Post: #351

Happy Easter

Post: #352

Fresh

Post: #353

Adam Carolla, who I actually like and is pretty redpill, completely lost the plot on this one. Dude is defending United and shitting on the passenger...

Post: #354

(04-19-2017 06:37 PM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Adam Carolla, who I actually like and is pretty redpill, completely lost the plot on this one. Dude is defending United and shitting on the passenger...

His logic makes perfect sense. He's basically saying that customers on airplanes that bitch about overbooking being a thing are paying cut-rate prices and want to "have their cake and eat it too."

...clearly a redpill guy that understands what's going on defending the police / airline over the "Dr" peddling pills for gay sex worried he's gonna miss the only day of the week he can legally practice his pill-peddling.

Post: #355

(04-12-2017 02:31 AM)Rawmeo Wrote:  Imagine you have an important surgery coming tomorrow. For the past month you've been taking your medication, preparing for that, following restrictions, and the day of the surgery, they announce you that your doctor got bumped off a flight because an employee was tired. You would probably be the one suing the airline.

Why talk about such a far-flung fantasy when we can talk about a much closer reality? Imagine you're a junkie and for the past week your prescription has ran out and you haven't been able to fill it because your doctor is only legally allowed to work one day a week. Then the day you're expecting to get your pills refilled they announce that your doctor got bumped off the flight because he had no status, bought the cheapest fare class he could, and the airline needed the seats to get another plane staffed the next day so that 120 people (one of which happens to be the doctor you refer to providing the surgery and of course he's sitting in business class) could make it to their destinations. Unfortunately you can't afford to see a lawyer to sue the airline and were planning on paying for the pills via gay sex with the 69 year old doctor but on the bright side - at least your cornhole isn't sore for the next week.

Post: #356

(04-20-2017 08:57 AM)achromaticmike Wrote:  His logic makes perfect sense. He's basically saying that customers on airplanes that bitch about overbooking being a thing are paying cut-rate prices and want to "have their cake and eat it too."

...clearly a redpill guy that understands what's going on defending the police / airline over the "Dr" peddling pills for gay sex worried he's gonna miss the only day of the week he can legally practice his pill-peddling.

Earlier in this thread you were arguing that because it was a rule in the fine print they had a right to kick him off. Now that we know that United weren't even following their own rules and had no authority to kick him off, you're still siding with United?

Your logic is inconsistent. Should the rules be followed or not?

Post: #357

Party in da house.

achromaticmike is back!

(04-14-2017 03:02 PM)weambulance Wrote:  

(04-14-2017 02:48 PM)cascadecombo Wrote:  

Quote: Some twat mentioned 'read the contract'? Fuck off. No one is reading a 45 page legal document prior to booking

Yeah cuz knowing what you sign up for is for chumps.

If you read 45 pages of legal babble, and you're not a lawyer, does that mean you know what you signed up for?

A lot of that stuff is written pretty vaguely. And of course there is probably some clause that if there is confusion the airline will decide what is right. No one really needs to read it anyway. It should just say "think of all the ways we can fuck you over...and then there are more you haven't thought of."

Just make it one sentence.

Post: #358

(04-20-2017 09:18 AM)FireStarter Wrote:  

(04-20-2017 08:57 AM)achromaticmike Wrote:  His logic makes perfect sense. He's basically saying that customers on airplanes that bitch about overbooking being a thing are paying cut-rate prices and want to "have their cake and eat it too."

...clearly a redpill guy that understands what's going on defending the police / airline over the "Dr" peddling pills for gay sex worried he's gonna miss the only day of the week he can legally practice his pill-peddling.

Earlier in this thread you were arguing that because it was a rule in the fine print they had a right to kick him off. Now that we know that United weren't even following their own rules and had no authority to kick him off, you're still siding with United?

Your logic is inconsistent. Should the rules be followed or not?

Are you sure it's my logic that's inconsistent and not that you just failed to read what I actually wrote? Here's three quotes from earlier in the thread that I made...

#1 "Wrong. It's not his plane and he was told to get off."

#2 "At the point of being told to get the fuck off the contract is rather irrelevant. It turns into illegal trespass once you refuse and is a violation of FAA regulations. Property rights and all that jazz."

#3 "It's possible that they did violate their own contract but in this case it really doesn't make a difference. If United violated their own contract due to a technicality they don't give up their right to kick you off their private property."

United's authority to kick him off resides in the fact that the plane is private property. Whether or not they had enough of a legal justification to win when defending themselves from a civil claim for breach of contract is questionable. A whole lot of legalese will be involved in that argument and probably relate to whether or not the passenger was actually "boarded." Too many details are missing. I've read everything from the guy voluntarily accepted the compensation but later reneged after he later realized the next flight was the following day, to rumors that his wife was there traveling with him, to the entire plane was informed they were gonna need volunteers before they actually boarded but they needed to board everyone to determine the exact number of empty seats, etc....

Post: #359

(04-20-2017 09:25 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  Party in da house.

achromaticmike is back!

Thanks! Feels really good not to have been surprised by the fact that the "Dr" turned out to be a pill-prescribing nut-job with diagnosed mental issues instead of a poor old cardiac surgeon being taken advantage of by the big, bad, corporate fascist airlines. I guess it all comes down to having more experience with airlines, travelers, O'Hare airport and United than most.

Post: #360

On a side note. It appears that this whole fiasco has had almost no effect on United's stock price.

...and I think that's mostly because investors know the typical once-a-year ticket-buying public will continue to buy the cheapest ticket that they can and overbooking allows airlines to offer the lower prices America's nation of Wal-Mart shoppers crave.

Post: #361

The "cut rate prices" argument is bullshit.

Roughly 40% of that ticket prices is taxes. You know what happens when you cancel or rebook a flight? The airline pockets the taxes and then resells the seat to someone else with those taxes.

Hell...in any other industry, refusing to provide the service paid for (transportation on a certain date) would get you sued in small claims court for breach of contract. Good luck with that when dealing with the airlines because said airlines have congress sucking their dicks under the table.

Post: #362

(04-20-2017 11:07 AM)Easy_C Wrote:  The "cut rate prices" argument is bullshit.

Roughly 40% of that ticket prices is taxes. You know what happens when you cancel or rebook a flight? The airline pockets the taxes and then resells the seat to someone else with those taxes.

Hell...in any other industry, refusing to provide the service paid for (transportation on a certain date) would get you sued in small claims court for breach of contract. Good luck with that when dealing with the airlines because said airlines have congress sucking their dicks under the table.

it's not just taxes. Airport Fees eat up a huge amount of costs. Those airport fees are what you pay for to wait in line for hours hoping your rectum isn't probed by the TSA. Those airport fees pay for those $100k ex ray machines that don't even work and get replaced constantly.

Flying would be much cheaper, much more efficient and less stressful without all the ridiculous security apparatus in place.

Come to think of it, that travel stress contributed to this situation and others like it. By the time you go through aaalllll the crap involved just to take your seat, your "sunk cost" in terms of time and preparation is so high that you are rather committed to your travel plan, rather than go through all that again. Surprised this isn't brought up more, but the public are such slaves to authority they will just bend over and take it.

@achromaticmike

Interesting private property argument, but one could argue it's more of a tenant-landlord type scenario. Try evicting your tenant for some random cause claiming "private property". Not gonna happen. I think on a plane you as a customer have SOME kind of recourse due to you. I think legally that's appropriate, and if not we'll see legislation (for better or worse) in that direction.

Post: #363

Adam Carrolla is a moron.

Cut-throat competition does not mean jack shit with 4 carriers left. Essentially the US has become one big oligopoly.

Ryanjet and Eeasyjet in Europe offer lower prices and have higher tax- and fee-base, yet they manage without kicking off passengers off their planes. Their overbooking is more reasonable - they simple never ever let you enter the plane.

In the US you have the tendency to go way overboard with corporate bootlicking.

"Yes Massa Corpo, Massa let me fly today, I am such a happy serf to give you my money and let me fly at such great prices! Massa very generous with me, that he won't beat me like that evil Asian doctor!"

This is of course bullshit. I have worked at more and far less ethical corporations. And let me tell you this - the fish stinks from the head and usually a stinking head results in shitty culture right down to the very bottom. In fact the less ethical the decisions are above, the worse they get reinterpreted at the bottom.

In contrast I saw a few big corporations which were conscious of a good comfortable work atmosphere and oh wonder, the workforce treated the customers way better and the folk were more happy.

United is simply a shitty company - if the market was more competitive, then the people would punish them more, but you seem to have a certain GM 1970s position where a company thinks, that it can do anything - offer you cars that fall apart instantly, you have no choice - do you?

This is not only a PR disaster - it is an indicator of a stinking rotten company - evil, rotten and even incompetent to the core.

Anyone should boycott such companies just as they should boycott Starbucks. AT least with Starbucks you get a passable product, but just propaganda stuffed down our throats. With United you get a shitty product and shitty attitude towards the customers - lose lose.

Post: #364

(04-20-2017 02:32 PM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  Ryanjet and Eeasyjet in Europe offer lower prices and have higher tax- and fee-base, yet they manage without kicking off passengers off their planes.


With United you get a shitty product and shitty attitude towards the customers - lose lose.

There's no such thing as Ryanjet. ...but with Ryanair, until recently they'd charge you $60 simple to get your boarding pass at the airport and they cut off printing it off online four hours before your flight so if you weren't familiar with the policy you'd automatically get screwed. On top of that, you should see the quality of their military charter flights. The one I was on had screens that flickered the entire way and had an engine go out requiring us to divert to Goose Bay Canada.


I have a lot of experience with United. If you're an elite flyer it's the best American airline. Star Alliance Gold status is great for traveling internationally.

United has two main problems that drag it down in the ratings. #1 it's carrying American passengers and Americans are some of the most overweight people in the world. #2 Union flight attendants mean you see a lot more 60 year old women then you would overseas where they trade them in for new models before they hit 35.

I've flown Singapore, Emirates, etc... they suck equally to United in the economy cabin. Emirates is actually worse because of all the quasi-slaves they're constantly flying back and forth that you need to sit next to who haven't taken showers in months.

Post: #365

(04-20-2017 12:55 PM)Robert High Hawk Wrote:  @achromaticmike

Interesting private property argument, but one could argue it's more of a tenant-landlord type scenario. Try evicting your tenant for some random cause claiming "private property". Not gonna happen. I think on a plane you as a customer have SOME kind of recourse due to you. I think legally that's appropriate, and if not we'll see legislation (for better or worse) in that direction.

You could make that argument but it wouldn't be a very good one. Landlord-tenant situations have very specific state by state laws dealing with them.

The recourse you have on a plane coded in law is the reimbursement they're required to give you. Perhaps you're right and the recourse e.g. the reimbursement coded in law is insufficient and needs to be looked at but ultimately you can't expect one airline to play by one set of rules and others to play by another. Ultimately all United did was exactly what every other US carrier is doing; they just were the first ones to be unlucky enough to do it with this gay-dick buying pill popper Dr.

As a frequent flyer you'd be nuts to want the government to take away overbooking. This would cause the airlines to have much more restrictive ticket change / cancellation policies while also increasing overall fares as a gross overreaction to something that rarely happens.

Post: #366

I meant Ryanair and they do have punitive measures for anyone who doesn't do the procedures on time online before the flight. The same goes for your baggage - if it is only slightly bigger or more heavy, you pay more than for the flight itself. But it is not as if this is unclear or a scam.

It is a budget airline, but still they manage fine relative to the prices they have.

Post: #367

(04-20-2017 04:32 PM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  I meant Ryanair and they do have punitive measures for anyone who doesn't do the procedures on time online before the flight. The same goes for your baggage - if it is only slightly bigger or more heavy, you pay more than for the flight itself. But it is not as if this is unclear or a scam.

It is a budget airline, but still they manage fine relative to the prices they have.

I just think it's funny how you're going out of your way to justify RyanAir's race-to-the-bottom while simultaneously crucifying United... Most of what has caused airlines to go downhill is the customers caring about nothing other than having the cheapest price.

There is NOTHING better about RyanAir than United except the price and it's extremely clear how they offer those prices.

We can debate all day long about whether or not the compensation for passengers denied boarding needs to be increased at the federal level but using RyanAir as your example of a good company while talking about how evil United is is laughable.

RyanAir is the toilet of the airline industry and mostly flown by peasants looking for the absolute cheapest fare. ...and half the time once you get to your destination you'll end up needing to take a bus the rest of the way because so many of the airports RyanAir flies out of are in the middle of nowhere.

The problem with your perfect-world boarding scenario is that sometimes passengers show up late or not at all. Should United not let the elite passenger who came in on a weather delayed connection board the plane because Joe Blow is in his seat at 1/5 the price already? Should Joe blow be informed he needs to wait until the last second to board because there's a 1% chance Mr. Global Services elite might make the flight in time? It's actually more convenient in more situations for everyone to have the option to take someone off the plane after they're on it and everyone's been seated. With travel and the uncertainty involved there is no perfect solution.

Most of your proposed solutions don't make sense because you clearly don't understand everything that's happening and the repercussions of what you want to change.

Post: #368

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

Post: #369

(04-20-2017 04:16 PM)achromaticmike Wrote:  I've flown Singapore, Emirates, etc... they suck equally to United in the economy cabin. Emirates is actually worse because of all the quasi-slaves they're constantly flying back and forth that you need to sit next to who haven't taken showers in months.

Is this a joke? Emirates and Singapore airlines are possibly the best airlines I've flown. I do a lot of traveling for work and I always avoid American carriers. Does United give you a toothbrush, socks, and eye mask for an overnight flight? Does United offer you $1 onboard wifi for international flight? Don't get me started with the attractiveness of flight attendants and the quality of customer service you get on United...

Post: #370

(04-20-2017 10:26 PM)bluejun Wrote:  

(04-20-2017 04:16 PM)achromaticmike Wrote:  I've flown Singapore, Emirates, etc... they suck equally to United in the economy cabin. Emirates is actually worse because of all the quasi-slaves they're constantly flying back and forth that you need to sit next to who haven't taken showers in months.

Is this a joke? Emirates and Singapore airlines are possibly the best airlines I've flown. I do a lot of traveling for work and I always avoid American carriers. Does United give you a toothbrush, socks, and eye mask for an overnight flight? Does United offer you $1 onboard wifi for international flight? Don't get me started with the attractiveness of flight attendants and the quality of customer service you get on United...

No it's not a joke and if $5 worth of goodies is what it takes to convince you that the Singapore economy class is better then so be it. I usually don't even use or take that stuff.

If you fly all the time you know the difference between $1 internet and $15 internet is often the difference between internet that crawls and internet that's usable. Cheap prices mean everyone on the plane is sharing the connection and the service sucks. I'd rather pay a little bit.

I've already said the flight attendants are superior on non-American carriers but at the end of the day I'll take my 50% rate of getting a free row to myself on United with economy plus and basically have a lay flat bed for the price of a regular economy ticket. Barring that I almost always have a center aisle seat with no one next to me. That's superior to me to a .50 toothbrush and a younger flight attendant. YMMV.

Post: #371

He's talking about business class. Singapore and Emirates are both a step above United.

Economy is shit for all three. It's economical to transport the "quasi-slaves".

Post: #372

I don't know what you guys talking about. I fly international all the time. Unless your experience was based on flying from Sri Lanka to India.
I just flew emirates a couple of weeks ago from Dubai to Seattle. It was economy. I got all those amenities and $1 wifi. The small details and attentiveness matter a lot and are everything there is to know about the flight (reflection of management, morale of the crew, mechanic and maintenance of the airplane). Surprisingly, the emirates ticket was actually cheaper than the flight offered by American or British airlines. Did I also mention how tidy Emirates maintain the bathroom for the whole duration of the flight? I don't think spoiled american/british flight attendants would care to lift a finger on the toilet seat.

Post: #373

^
Any, and I mean ANY airline economy is better than United on international flights where the more senior flight attendants are fat cow banshees.

Yet I still see that when picking fights people ignore this and just look at cost. Hell maybe I'm guilty of that.

@achromaticmike

Not saying that it's a good argument, just an applicable one. The current landlord tenant laws are certainly not good laws, and they ultimately hurt legitimate renters on the macro scale. Yet they are still laws. And They became laws due to over publicised incidences like this.

I'll say this, and it encapsulates my view on the whole thing.

I asked some of my German friends about their thoughts on this. They asked why the police bothered to get involved at all.

In normal world a cop would hear this shit on his CB radio and say "whaaaat? An old Asian gay fag guy? He paid for his ticket? Overbooked? What the hell does that mean? Sounds like a company problem sorry I'm busy...."

And to back that up, I saw an eerily similar yet more severe problem on the Deutsche Bahn (may God Bless that somewhat over priced but womderful Train company) before my very eyes and it was resolved with much less drama. That was due to a combination of the customers, the staff, and most importantly the polizei acting like adults.

Post: #374

(04-21-2017 01:10 AM)Armogan Wrote:  He's talking about business class. Singapore and Emirates are both a step above United.

Economy is shit for all three. It's economical to transport the "quasi-slaves".

I don't think he's talking about business class. Singapore gives out that stuff to long-haul economy passengers and United gives it out in business so the argument wouldn't even make sense...

I haven't flown long-haul business class on any of these three airlines.

Post: #375

I wouldn't say this was just one isolate incident that could've been resolved like the German way. The actual problem is rooted deeper than that . I would say it's symbolic and built up pressure that finally exploded. It's a reflection of years of piss poor customer service on passengers, asshole TSA/airport security personnel that go unchecked in the name of security and price manipulation and monopoly of unscrupulous US carriers.

(04-21-2017 01:33 AM)Robert High Hawk Wrote:  ^
Any, and I mean ANY airline economy is better than United on international flights where the more senior flight attendants are fat cow banshees.

Yet I still see that when picking fights people ignore this and just look at cost. Hell maybe I'm guilty of that.

@achromaticmike

Not saying that it's a good argument, just an applicable one. The current landlord tenant laws are certainly not good laws, and they ultimately hurt legitimate renters on the macro scale. Yet they are still laws. And They became laws due to over publicised incidences like this.

I'll say this, and it encapsulates my view on the whole thing.

I asked some of my German friends about their thoughts on this. They asked why the police bothered to get involved at all.

In normal world a cop would hear this shit on his CB radio and say "whaaaat? An old Asian gay fag guy? He paid for his ticket? Overbooked? What the hell does that mean? Sounds like a company problem sorry I'm busy...."

And to back that up, I saw an eerily similar yet more severe problem on the Deutsche Bahn (may God Bless that somewhat over priced but womderful Train company) before my very eyes and it was resolved with much less drama. That was due to a combination of the customers, the staff, and most importantly the polizei acting like adults.