Post: #51

Samseau: Successful forums have existed before reputation systems. If this one can't survive without it then maybe it has run its course.

Quote:Without the rep system, this place isn't much different from reddit.

With this statement I really can't take any of your opinions on the forum seriously. Your opinions seem to be based on emotion.

Quote:I think we all know that the forum has lost quality in the last month

You are free to go use another forum instead of repeatedly bitching about it. Funny that this is coming from a member who is begging for data sheets (/thread-9637.html ). What have you done for the forum lately?

Post: #52

I finally finalized plans for the hall of fame. It will be implemented in the next couple of days.

Post: #53

(04-09-2012 10:55 AM)Roosh Wrote:  Samseau: Successful forums have existed before reputation systems. If this one can't survive without it then maybe it has run its course.

I only hope not.

Quote:

Quote:Without the rep system, this place isn't much different from reddit.

With this statement I really can't take any of your opinions on the forum seriously. Your opinions seem to be based on emotion.

I'm speaking solely in terms of principle: we're all just nameless faces on the internet now. The rep system gave us personalities and character, created by the other users on the forum.

Easily the most fun I've ever had on any forum.

Post: #54

(04-09-2012 11:00 AM)Roosh Wrote:  I finally finalized plans for the hall of fame. It will be implemented in the next couple of days.

This sounds like a great alternative to the rep system.

Post: #55

I still think a lot of us who have been here for a while know who we can trust, who we like to read, and who annoys us. I dont know about you, but I can still tell the difference between a good post and a bad post even though the points are gone. Weird but I am still slightly cognizant of the content of the post sans rep points.

Post: #56

I agree wit Samseau as well. The rep system was part of the member identity. If it wasn't in place before then it wouldn't matter but for the guys who spent a lot of time and effort here I can understand it bothering them.

I look at the who's online section alot because I'm curious about which threads guests are reading. It gives me insight on what people google search to find this place. You can see them viewing the rep of the members all the time. I guess when they read something they look to see who is this person. It's identity.

Another thing is when you meet someone from here. We were encouraged to leave our feedback in the rep.

So to an outsider or newb post can be easily confused. Some could have thousands of posts and know nothing but if you see in rep that this person has given out countless amounts of good intel on lets say Colombia as in Mixx's case you get a feel about how accurate it is.

Rep also keeps the senior members in the game here (competitive nature) Who gets ass and has knowledge? People with competitive nature.

Take the people who think rep should be brought back and the people who think it shouldn't and put them all at place where women are at. I guarantee you the guys who care would be the same ones pulling all the ass. They are also the ones most likely to get in fights with eachother.

I can see hanging out with Mixx and butting heads. I was looking forward to it.

I would think that people don't meet eachother on most forums. On this one being a highly repped member is like having the keys to the entire planet. Other guys all over the world are going to want to meet you in their home cities. I watch the guys that come here to make sure nothing happens to them not only because it's my nature but so one day someone in another strange place may do the same for me. Without the feedback on the rep it's hard to tell who's who for newbs

Post: #57

I agree that rep points were a part of identity and also provided incentive for writing. It was a part of competition and as men, competition is what drives us to new frontiers.

I wrote many of my data sheets with getting points in mind. When I travelled, the only reason I took notes while I was travelling was because I could imagine getting points. Human beings ARE motivated by INCENTIVES. Just posting for the overall good doesn't interest many people. Especially as most posters are from North America which is an incentive based continent and not one where people do things for the overall good.

It is evident that the forum quality has dropped substantially since the rep point system was removed. Sometimes, a member drops something beautiful and I want to give him a point but I can't and then no one else appreciates those points.

I used to browse members profiles randomly and read their point allocation. I would go and see what thread they posted that warrantied the point reward.

Upon reading these posts, I had new admiration for these posters.

With no points, I don't know who is who and the personality has gone.

In terms of the people whining that people were asking for points and padding points, one can always report such behaviour to the mods and let them be the arbitrator of that.

But I think the overall point system was great and that's what gave RVF its own personal clout.

Anyways, Roosh, you can monitor and see how the forum unfolds. If there is a feel that it is continuing to go south then perhaps you might experiment with bringing back the rep points system and seeing if things take a turn back for the north.

Since there are two mods now, y'all can look over any flaky rep points allocations or padding and act accordingly.

Post: #58

I hope the baking soda and I want to bang a Pregnant woman threads get in the hall of fame! hehe... Also I've asked about this before but there should be a system in place just in case Roosh dies so the forum doesn't shut down once the servers stop being paid.

Post: #59

Quote:Anyways, Roosh, you can monitor and see how the forum unfolds.

Yes. One month really is not enough time to tell what the impact was. Believe me I fully understand the arguments made for rep points.

Post: #60

(04-09-2012 11:16 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  I agree wit Samseau as well. The rep system was part of the member identity. If it wasn't in place before then it wouldn't matter but for the guys who spent a lot of time and effort here I can understand it bothering them.

I look at the who's online section alot because I'm curious about which threads guests are reading. It gives me insight on what people google search to find this place. You can see them viewing the rep of the members all the time. I guess when they read something they look to see who is this person. It's identity.

Another thing is when you meet someone from here. We were encouraged to leave our feedback in the rep.

So to an outsider or newb post can be easily confused. Some could have thousands of posts and know nothing but if you see in rep that this person has given out countless amounts of good intel on lets say Colombia as in Mixx's case you get a feel about how accurate it is.

Rep also keeps the senior members in the game here (competitive nature) Who gets ass and has knowledge? People with competitive nature.

Take the people who think rep should be brought back and the people who think it shouldn't and put them all at place where women are at. I guarantee you the guys who care would be the same ones pulling all the ass. They are also the ones most likely to get in fights with eachother.

I can see hanging out with Mixx and butting heads. I was looking forward to it.

I would think that people don't meet eachother on most forums. On this one being a highly repped member is like having the keys to the entire planet. Other guys all over the world are going to want to meet you in their home cities. I watch the guys that come here to make sure nothing happens to them not only because it's my nature but so one day someone in another strange place may do the same for me. Without the feedback on the rep it's hard to tell who's who for newbs

Damn. I didn't see the rep system being taken away as a big deal.. after that though.

That was the best argument either for/against that I've read.

Post: #61

I was a fan of the rep point system and hope that they do come back eventually, but until then I`ll keep posting, I also think that a hall of fame section is a great idea.

Post: #62

(04-09-2012 12:11 PM)scotian Wrote:  I was a fan of the rep point system and hope that they do come back eventually, but until then I`ll keep posting, I also think that a hall of fame section is a great idea.

Case and point right here. Scotian you were new here and found out that you were right down the road from me. Did you look at my rep before you came out?

He was in an area where shit can go south real fast if you don't know what you're doing and probably would have stayed put.

Post: #63

(04-09-2012 12:05 PM)rozayINTL Wrote:  

(04-09-2012 11:16 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  I agree wit Samseau as well. The rep system was part of the member identity. If it wasn't in place before then it wouldn't matter but for the guys who spent a lot of time and effort here I can understand it bothering them.

I look at the who's online section alot because I'm curious about which threads guests are reading. It gives me insight on what people google search to find this place. You can see them viewing the rep of the members all the time. I guess when they read something they look to see who is this person. It's identity.

Another thing is when you meet someone from here. We were encouraged to leave our feedback in the rep.

So to an outsider or newb post can be easily confused. Some could have thousands of posts and know nothing but if you see in rep that this person has given out countless amounts of good intel on lets say Colombia as in Mixx's case you get a feel about how accurate it is.

Rep also keeps the senior members in the game here (competitive nature) Who gets ass and has knowledge? People with competitive nature.

Take the people who think rep should be brought back and the people who think it shouldn't and put them all at place where women are at. I guarantee you the guys who care would be the same ones pulling all the ass. They are also the ones most likely to get in fights with eachother.

I can see hanging out with Mixx and butting heads. I was looking forward to it.

I would think that people don't meet eachother on most forums. On this one being a highly repped member is like having the keys to the entire planet. Other guys all over the world are going to want to meet you in their home cities. I watch the guys that come here to make sure nothing happens to them not only because it's my nature but so one day someone in another strange place may do the same for me. Without the feedback on the rep it's hard to tell who's who for newbs

Damn. I didn't see the rep system being taken away as a big deal.. after that though.

That was the best argument either for/against that I've read.

Agreed 100%. I feel our identities have been stripped away. It's bad enough that the feminist and socialist are stripping us, and now Roosh has taken the last thing we had for men to be men. Our last stronghold has fallen.

Post: #64

Let me use my august wisdom to weigh in on the matter: rep points?....who gives a shite? no rep points?.....who gives a shite?

Post: #65

(04-09-2012 11:16 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  So to an outsider or newb post can be easily confused. Some could have thousands of posts and know nothing but if you see in rep that this person has given out countless amounts of good intel on lets say Colombia as in Mixx's case you get a feel about how accurate it is.

Rep also keeps the senior members in the game here (competitive nature) Who gets ass and has knowledge? People with competitive nature.

Without the feedback on the rep it's hard to tell who's who for newbs

Great post.
1) I have to say that as a new member, the rep system quickly pointed me to quality. This greatly enhanced the value of the forum for me in a very short time. I can't stress how helpful the feature was for me.

2) As for the "governance" model of the forum, the rep system helped me to "defer" to senior members and those with respected work. I don't do deference very well, but I understand that respect to senior members has to be extended for this site to work. Otherwise its a locker room free for all full of arrogant @ss dudes like me. Perhaps its the absence of some members, but I have noticed a decline in quality. Having the rep system highlighting senior members kept people in check and helped regulate posting- it dictated that what you posted better be quality and not a whim.

(04-09-2012 11:36 AM)Moma Wrote:  I agree that rep points were a part of identity and also provided incentive for writing. It was a part of competition and as men, competition is what drives us to new frontiers.

I wrote many of my data sheets with getting points in mind. When I travelled, the only reason I took notes while I was travelling was because I could imagine getting points. Human beings ARE motivated by INCENTIVES.

Yup. I'm very well-traveled and think I have skillz. But joining the forum I was eager to see how my ideas stacked up against a bunch of obviously proven studs. I was afraid to come soft against people here so I spent extra time editing my sheets and refining ideas. Competition works, and in my case drove me to go extra.

I think the rep system created an ideal triangulation between 1) keeping that competitive edge, 2) facilitating quality, and 3) supporting Roosh's admirable ideal of the forum open to all.

Post: #66

(04-09-2012 11:16 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  .......Rep also keeps the senior members in the game here (competitive nature) Who gets ass and has knowledge? People with competitive nature.

Simple answer: People that are driven. Mad men. Compelled men. People that will do that shit regardless of incentive/no incentive structure. People with intensity. Those are the most dangerous opponent, either on the football field or the math classroom or slaying pussy. People that are in it for "the love of the game", not some silly rep points. People like that stay hungry regardless of whether there is competition or no competition. They are possessed.

(04-09-2012 11:16 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  ....Take the people who think rep should be brought back and the people who think it shouldn't and put them all at place where women are at. I guarantee you the guys who care would be the same ones pulling all the ass.

Hahahaha. this is just silly. From my experience, people that into something for the LOVE OF THE GAME are usually more deadly than people that are in it for some artificial incentive. Take any field: sports, academics, soldiering, making money in the financial markets; the person that kicks everybody arse are usually in it for the love of the game. You will look at them and say "what keeps you going after all these accomplishment?" they dont really have a good answer except that they "just love what they do and wants to keep doing it to the best of their abilities". There is something in their gut that has taken hold of them and wont let go. It is not about some silly rep points. A person who loves to just play football(soccer) or rugby because they see it as their life are generally fucking better than some wanker who wants to play soccer because he wants to be famous or get girls or whatever incentive he is chasing.

So, to answer your question, el mechanico, my MONEY WILL BE ON THE PERSON THAT does it for the love of the game rather than some silly rep points.

(04-09-2012 11:16 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  .....They are also the ones most likely to get in fights with eachother.
.......

Well, girls will be girls.....

(04-09-2012 11:16 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  I can see hanging out with Mixx and butting heads. I was looking forward to it.
.......

I guess that is you....i am new here...came in february...i sincerely do not see myself spending time in reallife with anybody on this forum...but then, that is just me.

Post: #67

There are good points both for and against the rep system.

One thing to remember is it was removed for a reason. ie; Certain guys thinking they were god because of their high rep score, belittling others that did not agree with some statement they had made while holding up their rep as proof they were better than others. (That's what I remember as the impetus for it's removal. May be off base...)

Sure, a high rep generally shows a poster knows what he's talking about, but it became a dick waving contest to some which served to create issues in the forum.

Post: #68

(04-09-2012 11:36 AM)Moma Wrote:  I agree that rep points were a part of identity and also provided incentive for writing. It was a part of competition and as men, competition is what drives us to new frontiers.

I wrote many of my data sheets with getting points in mind. When I travelled, the only reason I took notes while I was travelling was because I could imagine getting points. Human beings ARE motivated by INCENTIVES.

I guess that is you.

Take your jtf2 or your special forces or your SAS or your navy seals or your delta or your SOG/SAG.

these are the ELITE OF THE ELITE.

You think they join up and serve because of money? because of fame? because of medals? because of......rep points????

They are natural born killers. first class predators. this is who they are. they are in it because they love these shite. they are in it for the love of the game. they are the most driven element in the military. what is their incentives? rep points? bragging rights? money? fame? hahahaha. none of the above. Simple answer: for the love of the game.

Find the best in anything: it could be music, sports, physics, art, seducing women, etc. and try and find their motivation....it certainly wont be some silly incentive.

they will do these shite even if you dont pay them.

I understand the arguments for rep points, but it is ridiculous trying to stretch it to (a) the concept of identity (b)people who likes rep point will get more women © people who likes rep point will get into more fights(insinuating some silly alpha shite) (d)people who like rep points are this or that is nonsensical.

I guess it boils down to
(a) people who do what they do because they just fucking love it
(b)people who do it because they love it but rep points provides extra motivation for them
©people who are mainly motivated by rep points.

Post: #69

I think having a hall of fame will help members with finding the best quality posts, it will be interesting to see how Roosh sets it up.

I don't have a big say in the rep system debacle since I am probably the biggest newbie here but I never saw anyone complaining about having a rep system when we did have it, and now with not having it has caused a big rift in the forum I think that it would be good to have it back BUT with a full time rep moderator like Neil Skywalker said.

Post: #70

Entropy. Navy seals get medals, rank and money. We only get rep points. Don't tell me they don't except those things for what they do.

As for meeting the guys here. I'm more than happy to show my skillz off in person even to the Indian troll if he wanted to come down. Navy seals cannot show their skills to random people. Apples to apples please.

Post: #71

(04-09-2012 03:04 AM)Neil Skywalker Wrote:  The rep system has some flaws though.
This is part of what i said in the other rep point thread and i haven't changed my mind on it: The first 6 points were made by Gmanifesto and all of those should be avoided should the rep system return.

1. Guys excoriating other guys for not having sufficient rep to be making certain claims.

2. Guys openly and repeatedly complaining that, despite all their contributions, they aren't getting enough rep. They would then get a couple of courtesy points.

3. Guys giving rep just for the sake of rounding off a member to the next major digit (saw three examples of this).

4. Guys publicly asking for rep in exchange for information. "If you give me a rep point, I'll tell you."

5. I had a guy PM-ing me immediately after giving me a rep point asking me to give him one in return.

6. Guys using rep as a way to retort to disagreements. "When you have this much rep you can X."

For the record, I made those six points.

Post: #72

I get what entropy is saying. I feel the same way.

I'm not on here for any sort of internet cock measuring through my virtual points. I don't care about that.

I'm on here because it's an awesome forum with awesome people. I enjoy participating here, that is my incentive. My own enjoyment.

I'm not gona hold back any info just because I won't get my special points. That's childish.

Post: #73

Question -- if you click on someone's profile and click "Add to ignore list" don't they just disappear from your viewing of threads?

Isn't that a fine way to just dump anyone you tend to disagree with?

Post: #74

(04-09-2012 03:15 PM)Tuthmosis Wrote:  

(04-09-2012 03:04 AM)Neil Skywalker Wrote:  The rep system has some flaws though.
This is part of what i said in the other rep point thread and i haven't changed my mind on it: The first 6 points were made by Gmanifesto and all of those should be avoided should the rep system return.

1. Guys excoriating other guys for not having sufficient rep to be making certain claims.

2. Guys openly and repeatedly complaining that, despite all their contributions, they aren't getting enough rep. They would then get a couple of courtesy points.

3. Guys giving rep just for the sake of rounding off a member to the next major digit (saw three examples of this).

4. Guys publicly asking for rep in exchange for information. "If you give me a rep point, I'll tell you."

5. I had a guy PM-ing me immediately after giving me a rep point asking me to give him one in return.

6. Guys using rep as a way to retort to disagreements. "When you have this much rep you can X."

For the record, I made those six points.

@Tuth, your right, i must have quoted them after G replied you. my bad !



@entropy , i think that El Mech and Moma are making good valid points here and you are trying to talk the talk about " the love of the game, elite, national born killers and a lot more crap about them being childish and silly but they are good solid contributors here.

Lets see what valuable gaming lessons Entropy can teach us with his "love for the game" :

A thread about literature and philosophy aka "Look mommy, i can copy/paste lists of boring books" : /thread-10583.html

A thread about science and technology aka i can copy/past medical fancy articles too: /thread-10584.html

Things i will never own myself and fantasize about thread: /thread-10565.html

Lets looks for betas in the news because i have nothing better to do thread : /thread-10585.html

and last and least : The ever interesting financial trading thread , really helpful with opening girls and sealing the deal : /thread-10585.html

Your love for the game surely teaches us a lot about getting girls in exotic countries, something this forum is about.

In all your threads you are either posting copy pasted articles by others and long boring lists OR doing all the posting yourself. I know some one her also called you out on all those financial graphs and you copy pasted that too from others.
Sort of copy/paste troll so to speak.
Stop degrading others and start posting some real datasheets or game threads.

Post: #75

(04-09-2012 01:32 PM)Entropy Wrote:  

(04-09-2012 11:16 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  .......Rep also keeps the senior members in the game here (competitive nature) Who gets ass and has knowledge? People with competitive nature.

Simple answer: People that are driven. Mad men. Compelled men. People that will do that shit regardless of incentive/no incentive structure. People with intensity. Those are the most dangerous opponent, either on the football field or the math classroom or slaying pussy. People that are in it for "the love of the game", not some silly rep points. People like that stay hungry regardless of whether there is competition or no competition. They are possessed.

Love of the game my ass. Athletes say that for PR reasons. Strip away their humongous salaries, the women they get, the fame, the awards, and everything else that comes with being a pro athlete and let's see how many of those football players still play.

Saying that some men do shit for the sake of it is being deluded. From soldiers, to investors, to athletes, to CEOs, to artists, to book authors - everyone does what they do because of inherent incentives present in their respective fields.

And anyway I'm not going to comment on the whole rep. thing. It's a waste. Roosh has his mind set on it and would rather drive the forum to the ground than admit that what he did was a mistake.

Quote:they will do these shite even if you dont pay them.

Nice try but just doing it is way different from putting in 100%.

Heck, many elite players get pissy as hell if the coaches aren't giving them special treatment. Plenty of examples in the NBA where the player's opinions led to the coach being fired... So much for "for the love of the game".