Post: #1

How do you interpret male suicide?

According to this article, suicide is the single biggest killer of young men in Britain. The author has an answer: it is because men are struggling to meet the masculine ideals enforced on them by "society".

I call bullshit.

More likely is the masculine attributes that men have inherited, by virtue of their genetic predisposition and birthright, have been suppressed and deformed. Men struggle to deal with the pussified middle class world, and the drastic inhibitions placed on their sexuality.

Some people think male suicide is exaggerated. They claim that male and female suicide attempts are identical – only that males are more successful in this act of self-violence. But doesn’t that prove the point: that males are inherently different from females. Precisely the masculine ones are most likely to kill themselves.

Or maybe those girls just aren’t as desperate as the men.

These are just some of my ideas. But I would be eager to hear your interpretation.

Quote:The biggest killer of men under 45 in the UK is suicide.

Even if you already knew, just really think about that for a moment. Despite all the horrible diseases we could contract, accidents we could be in or potential ways we could kill each other, we’re still killing ourselves more frequently than any of those things.

What’s more, of the 6,000+ British lives lost to suicide each year, nearly 75 per cent of those are male.

So what the hell is going on inside our heads that leads us to take the ultimate step with such frightening regularity? The answer is actually quite simply: nobody knows, because we stubbornly refuse to talk to about it.

The Mental Health Foundation state that in England, “women are more likely than men to have common mental health problems” – almost three times as likely, according to some research.

But there’s no evidence to suggest depression hits men harder than women – we don’t get “manpressed”. What we do instead is bury our heads in the sand – or bottle, to be more accurate, as alcoholism rates for men in the UK are three times that of women.

Our depression is hidden away, and goes undiagnosed.

We’re not brought up to talk about our emotions, and when those emotions start to run away from us we’re not equipped to deal with it ourselves.

From the moment we’re born, young boys are described as being “big”, “strong” and “tough”. We’re told that “boys don’t cry” and we’re praised for “manning up” when we’re oh, so brave.

While the girls nurture Barbie, we’re encouraged to smash up Action Man. That may be a tad twee, but it’s a microcosm of the way our brains are formed to accept these roles from an early age.

As we get older, this constant barrage of affirmation when we show no fear begins to permeate into our very being.

By the time we reach puberty, and our brains are being pumped full of mind-bending hormones, it’s become a hard and fast rule that unless they are humorous or erotic, “feelings” are to be suppressed.

During those years our personalities go through numerous manifestations, but the one constant is that of emotional silence. And lo’, as we head towards adulthood, we’ve successfully neglected our emotional intellect all-but out of existence.

For many men, opening up about their feelings is the biggest social taboo. It’s what girls do, and there’s no bigger embarrassment for a “real man” than to be compared to a girl.

We need to start bringing our young boys up in a world where, of course, we try and teach mental resilience, but we explain how a huge part of that is the ability and willingness to talk about it.


There are an untold number of young men out there struggling to adapt to a world where they don’t have to break-backs in the coal mines or charge at machine guns in Northern Europe.

The world doesn’t need tough guys anymore – it needs guys willing to tell the rest of us when they’re sad. Even more importantly, it needs guys willing to break the taboo, and ask how we’re all really feeling.

link

Post: #2

Well I agree that it can't be due to "masculine ideals", since those seem to have declined at the same rate that male suicide has increased. There's no logical reason to think masculine ideals are an increasing cause of stress.

I completely agree that many struggle to deal with such a restricted and safe world. I think this is also the cause of women acting out and becoming blue-haired feminists; it's a rebellion against a society that will not dominate them in the way they crave.

Humans evolved in difficulty, they're simply not prepared to become as domesticated as they have been in the last 50 years. It's a terrible shock to their psychology.

Post: #3

Maybe it's because a lot of them are sexless incels who are surrounded by ugly women who still turn them down because they aren't jacked, tan, and making 6 figures? In a world where sex is incredibly glorified and prioritized, it must drive a man insane when he is not able to get it. I have heard of many men who threaten suicide after being dumped/cheated on too...

Post: #4

Not to mention the men who try to find help and are instead encouraged to commit suicide. There is no help for men today, only ridicule and abuse. And not just from the SJWs.

Please, be kind to men in pain.

Post: #5

(09-10-2016 01:37 PM)General Stalin Wrote:  Maybe it's because a lot of them are sexless incels who are surrounded by ugly women who still turn them down because they aren't jacked, tan, and making 6 figures? In a world where sex is incredibly glorified and prioritized, it must drive a man insane when he is not able to get it. I have heard of many men who threaten suicide after being dumped/cheated on too...

The #1 factor in male suicide is isolation. I've faced it myself in the past: being desperate for someone to give a shit, to care and care about, when most absolutely do NOT give a shit. Explanations like "expectations of masculine ideals" are hamsterizations of the worst kind - if that's what women loved, everyone would behave that way. Clearly some projection going on here...

Social media and the dissolution of "traditional" communities atomizes society and further exacerbates the problem. Nobody feels responsible for anyone.

I'm a fairly fit, active guy in my 30s, with a fun job that I love, probably somewhat more attractive than average, and I know from the past year's experience I have to work like an absolute dog to find companionship I enjoy. In the liberal West, you have to really want it to succeed. I recognize not everyone is up to the task.

I don't see the outlook looking terribly bright on these statistics in the near future, and it saddens me a lot.

Post: #6

With my recent experience there, I would have to say the women there massively contribute to this. I have never seen such simpish behavior by the men, and such mean nasty cunts than the women in the UK. The way they treat their men is perfectly acceptable in society there, and the men that take it there are the worst example of new age beta male/white knight simp you will ever see in your life. Loud mouth fakers, preppy, zero depth, impressed by the school you went to, and boring corporate drone titles, which seems to be the meaning of life to these folks. One guy pretended to be an Olympic level athlete, then entered this race and was spit out the back in a matter of minutes. He faked the whole thing to look impressive then came in last place, quickly... He ended up wasting a massive amount of money and time to do this race. I was laughing. To me it was indicative of this new yuppie class in the UK. Women regularly dress down their men in public, under the guise of "banter". No, its not banter dude, you're a cuck, and your girl thinks even less of you. Banter is for men, who actually have a sense of humor.

Arguably the worst woman I have ever dated was from the UK. I grew up with images of Samantha Fox and Princess Diana as the ideal woman, and that accent always gets me, especially from the north. But these woman are awful; back biting, no discretion, cottage cheese bodies, cheating, sleeping with everyone in their office, gossiping about everyone and everything in her life. I knew every dirty secret about everyone in her life, and I am sure they knew mine too. She broke up with me and its wrecked me. Two months later and I am still torn up over it. She manipulated me and it destroyed me, and I am taking it day by day now. If this study is true I believe it 100%.

If the men there cant accept the new British masculinity, its because they aren't allowed to show any, but don't even know that.

Post: #7

(09-10-2016 02:02 PM)XPQ22 Wrote:  The #1 factor in male suicide is isolation. I've faced it myself in the past: being desperate for someone to give a shit, to care and care about, when most absolutely do NOT give a shit. Explanations like "expectations of masculine ideals" are hamsterizations of the worst kind - if that's what women loved, everyone would behave that way. Clearly some projection going on here...

Social media and the dissolution of "traditional" communities atomizes society and further exacerbates the problem. Nobody feels responsible for anyone.

I'm a fairly fit, active guy in my 30s, with a fun job that I love, probably somewhat more attractive than average, and I know from the past year's experience I have to work like an absolute dog to find companionship I enjoy. In the liberal West, you have to really want it to succeed. I recognize not everyone is up to the task.

I don't see the outlook looking terribly bright on these statistics in the near future, and it saddens me a lot.

All very true. I'm an old man. No family of any kind. I have a job (a contract that is running out) that is tolerable, but my career is over. I live alone. I haven't been involved with anyone for almost 20 years now, and not for lack of trying. There really isn't anyone who gives a damn. If I was to drop dead right now, it would be many months before anyone noticed and that would be the poor schmuck from the bank after my home is foreclosed on.

Yeah, I'm done.

Post: #8

(09-10-2016 02:56 PM)chicane Wrote:  Yeah, I'm done.

BULLSHIT

I reject the notion!

Post: #9

Quote:The world doesn’t need tough guys anymore – it needs guys willing to tell the rest of us when they’re sad.

This reminds me of this video I saw where a guy goes to see an MRA talk and is asked why are you here and he says because a friend of his committed suicide and he was looking for answers. Meanwhile a group of feminists are blocking the entrance and calling the attendees human scum.

Recently, women have started to kill themselves at a higher rate too. And women are always ready to share their feelings so I thinks its just modern life that is doing us in.

Looking at the state of the USA, people face rejection in work and relationships a lot more today than in previous generations. This takes its toll on your well being.

I blame the destruction of the basic family unit, it gave all members support, value and meaning.

Post: #10

(09-10-2016 02:56 PM)chicane Wrote:  

(09-10-2016 02:02 PM)XPQ22 Wrote:  The #1 factor in male suicide is isolation. I've faced it myself in the past: being desperate for someone to give a shit, to care and care about, when most absolutely do NOT give a shit. Explanations like "expectations of masculine ideals" are hamsterizations of the worst kind - if that's what women loved, everyone would behave that way. Clearly some projection going on here...

Social media and the dissolution of "traditional" communities atomizes society and further exacerbates the problem. Nobody feels responsible for anyone.

I'm a fairly fit, active guy in my 30s, with a fun job that I love, probably somewhat more attractive than average, and I know from the past year's experience I have to work like an absolute dog to find companionship I enjoy. In the liberal West, you have to really want it to succeed. I recognize not everyone is up to the task.

I don't see the outlook looking terribly bright on these statistics in the near future, and it saddens me a lot.

All very true. I'm an old man. No family of any kind. I have a job (a contract that is running out) that is tolerable, but my career is over. I live alone. I haven't been involved with anyone for almost 20 years now, and not for lack of trying. There really isn't anyone who gives a damn. If I was to drop dead right now, it would be many months before anyone noticed and that would be the poor schmuck from the bank after my home is foreclosed on.

Yeah, I'm done.

I hear you man. Ever thought about going to SEA or South America?

Post: #11

Shit ton of men are killing themselves in the military, though people are circumspect about it and the real root causes.

G

Post: #12

(09-10-2016 04:00 PM)bigrich Wrote:  I hear you man. Ever thought about going to SEA or South America?

Yeah. I hope to have my house paid off within a year. That will improve my financial situation tremendously. My plan is to rent it out so that I will have enough income to travel. Unfortunately, I'm not terribly attracted to brown girls, I find my own kind, really pale and freckled women the most attractive. I don't know how it will play out.

I've been having a really rough time, I don't know if I can make it. All I can do is hang on. It's not like there's any sort of support or community for somebody like me.

Post: #13

(09-10-2016 02:56 PM)chicane Wrote:  If I was to drop dead right now, it would be many months before anyone noticed and that would be the poor schmuck from the bank after my home is foreclosed on.

Obviously this happens more to men than women, though I think that especially in cities the isolation and fragmentation of human beings is dire, and it can even happen to young and not too bad looking women:



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joyce_Vincent

This woman lay for three years unnoticed in her London apartment after she died.

There was a documentary about her:





It is a sad feature of modern life we really don't want to think about. And if it happens to you or me, don't count on the documentary.

Post: #14

Sometimes I wonder if the long lifespan provided to us by western civilization is actually a curse, and we would all be better off hunting, warring, fucking, and ultimately dying in the prime of our lives.

Post: #15

(09-10-2016 04:12 PM)chicane Wrote:  

(09-10-2016 04:00 PM)bigrich Wrote:  I hear you man. Ever thought about going to SEA or South America?

Yeah. I hope to have my house paid off within a year. That will improve my financial situation tremendously. My plan is to rent it out so that I will have enough income to travel. Unfortunately, I'm not terribly attracted to brown girls, I find my own kind, really pale and freckled women the most attractive. I don't know how it will play out.

I've been having a really rough time, I don't know if I can make it. All I can do is hang on. It's not like there's any sort of support or community for somebody like me.

I would recommend joining a church group. (dead serious). It's a great way to get back out of your shell and put some action into your life.

Post: #16

(09-10-2016 01:41 PM)chicane Wrote:  Not to mention the men who try to find help and are instead encouraged to commit suicide. There is no help for men today, only ridicule and abuse. And not just from the SJWs.

Please, be kind to men in pain.

There's also the fact that the help that's offered tends to be either ineffective or counterproductive. When you're depressed, people will sometimes tell you, "Your depression is fuckin' annoying. Snap out of it. There are people whose situation is much worse than yours, so you have no reason to be depressed. Those who are less fortunate find it downright offensive that you're crying over your petty first world problems."

This is basically the "On your feet, soldier!" approach, the idea being that you can just decide to be happy, "fake it till you make it," etc. But if the situation seems so hopeless that you're having trouble just snapping out of your depression, you may feel bad that now not only do you feel like shit, but other people as well are finding your depression burdensome.

Or friends will give you "the western dismissal," i.e. they'll tell you to go see a shrink who has the qualifications needed to help you. Shrinks can push pills at you (some of which may push you over the edge to committing suicide) or offer you some different ways of looking at your situation, but have very little useful advice for fixing the problems in your life that are making you feel like a failure. They are not in a position to be giving you politically incorrect red pill truth, even if they were aware of it.

I wonder how many guys forums like RVF have saved from suicide, by helping them overcome one-itis, lack of game, etc. that gets in the way of their goals. Probably a lot of suicidal guys don't mention that they feel that way, out of concern that people will focus on saying "dude, don't kill yourself" rather than giving the actionable advice needed to help them live a happier life. So they just open a discussion about their problem, and give the facts, rather than saying just how bad it's making them feel. Then they get the help they need, and we never realize how close they were to the edge.

When you admit to feeling suicidal, people are liable to think, "I better not invest too much in this guy, because it will all be wasted if he kills himself. He's weak, and it's better to be allied with the strong." Even if you are weak, it's better to project as much confidence as you can, so that others can be inspired by the idealized image you put forth of being a strong man.

Post: #17

(09-10-2016 02:56 PM)chicane Wrote:  All very true. I'm an old man. No family of any kind. I have a job (a contract that is running out) that is tolerable, but my career is over. I live alone. I haven't been involved with anyone for almost 20 years now, and not for lack of trying. There really isn't anyone who gives a damn. If I was to drop dead right now, it would be many months before anyone noticed and that would be the poor schmuck from the bank after my home is foreclosed on.

Yeah, I'm done.

WOW - you don't know how lucky you are. There are ton middle ages guys out there who are stuck in a dysfunctional relationship working themselves to death in a dead end job. They're in debt up to their necks, their fat wife despises them, they have little left to live for.

YOU - are free as a bird my friend. You have no attachments and the only prison that is keeping you from enjoying the rest of your life is in your mind. Detach yourself from all the junk that's locking you down, force yourself out of your comfort zone. Sell all the useless shit, buy a flight ticket to some place you always dreamed of going. Go out there into the world and enjoy whatever is left of your life. The clock is ticking right now and once you're dust it'll be for eternity. Stop whining and start living.

Post: #18

I wanted to post something for all you guys who feel that life is overwhelming and that you're pretty much ready to bite the dust, so to say. Look, something you absolutely should deeply reflect on is how fragile and precious life is and how lucky you are to be part of it. The universe is fucking HUGE and our lives are truly meaningless in the big scope of the cosmos. Click on the video below - set it full screen and then meet me below:





See what I'm saying? In the big scope of it all do you really think all of your or my problems mean anything at all? At all?? No they don't. Remember what Carl Sagan said:





Here we are, stuck on that little blue dot at some far flung corner of our galaxy, thinking that our life is so special and that we deserve so many things. We have all these expectations in our heads and perhaps we are disappointed that our existence hasn't turned out the way we thought.

Get over it. Today's the first day of the rest of your life on our little blue dot. How much of it have you explored? Are you going to just sit around feeling sorry for yourself until your time is up? Fuck no - you're going to go out there and make a difference. We live in a truly amazing age and if you want to find yourself on the other side of the planet tomorrow afternoon then you can do that. We are only limited by our imagination and our mental inertia. Challenge yourself and get out of your comfort zone. Become the person you always wanted to be. But it starts now.

P.S. Fuck psychiatrists and those damn groups. You're a man for fuck's sake - snap out of it. Life isn't fair. Boohoo - now go out there and do something about it.

Post: #19

One of the best cures for depression is to find God. Too bad walking into many Churches today is just as likely to lead you astray as it will help a man find God.

It's seriously an uphill battle for tons of men, but finding a good Church is easily the best way to root oneself into a community of love.

Also, there is the Philippines.

Post: #20

(09-10-2016 04:57 PM)Enoch Wrote:  I would recommend joining a church group. (dead serious). It's a great way to get back out of your shell and put some action into your life.

I know you are serious. It didn't work. Churches have fallen too deeply into the feminist narrative. At best I am tolerated. And as an old man who has never married and never had children, I'm too much of an oddball.

I actually took a couple of part time semesters in seminary, it was life changing but I learned how much I was hated by the church.

And don't think I don't get out, I do but I am such an outsider it sometimes hurts a lot.

Post: #21

(09-10-2016 01:37 PM)General Stalin Wrote:  In a world where sex is incredibly glorified and prioritized, it must drive a man insane when he is not able to get it.

It does and I was one of those people. This sounds like a white knighting post but sadly a lot of men I know are brothers until it comes to the subject of pussy. A lot of men, unlike women, lack an appropriate network from friends and family dealing with issues with the opposite sex. I've noticed when women get dumped, their friends, mothers, sisters, etc. are comforting her and will offer her help. When men get dumped, it's nobody's fault but his, he has no game, he's a loser, etc. Before sites like these came up and other game resources I HATED life and was a virgin the majority of college. This was the early 2000s; post-new wave feminism but before The Game came out and launched a PUA revolution giving incels everywhere some shred of hope and teaching them how to deal with these women. I asked friends and other guys for advice on women and how to get them and all I kept hearing was "chill out" and "stop being so desperate". Men who were friends with me recently became dicks once they started getting laid. They teased me for not getting laid but refused to help when I asked for it. I got more help from women during this dark period than any guy. Hell, it was one of my female friends who helped me lose my virginity. I could discuss other divisive subjects such as politics and sports with other guys in a civilized manner but when it came to women it was a constant game of one-upmanship.

Some men just can't be happy with what they have, but feel the need to put down others who are not getting it.

(09-10-2016 03:52 PM)bigrich Wrote:  I blame the destruction of the basic family unit, it gave all members support, value and meaning.

This is a big one too and is even more pronounced among men. With the rise in absentee fathers and the grandfathers who were born prior to WWII dying out (a lot of these men became dads all over again to their grandchildren because their sons or son-in-laws couldn't properly handle the role) a lot of men don't have the proper foundation to deal with the world once they leave home. A lot of guys feel isolated and alone even in their own families, which are becoming increasingly female dominated. They don't learn how to play sports, talk to women, fix a car, and other masculine traits and once they grow older it starts to hit home. There is no dad to call when life gets tough, or no brothers or uncles to do any masculine activities with. A lot of these men are desperate to start their own families to right the wrongs they had growing up, but do not have the proper skills and masculine traits to attract a woman to have one with.

(09-10-2016 06:43 PM)chicane Wrote:  I know you are serious. It didn't work. Churches have fallen too deeply into the feminist narrative. At best I am tolerated. And as an old man who has never married and never had children, I'm too much of an oddball.

I actually took a couple of part time semesters in seminary, it was life changing but I learned how much I was hated by the church.

If you can find a good church it can so wonders. It helped me immensely. I found a church in the metro DC area that had a men's group and I never went without support or anything to do during the weekends. We went to concerts, sporting events, movies, etc. Nobody mentioned my singleness (most of the guys were married or partnered) or thought of it as a problem. What type of church did you attend?

Post: #22

(09-10-2016 04:12 PM)chicane Wrote:  

(09-10-2016 04:00 PM)bigrich Wrote:  I hear you man. Ever thought about going to SEA or South America?

Yeah. I hope to have my house paid off within a year. That will improve my financial situation tremendously. My plan is to rent it out so that I will have enough income to travel. Unfortunately, I'm not terribly attracted to brown girls, I find my own kind, really pale and freckled women the most attractive. I don't know how it will play out.

I've been having a really rough time, I don't know if I can make it. All I can do is hang on. It's not like there's any sort of support or community for somebody like me.

You got one right here. Me and the rest of the men on this forum. It's not a real live human presence, but we understand you and some of us here have got to be able to help, even if indirectly.

Even if you never get laid again (you will), even if everything goes to shit (some things will, some won't), no matter how bad you've fucked up somewhere, at the end of the day you just have to stand tall, look at the world around you, and smirk with defiance.

This life is like a packed bar-- when you're out of favor don't leave willingly, make the bastards throw you out.

Post: #23

(09-10-2016 07:45 PM)Germanicus Wrote:  Even if you never get laid again (you will), even if everything goes to shit (some things will, some won't), no matter how bad you've fucked up somewhere, at the end of the day you just have to stand tall, look at the world around you, and smirk with defiance.

This life is like a packed bar-- when you're out of favor don't leave willingly, make the bastards throw you out.

Yep, I agree, things will get better. When I was in college, I smoked and drank regularly over depression being a virgin and thought I'd die an old man without pussy.

In the decade since then, I've been laid seven times and had one LTR. I'm not where I want to be exactly, but I eventually pulled out of my funk. Sometimes a drastic change of scenery could do. A buddy of mine who graduated a virgin in college and didn't even get head during that period moved to Israel and now is in a LTR with an Israeli woman. He moved there originally to discover his roots (he's Jewish) but found a sense of who he was and attracted a good woman. For some men, their place of birth and where there family is isn't necessarily "home".

Post: #24

My 2 cents is the number one cause is guilt. After my divorce in my blue bill days I though about suicide. I've never suffered from depression and or thought of it before or since. After my divorce I couldn't even look at my parents in the face. Felt like I had let them down.

Post: #25

Mickey Rourke talked about his own suicide attempt. His dog saved him from it. Came right up to him as he sat contemplating death in his closet and said with his eyes:

"If you off yourself here, if you leave me like this, who will love me? Who will feed me?" Mickey put the gun down and decided to live on.

On the subject of pets, take care to make arrangements before your expiration day comes for the sake of your furry faithful ones. Dog. Cat. Parrot. Whatever.

If you fly to the Philippines to escape the matrix, ensure that your cat or dog will be looked after if (heaven forbid) the plane goes down into the ocean. A church member (or even a maid) being told you're going to be out of town and they should check up on them wouldn't be a bad idea.