Post: #76

(09-14-2013 03:05 PM)JimNortonFan Wrote:  I think Arnold and '80's action films had a lot to do with it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzVI6tRXCV4

Post: #77

Laughing at all the guys here trying to rationalize not building muscle.

You're lazy is all.

Post: #78

Guys, get back to earth here. If you have Bruce lee's body, your better than at least %90 of American men right there. %70 of americans are overweight, and %36 of them are obese. And from what I know, it's the brad pit in fight club body that is typically favored by women in scientific studies here in the USA. People judge celebrities different than people they interact with. Like neckbeards criticizing photoshopped models on the web, while they would be over the moon to get laid by a fat chick in real life.

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/overwt.htm

Post: #79

(09-15-2013 10:28 PM)malc Wrote:  Guys, get back to earth here. If you have Bruce lee's body, your better than at least %90 of American men right there. %70 of americans are overweight, and %36 of them are obese. And from what I know, it's the brad pit in fight club body that is typically favored by women in scientific studies here in the USA. People judge celebrities different than people they interact with. Like neckbeards criticizing photoshopped models on the web, while they would be over the moon to get laid by a fat chick in real life.

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/overwt.htm

Are guys still yapping about Brad Pitt in Fight Club?

Girls dig that body in part because a. it's a young Brad Pitt! and b. it's a hugely popular movie and his character is supposed to be everything Ed Norton's anonymous character wishes he could be, i.e. he's the ideal man.

His body is ideal because *he* (Brad Pitt or Tyler Durden) is ideal and because the fucking movie is.

Long story short - if you're a very good looking dude, then go for Brad Pitt's body in a movie from 1999.

Post: #80

Bruce Lee would not look big with a t shirt on. he would be considered small to girls. i would love to have his body but im starting to wonder if being fatter and appearing bigger with clothes on is better to girls than thin and cut up which cant really be seen under clothes. am i making sense?

Post: #81

(09-15-2013 10:37 PM)houston Wrote:  Bruce Lee would not look big with a t shirt on. he would be considered small to girls. i would love to have his body but im starting to wonder if being fatter and appearing bigger with clothes on is better to girls than thin and cut up which cant really be seen under clothes. am i making sense?

Yeah, you are making sense. It's a mistake just to show shirtless pics of guys flexing to girls and ask what their ideal is. Ok, but for picking up random chicks at coffee shops or bars what look works best?

And really, the question is this: all else being equal in terms of looks, height, and status, what is the best physical frame?

Hard to say! But it's going to be more muscular and less overweight than 90% of American men I would imagine.

Post: #82

(09-15-2013 10:37 PM)houston Wrote:  Bruce Lee would not look big with a t shirt on. he would be considered small to girls. i would love to have his body but im starting to wonder if being fatter and appearing bigger with clothes on is better to girls than thin and cut up which cant really be seen under clothes. am i making sense?

The solution isn't either of those options. It's to go to a tailor and make sure your clothes fit you properly.

Bruce Lee would destroy any body builder, athlete, or fighter today. Dude hit a kickbag so hard the sand exploded out the other end.

Post: #83

Im sure this show had something to do with it. At least for girls in their late teens early 20's



Based on my experiences of seeing some of my very swole friends in action, I dont think there is a problem in being too big as long as you're proportionate. So many guys have over developed chest and biceps and they look ridiculous. Also you cant expect to act like a meat head and pick up quality girls. If you're a d-bag, jersey shore wannabe then be prepared to hook up with snooki-like creatures. On the other hand if you are a well refined, sophisticated individual then it will be a huge advantage when gaming fine girls.

my personal goal is to get the Arlovski physique:


(guy on left)

we're about the same height but I would have to put on about 20 lbs of muscle and lose about 42 lbs of fat. Im still young though so i think its possible within 2-3 years.

Post: #84

(09-15-2013 11:06 PM)Jazzman92 Wrote:  we're about the same height but I would have to put on about 20 lbs of muscle and lose about 42 lbs of fat. Im still young though so i think its possible within 2-3 years.

Don't wait up. As jacked as he is, maybe 50% of that effect at best is visible if he wears anything other than a near skin-tight v-neck or henley on.

Guys who work out including myself, need to remember that even if you get better with picking up new chicks there's still the time and energy lost in the gym to consider. If you devoted most of that to getting new girls and used the remainder to just be in good shape, would you be much worse off?

Post: #85

(09-15-2013 10:43 PM)Therapsid Wrote:  what is the best physical frame?

This one:


Steve Reeves is the shit, and that is the physical look I think women desire the most.

I want to be built like him in 2-3 years.

Post: #86

(09-14-2013 06:36 PM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  

(09-14-2013 03:24 PM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  

Representing roughly the ideal physique for women. He is not a roid monster, but he is huge nonetheless.

I have literally never heard one girl mention Hemsworth. The teen girls all want his younger brother from the Hunger Games. The sexual heartthob who emerged from Thor for the 20-30 set seems to have been Tom Hiddleston, once again proving for me that bad boy status trumps the muscular white knight who will do anything for the women he loves.

The Hunger Games is a chick flick. Thor is a comic book turned into a movie. You can guess who has the larger fan base amongst women. Even still, girls love Chris Hemsworth.

Remove fame and stick those two dudes into a club, all things being equal, and see who does best. My money is easily on Chris Hemsworth. It doesn't matter if it is in Europe, Asia, South America or the US.

That scenario is flawed anyways because both brothers are very good looking men.

Many of these arguments are flawed because anytime someone on this forum brings up building muscle, guys like to scream "GIRLS DON'T LIKE BODYBUILDERS!", yet no one is trying to look like Jay Cutler here.

GSP has a great body, and as mentioned, he walks around at ~190lbs. He FIGHTS at 170, but he walks around about 20lbs heavier than that. You can find that in interviews. A man at 5"10', 190lbs at 10% bodyfat is pretty fucking big. That is a pretty ideal body in my mind. That is what I am shooting for.

If you don't think girls fucking DROOL over Chris Hemsoworth's body in that photo, then you are just running your male hamster on overdrive.

Do girls like Brad Pitt's body in Fight Club? Yes
Do girls like David Beckham's "soccer body"? Yes
Do girls like Chris Hemsworth's Thor body? Yes


As far as the Sean Sherk reference, that is just fucking stupid. Sherk looks like shit in that photo. He's all sucked up for weigh ins, meaning underfed and severely dehydrated. He's making a pose for the cameras that isn't attractive, and hes making a stupid "mean mug" face for the media as well.

Show them the Chris Hemsworth photo and see if 100% think he looks terrible. Not to mention, you shouldn't be listening to what women SAY they want in a man anyways.

What does a woman actually want? A millionaire with a huge cock, tons of status and power, a great/ripped body, tall, dark, handsome, alpha persona, man with beautiful women throwing themselves at him but that he doesn't fuck, etc.

I've never heard a woman say that is what she wants though, but we all know that is the truth.

Post: #87

(09-15-2013 11:13 PM)Therapsid Wrote:  Don't wait up. As jacked as he is, maybe 50% of that effect at best is visible if he wears anything other than a near skin-tight v-neck or henley on.

Guys who work out including myself, need to remember that even if you get better with picking up new chicks there's still the time and energy lost in the gym to consider. If you devoted most of that to getting new girls and used the remainder to just be in good shape, would you be much worse off?

This is a flawed argument.

It's like saying that 50% of the effect of being overweight/obese is visible in anything other than the attire you describe.

Sure, non revealing clothing covers things to a degree, however your frame is visible in other ways too - your profile/silhouette, and one of the biggest indicators that you do or don't look after yourself...your face/jaw-line.

Time and energy in the gym should never be considered as "lost". You're bettering your body, your mind (confidence) and your overall health.

As to the amount of mass you put on, well that should be about personal goals/preferences, not some unquantifiable female preference (and don’t forget, just because you have looks doesn’t mean you don’t need game).

As what most have said previously, if you’ve lowered your bf % so that you’ve got some good definition, you’re doing a lot better than the majority of the population.

Post: #88

(09-15-2013 11:40 PM)Windom Earle Wrote:  Time and energy in the gym should never be considered as "lost". You're bettering your body, your mind (confidence) and your overall health.

As to the amount of mass you put on, well that should be about personal goals/preferences, not some unquantifiable female preference (and don’t forget, just because you have looks doesn’t mean you don’t need game).

As what most have said previously, if you’ve lowered your bf % so that you’ve got some good definition, you’re doing a lot better than the majority of the population.

I disagree.

I think it's very possible - and increasingly common - for guys to reach the point where they work out so furiously that it is counterproductive.

I'm a religious guy. But unless you think there's a God ready to reward you for hours in the gym you should be suspicious.

Working out, as hard as it can be, is at least formulaic. Compared to picking up and banging new girls it's much more of a cook by numbers deal.

A man today can work out furiously, keep his body fat at low percentages, get good sleep, meditate, and eat well, and at the end of the day have just a few hours a week to do cold approaches... and lo and behold, can have shittier results than his flabbier and less disciplined peers.

Another issue which I see is with guys who work out so hard they feel a sense of entitlement and self-consciousness which doesn't do them much good.

Post: #89

(09-16-2013 12:01 AM)Therapsid Wrote:  

(09-15-2013 11:40 PM)Windom Earle Wrote:  Time and energy in the gym should never be considered as "lost". You're bettering your body, your mind (confidence) and your overall health.

As to the amount of mass you put on, well that should be about personal goals/preferences, not some unquantifiable female preference (and don’t forget, just because you have looks doesn’t mean you don’t need game).

As what most have said previously, if you’ve lowered your bf % so that you’ve got some good definition, you’re doing a lot better than the majority of the population.

I disagree.

I think it's very possible - and increasingly common - for guys to reach the point where they work out so furiously that it is counterproductive.

I'm a religious guy. But unless you think there's a God ready to reward you for hours in the gym you should be suspicious.

Working out, as hard as it can be, is at least formulaic. Compared to picking up and banging new girls it's much more of a cook by numbers deal.

A man today can work out furiously, keep his body fat at low percentages, get good sleep, meditate, and eat well, and at the end of the day have just a few hours a week to do cold approaches... and lo and behold, can have shittier results than his flabbier and less disciplined peers.

Another issue which I see is with guys who work out so hard they feel a sense of entitlement and self-consciousness which doesn't do them much good.

They spend 4.5 hours in the gym per week. Cook 2-3 meals per day.



I'm sure everyone can fit that into their schedule and still have enough time to cold approach. Not to mention, their cold approaches will go SIGNIFICANTLY better if they have a body like that.


Funny story to throw into this debate.

My Thai girlfriend has been telling me my muscles are getting too big, and she doesn't like big muscles. She thinks they are gross. I'm about 185-190lbs, so not huge, but decent sized after lifting heavy for 6 months solid.

You know who her favorite actor is that she thinks is super handsome?

Chris Hemsworth.....

Post: #90

Thinking of that in terms of opportunity cost is smart but unless you're doing a serious full time job and chasing ass 24/7, are pulling something like 200 new notches a year, and require no downtime (gym time is the best downtime), it's still worth it to think of the long haul, set aside three or four hours a week, and lift. Even a minimal input of one twenty minute session, four days per week, of just deadlift and military press will net body composition gains you can't get elsewhere. While acquiring strength is good, you don't have to train seriously hard -- anything over a 375# deadlift and a bodyweight military press is probably in the upper 90th percentile and needn't take more than a few months (years for the military press) of short workouts. Then you can "stagnate" and just work out to maintain that strength without being concerned to gain more, which will make your workouts easier.

Check out Pavel's Power to the People for more information on that kind of targeted approach -- Tim Ferriss also has an article on this exact subject, google 'tim ferriss pavel deadlift' and you'll find their collaborative effort. Pavel managed to pare down a training protocol for his seventy year old father and after a several months of training, his dad pulled 405# in a powerlifting competition raw and without gear.

Being stronger and having more muscle makes you age better and stay healthier longer, it can also increase your baseline testosterone and maintain your lean body mass (most people lose about one pound of muscle per year). What's good for your T-levels is good for your dick, and vice-versa.

Post: #91

It depends on where you live and the crowd you roll with. I'm 6' and at 178lbs right now. I've been up to 205lbs and when I walked in a gas station guys would literally get out of line so as to not have me behind them.

Part of that is because I tend to wear sleeveless shirts while doing errands during the day and I carry myself like I'm the baddest mofo physically. People sense the vibe and are wary.

Personally for me to stay at 200+ I have to eat a lot and do protein shakes etc. I can maintain 188lbs quite easily when I workout 4x a week and just eat 3x a day. My winter goal is 195lbs.

Personally I prefer being bigger but ironically I tend to pull a lot more when I'm lean and more 'natural'. Girls in LA, at least the model types tend to prefer the naturally athletic look. In Vegas it was ALL about being jacked. In the Midwest they preferred jacked as well.

To each their own, but never knock being muscular until you've been there. Having a strong physical presence is great, and I plan on getting back to that. Summers I always get leaner and the constant drinking doesn't help.

Post: #92

I'm about 145-160 lbs. and 5' 11"

Not jacked at all. I do lift some weights, but nothing crazy. I still get laid.

I'd like to be bigger, but it hasn't been the deciding factor for my bangs.

Where I am, fashion and having facial features tend to do well as far as looks go. I'm curious to see what happens if I get more muscular. I've always had more of a skinny kind of body, often with beer belly.

I'm doing it very slowly.. I've got a pair of 30 lbs. dumbbells that I keep out. Throughout the day I'll pick them up and do reps of like 20 or more on each arm. Chin-ups, pushups..

Post: #93

I dunno...a lot of players I know are really skinny. Being muscular has certainly helped me on several occasions but I think being in decent shape in general can be just as good.

Post: #94

(09-16-2013 12:01 AM)Therapsid Wrote:  

(09-15-2013 11:40 PM)Windom Earle Wrote:  Time and energy in the gym should never be considered as "lost". You're bettering your body, your mind (confidence) and your overall health.

As to the amount of mass you put on, well that should be about personal goals/preferences, not some unquantifiable female preference (and don’t forget, just because you have looks doesn’t mean you don’t need game).

As what most have said previously, if you’ve lowered your bf % so that you’ve got some good definition, you’re doing a lot better than the majority of the population.

I disagree.

I think it's very possible - and increasingly common - for guys to reach the point where they work out so furiously that it is counterproductive.

I'm a religious guy. But unless you think there's a God ready to reward you for hours in the gym you should be suspicious.

Working out, as hard as it can be, is at least formulaic. Compared to picking up and banging new girls it's much more of a cook by numbers deal.

A man today can work out furiously, keep his body fat at low percentages, get good sleep, meditate, and eat well, and at the end of the day have just a few hours a week to do cold approaches... and lo and behold, can have shittier results than his flabbier and less disciplined peers.

Another issue which I see is with guys who work out so hard they feel a sense of entitlement and self-consciousness which doesn't do them much good.

Let me get this straight...you're saying that guys should spend less time in the gym because God isn't going to reward it. They should instead focus on picking up and banging women.

Post: #95

I agree with the poster who spoke about male hamster, we are using a lot when it comes to muscle and the effect on lizards.

I have lived in 3 different countries as an adult (not visited but lived as a local) and I would say I am pretty observant of how people react to me.
I started of regular build not skinny but normal and then a few mates brimming with arrogance quite out of place for Brits convinced me to start hitting the iron.
So starting point was London, UK where they are not into all that bloated he-man shyt (overtly, anyway).

I always used to hear lizards say..oh I don't like men who are big, blah blah..they look like they can't move and they probably have little willies..the usual shyt lizards say to hinder a man from stepping up his game and opening up portals to a richer resource.

Like a dummy, I used to pay attention to what lizards would say before and how they would react (verbally) which means nothing since lizards use words as fleetingly as a dolphin plays in the ocean.

Anyway, me and my two mates started hitting the gym hard, free weights etc. After a few months, we noticed palpable differences on road. Gnarly dudes wouldn't be so quick to pop off and reptiles would gaze for longer and when we did swoop on the transfixed lizards, rewards would be much more fruitful. I am talking bangs.
One of my mates was 5'10 and about 170 pounds to start with. With attention to protein and going HAM in the gym..he got it up to about 190 or so of lean muscle. He had big forearms and a wide chest and we were in Camden Town one day, me and his missus and I could see both men and women gawking at that physique.

Without going into a whole heap of tales and so forth, every country that I have gone to, being swole helps to identify potential targets and facilitates closure, worldwide.

Forget using Jay Cutler and Ronnie as an example because you will NOT look like that without gear, End of story.

The Thor guy look is quite attainable. Forget talking about height. You cannot affect your height. But you can affect your muscular composition.

As MikeCF said, unless you have experienced before and after, then you are just hamstering right now.

I have experienced before and after both on myself and I have been with a friend who went from being a fat bastid to a carved cat and seen lizards who formerly only saw my friend as a friendly fellow to a sex partner and she told me this.

Post: #96

if you guys think thor isn't on the juice you're in denial

Post: #97

(09-16-2013 10:03 AM)reaper23 Wrote:  if you guys think thor isn't on the juice you're in denial

I am not sure it's that conclusive. You ever been around Dutch people, white South Africans, Germans or Danes? They have a naturally big frame. He has a big chest and flat stomach from the pics I see..is that automatically roids?

Post: #98

(09-16-2013 10:03 AM)reaper23 Wrote:  if you guys think thor isn't on the juice you're in denial

Thor is a nordic demi-god, why would he need juice?

Post: #99

its his quick progress from surfer skinny to completely jacked and shredded.

its been analyzed to death on the internetz

Post: #100

(09-15-2013 11:06 PM)Jazzman92 Wrote:  Im sure this show had something to do with it. At least for girls in their late teens early 20's



Based on my experiences of seeing some of my very swole friends in action, I dont think there is a problem in being too big as long as you're proportionate. So many guys have over developed chest and biceps and they look ridiculous. Also you cant expect to act like a meat head and pick up quality girls. If you're a d-bag, jersey shore wannabe then be prepared to hook up with snooki-like creatures. On the other hand if you are a well refined, sophisticated individual then it will be a huge advantage when gaming fine girls.

my personal goal is to get the Arlovski physique:


(guy on left)

we're about the same height but I would have to put on about 20 lbs of muscle and lose about 42 lbs of fat. Im still young though so i think its possible within 2-3 years.

Most girls I know thought Vinny "looked" the best. Almost all thought the situation looked old and gross, other guy was to short, and the rest were split on DJ Pauley-D.

But like other female ratings you take it with a grain of salt as the characters they portrayed played into it a lot. Vinny was more chill and nice so the girls "liked" that more openly.

Post the show which guy did MTV swoop as being more of a draw to its target market base of young girls 16-28?? Vinny has his own successful thing going, it's obvious the females perferd him. He lifted but nothing serious, just had some mass but was never cut, IMO women always perferd that look, or the lanky athletic look. Only men get wet over massive muscles hense why we have 4 pages trying to rationalize it.

And it is true. More men compliment me on my muscles then women - we never win chasing aesthetics. workout for your own goals, doing it soley to help you appeal to broads is a trap.