(12-31-2016 10:42 AM)Stirfry Wrote:  4) due to water Fluoridation and better oral hygiene instruction, tooth decay is becoming more and more rare these days. Therefore, dentists are trying to find new ways to generate money. In fact, when I was a dentist, I remember attending various seminars which were basically innovative ways to get more money from patients that didn't involve drilling on teeth (I.e., sealants for kids, fluoride treatments, iontophoresis for tooth pain, tooth bleaching, temporomandibular joint disorder interventions such as mouthguards, etc.). T

There are some serious health issues related with water fluoridation, fluoride is a neurotoxin, among other problems.

(12-31-2016 11:05 AM)scorpion Wrote:  One of the scams they do is pushing unnecessary dental X-rays. Most Dentists will want to do an X-ray on an annual basis, even if you're a low risk patient. I've never had a cavity in my life nor any history of dental problems and yet my Dentist wants to X-ray me every year. It's a combination of pure profiteering (the X-ray is just another moneymaker he can bill straight to insurance) and the "CYA" mentality doctors have in this litigious society (which is basically the excuse he gave me).

Most people don't need to regularly go to the dentist anyway. It's very easy to take good care of your teeth yourself.

1) Brush 2x daily
2) Floss daily (realistically 2x a week is pretty good)
3) Get a dental scaler and remove plaque buildup once or twice a month
4) Don't eat a lot of high sugar content food/candy
5) Rinse your mouth out well with water after every meal

Totally agree on the xray front, that is certainly a scam. I went back to my old dentist who I hadn't been to in 2 years, not really that long. They refused to see me for a simple cleaning unless they could do a full mouth xray for $400 first. Talk about a scam. They said it was for "liability reasons"...yeah sure buddy.

So, I stopped going for a while but I really wanted a cleaning. Went to Groupon where there were a plethora of dentists offering "new patient specials" for like $49 that included a cleaning, xrays, etc the whole 9 yards. That is a good deal!

Of course they tried to upsell me on fluoride treatments and a bunch of other stuff, but basically since my mouth was fine I don't think I need any of that.

I read the West Price stuff about tooth remineralization, etc. It is true, teeth can remineralize. I've had chipped teeth that didn't exactly repair themselves, but they did smooth out and don't hurt. I thought it was wierd that every single time I went to a dentist, he found some new cavity to fill.

Anyway, for teeth to remineralize, you have to have the minerals. I tried the vitamin D3 and vitamin K2, which the paleo and Weston Price folks recommend. That didn't cure tooth sensitivity. I added some borax in. That boosted my testosterone, but didn't end the tooth sensitivity. D3, K2, and borax are all super good for bone repair, and the body's calcium processing chemistry.

Finally I tried one more thing. After an initial week where my teeth became MORE sensitive, now they are feeling really good, I can eat ice cream again, etc. That product is silica. Silica is a trace element that we need, but most sources are toxic. A company called "Alta" has a bio-available form of silica derived from the horsetail herb. Apparently it has to be fermented for half a year for the negative things to break down. But then it is the best form of silica you can get. Careful not to take too much or for too long. We need silica, but too much will damage the kidneys. For an adult male, 1 alta pill per day for a couple months should be completely safe. Some people with severe silica deficiency may need to take 2 or 3 pills a day for a few weeks.

Men used to get silica from their beer, too. Modern day filtered beer doesn't have the silica content.

Also, silica helps with hair, nails, skin tags, etc.

Quote:

Silica also promotes proper mineral balance between calcium and magnesium within the body. This mineral balance in turn helps with hormonal balance. This hormonal balance in turn is important because it is precisely hormonal imbalances that lead to osteoporosis. By achieving hormonal balance and its ability to enhance bone mineralisation, silica is invaluable in the treatment and prevention of osteoporosis and ideally every good calcium supplement should have some silica within the formulation.

Silica is used by every single cell and every internal gland within our bodies. Silica has an impact on strengthening the cardiovascular system as well as the central nervous system which relies of calcium and magnesium for the optimal transmission of nerve impulses. Silica also may be of value in the elderly for offering protection against Alzheimer’s since it counteracts aluminium’s effects on the body by aiding its removal.

Was having tooth pain and took Bio Dent by Standard Process and it went away. This stuff will keep your teeth strong.My nutritionist turned me onto it.

Go to the dentist for occasional checkups, but don't rely on cavity drillings and root canals.

Floss, brush, stay away from sugars and the supplements below can keep your teeth healthy where you never need any of those extravagant dentally-invasive (sometimes surgical) procedures.

https://www.amazon.com/Bio-Dent-90-Tabs-...s+bio-dent

https://www.amazon.com/Standard-Process-...SQA3QZBT81

(12-31-2016 05:23 PM)911 Wrote:  

(12-31-2016 10:42 AM)Stirfry Wrote:  4) due to water Fluoridation and better oral hygiene instruction, tooth decay is becoming more and more rare these days. Therefore, dentists are trying to find new ways to generate money. In fact, when I was a dentist, I remember attending various seminars which were basically innovative ways to get more money from patients that didn't involve drilling on teeth (I.e., sealants for kids, fluoride treatments, iontophoresis for tooth pain, tooth bleaching, temporomandibular joint disorder interventions such as mouthguards, etc.). T

There are some serious health issues related with water fluoridation, fluoride is a neurotoxin, among other problems.

Supposedly, it's not actual naturally occurring fluoride in the water, but rather an aluminum byproduct- sodium fluoride. Sodium fluoride is poison.

G

You will get cavities much more regularly if you consume sugary drinks or foods. In my experience, if your diet is bad but you have good oral hygiene it won't make a difference.

Once I cut out all the sugary drinks and foods it's made a pretty huge difference with incidence of cavities.

I do the "traditional" thing of annual x-rays and twice-annual cleanings. It costs me very little (I pay out of pocket, no dental coverage on my insurance), and I don't have a dentist-orthodontist that upsells me on procedures or finds phantom cavities to drill and fill - in twelve years, she's replaced a cracked crown and two old amalgam fillings, but has found no new work. She also replaced an old retainer I wear for TMJ, which she routinely tweaks as needed at no extra charge.

In my case, the fillings/crown were necessary due to defects in the affected teeth - or so I was told. Sure, maybe prior dentists lied or overdiagnosed, but I see no reason to believe so given the rest of my dental history. Plus the retainer is absolutely necessary based on direct experience - with it I have no jaw problems, without it I rapidly lose range of motion to the point I can barely open my mouth. I'd pretty much pay whatever a dentist asked for one (which fortunately wasn't that much, around $600 as I recall).

I don't doubt that there are disreputable dentists out there that do the things described above, but NADALT. I look at a semi-annual cleaning as routine maintenance - it doesn't cost much, and with this dentist at least there's never pressure to do anything of questionable necessity.

As for eating right/avoiding certain things and doing your own maintenance, absolutely. I eat very little in the way of unnatural sweets, I haven't drunk sodas (diet or otherwise) in about seven or eight years, and brush and floss nightly. When needed maybe every 8-10 weeks, I scrape trouble spots with a scaler. The hygienists compliment me on every visit over how little work they have to do - scaling a few little spots I can't get at, and then a good polishing. So, good eating and basic maintenance pay off.

(12-31-2016 02:36 PM)Gmac Wrote:  It's a scam in so that it's very easy to take advantage of people, much like mechanics. They'll tell you that you need things fixed when you don't. Procedures you need that you often don't. But dentistry is still important. You just need to try to stick to those you trust.

This is very true, if a doctor is telling you that you need something, it's difficult for the average person not to trust that opinion completely. Plus it's your teeth. Who would want to risk fucking around with their long term dental health by ignoring their dentist? So it's easy to give in to whatever they suggest. When I was a kid, I got hit in the mouth with a baseball bat. Split teeth, exposed nerves, even as I'm typing this I'm getting goosebumps just remembering the excruciating pain and root canals. A lot of years I was easily susceptible to whatever the dentist suggested because I wanted to do all I could to ensure I never had to experience any tooth trouble as long as I could help it. But as most here have said, basic and smart personal dental care along with diet does wonders.

I would have expected to hear from RVFers who've had good experiences doing major dental work abroad, in low-cost countries (EE, Latin Am. etc), that would be a great way to finance a vacation. Countries with great babe factors and high-grade low-cost dentists?

(01-01-2017 10:12 PM)Geomann180 Wrote:  

(12-31-2016 05:23 PM)911 Wrote:  

(12-31-2016 10:42 AM)Stirfry Wrote:  4) due to water Fluoridation and better oral hygiene instruction, tooth decay is becoming more and more rare these days. Therefore, dentists are trying to find new ways to generate money. In fact, when I was a dentist, I remember attending various seminars which were basically innovative ways to get more money from patients that didn't involve drilling on teeth (I.e., sealants for kids, fluoride treatments, iontophoresis for tooth pain, tooth bleaching, temporomandibular joint disorder interventions such as mouthguards, etc.). T

There are some serious health issues related with water fluoridation, fluoride is a neurotoxin, among other problems.

Supposedly, it's not actual naturally occurring fluoride in the water, but rather an aluminum byproduct- sodium fluoride. Sodium fluoride is poison.

G

Right Geoman, most of it is not pharma-grade fluoride, but rough stuff laced with arsenic, lead. But even in the best conditions fluoride is toxic, resulting in the calcification of the brain's pineal gland and hypocampus, IQ drops, behavioral issues and cancer.

here are a couple of good recaps on fluoride:









and an annotated audio survey by James Corbett:

https://www.corbettreport.com/episode-13...-fluoride/

I have not been to a dentist for more than 10 years (maybe even 15, I do not remember)

I clean my teeth once, before going to sleep with Sensodyne, because it helps to prevent my teeth becoming sensitive to cold or hot (really works)
One of my tooth started to ache a little bit few weeks ago, I applied extra amount of toothpaste on it for a week, the aching went away.

Also I drink only water, no sugary stuff, and try to avoid sugars as I am on a LCHF diet.
I go to a dentist only when it hurts to be honest.

I go to the dentist twice a year for routine cleanings, covered by insurance. Brush 2-3 times a day, floss, etc. Never had any cause to regret it, I've got zero cavities (I'm sure it helps that I never drink soft drinks.) I wouldn't be surprised if many of the other procedures are superfluous, but I do think it's worth the effort to get your teeth professionally cleaned twice a year since there's stuff a regular brushing/flossing routine doesn't get out.

A good thread on dental matters
/thread-22744.html

Can't say anything about dentistry as an industry.
Yet I do wonder after a visit here or there whether individual dentists are doing more harm than good with their heavy handed procedures...?

One obvious money maker is the 'tooth brush industry'.

All these angled bristles, flip-top heads & all these other gimmicks, purely to entice the customer to purchase their latest overpriced toothbrush.
I'm surprised there have been no tooth brushes released with electrolytes.

"Brushdo! It's got electrolytes!"

Speak of the devil, I'm getting all four wisdom teeth pulled out at 6am tomorrow morning. For anyone who has gone through it, any tips as to what food is best to eat? I'm thinking lots of applesauce and soup. For the dental professionals amongst us, any further advice other than to get lots of rest and take the pain meds the surgeon will hand out?

I have had multiple procedures done on one of my back teeth, and I was recently told that I need to have it pulled out and have an implant put in.

When I was around 15 and living in South America, I had a bad cavity and they ended up putting a metal rod in my tooth to fill the cavity (if I remember correctly). A few years later, I had a root canal, and they ground the tooth down to a stump and put a crown over it, which fell off after a few years. The tooth kept getting infected every year or so, and I was recently told that I need to have it taken out and get an implant put in, which basically means all the work that was previously done on it was useless.

(01-02-2017 09:02 PM)John Michael Kane Wrote:  Speak of the devil, I'm getting all four wisdom teeth pulled out at 6am tomorrow morning. For anyone who has gone through it, any tips as to what food is best to eat? I'm thinking lots of applesauce and soup. For the dental professionals amongst us, any further advice other than to get lots of rest and take the pain meds the surgeon will hand out?

Had all four wisdom teeth removed at the same time.
Two required surgery into the gums to remove, not a simple plucking out of exposed teeth.

Soft foods afterwards were the only option. Between the numbing from medication making the feeling of eating solid food odd & difficult.
Along with the risk of accidental biting of ones tongue or cheeks cause of the numbing.
It was easier to eat soft foods that don't require chewing, like a duck.
At least for the first day or two.

I have spinal stenosis and a herniated disk in my lower back that is a definite bitch and can lay me up for a week if I fuck around. But with consistent PT, it will heal. I just to need to stop being an idiot and follow Dr's orders to a T. I broke my hand in high school that required surgery to properly fix. I went with a six-week cast to avoid missing basketball season. A metacarpal is a little crooked but no big deal. I've been pretty lucky health wise, especially considering all the sports I played growing up.

I needed a root canal a few years ago. That was the most miserable I've been with a bodily ailment. Few things are as irritating or nagging as some tooth issue.

As for the post retelling the research into the teeth of forager/hunter/gather population vs Western civ. Absolutely. And it's not just the garbage we've been eating for the last handful of decades. The peasants of Rome are claimed to have better teeth than the nobles for the simple reason that fruits were more readily available to the wealthy.

I went to the dentist about six months ago for the first time in what had to have been six or seven years. I don't know if it was teeth sealing when I was a kid, fluoridated water, regular brushing or plain genetic luck, but I've only had one cavity I can remember in my life. However I got to the point where I started imagining something was wrong (it had been so long since I'd had even a cleaning) and I finally made an appointment.

Although the dentist put me through a solid cleaning, I was amazed not to have a single cavity. I brush regularly and always use Listerine but I was still surprised. He did tell me I was brushing too hard and was starting to have issues with gum recession, so he applied a filling material around several teeth to provide some protection and told me to brush more gently and only to use a soft toothbrush. Honestly it pinged my bullshit detector, but I talked to a similar age friend in a totally different area who'd gotten the same input from his dentist. I ponied up (I have passable dental insurance but still had a good out of pocket expense) just knowing that receding gums can be a problem I don't want to deal with.

I do think that it's the same as any other professional service - your mileage will definitely vary. I looked for an independent business with an established history and good reviews. You couldn't pay me to go to some kind of corporate dental mill.

As an aside, it's anecdotal and not 'data' but to comment on the fluoride discussion - I had a girlfriend who'd grown up on well water. I hung out with her and a couple friends from the same town and at least once they commented on how all of them had had a number of cavities over the years. They were all conscientious about brushing their teeth - I asked - but the only conclusion I could draw was the lack of fluoride hadn't helped.

I grew up in a town that flouridated the water. I wanted to be healthy and properly hydrated, so throughout my teen years I drank at least 2 large glasses of water per day. I had so many cavities it wasn't funny. And ugly yellow teeth too. So, the fluoride in the water did NOT help me.

The cavities I think has a lot to do with diet, good or bad. If you consistently have a poor diet, especially one heavy with sweets, your teeth are going to rot. If you drink tons of wine and never brush your teeth, you are going to acid wash them. Guess what happens next? I've never read a study linking cavities to genetics, but there's probably some factor in there as well. The only thing we can control is diet, brushing, flossing and regular check-ups.

Side note on x-rays:

When you go to pick a dentist, make sure you pick one with a modern digital x-ray machine. The old x-ray machines that many dentists are still using emit a huge amount of radiation compared to the new ones. Also, the images are far clearer on a digital x-ray. There's no point in exposing your body to more radiation than necessary, so either pick a dentist that has modern equipment, or if you like a dentist a lot that does not, just get x-rays done with one of his competitors with a new machine, then bring him back the images.

(01-02-2017 09:02 PM)John Michael Kane Wrote:  Speak of the devil, I'm getting all four wisdom teeth pulled out at 6am tomorrow morning. For anyone who has gone through it, any tips as to what food is best to eat? I'm thinking lots of applesauce and soup. For the dental professionals amongst us, any further advice other than to get lots of rest and take the pain meds the surgeon will hand out?

Here's a good smoothie idea: Chocolate protein powder, peanut butter, and banana. Add quick oats if you want some extra carbs.

If you live in an area with flouridised tap water, yes.

(01-03-2017 02:31 AM)Razor Beast Wrote:  

(01-02-2017 09:02 PM)John Michael Kane Wrote:  Speak of the devil, I'm getting all four wisdom teeth pulled out at 6am tomorrow morning. For anyone who has gone through it, any tips as to what food is best to eat? I'm thinking lots of applesauce and soup. For the dental professionals amongst us, any further advice other than to get lots of rest and take the pain meds the surgeon will hand out?

Here's a good smoothie idea: Chocolate protein powder, peanut butter, and banana. Add quick oats if you want some extra carbs.

Unless you are in a lot of pain, DON'T DO IT. I had all 4 wisdom teeth out at age 20. I had a nice high-T masculine square jaw up until then. Since then my T has dropped, chin has receded, looks weaker, has NOT reduced any tooth pain or anything else. Keep your wisdom teeth, get braces, if at all possible. If you take out your wisdom teeth, in a few years (10, 15) you'll be getting other teeth root canalled and bridged (or yanked, if you're poor). Getting wisdom teeth pulled has no impact on how the OTHER teeth in your mouth fit together. Wish I'd known that at the time.

(01-03-2017 03:16 AM)TheMost Wrote:  

(01-03-2017 02:31 AM)Razor Beast Wrote:  

(01-02-2017 09:02 PM)John Michael Kane Wrote:  Speak of the devil, I'm getting all four wisdom teeth pulled out at 6am tomorrow morning. For anyone who has gone through it, any tips as to what food is best to eat? I'm thinking lots of applesauce and soup. For the dental professionals amongst us, any further advice other than to get lots of rest and take the pain meds the surgeon will hand out?

Here's a good smoothie idea: Chocolate protein powder, peanut butter, and banana. Add quick oats if you want some extra carbs.

Unless you are in a lot of pain, DON'T DO IT. I had all 4 wisdom teeth out at age 20. I had a nice high-T masculine square jaw up until then. Since then my T has dropped, chin has receded, looks weaker, has NOT reduced any tooth pain or anything else. Keep your wisdom teeth, get braces, if at all possible. If you take out your wisdom teeth, in a few years (10, 15) you'll be getting other teeth root canalled and bridged (or yanked, if you're poor). Getting wisdom teeth pulled has no impact on how the OTHER teeth in your mouth fit together. Wish I'd known that at the time.

I'm going to voice some skepticism towards the idea that getting your wisdom tooth removed lowers your testosterone.

Many people do not understand how flossing is important. I learned it about 6 years ago (I'll turn 46) and it's when I got periodontitis problems that I realized it.

I made another good move when I bought my own personal dentist cleaning kit. I can remove some tartar by myself. Since I started doing it my dentist noticed it, as he has less of it to remove.

I still go for a check twice a year and it usually cost me around 100$ Canadian Dollars everytime.

(12-31-2016 11:16 AM)Stirfry Wrote:  My tips for proper dental care:

1) brush after every meal. If that's not practical, than twice a day (morning and evening- never go to bed with food or sugary liquids stuck to your teeth). Floss 1x day, or as much as practical.

2) sugar free gum or candy is good, because it gets saliva flowing and saliva is highly protective against cavities and periodontal disease. People with poor salivary flow due to illness or other conditions have horrible rampant decay and periodontal bone loss.

3) The best thing to do is to try not to get cavities in the first place, because much dental work in adults involves removing and replacing old restorations that have leaked or old crown and bridge work that has broken or decayed. In other words, watch your diet! Stay away from sugary sticky foods, and soda- especially sugary cola! God that stuff is horrible for your teeth, as well as just about every other part of your body. Drink diet soda if you have to. If you don't drill into the tooth to begin with and maintain a smooth enamel surface, that's the best defense against cavities. No porcelain restoration or composite filling will ever be better than your natural teeth.