Post: #26

Depends on what you want out of life...

From a legal standpoint, marriage really makes no sense except for the tax breaks, and ability to shield your assets in many states. (i.e., your creditors can't come after your house if it's jointly owned). On the flip side, there is always a chance you'll wake up one morning and find your kids gone, your furniture gone, and your wife gone (with all the money in the joint bank account) because she wanted to "find herself" with the pool boy.

Personally, I haven't found there to be much of a bias against my "Peter Pan" lifestyle. A lot of guys will talk to me in secret and be like "Dude, if I could do it again, I'd do what you're doing and just stay single, date, make money, fuck around, and travel." I don't get invited to "playdates", and I don't really know what people with kids do in their spare time, other than stay in and bitch about money. (Just last night one of my buddies wanted me to stay over, drink whiskey, and watch superhero movies. Dude is in his 50s. Wife put the kibosh on it and he was sort of pissed. Sometimes dudes just need male companionship.)

If you're the type of person who wants to co-habitate a house, have kids, or build a life with someone, you can still have a "companion" without getting married.

Again, it all depends. Personally, I'd rather just keep doing what I'm doing.

Post: #27

(10-28-2017 07:22 AM)Thought Criminal Wrote:  Sexless marriages (or LTRs) if you win. Divorce and Family Court if you lose. Why play this game?
Game is a necessary evil when you are single - those are the minor leagues. Marriage is the big leagues where the stakes are far higher. If you can’t master game when you are single (think of it as training wheels), then you will be destroyed in marriage.

I've been married twice. Once before I learned game and once after. If you adapt single game into relationship game... then you literally never have to worry about this sexless marriage situation. If a guy complains about a sexless marriage then it's because he is a beta bitch boy. I was like that the first marriage. My x/wife tried to tell me that I was too passive but I was too blue pill to get it.

Kids are worth marriage. That's the truth. I've had to pass up on a lot of pussy to have children... I don't often regret it.

The biggest issue with marriage is sexual boredom. Maybe this isn't a thing for other guys, but for me it's a struggle. No matter how hot the woman... I will eventually get tired of banging her. Luckily for me this is why business travel was invented.

Post: #28

I'd rather get married, but ONLY if it's reasonable to expect a good marriage. Being single has huge perks. Both probably end with some moments where you wish you'd made the other choice. In the end, I'll choose being single if things don't improve.

Post: #29

(10-29-2017 09:54 AM)Investment Bro Wrote:  You don't practice monogamy (don't get legally married) and have a range of women that meet different needs for you?

Women are beautiful and wonderful. Spending time with them can be both beautiful and wonderful. But no woman will make you feel like that forever, which is why so many people get divorced.

Picture this:

You've got your main girl who you really love. Another plate who you like a lot and can do things you like with her, and another plate you think is hot and can have wild sex with. No one woman will be all 3 of these things for you, so why not have 3 who's sum value is everything you want?

Why not? At least while she's in her 20's, I don't see why not.

Once she's in her 40's, 50's, then I can see your case, and then it just depends on the arrangements you two have made for that eventuality, for example, "do it, but I don't want to know about it," or "absolutely not, we don't need the drama, possible pregnancy that would take from the inheritance of the children of this family, and possible STD's that would result from that course of action," or "as long as you don't love her," etc.

It just depends on what you and your wife are willing to agree to and risk, or if you're willing to ignore your wife/main girl and deal with the consequences of going against her wishes if she's opposed.

What I find surprising is the amount of guys that are delusional and think they can get away with banging other women on the side without the wife knowing, or alternatively, thinking they can get away with banging women on the side and the wife knowing and there will be no repercussions and she'll still love them 100%. I see it a lot, "it's all about setting the rules," then you see the relationship they have and it's actually the girl in charge, not the guy, the guy's just a living dildo on tap for the girl, and he's just a plate she's spinning.

Engaging in this stuff without a girl that's onboard is a recipe for disaster, and it's rare for girls to be onboard with this. Even if she is onboard, which is possible especially in more patriarchal countries if your value is high enough, there will still be repercussions, however small.

There's no free rides, man, this stuff has a cost, and ultimately it's up to you to determine if the cost is worth the benefit, just don't fool yourself into thinking there's no cost.

Post: #30

Isn't marrying a lass you like and who likes you without tomfooling on the side,dealing with whatever conflicts will inevitably arise, making kids and live to an old age together also possible???

Post: #31

(10-29-2017 12:22 PM)Elster Wrote:  Isn't marrying a lass you like and who likes you without tomfooling on the side,dealing with whatever conflicts will inevitably arise, making kids and live to an old age together also possible???

Possible? Yes. Likely? No. Nobody should get married unless they feel what they'll get out of in the short-term is worth it ending in a costly and emotionally traumatic divorce. The defintion of blue-pill is assuming a woman's love and commitment can last forever. Marriages and rings and kids and even prenups are not really enough to check hypergamy.

Post: #32

(10-29-2017 12:22 PM)Elster Wrote:  Isn't marrying a lass you like and who likes you without tomfooling on the side,dealing with whatever conflicts will inevitably arise, making kids and live to an old age together also possible???

In the right social circle, that's probably going to be the outcome. Well, except the liking each other part is less likely. Most lasting marriage I've seen result in the wife treating her husband poorly. That's why I hesitate with the idea of marriage. Getting a woman to sick around isn't that hard if you're devoutly religious. Being respected by her long term is the hard part.

Post: #33

(10-29-2017 07:29 AM)not_dead_yet Wrote:  I think I'm going to change my signature line so I don't have to keep posting this over and over again:

Go with a religious marriage ceremony, if you like. Do not get legally married or live in a jurisdiction with common-law marriage. If you must get married, consult an attorney in your jurisdiction for a pre-nup and divorce-proofing your assets.

Sadly, they are onto that escape clause.

In Australia there is a "de facto" legal loop that lets the family court system designate you "married" if you act like man and wife (ie have sex, hang out in a LTR) EVEN if you don't live with a woman, she can still get all your stuff in court.

Post: #34

(10-29-2017 12:22 PM)Elster Wrote:  Isn't marrying a lass you like and who likes you without tomfooling on the side,dealing with whatever conflicts will inevitably arise, making kids and live to an old age together also possible???

Yes, but its most likely that I fucked myself up long term by banging every girl I could, to such an extent that my mind almost needs new women.

In the same vein that women have been lead astray by feminism, men like me were right there, every step of the way, to help them fulfill their fantasy.

Post: #35

I've been helping out an old boss recently, on my weekends, who runs a high end catering company, as she's had her chef and her main front of house guy move back to their home countries within weeks of each other without much warning. She is a phenomenal cook - one of the best I've ever come across - and I've been fortunate enough to eat in some spectacular restaurants. Working in the kitchen under her still rates as one of the best investments in my future happiness that I have ever made. She was very kind to me when I was at university, and gave me the chance to work for her (and paid me very well when she didn't have to), so I've been happy to help her out.

I've been out of that world for a long time now, and it's been fascinating to be back in now I'm older. After I finished in the kitchen last night, I joined the late-shift at the bar at a very glamorous party for some girl's 40th. There was a blonde woman there, 40ish, single, never married, who had obviously been very beautiful when she was younger. Of course, she was no longer very beautiful, but she'd clung to all the fragments of that beauty as best she could. I was struck by how sad her situation was and it was quite a thing to see one of nature's rarest and most powerful creations brought so low. She seemed only too aware of the crushing awfulness of her situation, there in a room full of couples with young children. She didn't try to dull the experience with drink, or hide from her reality. She did spend the entire night scanning the room for eligible men, of which there were none (all the men there had bagged themselves formerly hot wives and proceeded to let themselves go rapidly), and then left as early as she could when she realised that another barren night had passed.

Most of the couples at this party were the same age, roughly. Of course, even the MILF-y women, plenty of former 8s, could not begin to compare to the young, wholesome and plain (18-20s) waitresses, none of whom was any better than a six. The thought of being shackled to anything so old and tired looking, at the relatively spritely age of 40, filled me with horror.

The other relevant fact, that made for an interesting dynamic, was that the man in question - a very wealthy gentleman farmer with a substantial estate and all the trappings - had married a working class village girl (a formerly very pretty one). This was clearly, for all their shared experience (kids, home, etc), still an insurmountable divide. The husband was in a foul mood all evening, as his wife's friends descended on his home and brought a world that was alien and unpleasant to him right through his back door. He was clearly in agony, each moment excruciating as he watched her friends and family drink his booze - one guest thought Chateau Lafite was a type of fancy wellington boot. I thought this was instructive for anyone looking for a happy life, and particularly a happy married life, since class was all that divided them (the girl was from the same area, appeared sweet and decent enough). The husband spent every moment looking as though no amount of sexual depravity, amassed over years with the blacksmith's pretty daughter, would ever make a single second of last night worth it.

The friends too kept themselves very much to themselves along social lines, one's own being easy to recognise for each group. It made for a fractured, and not terribly jolly evening, despite the best efforts of the nymphomaniacal young budding pop star leading the band to get everyone twerking in unison. It was instructive to see how such a seemingly archaic divide - social class - which the heart so easily overcomes when the passions are in the driving seat, can be a thorn that festers, and niggles, and can consign a man to a way of life that will be constantly grating and modestly unpleasant to him for the rest of his days.

Post: #36

If you're in a sexless marriage you ain't doing it right.

The game never stops.

Post: #37

(10-29-2017 12:06 PM)Spaniard88 Wrote:  

(10-29-2017 09:54 AM)Investment Bro Wrote:  You don't practice monogamy (don't get legally married) and have a range of women that meet different needs for you?

Women are beautiful and wonderful. Spending time with them can be both beautiful and wonderful. But no woman will make you feel like that forever, which is why so many people get divorced.

Picture this:

You've got your main girl who you really love. Another plate who you like a lot and can do things you like with her, and another plate you think is hot and can have wild sex with. No one woman will be all 3 of these things for you, so why not have 3 who's sum value is everything you want?

Why not? At least while she's in her 20's, I don't see why not.

Once she's in her 40's, 50's, then I can see your case, and then it just depends on the arrangements you two have made for that eventuality, for example, "do it, but I don't want to know about it," or "absolutely not, we don't need the drama, possible pregnancy that would take from the inheritance of the children of this family, and possible STD's that would result from that course of action," or "as long as you don't love her," etc.

It just depends on what you and your wife are willing to agree to and risk, or if you're willing to ignore your wife/main girl and deal with the consequences of going against her wishes if she's opposed.

What I find surprising is the amount of guys that are delusional and think they can get away with banging other women on the side without the wife knowing, or alternatively, thinking they can get away with banging women on the side and the wife knowing and there will be no repercussions and she'll still love them 100%. I see it a lot, "it's all about setting the rules," then you see the relationship they have and it's actually the girl in charge, not the guy, the guy's just a living dildo on tap for the girl, and he's just a plate she's spinning.

Engaging in this stuff without a girl that's onboard is a recipe for disaster, and it's rare for girls to be onboard with this. Even if she is onboard, which is possible especially in more patriarchal countries if your value is high enough, there will still be repercussions, however small.

There's no free rides, man, this stuff has a cost, and ultimately it's up to you to determine if the cost is worth the benefit, just don't fool yourself into thinking there's no cost.

Yes, I agree that there is a cost. That's 100% true, and the cost is realizing that once you start living this type of lifestyle it's almost impossible to go back. I don't think I will ever be able to live a "traditional" marriage after having experienced what I have. That's definitely a cost, but it's one I'm prepared to live with.

That said, I'm in my 20's right now, and you'd be surprised how many women this age are down for the sort of thing I'm describing. Yes, I know that the women I am with right now will fall off the wagon at some point and I need to replace them, but these women are simply a compliment to my life, and they are always replaceable. So far, I haven't found a woman who meets all of my needs, and if I did, I would be highly suspicious, because you know how women love to act.

Post: #38

(10-29-2017 03:03 PM)Laner Wrote:  ...its most likely that I fucked myself up long term by banging every girl I could, to such an extent that my mind almost needs new women.

In the same vein that women have been lead astray by feminism, men like me were right there, every step of the way, to help them fulfill their fantasy.

Quote:Posted by Investment Bro - Today 04:50 PM
Yes, I agree that there is a cost. That's 100% true, and the cost is realizing that once you start living this type of lifestyle it's almost impossible to go back. I don't think I will ever be able to live a "traditional" marriage after having experienced what I have. That's definitely a cost, but it's one I'm prepared to live with.

This is one of the reasons I'm refraining from sex until marriage. If I get married, then I want the best odds, and most enjoyment from it. Although it's great to learn from the wisdom and experience of those who game.

Post: #39

(10-29-2017 06:31 PM)Laska Wrote:  

(10-29-2017 03:03 PM)Laner Wrote:  ...its most likely that I fucked myself up long term by banging every girl I could, to such an extent that my mind almost needs new women.

In the same vein that women have been lead astray by feminism, men like me were right there, every step of the way, to help them fulfill their fantasy.

Quote:Posted by Investment Bro - Today 04:50 PM
Yes, I agree that there is a cost. That's 100% true, and the cost is realizing that once you start living this type of lifestyle it's almost impossible to go back. I don't think I will ever be able to live a "traditional" marriage after having experienced what I have. That's definitely a cost, but it's one I'm prepared to live with.

This is one of the reasons I'm refraining from sex until marriage. If I get married, then I want the best odds, and most enjoyment from it. Although it's great to learn from the wisdom and experience of those who game.

What the? Are you being serious?

Post: #40

(10-29-2017 06:31 PM)Laska Wrote:  

(10-29-2017 03:03 PM)Laner Wrote:  ...its most likely that I fucked myself up long term by banging every girl I could, to such an extent that my mind almost needs new women.

In the same vein that women have been lead astray by feminism, men like me were right there, every step of the way, to help them fulfill their fantasy.

Quote:Posted by Investment Bro - Today 04:50 PM
Yes, I agree that there is a cost. That's 100% true, and the cost is realizing that once you start living this type of lifestyle it's almost impossible to go back. I don't think I will ever be able to live a "traditional" marriage after having experienced what I have. That's definitely a cost, but it's one I'm prepared to live with.

This is one of the reasons I'm refraining from sex until marriage. If I get married, then I want the best odds, and most enjoyment from it. Although it's great to learn from the wisdom and experience of those who game.

I think most will agree with you that they want the best odds and most enjoyment, if married.

But refraining from sex until marriage doesn't really correlate with best odds/most enjoyment, and will not help you in any way IMO.

Post: #41

(10-29-2017 06:31 PM)Laska Wrote:  

(10-29-2017 03:03 PM)Laner Wrote:  ...its most likely that I fucked myself up long term by banging every girl I could, to such an extent that my mind almost needs new women.

In the same vein that women have been lead astray by feminism, men like me were right there, every step of the way, to help them fulfill their fantasy.

Quote:Posted by Investment Bro - Today 04:50 PM
Yes, I agree that there is a cost. That's 100% true, and the cost is realizing that once you start living this type of lifestyle it's almost impossible to go back. I don't think I will ever be able to live a "traditional" marriage after having experienced what I have. That's definitely a cost, but it's one I'm prepared to live with.

This is one of the reasons I'm refraining from sex until marriage. If I get married, then I want the best odds, and most enjoyment from it. Although it's great to learn from the wisdom and experience of those who game.

C'mon man! Don't do that to yourself! Sex is one of the baseline needs for happiness! It's right up there with food, water, and shelter on Maslow's pyramid. You owe it to yourself to experience the fullness of many different women, especially before you get married. What if you find out you're not sexually compatible with your wife? You think she's going to stay with you?

There's nothing wrong with wanting to get married or wanting to make it work, but if you want to be fair to your future wife, you need to make sure you know exactly what you're looking for ahead of time, so you're not spinning your wheels and wasting some poor girl's time and fertility. Having sex with women beforehand is a great way to start.

Post: #42

Yes I'm serious. The idea of premarital sex being acceptable is less than sixty years old in our society, so look at the resulting divorce and birth rates. It leads to better odds of success and sexual satisfaction in marriage: https://www.webmd.com/sex-relationships/...l-marriage

I don't look down on others for following the instincts that all of us have, but I have a fairly low sex drive and enough self control for this level of temperance. Actually, I'm almost perfectly celibate, and have been for a couple of years.

Post: #43

(10-29-2017 04:37 AM)N°6 Wrote:  

(10-28-2017 08:28 AM)Cumlluminates Wrote:  I think more and more guys are holding off on marriage and maybe even indefinitely.

The question is whether there is a "marriage strike" or if many men have simply been disqualified as potential suitors.

MGTOW and the libertine PUAs would like to believe that men are beginning to form a relationship cartel in response to women's sex cartel granting sex to anyone apart from would-be husbands. A successful player after all is a man who has broken the cartel and got the goods without paying the tariffs - but only a few years in PUA reveals that the women he is meeting are on the cock carousel anyway - not because of the $100s he has spent on DVDs, books etc.

Saying there is a marriage strike might be like a trade union saying that its members have collectively withdrawn its labour from industry when those who control the means of (re)production have found cheaper, less skilled, migratory, seasonal or automated Chad Thundercocks "hire and fire" labour to allocate sexual capital to when the need arises.

I think a debt-based, anti-wealth generating economic system that we have in the West simply makes men and women unattractive to each other.

This times 100x. A lot of guys think that men have something to do with the dating climate today, when the impact men have is almost entirely insignificant.

If women want to have families and babies, then they will get them. It's that simple. Between WW1 and WW2 somewhere around 10-35% of men of all European countries were murdered, and yet birthrates remained high and population continued to increase. Didn't matter that there was a massive man shortage. Women still had families and babies.

On top of that, the highest birthrates in the world today occur in shit poor countries where people crawl around in dirt. Women are popping out 4-8 kids a whack in these places despite living like it's the bronze-age.

Meanwhile, in our "advanced" first-world nations, where money and men are plentiful, somewhere close to 50% of women aren't having children and around 40% of those who do have kids are welfare moms. White birthrates are negative, despite the women having more than virtually any other women on earth or history, and people want to blame the men?

If women want to have children and families, they will have them and few things can stop them from doing so. Therefore the only possible explanation today is that women do not want to have children and families.

Post: #44

I read in Aristotle's Ethics that you don't get real and lasting satisfaction from pursuing pleasure for its own sake. This lined up with with my experience, and seems to apply to sex outside of marriage. So, after thinking about it for a long time, I made this conclusion and have stuck with it. Of course, since I want sex, I'm VERY open to being persuaded.

Post: #45

(10-29-2017 09:12 PM)Laska Wrote:  Yes I'm serious. The idea of premarital sex being acceptable is less than sixty years old in our society, so look at the resulting divorce and birth rates. It leads to better odds of success and sexual satisfaction in marriage: https://www.webmd.com/sex-relationships/...l-marriage

I don't look down on others for following the instincts that all of us have, but I have a fairly low sex drive and enough self control for this level of temperance. Actually, I'm almost perfectly celibate, and have been for a couple of years.

How old are you? Have you had your T-level checked? I respect your choice to remain celibate, but let's make sure you're healthy even if it makes it tougher to guard your virtue!

Post: #46

Early 20's, my T-level is almost 900. Edit: I've had hormone imbalances in the past. It's something worth checking up on.

Post: #47

(10-29-2017 09:20 PM)Laska Wrote:  I read in Aristotle's Ethics that you don't get real and lasting satisfaction from pursuing pleasure for its own sake. This lined up with with my experience, and seems to apply to sex outside of marriage. So, after thinking about it for a long time, I made this conclusion and have stuck with it. Of course, since I want sex, I'm VERY open to being persuaded.

My take on Christ and Paul's teachings applied to today's world is not to have sex with a woman you don't think you could have a relationship with. The goal is still a good marriage. And I still avoid whores (this obviously includes porn).

But the idea of total abstinence until marriage doesn't seem to work in my experience. Women won't even consider a man for marriage unless she gets a good fucking from him. Marriage is entirely a passionate affair for 99% of women.

The only woman I would consider waiting for is a virgin, and even then a virgin is nothing special today: she could easily become just another slut or whore on the market. If you do find a good virgin, of course, court her and keep her. Keep pushing sexual tension all the way until marriage day or even bang her before marriage to keep her in love.

But simply banging women just for sex's sake is still sinful and destructive. Fuck a slut and you'll have a good time but it's still a waste of time that could have been spent on actually trying to find a good woman.

That said, while my notch count is far higher than the average man according to most surveys I have not lost my ability to bond with women. I just recently had a virgin in my bed who would not put out beyond some kissing and cuddling, but I very much enjoyed it nonetheless. If I was a sex addict I would have kicked her out for not putting out.

In general, men are stronger than women. This includes our ability to have larger partner counts with no negative repercussions. There has not been, to my knowledge, any study showing moderately high notch counts (between 20-50) for men leading to higher divorce rates.

Now, most of the girls I bang do not work out, but at least I pursued her with good intentions. I do not pursue women merely for sex (unless she is SMOKING... then I will throw caution to the wind) but to try and create a relationship with her. And there's no relationship with any modern woman today unless you're having sex with her, which means pursuing her only like a man can. With aggression, persistence, and determination. But also with cunning game and measured displays of affection for her.

I know Christ tells us that God judges us primarily based upon our intentions, so this is my best way as a man who burns to navigate the world without total indulgence in sinful sluts or faith-destroying blind hope in purity prevailing over all.

Hell, I used to pray to God to help me out to get sex, and boy oh boy did I get plenty of it.

The only reason to truly abstain is if you want to become a monk, which will give you tremendous rewards in heaven but is not something 99% of men can handle. I was a virgin until 24 and it was not easy for me at all. If you can avoid women and be happy as a virgin, then don't listen to anyone else you've got an amazing gift.

Post: #48

(10-29-2017 04:11 PM)H1N1 Wrote:  I've been helping out an old boss recently, on my weekends, who runs a high end catering company, as she's had her chef and her main front of house guy move back to their home countries within weeks of each other without much warning. She is a phenomenal cook - one of the best I've ever come across - and I've been fortunate enough to eat in some spectacular restaurants. Working in the kitchen under her still rates as one of the best investments in my future happiness that I have ever made. She was very kind to me when I was at university, and gave me the chance to work for her (and paid me very well when she didn't have to), so I've been happy to help her out.

I've been out of that world for a long time now, and it's been fascinating to be back in now I'm older. After I finished in the kitchen last night, I joined the late-shift at the bar at a very glamorous party for some girl's 40th. There was a blonde woman there, 40ish, single, never married, who had obviously been very beautiful when she was younger. Of course, she was no longer very beautiful, but she'd clung to all the fragments of that beauty as best she could. I was struck by how sad her situation was and it was quite a thing to see one of nature's rarest and most powerful creations brought so low. She seemed only too aware of the crushing awfulness of her situation, there in a room full of couples with young children. She didn't try to dull the experience with drink, or hide from her reality. She did spend the entire night scanning the room for eligible men, of which there were none (all the men there had bagged themselves formerly hot wives and proceeded to let themselves go rapidly), and then left as early as she could when she realised that another barren night had passed.

Most of the couples at this party were the same age, roughly. Of course, even the MILF-y women, plenty of former 8s, could not begin to compare to the young, wholesome and plain (18-20s) waitresses, none of whom was any better than a six. The thought of being shackled to anything so old and tired looking, at the relatively spritely age of 40, filled me with horror.

The other relevant fact, that made for an interesting dynamic, was that the man in question - a very wealthy gentleman farmer with a substantial estate and all the trappings - had married a working class village girl (a formerly very pretty one). This was clearly, for all their shared experience (kids, home, etc), still an insurmountable divide. The husband was in a foul mood all evening, as his wife's friends descended on his home and brought a world that was alien and unpleasant to him right through his back door. He was clearly in agony, each moment excruciating as he watched her friends and family drink his booze - one guest thought Chateau Lafite was a type of fancy wellington boot. I thought this was instructive for anyone looking for a happy life, and particularly a happy married life, since class was all that divided them (the girl was from the same area, appeared sweet and decent enough). The husband spent every moment looking as though no amount of sexual depravity, amassed over years with the blacksmith's pretty daughter, would ever make a single second of last night worth it.

The friends too kept themselves very much to themselves along social lines, one's own being easy to recognise for each group. It made for a fractured, and not terribly jolly evening, despite the best efforts of the nymphomaniacal young budding pop star leading the band to get everyone twerking in unison. It was instructive to see how such a seemingly archaic divide - social class - which the heart so easily overcomes when the passions are in the driving seat, can be a thorn that festers, and niggles, and can consign a man to a way of life that will be constantly grating and modestly unpleasant to him for the rest of his days.

Nice post. It kind of hit home for me because I'm going through a breakup that I initiated, the tried to take it back too late.

I was married to a very feminine filipina 8, who's a good cook and likes sex, for 13 years. She's bad with money, lives w/ clutter, and I don't like the way she chews her food sometimes. She's from a lower middle class family as am I, but she remains in that category while I've made a concerted effort (successfully) to rise to the upper middle class.

I guess it was a late midlife crisis for me, but I divorced her and pushed her away, hoping she'd find another guy soon so I wouldn't feel guilty. Well, she did find another guy, and I'd do almost anything to have her back.

So, I can totally relate to the irritation the host felt among his wife's trashy friends. Maybe he's smart enough to realize that it still might be worth the hassle to enjoy her good qualities.

Post: #49

(10-29-2017 09:46 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

(10-29-2017 09:20 PM)Laska Wrote:  I read in Aristotle's Ethics that you don't get real and lasting satisfaction from pursuing pleasure for its own sake. This lined up with with my experience, and seems to apply to sex outside of marriage. So, after thinking about it for a long time, I made this conclusion and have stuck with it. Of course, since I want sex, I'm VERY open to being persuaded.

My take on Christ and Paul's teachings applied to today's world is not to have sex with a woman you don't think you could have a relationship with. The goal is still a good marriage. And I still avoid whores (this obviously includes porn).

But the idea of total abstinence until marriage doesn't seem to work in my experience. Women won't even consider a man for marriage unless she gets a good fucking from him. Marriage is entirely a passionate affair for 99% of women.

The only woman I would consider waiting for is a virgin, and even then a virgin is nothing special today: she could easily become just another slut or whore on the market. If you do find a good virgin, of course, court her and keep her. Keep pushing sexual tension all the way until marriage day or even bang her before marriage to keep her in love.

But simply banging women just for sex's sake is still sinful and destructive. Fuck a slut and you'll have a good time but it's still a waste of time that could have been spent on actually trying to find a good woman.

That said, while my notch count is far higher than the average man according to most surveys I have not lost my ability to bond with women. I just recently had a virgin in my bed who would not put out beyond some kissing and cuddling, but I very much enjoyed it nonetheless. If I was a sex addict I would have kicked her out for not putting out.

In general, men are stronger than women. This includes our ability to have larger partner counts with no negative repercussions. There has not been, to my knowledge, any study showing moderately high notch counts (between 20-50) for men leading to higher divorce rates.

Now, most of the girls I bang do not work out, but at least I pursued her with good intentions. I do not pursue women merely for sex (unless she is SMOKING... then I will throw caution to the wind) but to try and create a relationship with her. And there's no relationship with any modern woman today unless you're having sex with her, which means pursuing her only like a man can. With aggression, persistence, and determination. But also with cunning game and measured displays of affection for her.

I know Christ tells us that God judges us primarily based upon our intentions, so this is my best way as a man who burns to navigate the world without total indulgence in sinful sluts or faith-destroying blind hope in purity prevailing over all.

Hell, I used to pray to God to help me out to get sex, and boy oh boy did I get plenty of it.

The only reason to truly abstain is if you want to become a monk, which will give you tremendous rewards in heaven but is not something 99% of men can handle. I was a virgin until 24 and it was not easy for me at all. If you can avoid women and be happy as a virgin, then don't listen to anyone else you've got an amazing gift.

Your wisdom is always appreciated Samseau. You've given me a lot to think about. Yes, in my rare case, being a virgin while being happy is easily possible, but with practice, I could game as well.

It's a matter of whether its right to sleep with girls outside of marriage, or if the closest thing are reason's why it's not wrong. I'm going to try to separate this question from marriage as much as possible, reexamine the issue, and just think about fornication itself, with the goal being to end up doing the right thing.

Post: #50

Cities have given people all the illusions of community with none of the oversight. As a rural guy I understood sex just like any other 16yo man, and it lead to sex with other 16yo girls. Where my path shifted compared with those who chose to stay rural, is my notch count went up, and then kept going up. The girls who I shared my most profound moments with went on soon after into having families of their own. Having sex with one or two guys in high school did not - as of 2017 - seem to have given their marriages issues in regards to stability.

A few of us went on to live in cities and travel the world. The women, some of whom I am still close with, are either single through divorce or even more common - through their anxiety of finding better. For myself, as long as I live in a city and live the life that I do, I will be presented with opportunity for sex with girls from the age of 18-26. I am a few years off 40, yet quality and quantity has not waned. Cities are a places where good people become progressives and bad people become politicians. There is not much in between, and for men like me where abundant sex with attractive women never seems to stop, cities are a type of hell.