(12-08-2014 09:30 PM)Roardog Wrote:  Need some help guys on keeping my frame.

Her: When we meet there is to be dim lights, possible restraints and a blind fold.
I like it hard rough and biting my neck sends me crazy but your going to have to keep up, I like having multiple orgasms.

I thought about something along the lines of "hold on while I get my pen and a notepad so I can write all that down".

No that's the wrong thing to say , say this :

" I'll decide how many orgasms you'll have . I hope you not another one of these women that says she likes it rough ends up changing her mind "

You maintain frame AND you force to validate herself to you .

Win/Win in my book .

(12-08-2014 09:55 PM)HenrySprinkler Wrote:  

(12-08-2014 09:30 PM)Roardog Wrote:  Her: When we meet there is to be dim lights, possible restraints and a blind fold.
I like it hard rough and biting my neck sends me crazy but your going to have to keep up, I like having multiple orgasms.

I can tell she is trying to change the frame but I'm not sure how to respond so that I keep my frame. Up until now I have been entirely dominant, hardly replying to her, making her call me master and having her send me nude pics.
I thought about something along the lines of "hold on while I get my pen and a notepad so I can write all that down".

Never been in this situation so congrats for that. Maybe take your response in this direction.

"hold on while I get my pen and notepad.... I'm making a grocery list for you. I'll take one sandwich for every orgasm I allow you to have."

Don't know to what degree she is sub, sexual or other stuff, but you could go into how she needs to crawl across the floor and remain there while you eat the sandwich on the bed or some shit. That would be most boss.

This frame thing is getting out of control.

She is obviously enjoying it.

"What else do you like? You're making me so hard, continue..."

(12-09-2014 01:10 PM)Noir Wrote:  

(12-08-2014 09:30 PM)Roardog Wrote:  Her: When we meet there is to be dim lights, possible restraints and a blind fold.
I like it hard rough and biting my neck sends me crazy but your going to have to keep up, I like having multiple orgasms.

This frame thing is getting out of control.

She is obviously enjoying it.

"What else do you like? You're making me so hard, continue..."

While it's great that she's texting him sexual things, the wording highlighted in bold above is significant. Likely he needs to dominate her, but it's also possible she's trying to take control or shit-test him hard. Your line is a little bit too supplicating for my tastes, although it could work out. As always, context is key and the next text from her will shed more light.

OP - Where did this end up?

Love it when a girl wants to be submissive, yes, it's a bit odd when one is first confronted by it the first time.

I'd angle anything she wants as a reward for doing something for you, like deepthroating, whipping her a certain of times etc etc

When I've been in this situation I've always countered and re-frame with things that I want done, things I want her to bring, wear, act like.

Always respond with a strong sexual tone, even throw in the "daddy" term, make her earn what she wants.

This isn't for the fain of heart, one needs a strong frame, and I'd say some experience with submission/bdsm/fantasy.

Would love to hear the follow up to this story.

(12-09-2014 05:27 PM)kaotic Wrote:  Love it when a girl wants to be submissive, yes, it's a bit odd when one is first confronted by it the first time.

I'd angle anything she wants as a reward for doing something for you, like deepthroating, whipping her a certain of times etc etc

When I've been in this situation I've always countered and re-frame with things that I want done, things I want her to bring, wear, act like.

Always respond with a strong sexual tone, even throw in the "daddy" term, make her earn what she wants.

This isn't for the fain of heart, one needs a strong frame, and I'd say some experience with submission/bdsm/fantasy.

Would love to hear the follow up to this story.

This is my first time with a girl being this submissive and I am finding it a bit strange. It started out as me not giving a crap about her and just having some fun and has now become this.

I ended up giving her radio silence for 24 hours and going with AndroidOcean's advice about saying No and then re describing the scenario.
I really didn't like the tone of her her message, as highlighted by AndroidOcean, as it's not the dynamic I want with this girl, or any girl really.
I'll let you all know how it goes.

**Update**

She just responded, see below, but again is trying to dictate. This time I'm thinking of going Kaotic's route and telling her she has to offer me something to comply with this.

Her: Make sure you're wearing that bowtie!

This is a reference to a pic she has seen of me at a Gala I went to a couple of weeks back where I was suited up with a bowtie. She wants me to wear it naked when I bang her.

(12-09-2014 10:33 PM)Roardog Wrote:  **Update**

She just responded, see below, but again is trying to dictate. This time I'm thinking of going Kaotic's route and telling her she has to offer me something to comply with this.

Her: Make sure you're wearing that bowtie!

This is a reference to a pic she has seen of me at a Gala I went to a couple of weeks back where I was suited up with a bowtie. She wants me to wear it naked when I bang her.

Wtf no way, fuck that, you should be the one saying "make sure you wear that skirt or that certain piece of lingerie.'

Thing is once she started getting submissive she ended up taking the reigns and controlled the frame.

At this point you can make demands of your own, saying "as long as you wear x and do y"

She's clearly DTF, but you have to be mentally be prepared to handle this, I'm naturally really aggressive in bed and always choked and slapped, it took me a few sessions to get comfortable with whips, cuffs, binds, etc.

It's your call on how to proceed, I'd at least probe seeing how she reacts to your counters and demands.

(12-09-2014 10:49 PM)kaotic Wrote:  

(12-09-2014 10:33 PM)Roardog Wrote:  **Update**

She just responded, see below, but again is trying to dictate. This time I'm thinking of going Kaotic's route and telling her she has to offer me something to comply with this.

Her: Make sure you're wearing that bowtie!

This is a reference to a pic she has seen of me at a Gala I went to a couple of weeks back where I was suited up with a bowtie. She wants me to wear it naked when I bang her.

Wtf no way, fuck that, you should be the one saying "make sure you wear that skirt or that certain piece of lingerie.'

Thing is once she started getting submissive she ended up taking the reigns and controlled the frame.

At this point you can make demands of your own, saying "as long as you wear x and do y"

She's clearly DTF, but you have to be mentally be prepared to handle this, I'm naturally really aggressive in bed and always choked and slapped, it took me a few sessions to get comfortable with whips, cuffs, binds, etc.

It's your call on how to proceed, I'd at least probe seeing how she reacts to your counters and demands.

I've already told her to wear a skirt and heels, which she readily agreed to.
This is what she wants in return.

I'm thinking of just telling her "You need to ask nicely" which I have done before when she got a bit demanding and she backed down and said "please master".

Got girls number several nights ago at a bar. Conversation was around 10 minutes

Me: what u up to

Her: On my way to work, what about you? had fun last night?

Me: yea was awesome music..just leaving gym lets do drink sat nite

Her: possible

Me: yawn

Her: Yeah..I guess I deserved it :b

Me: k lets do 9:30 saturday meanwhile ill think of a place

Her: Why do you get to think of a place and not me?

Me: Little spoon doesnt ask big questions

Since that last message radio silence. Whats your guys's opinion for next step?

Im thinking just assume the sale and message her on saturday where to meet me

(12-11-2014 01:16 PM)sandman972 Wrote:  Got girls number several nights ago at a bar. Conversation was around 10 minutes

Me: what u up to

Her: On my way to work, what about you? had fun last night?

Me: yea was awesome music..just leaving gym lets do drink sat nite

Her: possible

Me: yawn

Her: Yeah..I guess I deserved it :b

Me: k lets do 9:30 saturday meanwhile ill think of a place

Her: Why do you get to think of a place and not me?

Me: Little spoon doesnt ask big questions

Since that last message radio silence. Whats your guys's opinion for next step?

Im thinking just assume the sale and message her on saturday where to meet me

Even though the last text was a bit much, I laughed. Assume the sale, I'd confirm the afternoon before, that way if she doesn't respond, you can setup another date (you should be double booking anyways).

If she does respond great, if she counters, great. If she hardly responds, next her. (or restart text later)

Here's a short report I posted on the Approach thread.. I don't know what the hell happened here. Maybe you guys can give me some feedback.

Scenario: I'm waiting for the airport shuttle at some random bus stop in NYC. I'm waiting and see this HB7.5 blonde (who I later found out was a yoga teacher) waiting with a luggage as well. A bus stops, everybody in the bus stop gets in except me and the blonde chick. I knew it wasn't our bus, but I asked her anyway "You sure that's not our bus?". We talked for 2 minutes about the bus, airport rides and parking options. Then some silence. The bus arrives and we get in. I notice she chose a seat very close to me inside the bus, so I knew I had a chance to re-open once inside. This is also a very subconscious action.

10 minutes before the bus arrives the airport, we talk to each other about our trips. I was going to visit some family in Asia, while she was going to Los Angeles to meet a friend. We talked for 10 minutes -- and get this -- when the bus arrives in the airport, we walk together and she number closes me when she got to her terminal. I'd call myself an average looking kid, and I know this type of thing is extremely rare even for good looking guys. She said "I want to hangout with you next time." I found it strange, so I give her my number without any expectations. She texts me before my flight and we go on a boring conversation. I don't escalate at all. No flirting at all, just the "where are you from", 'what do you do", "where are you staying", "have you been to Cali before" these types of questions. Maybe for 20 minutes until my plane left. Honestly, I was just so perplexed why this chick number-closed me in broad daylight. She lives in the city but she is from Las Vegas, and I just thought she was a hooker.

Then bam. I don't talk to her for a whole week until I come back to the states.

When I got back to the states, I try to set up a date right as soon as possible right. I begin to escalate through text to jump start attraction. I'm telling her I'm really interested in taking her out. I even told her what to wear, what my type is and to make sure she smells good. At first she told me she'd love to go out, but she had to be in Rochester for work for a few days. I wait and on the the night she comes back, she says sorry I'm too tired to go out (which is understandable since it was 11PM). Anyway, the next day, she sets up a date with me and it is sealed.

I play the logistics game -- I bring her to get food and drinks in a restaurant and a bar a few blocks from my house. I know Roosh members don't like to get food during first dates --- but I really enjoy it so I do it anyway. We get some pizza and re-engage the conversation. We're just regular two people conversing. We're eating and as soon as we finish, bounce off the next pub to get a couple of drinks. This time we get more cozy. We sit super close to each other. Talk about our lives, sex, our ex's, and in the span of three hours I also built a lot of inside jokes together. I'm good at that shit inside jokes shit -- so it went well. When it was time to go, I just said she had to come to my place to see this samurai sword I bought from JPN. (side note: as an asian dude, I probably should find better props).

Surprisingly, she gave no hesitation and just started walking. We got into my apartment, I gave her a tour of the place, showed that thing I bought from Japan and we sit on the couch to talk some more. While she is talking, I cut her off and told her I've been wanting to kiss her since we were at the club. I lean in and kiss her. She doesn't kiss me back but doesn't push me away. I'm like, what? She said she was shy, and she started hiding her face in my pillows like a 10 year old girl and started talking super boring mundane things about work.

Then, I had a fucking genius hook that brought her to bed. I told her I had these disco-balls neon lights in my bed post. She wanted to see it, so we go to the bedroom and i turn on the lights. She assumes the position (lies on my bed) to look at the lights. I lie down too. We're making out, and she's kissing me a lot this time. I grope her but it was so hard to remove her dress. She said she just met me and she's not ready for my samurai sword just yet. We make out maybe for an hour in between telling jokes and laughing. I'm still pushing but she is resisting every time I try to advance. I stop, we talk and then kiss again and she won't get any further again. I didn't push that hard because I honestly was having such a good time, and I also had set her up for a broadway show next week (I won tickets on the radio) and seeing how sure thing this is, I wasn't worried. I told myself it'll just be a matter of time. My balls were blue as fuck but I figured I'd just wait it out.

So here's what happens right. We plan 2 more dates. We planned a date last weekend and another date for the show (this Thursday) I assumed the bang will just happen any time between that.

The day after our first date, she texts me "hey genghis, i saw the trailer of the show and it looks amazing. i can't wait!" I told her I couldn't wait too.

That night, I knew she met some of her girl friends, and I don't know what her friends told her. The next day, she messages me to cancel on me telling me she has work and can't see me that night. This is just obvious bullshit because her job isn't busy at all. That's it. Bam. Radio silence after. No text response. Of 3 weeks of texting with this broad, that never happens.

I'm trying to understand and review my game to see if I did something wrong. Maybe she knew I was just trying to get into her pants? Did I bring her to my room too soon?

I really hate flakers. I'm angry this broad wasted my time and effort. I'm pissed because my balls are blue as fuck, and I honestly couldn't play a better game.

What should I do for the Broadway show? It's like 3 nights away. Do I text her?

Do I wait for the day before? Do I open the text about the Broadway show, or do I open the text with something else?

(12-12-2014 02:12 AM)GenghisKhan Wrote:  Here's a short report I posted on the Approach thread.. I don't know what the hell happened here. Maybe you guys can give me some feedback.

Scenario: I'm waiting for the airport shuttle at some random bus stop in NYC. I'm waiting and see this HB7.5 blonde (who I later found out was a yoga teacher) waiting with a luggage as well. A bus stops, everybody in the bus stop gets in except me and the blonde chick. I knew it wasn't our bus, but I asked her anyway "You sure that's not our bus?". We talked for 2 minutes about the bus, airport rides and parking options. Then some silence. The bus arrives and we get in. I notice she chose a seat very close to me inside the bus, so I knew I had a chance to re-open once inside. This is also a very subconscious action.

10 minutes before the bus arrives the airport, we talk to each other about our trips. I was going to visit some family in Asia, while she was going to Los Angeles to meet a friend. We talked for 10 minutes -- and get this -- when the bus arrives in the airport, we walk together and she number closes me when she got to her terminal. I'd call myself an average looking kid, and I know this type of thing is extremely rare even for good looking guys. She said "I want to hangout with you next time." I found it strange, so I give her my number without any expectations. She texts me before my flight and we go on a boring conversation. I don't escalate at all. No flirting at all, just the "where are you from", 'what do you do", "where are you staying", "have you been to Cali before" these types of questions. Maybe for 20 minutes until my plane left. Honestly, I was just so perplexed why this chick number-closed me in broad daylight. She lives in the city but she is from Las Vegas, and I just thought she was a hooker.

Then bam. I don't talk to her for a whole week until I come back to the states.

When I got back to the states, I try to set up a date right as soon as possible right. I begin to escalate through text to jump start attraction. I'm telling her I'm really interested in taking her out. I even told her what to wear, what my type is and to make sure she smells good. At first she told me she'd love to go out, but she had to be in Rochester for work for a few days. I wait and on the the night she comes back, she says sorry I'm too tired to go out (which is understandable since it was 11PM). Anyway, the next day, she sets up a date with me and it is sealed.

I play the logistics game -- I bring her to get food and drinks in a restaurant and a bar a few blocks from my house. I know Roosh members don't like to get food during first dates --- but I really enjoy it so I do it anyway. We get some pizza and re-engage the conversation. We're just regular two people conversing. We're eating and as soon as we finish, bounce off the next pub to get a couple of drinks. This time we get more cozy. We sit super close to each other. Talk about our lives, sex, our ex's, and in the span of three hours I also built a lot of inside jokes together. I'm good at that shit inside jokes shit -- so it went well. When it was time to go, I just said she had to come to my place to see this samurai sword I bought from JPN. (side note: as an asian dude, I probably should find better props).

Surprisingly, she gave no hesitation and just started walking. We got into my apartment, I gave her a tour of the place, showed that thing I bought from Japan and we sit on the couch to talk some more. While she is talking, I cut her off and told her I've been wanting to kiss her since we were at the club. I lean in and kiss her. She doesn't kiss me back but doesn't push me away. I'm like, what? She said she was shy, and she started hiding her face in my pillows like a 10 year old girl and started talking super boring mundane things about work.

Then, I had a fucking genius hook that brought her to bed. I told her I had these disco-balls neon lights in my bed post. She wanted to see it, so we go to the bedroom and i turn on the lights. She assumes the position (lies on my bed) to look at the lights. I lie down too. We're making out, and she's kissing me a lot this time. I grope her but it was so hard to remove her dress. She said she just met me and she's not ready for my samurai sword just yet. We make out maybe for an hour in between telling jokes and laughing. I'm still pushing but she is resisting every time I try to advance. I stop, we talk and then kiss again and she won't get any further again. I didn't push that hard because I honestly was having such a good time, and I also had set her up for a broadway show next week (I won tickets on the radio) and seeing how sure thing this is, I wasn't worried. I told myself it'll just be a matter of time. My balls were blue as fuck but I figured I'd just wait it out.

So here's what happens right. We plan 2 more dates. We planned a date last weekend and another date for the show (this Thursday) I assumed the bang will just happen any time between that.

The day after our first date, she texts me "hey genghis, i saw the trailer of the show and it looks amazing. i can't wait!" I told her I couldn't wait too.

That night, I knew she met some of her girl friends, and I don't know what her friends told her. The next day, she messages me to cancel on me telling me she has work and can't see me that night. This is just obvious bullshit because her job isn't busy at all. That's it. Bam. Radio silence after. No text response. Of 3 weeks of texting with this broad, that never happens.

I'm trying to understand and review my game to see if I did something wrong. Maybe she knew I was just trying to get into her pants? Did I bring her to my room too soon?

I really hate flakers. I'm angry this broad wasted my time and effort. I'm pissed because my balls are blue as fuck, and I honestly couldn't play a better game.

What should I do for the Broadway show? It's like 3 nights away. Do I text her?

Do I wait for the day before? Do I open the text about the Broadway show, or do I open the text with something else?

I would definitely schedule with a new girl if possible or sell the tickets and do something else you like.

She can and will contact you if she wants to hear from you. Alternatively, you could write her in a week after the Broadway show.

She might in fact be hoping you pursue her, but she has to be punished for being a cunt.

In other news:

I just had a horrible bout of one-itis. Am feeling absolutely in the gutter! Would be cool to hook up with some RooshV bros for gaming. Alas...

(12-12-2014 03:36 AM)ElJefe Wrote:  In other news:

I just had a horrible bout of one-itis. Am feeling absolutely in the gutter! Would be cool to hook up with some RooshV bros for gaming. Alas...

True.

But I thought he really had this one in the bag. Seems like he did a lot of things right.

It's meaningless to try and figure out why. Women are women. Power is with the one who cares less...

Oh I agree... I was talking about me lol

(12-12-2014 02:12 AM)GenghisKhan Wrote:  Here's a short report I posted on the Approach thread.. I don't know what the hell happened here. Maybe you guys can give me some feedback.

Scenario: I'm waiting for the airport shuttle at some random bus stop in NYC. I'm waiting and see this HB7.5 blonde (who I later found out was a yoga teacher) waiting with a luggage as well. A bus stops, everybody in the bus stop gets in except me and the blonde chick. I knew it wasn't our bus, but I asked her anyway "You sure that's not our bus?". We talked for 2 minutes about the bus, airport rides and parking options. Then some silence. The bus arrives and we get in. I notice she chose a seat very close to me inside the bus, so I knew I had a chance to re-open once inside. This is also a very subconscious action.

10 minutes before the bus arrives the airport, we talk to each other about our trips. I was going to visit some family in Asia, while she was going to Los Angeles to meet a friend. We talked for 10 minutes -- and get this -- when the bus arrives in the airport, we walk together and she number closes me when she got to her terminal. I'd call myself an average looking kid, and I know this type of thing is extremely rare even for good looking guys. She said "I want to hangout with you next time." I found it strange, so I give her my number without any expectations. She texts me before my flight and we go on a boring conversation. I don't escalate at all. No flirting at all, just the "where are you from", 'what do you do", "where are you staying", "have you been to Cali before" these types of questions. Maybe for 20 minutes until my plane left. Honestly, I was just so perplexed why this chick number-closed me in broad daylight. She lives in the city but she is from Las Vegas, and I just thought she was a hooker.

Then bam. I don't talk to her for a whole week until I come back to the states.

When I got back to the states, I try to set up a date right as soon as possible right. I begin to escalate through text to jump start attraction. I'm telling her I'm really interested in taking her out. I even told her what to wear, what my type is and to make sure she smells good. At first she told me she'd love to go out, but she had to be in Rochester for work for a few days. I wait and on the the night she comes back, she says sorry I'm too tired to go out (which is understandable since it was 11PM). Anyway, the next day, she sets up a date with me and it is sealed.

I play the logistics game -- I bring her to get food and drinks in a restaurant and a bar a few blocks from my house. I know Roosh members don't like to get food during first dates --- but I really enjoy it so I do it anyway. We get some pizza and re-engage the conversation. We're just regular two people conversing. We're eating and as soon as we finish, bounce off the next pub to get a couple of drinks. This time we get more cozy. We sit super close to each other. Talk about our lives, sex, our ex's, and in the span of three hours I also built a lot of inside jokes together. I'm good at that shit inside jokes shit -- so it went well. When it was time to go, I just said she had to come to my place to see this samurai sword I bought from JPN. (side note: as an asian dude, I probably should find better props).

Surprisingly, she gave no hesitation and just started walking. We got into my apartment, I gave her a tour of the place, showed that thing I bought from Japan and we sit on the couch to talk some more. While she is talking, I cut her off and told her I've been wanting to kiss her since we were at the club. I lean in and kiss her. She doesn't kiss me back but doesn't push me away. I'm like, what? She said she was shy, and she started hiding her face in my pillows like a 10 year old girl and started talking super boring mundane things about work.

Then, I had a fucking genius hook that brought her to bed. I told her I had these disco-balls neon lights in my bed post. She wanted to see it, so we go to the bedroom and i turn on the lights. She assumes the position (lies on my bed) to look at the lights. I lie down too. We're making out, and she's kissing me a lot this time. I grope her but it was so hard to remove her dress. She said she just met me and she's not ready for my samurai sword just yet. We make out maybe for an hour in between telling jokes and laughing. I'm still pushing but she is resisting every time I try to advance. I stop, we talk and then kiss again and she won't get any further again. I didn't push that hard because I honestly was having such a good time, and I also had set her up for a broadway show next week (I won tickets on the radio) and seeing how sure thing this is, I wasn't worried. I told myself it'll just be a matter of time. My balls were blue as fuck but I figured I'd just wait it out.

So here's what happens right. We plan 2 more dates. We planned a date last weekend and another date for the show (this Thursday) I assumed the bang will just happen any time between that.

The day after our first date, she texts me "hey genghis, i saw the trailer of the show and it looks amazing. i can't wait!" I told her I couldn't wait too.

That night, I knew she met some of her girl friends, and I don't know what her friends told her. The next day, she messages me to cancel on me telling me she has work and can't see me that night. This is just obvious bullshit because her job isn't busy at all. That's it. Bam. Radio silence after. No text response. Of 3 weeks of texting with this broad, that never happens.

I'm trying to understand and review my game to see if I did something wrong. Maybe she knew I was just trying to get into her pants? Did I bring her to my room too soon?

I really hate flakers. I'm angry this broad wasted my time and effort. I'm pissed because my balls are blue as fuck, and I honestly couldn't play a better game.

What should I do for the Broadway show? It's like 3 nights away. Do I text her?

Do I wait for the day before? Do I open the text about the Broadway show, or do I open the text with something else?

I see several arising issues here that led to end result of her radio silencing you.

Ok so what do we know?

- Shes a 7.5 blonde from NYC. Meaning she probably gets hit on all the time, and probably has atleast 4-5 other options on the go, not to mention a handful of beta orbiters, and on top of all that her hypergamy is very pronounced

- The fact that she number closed you (and yes this is rare) tells me she obviously was attracted to you and associated with you high value, intriguing her interest in you, meaning besides your physical attraction to her, you spat good game on the initial meet and bus ride.

- The fact she said "she wants to hang out with you" already puts you in a good position before the 1st date, in my opinion she was DTF

Where did it go wrong?

(12-12-2014 02:12 AM)GenghisKhan Wrote:  I play the logistics game -- I bring her to get food and drinks in a restaurant and a bar a few blocks from my house. I know Roosh members don't like to get food during first dates --- but I really enjoy it so I do it anyway. We get some pizza and re-engage the conversation.

This ^^^. You already started off on the wrong foot by taking her for food to begin the date.

-Theres a reason why dinner and food for a first date is a no go. Firstly, why would you want to watch her eat and try to have a conversation, while paying for the bill (im assuming you did).

-Having dinner is a counterproductive environment for physical escalation. Any RVF member will tell you alcohol almost always is a catalyst to the bedroom. In short, no dinner first dates PERIOD. Drinks only, plus in what world does she even deserve a paid for dinner from you. Its not your 1 year girlfriends birthday.

- The second suspicion is when you guys went to the bar, besides your inside jokes and playful conversation, your physical escalation was non-existent. Im not advocating making out in the bar per say, but definitely some leg and arm touching, to the point of locking hands with her on and off in the bar.

Ok so you get her back to your place. Nice. At this point, you still are not out of the game by any means. She probably isnt sure why you didnt escalate with her at the bar, but shes giving you another opportunity at your place.

At this point you guys continue conversation until the breaking point/ buzz kill comes into play and destroys any chance you have of banging her:

-When you told her " you've been wanting to kiss her ever since the bar". This comes off totally weak and beta and in fact thats what she should be thinking in her head. Had you have been physically escalating at the bar and your place, theres no need to say anything, and a makeout would have naturally happened.

- You skipped many steps of escalation up to the point that she probably was surprised and later on embarrassed that you tried to kiss her out of the blue like that. Thats why she put her face in a pillow and said she was "shy" (ya my ass).

- This resulted in a snowball effect leading into the bedroom where no comfort was established and she was probably turned off by the entire thing, ultimately making out with you out of guilt.

Its unnecessary to have already planned 2 more dates. It comes off as needy and a man lacking options. Always leave her guessing. Your mask was lifted, and she knew she had you, instead of her trying to qualify herself to you.

Lastly, she left your place knowing you weren't the alpha high valued man she perceived you to be.
I would say shes a lost prospect and move on, you are already low value in her eyes with not much hope of recovery.

If you really want to try, send her randomly " cool c u at 9" to which her response will be "what?" to which you reply " oops wrong convo" with the goal of you trying to instill jealousy, but my guess its low success rate at this stage.

Happens to all of us man, dont worry about it, learn from you mistakes and slay the next brod that comes to see your Samurai Sword

ok someone perhaps has an idea (although I doubt).

This girl doesn't respond well to typical game - I've been getting much better results by actually just being really authentic, chill and happy go-lucky. And she doesn't put out at all, so I think she's a good long-term prospect.

I'm banging other girls, but this one deserves a chance, I think. She's abroad, but wee skyped a week ago and she gave me several IOIs (I'm relatively sure about this). We had a very tentative agreement to skype yesterday, but she never checked my messages to her on FB chat. She came back today saying the network had been down and she couldn't write me, followed up with three boring ass snaps in a row. I know for a fact she liked some public figure's status and sent some snaps yesterday while the network wasn't working, so I don't know if that's plausible that she couldn't use the chat function but could do other stuff. She's a conflict-shy girl, but has a great deal of integrity.

Now it seems like she's not interested anymore, so I am ready to move on, and this is perhaps her way of trying to come back and let me off easy rather than just ignore me.

It could also be that the whole thing is 100% true.

Besides the fact I need to get off my one-itis, not sending a reply could seem like butthurtness.

What can I send back that is a combination of reply/maintaining frame/keeping door open for further interaction/maintaing high value and self-esteem. I think you get the picture. Right now I'm like the less words the better. Perhaps:

"bummer!" or "that's too bad" or "sucks. Hit me up if you want to reschedule".

If she wants to reschedule, i want her to feel comfortable asking for it. She is absolutely not the type to take the initiative except on very rare occassions, ssince she's such an introvert.

Right now the best I've got is:

"okay... if you say so!"

Kinda open ended hamster-trap

I also thought of sending a photo of me with a bicep-shot since I'm getting drunk right now

Come at me bros!

(12-12-2014 08:49 AM)ElJefe Wrote:  ok someone perhaps has an idea (although I doubt).

This girl doesn't respond well to typical game - I've been getting much better results by actually just being really authentic, chill and happy go-lucky. And she doesn't put out at all, so I think she's a good long-term prospect.

I'm banging other girls, but this one deserves a chance, I think. She's abroad, but wee skyped a week ago and she gave me several IOIs (I'm relatively sure about this). We had a very tentative agreement to skype yesterday, but she never checked my messages to her on FB chat. She came back today saying the network had been down and she couldn't write me, followed up with three boring ass snaps in a row. I know for a fact she liked some public figure's status and sent some snaps yesterday while the network wasn't working, so I don't know if that's plausible that she couldn't use the chat function but could do other stuff. She's a conflict-shy girl, but has a great deal of integrity.

Now it seems like she's not interested anymore, so I am ready to move on, and this is perhaps her way of trying to come back and let me off easy rather than just ignore me.

It could also be that the whole thing is 100% true.

Besides the fact I need to get off my one-itis, not sending a reply could seem like butthurtness.

What can I send back that is a combination of reply/maintaining frame/keeping door open for further interaction/maintaing high value and self-esteem. I think you get the picture. Right now I'm like the less words the better. Perhaps:

"bummer!" or "that's too bad" or "sucks. Hit me up if you want to reschedule".

If she wants to reschedule, i want her to feel comfortable asking for it. She is absolutely not the type to take the initiative except on very rare occassions, ssince she's such an introvert.

Right now the best I've got is:

"okay... if you say so!"

Kinda open ended hamster-trap

I also thought of sending a photo of me with a bicep-shot since I'm getting drunk right now

Come at me bros!

"k"

Tips on how to play this? I met her at a bar, got the number, then called her two days later. We played phone tag back and forth once or twice, then she sent me a message that she'd "get back to me tomorrow." Three days later she still hadn't called so I messaged her "..." and then only a day later she responded with "busy with work" bull shit. You can see the rest here:

[attachment=23485]
[attachment=23486]
[attachment=23487]

My intuition is that the odds aren't on my side, but wanted to see what you guys think.

I'm leaning towards radio silence then continuing with a confirmation text tomorrow a few hours before 21:30 even though I'm not counting on her coming out to meet me.

(12-12-2014 03:29 PM)RealityCheck Wrote:  My guess is that she's a pretty cold prospect, but wanted to see what you guys think.

I'm leaning towards radio silence then continuing with a confirmation text tomorrow a few hours before 21:30.

You can go radio silence, but "maybe" is pretty much code for "no."

I'd go with a "nah"

You might as well cancel on her. She's being a bitch, it's not going to get any better with this line of texting she's giving you. Go find another girl to meet for drinks.

Here's the deal. Had a great first date that led to a bang. All peaches and 30 minutes after she's left she texts me first "Got home. Sleep tight! Hope to see you again some other day! : *"

That's on the Saturday.

Then I text her on Monday basically asking how she is and a bit of chit chat. Fast responses and all seems sweet. Then I ask if we should meet next Saturday, she goes quiet and answers the next day.

The rest you can see here.



Now it's Friday night, haven't heard from her yet.

It's one of those situations where it seems almost unbelievable, because things were really great. I am in Brazil and I'm thinking this is a different culture, but to be honest I don't really know and hence "stuck".

Appreciate your help, fellas!

"I'll let you know" or "tell you later" is always a bad sign. I tend to apply the same logic than, if someone offers you something really important on a certain date/time, you will write it in your agenda. The fact that she needs to "think about it" indicates that she is not 100% satisfied by the idea. That's just my opinion, I'd like to see what other players think on this one.

(12-12-2014 04:04 PM)AneroidOcean Wrote:  

(12-12-2014 03:29 PM)RealityCheck Wrote:  My guess is that she's a pretty cold prospect, but wanted to see what you guys think.

I'm leaning towards radio silence then continuing with a confirmation text tomorrow a few hours before 21:30.

You can go radio silence, but "maybe" is pretty much code for "no."

I'd go with a "nah"

You might as well cancel on her. She's being a bitch, it's not going to get any better with this line of texting she's giving you. Go find another girl to meet for drinks.

Good call, that's what I did in the end.

(12-12-2014 10:20 PM)Staros Wrote:  Now it's Friday night, haven't heard from her yet.

It's one of those situations where it seems almost unbelievable, because things were really great. I am in Brazil and I'm thinking this is a different culture, but to be honest I don't really know and hence "stuck".

Appreciate your help, fellas!

Similar to my situation, "I'll let you know" usually means that she's not interested. In your case, you've already slept with her, but for whatever reason that you'll likely never know, the attraction might have dissipated.

Instead of two messages:
"hmm
Sunday?"

I would have just said "sunday". This way your keeping the ratio of your texts to her texts in your favor, plus you're talking in the imperative instead of asking a question.

And instead of "yeah" I would've said "k". Less is more.

But I'm nitpicking and these things likely wouldn't have made a big difference overall.

Good luck.

I've come to view pre-bang text exchanges as code-talk in many cases. Exhibit A below, my text exchange with an online 8/10 chick yesterday in response to my "do you want to connect over drinks and see where that leads us" (translated: "let's meet and fuck") line.
   
Exhibit A translated:

Me: Meet me Tue night. If you have work/school, I can see u Wed night
Her: I'm free Tue night but I'm talking to a few other dudes right now
Me: I'm going out Tue night anyway and don't give a fuck if you come along or not
Her: Wait! I'll schedule other dudes later (or earlier?) and meet you Tue night. Btw here's my escape plan in case you turn out to be a dumb/ugly sonofabitch so don't assume the sale dude!
Me: F u bitch. I'm calling u out and walking away
Her: Wait, wait! I'm dtf, it's just an escape hatch
Me: You down?
Her: Fuck yeah!

In the past, I used to mishandle the "I may have plans with gf" line by employing the rational approach. Now I just tell them to fuck off in a nice way and see if they retrace.

Would you guys have read and handled it differently?

Haven't banged this chick in a while. Thought I was getting set-up for a "fuck you" but it worked out in my favor