Post: #26

^^^ El Mech is right, but so is DOBA.

There is a decaying of the rule of law in the West with laws being selectively enforced.

Will focusing on the negative help you live the happiest most fulfilling life you can? No. A balance is required between not sticking your head in the sand, but not getting dragged down by things you cannot change.

Don't rely on society to change. Look for a personal solution, whether its forming a local community of like minded people, or moving to a country that has a stronger rule of law (and good luck with that).

Post: #27

(01-06-2016 09:09 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  Just turn your computer off man and go get some ice cream.

Ironically, the one place where I do see those surfer girls* I referenced in my post is at the local ice cream place, which here in Maryland is called Rita's.

I'm too old for these girls now. But if you're in college and need a summer job, I'd strongly recommend applying to one of these places. You'll be swimming in it.

This happened to me once at a pizza place when I was 18 and I wish I'd stayed longer. I was too annoyed about crappy pay and bad working conditions to appreciate that I was surrounded by a revolving door of babes in their late teens and early twenties. Gotta live in the moment.

* My slang for those healthy-looking, fresh-faced, clean-cut, perky All-American girls that seem to proliferate when you're in your late teens is "surfer girls." Doesn't mean they surf. They just fit a classic American archetype.

Post: #28

When it comes to meltdown threads like these, the question isn't whether OP is right or wrong. Being right doesn't earn you anything.

Your time is best spent developing your existence, so that no matter what happens, you'll have good options.

So my question for you (and anyone else) is, "considering that you believe this, what are you going to do in response?"

Post: #29

The law is only as good as the disincentives for getting caught. Right now, as Korben pointed out rather solidly, one has every incentive to break the law when it suits him.

Post: #30

(01-06-2016 11:51 PM)Suits Wrote:  "considering that you believe this, what are you going to do in response?"

As aware western men, the best thing we can do is exactly whats preached on this forum daily; work out and get in the best shape possible, eat healthy, pickup hobbies that generally interest you, teach yourself new things, meet other alpha guys, bang hot sluts, maybe find yourself a nice conservative woman, have kids, and if you live in the USA, buy guns.

This year as the downfall accelerates, I plan to start an ecommerce business so I can be mobile, get the fuck out of Massachusetts and setup homebase in a state like Tennessee, Utah, Texas etc. so I can buy guns like an American, distance myself from the SJW berniefags, and be surrounded by like minded people. Eventually I will get to the point where its time to seek out the right woman to have a big family with.

The biggest thing holding us back is the divorce rape culture, but we cant let that stop us from having families, otherwise we let everything the great men before us built die. I forget whether I read it hear or somewhere else, but recently someone said something about how conservatives have for a while been and continue to outbreed liberals, we need to continue that trend. It would be in our best interests to eventually settle down and have 3 or more kids.

Post: #31

There is serious confusion about what the Rule of Law actually is here.

DoBA, your analogy is flawed. You say 'if they won't obey the law, why should I?' The point is that criminals, by definition, break the law. Some get caught and punished, and generally the most competent ones get away with it time after time. Thus it is, and thus it has always been. The only real complaint in this instance is that the criminals aren't indigenous (a reasonable complaint to make). It is absolutely true that increasing numbers of people, many without papers identifying them, pose some almost Kafka-esque problems for the justice system. This may increasingly be the case as we (in the UK, at least) increasingly make cutbacks to front line policing and the court system more generally.

The Rule of Law has always been a kind of contract between citizens, essentially to protect property rights, that provides a set of principles we can rely on when conducting our affairs, and a mechanism for redress should our ability to exercise our property rights be infringed by another (property rights here extend to your physical person). Since the dawn of civilization, which has come about largely due to the Rule of Law, there have been people who have breached this contract and got away with it, often more egregiously than these migrants are doing now.

What the Rule of Law is not, is a guarantee of redress, or of justice in all cases. Again, this is why history is littered with examples of otherwise law abiding citizens who have been failed by the justice system, and who have taken the law into their own hands. It is not perfect, and it is not a panacea. Abuses of power happen and have always happened. For example, if police construct evidence to obtain a conviction, or the Government in a civil case simply uses the fact that it has limitless financial reserves to string out the case until you go bankrupt, an injustice has been done, but the Rule of Law has not failed, not in any way that it could ever have meaningfully succeeded.

The Rule of Law is also, necessarily, reactive. It makes no sense to claim it is destroyed because the migrants are coming in their droves. The fact of the matter is that if it is unconstitutional or illegal, then the Rule of Law does provide a mechanism for holding the government to account - but it is necessarily something that happens after the fact. That does not make the invasion desirable, or sensible, but it doesn't mean the rule of law has been blown wide open either.

Finally, as Lizard has said, we are not yet at a point where people are being dragged out of their houses at night. I don't doubt that the journalist that was mentioned is being harangued by the state, or that it is a gross abuse of power. But these things have always happened, even in our civilized countries. It is not a good thing, it is not something we should necessarily lie down and accept, but it is and has always been a reality that if you poke a bear you are either naive or courageous, and either way dealing with the consequences is on you. For actual attempts to separate you from your freedom, we still have jury trial in the West. You are not going to prison without 12 of your peers finding you guilty. It is not, and has never been, a perfect protection against the excesses of the state, but it is a real and substantial protection, and there has been no attempt to remove it. This is no guarantee that the state won't fit you up and construct evidence to suit its case, but with an independent judiciary, a jury of your peers, free use over the internet etc etc, not to mention the consciences of the many people who would need to be involved in such a stitch up, you have significant protection before the law.

Far from the Rule of Law being broken, it is still your strongest, best developed, and most potent weapon in the fight against real injustice. This is because in the eyes of nearly every law abiding citizen, it has total legitimacy. The power of an institution that commands near universal respect like that is immeasurable - indeed, in many respects the legal system has power far in excess of the state, far more so than the armed resistance of a few individuals.

This is not to say it won't be corrupted in future, that there won't continue to be abuses, that the police will enforce the law against migrants, or anything else. It may happen, but it is pure speculation at this point. I agree with Lizard that the most likely scenario is the creation of ghettos, a kind of voluntary segregation. Laws may evolve and adapt, as they have done for the best part of a millennium here in the UK, and citizens may very well find themselves being sympathetically treated when they take action in response to real or perceived threats from the invaders.


Finally, this readiness to throw out the rule of law is symptomatic of many other similarly negative posts here, a good cross-section of which can be seen on the front page of this sub-forum, and shows a loss of hope. There is a great readiness, and indeed enthusiasm, to attack or throw out the instruments of civilization that have brought us to this unparalleled point in human development, but it is motivated by despair, not by hope, and to my mind is therefore doomed. The impulse is destructive, and is perverse in its destructiveness - it is hatred, and an enthusiasm for oblivion driven by fear.


Edit:

Here is an excellent video advocating sound PERSEC principles for all aspiring freedom fighters:

Post: #32

Hmm, are you Paul Craig Roberts? Funny, I just read this article on Infowars.
http://www.infowars.com/the-rule-of-law-...ilization/

The Rule Of Law No Longer Exists In Western Civilization
My work documenting how the law was lost began about a quarter of a century ago.

A close friend and distinguished attorney, Dean Booth, first brought to my attention the erosion of the legal principles on which rests the rule of law in the United States. My columns on the subject got the attention of an educational institution that invited me to give a lecture on the subject. Subsequently, I was invited to give a lecture on “How The Law Was Lost” at the Benjamin Cardozo School of Law in New York City.

The work coalesced into a book, The Tyranny Of Good Intentions, coauthored with my research associate, Lawrence M. Stratton, published in 2000, with an expanded edition published in 2008. We were able to demonstrate that Sir Thomas More’s warning about prosecutors and courts disregarding law in order to more easily convict undesirables and criminals has had the result of turning law away from being a shield of the people and making it into a weapon in the hands of government. That is what we witness in the saga of the Hammonds, long-time ranchers in the Harney Basin of Oregon.

With the intervention of Ammon Bundy, another rancher who suffered illegal persecution by the Bureau of Land Management but stood them off with help from armed militia, and his supporters, the BLM’s decades long persecution of the innocent Hammonds might have come to a crisis before you read this.

Bundy and militiamen, whose count varies from 15 to 150 in the presstitute media, have seized an Oregon office of the BLM as American liberty’s protest against the frame-up of the Hammonds on false charges. As I write the Oregon National Guard and FBI are on the way.

The militiamen have said that they are prepared to die for principles, and the rule of law is one of them. Of course, the presstitute media is making the militiamen into the lawbreakers—and even calling them terrorists—and not the federal government’s illegal prosecution of the Hammonds, whose crime was their refusal to sell their ranch to the government to be included in the Masher National Wildlife Refuge.

If there are only 15 militiamen, there is a good chance that they will all be killed, but if there are 150 armed militiamen prepared for a shootout, the outcome could be different.

I cannot attest to the accuracy of this report of the situation:https://www.superstation95.com/index.php/world/723 The resources required to verify the information in this account of how the government escalated a “crisis” out of the refusal of a family to bend is beyond the resources of this website. However, the story fits perfectly with everything Lawrence Stratton and I learned over the years that we prepared our book on how the law was lost. This account of the persecution of the Hammonds is the way government behaves when government has broken free of the rule of law.

I can attest with full confidence that the United States no longer has a rule of law. The USA is a lawless country. By that I do not mean what conservative Republicans mean, which is, if I understand them, that racial minorities violate law with something close to impunity.

What I mean is that only the mega-banks and the One Percent have legal protection, and that is because these people control the government. For everyone else law is a weapon in the hands of the government to be used against the American people.

The fact that the shield of law no longer exists for American citizens is why, according to US Department of Justice statistics, only 4 percent of federal felonies ever go to trial. Almost the entirety of federal felonies are settled by coerced plea bargains that force defendants to admit to crimes that they did not commit in order to avoid “expanded indictments” that, if presented to the typical stupid, trusting, gullible American “jury of their peers,” would lock them away for hundreds of years.

American justice is a joke. It does not exist. You can see this in the American prison population. “Freedom and Democracy” America not only has the largest percentage of its population in prison thanany country on the planet, but also the largest number of prisoners.

If you consider that “authoritarian” China has four times the population of the United States but fewer prisoners, you understand that “authoritarian” China has a more protective rule of law than the United States.

Compared to “freedom and democracy America,” Russia has hardly anyone in prison. Yet, Washington and its media whores have defined the President of Russia as “the new Hitler.”

The only thing we can conclude from the facts is that the United States Government and those ignorant fools who worship it are evil incarnate.

Out of evil comes dictatorship. The White House Fool, at best a two-bit punk, has decided that he doesn’t like the Second Amendment to the US Constitution any more than he likes any of the other constitutional protections of US citizens. He is looking for dictatorial methods, that is, unlegislated executive orders, to overturn the Second Amendment. He has the corrupt US Department of Justice, a criminal organization, looking for ways for the dictator to overturn both Congressional legislation and Supreme Court rulings.

The media whores have fallen in line with the would-be dictator. All we hear is “gun violence.” If only Karl Marx were still with us. He would ridicule those who turn inanimate objects into purposeful actors. It is extraordinary that the American left-wing thinks that guns, not people, kill people.

The position of the “progressive left-wing” in the United States is perplexing. Here are Americans, immersed into a police state, as are the Hammonds, and the progressive left-wing wants to disarm the population.

Whatever this “progressive left-wing opposition” is, it has nothing in common with revolutionaries. The American left-wing is totally irrevelant, a defeated force that sold out and no longer represents the people or the truth.

Even more astonishing, judging by comments on RT’s report on the situation and the readers comments, all RT and American blacks want to know is where is the National Guard in Oregon? Why isn’t it called out against the White militia protests as it was called out against the Black Ferguson protests?https://www.rt.com/usa/327809-bundy-militia-oregon-reaction/
If protesting the murder of a young black American by Ferguson police is not legitimate and the protesters are “terrorists,” why aren’t the Oregon protestors terrorists for trying to protect jailbirds from their “lawful sentence”? This is the wrong question.

It really is discouraging that the American black community is unable to understand that if any American can be dispossessed, all Americans can be dispossessed.

It is also discouraging that RT decided to play the race card instead of comprehending that law is no longer a shield of the American people but is a weapon in the hands of Washington.

Why doesn’t RT at least listen to the President of Russia, who states repeatedly that America and the West are lawless.

Putin is correct. America and its vassals are lawless. No one is safe from the government.

Post: #33

(01-06-2016 09:09 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  Just turn your computer off man and go get some ice cream.

El Mechanico you're starting to sound like a social justice warrior!

Post: #34

Agreed, but rule of law in the West still varies country to country.

In America, the rule of law is still very strong even if quite corrupted. Non-whites still can be jailed and imprisoned, evidenced by their high incarceration rates. Illegal aliens are bullshit but you can still kill them with guns if they do a house robbery or something. The big giant banks at the top are all illegal and unjust, but good luck stealing their phony money or suing them in court. It wouldn't make sense to completely ignore the rule of law in America and go around robbing banks and hurting more innocents just because a bunch of other cocksuckers are working under the table. There needs to be a measure of proportion. So observing MOST laws in America is still good.

However, in Germany, Sweden, Britain, or France, I would say there is no rule of law but basic morals still should guide your behaviors. You cannot count on the police in these countries to do anything, they seem mostly harmless because the governments have defanged them. So in these cases, I wouldn't feel bad about beating up Syrians who are too close to my home, or anything like that. Self-defense comes into your own hands, but the government bans guns there and I wouldn't feel bad about obtaining a gun there by almost any means necessary. Break the laws that are necessary but it doesn't mean you should let the country disintegrate into every man for himself.

In times of lawlessness, it's up to you to find other good spirited men to restore order and punish criminals. That's how all societies are created. Police are just specialists who make this their full time job, but if the police are taken apart due to politics then it's a legit case for rebellion and revolution. I certainly would not be paying my taxes in Germany.

If there is any man who thinks the rule of law applies in Germany, then congrats you aren't much different than the cuck who let a Syrian man stay with him and his girl. As an American, I would never stand for such a situation and would rather die before living like a slave coward cuck, and I would take down as many assholes as possible with me.

Post: #35

Korben's a good guy and has always been a level-headed dude. Which is why I when I read his original post, I thought he was having a rough patch.

Hang in there, man. Don't let the bullshit get you down. The dorks out there want you to feel helpless and powerless, but that's not the case. You have the power to take control of your life.

But I think does have a point about there being a feeling of incipient breakdown in the air. It's hard to put your finger on, but it's there. One gets the feeling that the moral connective tissues that used to hold society together are slowly being dissolved.

Even so, all we can do about it is what we're doing now.

Hang in there, Korben.

Post: #36

(01-07-2016 04:07 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  Korben's a good guy and has always been a level-headed dude. Which is why I when I read his original post, I thought he was having a rough patch.

Hang in there, man. Don't let the bullshit get you down. The dorks out there want you to feel helpless and powerless, but that's not the case. You have the power to take control of your life.

But I think does have a point about there being a feeling of incipient breakdown in the air. It's hard to put your finger on, but it's there. One gets the feeling that the moral connective tissues that used to hold society together are slowly being dissolved.

Even so, all we can do about it is what we're doing now.

Hang in there, Korben.

Did you read his other thread? The dude had quite a meltdown I must say.

Hopefully he can clear his head during his 7 day suspension.