Post: #201

Lol I'd ban the guy just for posting that eyelashes thread, that is some masterful trolling.

Post: #202

(02-14-2014 09:51 AM)Jackreacher Wrote:  Lol I'd ban the guy just for posting that eyelashes thread, that is some masterful trolling.

Masterful trolling indeed.



   

Post: #203

To aid the discussion:

Wikipedia Wrote:Legal standards, from lowest to highest:

1. Reasonable suspicion
2. Reasonable to believe
3. Probable cause for arrest
4. Some credible evidence
5. Substantial evidence
6. Preponderance of the evidence
7. Clear and convincing evidence
8. Beyond reasonable doubt
9. Beyond the shadow of a doubt

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_burden_of_proof

With a lot of doubt surrounding this Dmitri character and his trollish activities which range in all directions, I believe the case against Vincent to be at #2 (bolded). I'd sure like not to jump the gun and keep him around. While it is not in the least unreasonable to believe him what the first post accuses him of being, remember that acting on that would open the floodgates for lunatics to assassinate anyone's character by creating troll accounts on other forums (and not just this puahate thing).

Post: #204

(02-14-2014 09:51 AM)Jackreacher Wrote:  Lol I'd ban the guy just for posting that eyelashes thread, that is some masterful trolling.

He said to apply saliva to your eyelashes to make your eyes look bigger. Then he stated that he'd been getting compliments because of it. It's not a troll thread. It may not me James Dean-masculine, but it's not a troll thread. He just stated something he's been doing that's gotten improved results with girls. If a few members benefit from that tip then fair enough.

Plus he hardly stated that he was applying mascara or eyeliner or lipstick. Eyes are a focal point of attraction. I personally won't be following his advice, but it's not a troll thread. Just a tip.

That thread should be ignored.

If he's found guilty of being Dimitri, fine, but the hate for that thread is in danger of tipping this over the edge.

Post: #205

(02-14-2014 07:45 AM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  In closing, I'll just leave this here for our good friend (in suffering), Mr. AliBhlaba, because it's gotten to the point where it's just far too painfully obvious to ignore:

Honesty BB, I'd like nothing better to get in the closet, but I just don't think there's room between you and all those ladyboys you got chained up in there. Serious question though. How do you decide which one of them curls your eyelashes?






   

Post: #206

(02-14-2014 05:18 AM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

(02-14-2014 05:12 AM)Vicious Wrote:  VV has had some questionable thread topics.

Ali gets riled up over everything perceived as gay to the point you'd think he's parodying Fred Phelps.

I get flared up when I login and there's a string of gay topics on a forum that is to celebrate heterosexuality and masculinity. Its sets a bad precedent when these threads aren't locked and shunned.

Gays don't bother me, but I don't walk into a fag bar cause I've nothing in common with them. So I don't want to hang out with homo's online either. I'm trying to set a good example for the younger players here about what you shouldn't have to tolerate in life. There's enough bullshit gayness, passive aggressive bullshit, and sense of entitlement/complacency in the real world. Do we have to put up with it here too?

So you're saying I SHOULDNT start a thread about the benefits of prostate massages for stress relief?

Post: #207

(02-14-2014 10:18 AM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

(02-14-2014 07:45 AM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  In closing, I'll just leave this here for our good friend (in suffering), Mr. AliBhlaba, because it's gotten to the point where it's just far too painfully obvious to ignore:

Honesty BB, I'd like nothing better to get in the closet, but I just don't think there's room between you and all those ladyboys you got chained up in there. Serious question though. How do you decide which one of them curls your eyelashes?

^ Just to the left of the lead "girl" looks slightly promising.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #208

Someones gotta get banned. Who's it gonna be!

Post: #209

(02-14-2014 10:24 AM)Kickb Wrote:  

Someones gotta get banned. Who's it gonna be!

That party already went down. Czar for the win.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #210

Quote:Until we can prove it 100%, he's innocent

Post: #211

One thing to consider is now the puahate guys are reading this thread and deciding who they want to bring the heat on over here now by spoofing them.

Post: #212

(02-14-2014 10:31 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Quote:Until we can prove it 100%, he's innocent

In terms of this GIF, all I ask is 'why?'

I don't think I'm making posts that are disrespectful to the community. I'm genuinely trying to be as polite as possible and just don't want a lynch mob to form.

Like I have said, if he's found guilty, I'll shut up and will apologise.

Kickb you can put me at 'evens' for getting banned now

Post: #213

(02-14-2014 10:38 AM)Hotwheels Wrote:  One thing to consider is now the puahate guys are reading this thread and deciding who they want to bring the heat on over here now by spoofing them.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #214

Doing a quick look, they both seem to be living in the same area of the world.

http://puahate.com/showthread.php?t=93321

Dmitri even has a blog in his "best of posts" that goes to some blog boldanddetermined.com Victor Pride who also lives in Thailand.

Judging from Dmitri's posting style, it looks more like the same style in the blog than Vincent's writing style.

Dmitri also talks a lot about testosterone on puahate and it is a big topic on the blog. I haven't seen Vincent talk too much about taking testosterone.

I have a feeling this Dmitri is this Victor Pride guy. Maybe Victor latched on Vincent's picture because they both live in SEA. Judging by some of the posters, this looks common as well as taking on usernames of pua gurus. The identical posts on the same day still keeps me wondering, though.

Post: #215

(02-14-2014 10:39 AM)LeightonBlackstock Wrote:  

(02-14-2014 10:31 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Quote:Until we can prove it 100%, he's innocent

In terms of this GIF, all I ask is 'why?'

I don't think I'm making posts that are disrespectful to the community. I'm genuinely trying to be as polite as possible and just don't want a lynch mob to form.

Like I have said, if he's found guilty, I'll shut up and will apologise.

Kickb you can put me at 'evens' for getting banned now

This isn't a court of law. This is a private forum and he who owns said private forum makes the rules and decisions.

Post: #216

(02-14-2014 10:47 AM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

(02-14-2014 10:39 AM)LeightonBlackstock Wrote:  

(02-14-2014 10:31 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Quote:Until we can prove it 100%, he's innocent

In terms of this GIF, all I ask is 'why?'

I don't think I'm making posts that are disrespectful to the community. I'm genuinely trying to be as polite as possible and just don't want a lynch mob to form.

Like I have said, if he's found guilty, I'll shut up and will apologise.

Kickb you can put me at 'evens' for getting banned now

This isn't a court of law. This is a private forum and he who owns said private forum makes the rules and decisions.

I know this. But let's give a little leeway here. He's a well-repped poster and has been vouched for by a few respected members.

I really have no ego about the situation. To reiterate again, if he's Dimitri I'll apologise immediately. I'm one of the least likely here to start a pissing match. Tuthmosis asked for the forum's opinion and I'm just saying my views. If they're dismissed, so be it.

Vincent gave a pretty strong rebuttal here, so it should be pursued further.

If I get banned, you will see no bitter messages on Naughty Nomad forum, I'm not the type.

Post: #217

(02-14-2014 10:39 AM)LeightonBlackstock Wrote:  

(02-14-2014 10:31 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Quote:Until we can prove it 100%, he's innocent

In terms of this GIF, all I ask is 'why?'

I don't think I'm making posts that are disrespectful to the community. I'm genuinely trying to be as polite as possible and just don't want a lynch mob to form.

Like I have said, if he's found guilty, I'll shut up and will apologise.

Kickb you can put me at 'evens' for getting banned now

Too much overhead trying to do that. If a few false positives get swept out with the rest of the garbage, that's just cost of doing business. We're not talking about fines or jail sentences here, just a forum ban.

Post: #218

(02-14-2014 10:57 AM)LeightonBlackstock Wrote:  I know this. But let's give a little leeway here. He's a well-repped poster and has been vouched for by a few respected members.

Roosh and Tuthmosis want sufficient information to commit to a decision they can stand by. That's a lower standard than the 100% certainty you suggested earlier.

Post: #219

Trying to see this from a PUAHate troll's perspective, and it doesn't add up. Vincent's posts on this forum and on ROK always seemed reasonable to me... but more than that, they garnered him a lot of threats and hatred from feminists.

To go that far as part of a scheme to troll the manosphere would indicate he was planning something much bigger in the future, but Tuth noticed him before it got that far. However, that's not consistent with the amount he's been posting (~1 post per day). Anyone that dedicated would be spending a lot more time posting/building a reputation with the community. The very nature of such a mission would preclude the possibility of them having a life, so I just can't imagine them posting as sporadically as Vincent has.

Then there's the ideological aspect. Try looking at this through the eyes of a male feminist, for a moment. These are people who strongly believe that merely expressing the ideas we do has a serious, negative impact on the world. Through this frame, making the kind of posts Vincent has just to gain our trust and fuck with us would be akin to molesting your way to the centre of a paedophile ring just to mess with them. It doesn't make sense.

However... perhaps I'd simply like to believe our enemies lack the understanding of themselves and others to create a character who seems as authentic as Vincent.

Post: #220

(02-14-2014 11:03 AM)Blaster Wrote:  

(02-14-2014 10:57 AM)LeightonBlackstock Wrote:  I know this. But let's give a little leeway here. He's a well-repped poster and has been vouched for by a few respected members.

Roosh and Tuthmosis want sufficient information to commit to a decision they can stand by. That's a lower standard than the 100% certainty you suggested earlier.

OK fair enough, 100% certainty is not needed to ban him here if we are to be literal. Nearer to 95% perhaps. (I can't give an actual percentage and I know that's not the reason behind your post, but yes, if we are to be literal, asking for literally 100% proof isn't achievable and is completely ridiculous, perhaps that was why the GIF was used)

Still, there are some routes which could let him off here. Maybe I'm just biased because I've met the guy and like him, but when a well-repped member is under the spotlight we shouldn't just clap our hands and cry 'Ban' because it's entertaining, we should give them a chance.

Post: #221

The main issue I see with jumping the gun, besides losing a valued member, is that if VV isn't on PUAHate then whoever is duping him scores a major victory.

Post: #222

I met up with VV for some beers in Bangkok. He was a great help via the forum back when we were setting up SwoopTheWorld; I was very surprised to find out about this thread, the eyelash thread did strike me as odd as well but Vincent does seem like the guy doesn't care what other people think of him. Moreover, he's using his real picture for his online identity, that would be very bad trolling practice imo.

Post: #223

I spent some time looking at Dimitri's posts on PUAHate. "Dimitri" is a misc troll -- obsessed with Zyzz, TRT and other misc tropes, and he speaks the misc language. He's also been obsessed with Roosh and the RVF from the beginning.

Certainly his style in these posts is completely different from VV's style. So if they are the same person that would involve a pretty serious ability to assume a completely different persona. Possible, but seems a little unlikely.

I think there is at least the possibility that this Dimitri character is someone who knows VV from Thailand and has chosen to latch on to him and troll him once he joined the RVF (which would explain why he used the avatar and some posts of someone who was at the time a little-known entity at the RVF).

@WWT, I don't think Dimitri is Victor Pride, he just likes to quote his articles (among others).

Post: #224

I might be wrong but I don't believe that Vincent is Dimitri. It looks like Dimitri copies and paste from RVF to add content and posts to that site. Also, Vincent's writing style seems very different from that of Dimitri. Dimitri also admitted to stealing avatars from other forums and Vincent was the victim of that.

Post: #225

(02-14-2014 11:17 AM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  @WWT, I don't think Dimitri is Victor Pride, he just likes to quote his articles (among others).

Could be Liz. Maybe it was the bro talk that made me see the similarities. At least we agreed the writing styles were pretty different to Vincent. I would imagine it would be hard to pull that off for any length of time.