• Reading books
• Writing
• Watching videos of great orators
• Talking to yourself in private to articulate your thoughts
  

Post: #48

Consider ducking back to the classics for more material on rhetoric, aside from what's presented here. Cicero is popularly acknowledged as the public speaker of the ancient world; he was a lawyer and we still have some of his speeches. Quintillian's []iInstitutio Oratoria[/i] is a four volume text on how to best train people for success in rhetoric, including devices for argument and how to best get your point across in debating.

Post: #49

I'll disagree with "online game". I don't really think of it as "online" though, as to me the online part is just the intermediary that allows me to set up the first date. Once you meet up in person there is nothing "online" about it.

For becoming a better speaker there is, hands down, only one way to do it. Get more practice. I recommend joining an improv group or taking comedy lessons as your first choice because they will more quickly improve your conversation skills. If that isn't an option or you also want to improve your presentation skills(good if you need to improve business communication skills) then look up Toastmasters. They're almost ubiquitous and your first few meetings will seem very archaic but they are hands down the fastest way to become a good speaker

Post: #50

also:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCBJDYCL-m8