Post: #1

Hey guys,

It looks like my company is expanding my department abroad. My boss basically offered me the choice of being his man on the ground in either London or Sao Paulo.

He doesn't have any details on the expat package yet but I was wondering what other people's opinion may be?

I'm willing to learn Portuguese (work will pay for classes) so beyond that barrier that's really it.

I'm curious what others opinions might be. Let's hear it!

Post: #2

I'm surprised that you have to ask this question, you're from France/US?

Go somewhere where you are considered exotic.

A: Sao Paulo.. just don't party too much.

Post: #3

US based. Never been to France, but yes it is a serious question.

The headquarters of where I work is in the UK too. I figured i'd start learning Portuguese as a fun side challenge.

But yeah, I was hoping someone had been to both and had an opinion.

Post: #4

(11-07-2014 06:37 PM)Hot Commodity Wrote:  I'm surprised that you have to ask this question, you're from France/US?

Go somewhere where you are considered exotic.

A: Sao Paulo.. just don't party too much.

Honestly though, Sao Paulo is so much of a cosmopolitan city that the exotic factor isn't that high. A lot of Brazilians are light skinned and light haired there, particularly the middle and upper classes.

Post: #5

London may be better for your career but I'd still go to São Paulo for its quality of life and for the life experience overall (assuming you'll be paid in USD and not in Brazilian reals).

Post: #6

(11-07-2014 07:07 PM)LouEvilSlugger Wrote:  London may be better for your career but I'd still go to São Paulo for its quality of life and for the life experience overall (assuming you'll be paid in USD and not in Brazilian reals).

That's the thing, depending on the expat package I get it may be better for me to live in Brazil. My current salary in USD in the real is 150k. I have no idea what the equates to in real life dollars.

Post: #7

Sao Paulo is a jungle, although one worth swinging through if you're up for the challenge.

It has a lot to offer in terms of nightlife, events, variety in people, and in general things to do. SP is like the NY of South America where Rio is like the Miami.

Drawbacks with SP is high expenses, traffic (top 5 worst in the world I'd imagine) and it is simply a concrete mess.

Post: #8

I have been to both cities.

Sao Paulo hands down if you are single. If I were you I would make that decision pretty much on the spot. London just sucks balls compared to Sao Paulo. The only reason to stay in London vs Sao Paulo is to travel to continental Europe on weekends.

If you go to SP, make sure you research the neighborhoods before you choose an apartment. Ideally, it should be a nice neighborhood close to work. The Metro (subway) kind of sucks there and only covers a small part of the city. Other public transport is almost non existent. Taxis are expensive. Safety is a problem, but much less so than in Rio or many cities in the North.

There are some nice neighborhoods, like Paulista and Via Madalena (spell?). The first one is the equivalent of the Financial District, the second one is more like the East Village.

Post: #9

(11-07-2014 07:38 PM)Brodiaga Wrote:  I have been to both cities.

Sao Paulo hands down if you are single. If I were you I would make that decision pretty much on the spot. London just sucks balls compared to Sao Paulo. The only reason to stay in London vs Sao Paulo is to travel to continental Europe on weekends.

If you go to SP, make sure you research the neighborhoods before you choose an apartment. Ideally, it should be a nice neighborhood close to work. The Metro (subway) kind of sucks there and only covers a small part of the city. Other public transport is almost non existent. Taxis are expensive. Safety is a problem, but much less so than in Rio or many cities in the North.

There are some nice neighborhoods, like Paulista and Via Madalena (spell?). The first one is the equivalent of the Financial District, the second one is more like the East Village.

That's a pretty big deal in my book. I used to live in London and I'm now in Los Angeles. Everything is far from me now – I regret not travelling more when I was based in London. You can fly to most European countries in under 3 hours from London.

I've never been to Brazil so I can't comment on Sao Paolo.

I would have thought that London has more variety when it comes to women, Sao Paolo’s quality may be higher though. Native English women are mostly ugly, but there’s a lot of foreigners in London.

Post: #10

^ pretty much my answer.
Lived in London for four years, toured like a maniac and miss it everyday. You don't have to date English girls, I dated everything but. Cheap flights to most places in Europe make it a big plus.

SP I am sure is nice and has great weather, I haven't been but heard mixed reviews.

Post: #11

(11-07-2014 07:38 PM)Brodiaga Wrote:  I have been to both cities.

Sao Paulo hands down if you are single. If I were you I would make that decision pretty much on the spot. London just sucks balls compared to Sao Paulo. The only reason to stay in London vs Sao Paulo is to travel to continental Europe on weekends.

Limited experience in both cities but I do like London too. I'm sure they have monthly tube (metro) passes, but it can be expensive. 5.50 Pounds for a one way trip on the metro (8 USD!)

Lot of hot international chicks/easy English girls (though of lower quality) vs. Sao Paulo local talent and the most attractive Brazilian transplants there for work

(11-07-2014 07:38 PM)Brodiaga Wrote:  If you go to SP, make sure you research the neighborhoods before you choose an apartment. Ideally, it should be a nice neighborhood close to work. The Metro (subway) kind of sucks there and only covers a small part of the city. Other public transport is almost non existent. Taxis are expensive. Safety is a problem, but much less so than in Rio or many cities in the North.

There are some nice neighborhoods, like Paulista and Via Madalena (spell?). The first one is the equivalent of the Financial District, the second one is more like the East Village.

The bolded comment is key. Is your work near Brooklin/Itaim Bibi or Avenida Paulista/Jardins?

Metros and taxis are complete hell during rush hour. Sometimes it's better to walk during those moments instead of dealing with traffic jams on the road or in public transportation.

If you can find a good deal, it seems like Jardin Paulista (singles and rich families) or Itaim Bibi/Brooklin/Vila Olimpia (more young professional singles) are the places to be. Vila Madalena IMO is very cool from a commercial/residential standpoint though farther out there. The knock on Vila Madalena is all the nightlife caters to just groups of people opposed to actual cold approaches that you can more likely pull off in the first two areas.

I'm sure a local Paulistano can shed more light than me though..just my 2 cents.

Post: #12

I have been to both cities. London provides nice access to other cities Europe and diverse groups of women within. However, my vote would Sao Paulo. I have been to Brazil many times but never had the chance to live there. This would be a dream for me. Great weather and the sensuality of the women is unmatched. Sao Paulo has great night life and lots of attractive girls. The girls make better girlfriends than Cariocas if that is important to you.

Post: #13

Frenchie makes 150k USD?

You in a relationship?

If no, would you like to be?

Post: #14

(11-07-2014 07:14 PM)frenchie Wrote:  

(11-07-2014 07:07 PM)LouEvilSlugger Wrote:  London may be better for your career but I'd still go to São Paulo for its quality of life and for the life experience overall (assuming you'll be paid in USD and not in Brazilian reals).

That's the thing, depending on the expat package I get it may be better for me to live in Brazil. My current salary in USD in the real is 150k.

You mean your salary will be around 150K Brazillian Real? That's a shade under 60K, not very high for an expat package and a high standard of living in Brazil is reportedly high.

Post: #15

(11-08-2014 12:13 AM)CodyB Wrote:  

(11-07-2014 07:14 PM)frenchie Wrote:  

(11-07-2014 07:07 PM)LouEvilSlugger Wrote:  London may be better for your career but I'd still go to São Paulo for its quality of life and for the life experience overall (assuming you'll be paid in USD and not in Brazilian reals).

That's the thing, depending on the expat package I get it may be better for me to live in Brazil. My current salary in USD in the real is 150k.

You mean your salary will be around 150K Brazillian Real? That's a shade under 60K, not very high for an expat package and a high standard of living in Brazil is reportedly high.

If it's 150K Reais annually, would you have to pay US income taxes?

Something to ponder

Post: #16

SP: extremely high cost of living (I know the other option is fuking £ondon, but still) and aproaching seriously a water supply crisis...

I'm brazillian and enthusiast about foreigners coming (even though that could mean more competition) but don't think twice. It's bad moment.

Post: #17

(11-07-2014 11:36 PM)L M McCoy Wrote:  Frenchie makes 150k USD?

You in a relationship?

If no, would you like to be?

Hehehe 150k real equals out to roughly 60k USD and i'm not single at the moment.

The package is being set up at the moment. I'm trying to decide what city would be the best all things being equal.

U luv me long time

Post: #18

London probably would be better for your career, unless you learn Port. and devote yourself to becoming a LATAM expert. Friends that live in SP for US based company are enjoying it. My buddy was a total masshole from Boston, moved to SP, learned the language, has a purple belt in BJJ and a Colombian GF now. He has this crazy fucking attitude now I think he picked up in Brazil. I think we lost the guy for good. London is a lot of fun though, and can be a good jumping off point to explore EE.

Post: #19

(11-08-2014 09:46 AM)Vaun Wrote:  London probably would be better for your career, unless you learn Port. and devote yourself to becoming a LATAM expert. Friends that live in SP for US based company are enjoying it. My buddy was a total masshole from Boston, moved to SP, learned the language, has a purple belt in BJJ and a Colombian GF now. He has this crazy fucking attitude now I think he picked up in Brazil. I think we lost the guy for good. London is a lot of fun though, and can be a good jumping off point to explore EE.

Yeah that's what i'm feeling too. I should say, bars and clubs aren't my scene anymore (an RvFer not clubbing you say?!). I like to be in bed by 10pm haha.

The posts here are great and I appreciate the insights. I'll wait to hear back on what type of package i'd get.

Post: #20

Only go to London if you have a family and kids that need a good education, otherwise Sao Paolo hands down for a single guy.

Post: #21

So you wanna be in bed at 10pm and bars and clubs not your scene.
What is your scene ? day game?
If so no point going to brazil.

I don't understand why u are hesitating to make a choice between these 2 cities. They are completely different. Pretty obvious to everyone I think.

Post: #22

R$ 150K a year is more than enough to have a decent lifestyle in Sao Paulo (local guy speaking). Rent + living expenses in a prime area shouldn't cost you more than R$ 4K a month. That's under USD 2,000.

Post: #23

(11-08-2014 09:50 AM)frenchie Wrote:  Yeah that's what i'm feeling too. I should say, bars and clubs aren't my scene anymore (an RvFer not clubbing you say?!). I like to be in bed by 10pm haha.

The posts here are great and I appreciate the insights. I'll wait to hear back on what type of package i'd get.

I don't know what industry you are in, but I don't see how working in London would be better for your career than working in Sao Paulo unless you are in Investment Banking, Hedge Funds, Insurance or something similar where London-based companies play a big part.

My knowledge of Sao Paulo is very limited, but what I do know is that there are beautiful girls out there you can meet during the day. You don't have to go to clubs and bars late at night to meet them.

Although Sao Paulo is quite expensive, London is more so, particularly when it comes to housing which is, except for the luxury segment, total shit. For $60K/year salary, you will either share an apartment in a decent neighborhood or rent a shitty apartment in a boring "working class" neighborhood where most girls are ugly and fat.

Bottom line, if you are interested in Europe and want to settle there eventually, then London may be a better option because you can explore other European cities from there. If you just want to change the scenery and sleep with a bunch of foreign girls, then it's definitely Sao Paulo.

Post: #24

(11-08-2014 09:34 AM)frenchie Wrote:  

(11-07-2014 11:36 PM)L M McCoy Wrote:  Frenchie makes 150k USD?

You in a relationship?

If no, would you like to be?

Hehehe 150k real equals out to roughly 60k USD and i'm not single at the moment.

The package is being set up at the moment. I'm trying to decide what city would be the best all things being equal.

U luv me long time

Only 60k?

You can't spoil someone like me with that chump change

Post: #25

Never been to any of them but I am 100% sure you should pick Brazil over London.

The fact that i am so sure without even being there should tell you something as to how sexy london is when it comes to women.