Post: #176

(06-22-2013 10:32 PM)MrRoundtree Wrote:  I've never heard of a really high end scene in Montreal and if you call 737, Ballroom or 1234 that, guess what, those club are some of the shittiest in the city.. nothing compares with NY or Miami for high end scene, at least for the east coast..

KOKO was high end, although I guessed it closed and has a new name.

Wood 35 was pretty high end.

New City Gas on Thurs was high end. So was Cavalli on Thurs.

Buonotte and Time are what I would call pretty high end.

Rosalie was pretty high end on Wed and Sat.

The restaurants are high end.

Kind of depends on what you consider "high end". Is Montreal "Monaco High End" ie Masserati's and a 47 Euros ($60) price tag for 2 Goose and sodas? No.

Although I would agree nothing quite matches NYC or Miami.

The more I travel, I am coming to the conclusion that nowhere matches NYC or Miami.

However, I have said before on here, if someone can steer me in the direction of a "Miami Beach" with $6 cocktails, I might have just found my new Shangri-la.

Post: #177

(06-23-2013 10:32 AM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

(06-22-2013 02:54 PM)pbw Wrote:  With a tight budget and basics pua skills, you may as well forget Montreal women.

I would say you are dead in the water with the high end scene there.

I don't really know the low end scene in Montreal.

G, the low end scene in Montreal is basically all I know because I was a broke ass student while living there and my budget for a night out was about $50 and I still managed to have a good time. As I mentioned above, I used to hit up Saint Sulpice and Foufounes, two other bars I used to go to were Peel Pub (very cheap drinks) and Cafe Campus. That was back in 01' and 05' so I don't know if those places are good any more, but they were always packed when I went. Maybe some of you guys who aren't doing so well in the swankier clubs should try those out and see how you do. As I said, quality of women isn't the best, but the drinks are cheap and the crowds are rowdy.

Post: #178

Cafe Campus is a cegep/1st year university bar... girls are easily impressed there but will often be with their social circle and the bar attract girls that are in the 4--7 range. It's not a snobby bar so its easy to approach but overall the quality isn't that great (often girls with jeans) and most of you experienced better I'm sure.

I agree about Buennanote, Cavalli and Time (supperclub) they are somewhat upperclass bars but the people there are not upperclass, mostly showing off, I never felt the vibe of these nightclubs. Buennanote is a bit more hispanic.

Rouge might be one of the best clubs for quality of girls but again they let most of the scum enter as long as they dress well.

I would call those bars upper class bars (besides Bily Kun but this one is more suited for dates): http://www.nightlife.ca/sorties/7-bars-m...-grown-ups

Montreal will always be first and foremost a bar/pub city and never a club city. A lot of bars are upperclass indeed but not the nightclubs and that was my point. Montreal needs more bars with electro music like in Europe or huge dancefloors with reknown DJ like Razzmatazz to truly be one of the best party city. But in term of pubs/bars its there with the best.


I agree also that the restaurants are upper class, I'm taking my next date to Le Filet next time, can't wait to try it.

Post: #179

Just got back from one week in Montreal. Back in the TO dungeon. I must say Montreal is a vibrant city -- I would also rate it among the world's best. It has a lot going for it.

However, Montreal women are by no means easy. If you have lots of money to spend, then yes some Montreal women may be accessible. My luck this time with women was zero -- though I did go out quite a bit --day and night. Things just never clicked. I did meet a girl outside club 281 --but I sensed her to be a gold digger -- though she was very friendly -- I gave up on her.

Even the famous Montreal porn producer Bruno B said: He was tired of going to clubs and buying girls drinks all night and never getting laid.

I will go again to Montreal -- have not given up on t just yet.

Post: #180

(06-23-2013 09:30 PM)MrRoundtree Wrote:  Montreal will always be first and foremost a bar/pub city and never a club city. A lot of bars are upperclass indeed but not the nightclubs and that was my point. Montreal needs more bars with electro music like in Europe or huge dancefloors with reknown DJ like Razzmatazz to truly be one of the best party city. But in term of pubs/bars its there with the best.

Very good point. When I think back to my experiences in Montreal, it's the bars that stand out.

Montreal is a place to consider living in or posting up in for a while. You can really carve out a nice niche with all of the talent you find out there. It's more accessible than NYC and the talent is also better pound for pound. One of the few places, and probably the best place, in North America you can say that about.

Post: #181

(06-25-2013 12:25 AM)pbw Wrote:  Just got back from one week in Montreal. Back in the TO dungeon. I must say Montreal is a vibrant city -- I would also rate it among the world's best. It has a lot going for it.

However, Montreal women are by no means easy. If you have lots of money to spend, then yes some Montreal women may be accessible. My luck this time with women was zero -- though I did go out quite a bit --day and night. Things just never clicked. I did meet a girl outside club 281 --but I sensed her to be a gold digger -- though she was very friendly -- I gave up on her.

I have been saying that all along. The "easy" part of Montreal girls is hype.

America is easier than Montreal.

However, I would rate Montreal easier than South American cities ie Buenos, Bogota, etc and many people on here claim Colombia is the easiest place in the world, so what do I know?

----

Give us some insight, what places were holding the most/hottest girls on which nights?

It is prime time there right now. I actually liked June the best of the 4 months I spent there.

(06-25-2013 08:45 AM)Hencredible Casanova Wrote:  

(06-23-2013 09:30 PM)MrRoundtree Wrote:  Montreal will always be first and foremost a bar/pub city and never a club city. A lot of bars are upperclass indeed but not the nightclubs and that was my point. Montreal needs more bars with electro music like in Europe or huge dancefloors with reknown DJ like Razzmatazz to truly be one of the best party city. But in term of pubs/bars its there with the best.

Very good point. When I think back to my experiences in Montreal, it's the bars that stand out.

Montreal is a place to consider living in or posting up in for a while. You can really carve out a nice niche with all of the talent you find out there. It's more accessible than NYC and the talent is also better pound for pound. One of the few places, and probably the best place, in North America you can say that about.

Interesting.

I pretty much hit lounges, restaurants and clubs. Some Gentleman's clubs.

Not really any bars.

But the lines get pretty blurred. I wouldn't really consider Philemon or Santos a "bar" but Philemon was on that list of "7 bars in Montreal", so, again, what do I know?

However, I kind of hated Philemon and Santos.

I really think the restaurants are what stood out for me in Montreal.

Here is how I break it down:

Bars: Didn't like.

Lounges: Good quality.

Gentleman's clubs: Decent in the whole scheme of things, but nothing on Vegas or New Orleans.

Clubs: Real good. Nothing on Miami or NYC. But better than anywhere in the entire state of California.

Restaurants: Great. Behind NYC. Possibly on par with SF and Chicago. That good.

I am real interested to see what Quebec City holds for me this summer.

Post: #182

My experience is that Montreal women are very nationalistic and they don't really care for anglo phones or foreigners. They want to protect their culture from outsiders. However, most of them are also broke with little money. They have a high sense of fashion and culture. So they need money and they see foreigners as having it. They also know about game and pua tactics. So they relent bc they have to. Montreal however is more anglo than franco phone imo. So there is an interesting delima going on. The only thing keeping separatists at bay is the weakening economy. Should the economy ever strengthen -- so would the separatists. That isn't likely to happen anytime soon if ever.

Unfortunately for me, I usually have a very tight budget. I travel now quite a few times a year, but I manage to do this by getting last minute specials and staying at cheap hotels and cheap dining. Why blow all your money on one trip?

So this makes it difficult for me in particular when I go to Montreal -- and I am also a bit older. Can't go after the young ones but still try once in a bit.

Without http://www.meetup.com though, Montreal for me would be very isolating and not worth it to go. I was able to attend quite a few parties, social events and hikings trips , dining etc -- things that I was really interested in -- like environmental and animal rights, Men's Rights, Health seminars, speed dating, business meetings etc - all through meet up.

So everyday while there, I had a good amount of things to do and meeting a lot of new montrealers.

Basically I am thinking now - don't go to Montreal for the women -- but for the culture and a good time. If you get women while there consider it a bonus.

You still can't beat Latin America for the women.

Post: #183

(06-25-2013 10:35 AM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

(06-25-2013 12:25 AM)pbw Wrote:  Just got back from one week in Montreal. Back in the TO dungeon. I must say Montreal is a vibrant city -- I would also rate it among the world's best. It has a lot going for it.

However, Montreal women are by no means easy. If you have lots of money to spend, then yes some Montreal women may be accessible. My luck this time with women was zero -- though I did go out quite a bit --day and night. Things just never clicked. I did meet a girl outside club 281 --but I sensed her to be a gold digger -- though she was very friendly -- I gave up on her.

I have been saying that all along. The "easy" part of Montreal girls is hype.

America is easier than Montreal.

However, I would rate Montreal easier than South American cities ie Buenos, Bogota, etc and many people on here claim Colombia is the easiest place in the world, so what do I know?

----

Give us some insight, what places were holding the most/hottest girls on which nights?

It is prime time there right now. I actually liked June the best of the 4 months I spent there.

(06-25-2013 08:45 AM)Hencredible Casanova Wrote:  

(06-23-2013 09:30 PM)MrRoundtree Wrote:  Montreal will always be first and foremost a bar/pub city and never a club city. A lot of bars are upperclass indeed but not the nightclubs and that was my point. Montreal needs more bars with electro music like in Europe or huge dancefloors with reknown DJ like Razzmatazz to truly be one of the best party city. But in term of pubs/bars its there with the best.

Very good point. When I think back to my experiences in Montreal, it's the bars that stand out.

Montreal is a place to consider living in or posting up in for a while. You can really carve out a nice niche with all of the talent you find out there. It's more accessible than NYC and the talent is also better pound for pound. One of the few places, and probably the best place, in North America you can say that about.

Interesting.

I pretty much hit lounges, restaurants and clubs. Some Gentleman's clubs.

Not really any bars.

But the lines get pretty blurred. I wouldn't really consider Philemon or Santos a "bar" but Philemon was on that list of "7 bars in Montreal", so, again, what do I know?

However, I kind of hated Philemon and Santos.

I really think the restaurants are what stood out for me in Montreal.

Restaurants: Great. Behind NYC. Possibly on par with SF and Chicago. That good.

I am real interested to see what Quebec City holds for me this summer.

True. I consider Santos a bar. I throw that term around loosely. What you consider "lounges" is probably what I think of as a bar.

As the one Montrealer said in a recent post on this thread, Santos is hit or miss. Was on point during my first two trips (late happy hour time), but a brick on the runs since.

If you're talking about everything about restaurants EXCEPT food, agreed. But I have yet to go to a city - anywhere in the world - where the quality of food is on par with SF.

QC should be interesting indeed. Also, June is my favorite month in MTL as well.

Post: #184

(06-25-2013 12:25 AM)pbw Wrote:  Just got back from one week in Montreal. Back in the TO dungeon. I must say Montreal is a vibrant city -- I would also rate it among the world's best. It has a lot going for it.

However, Montreal women are by no means easy. If you have lots of money to spend, then yes some Montreal women may be accessible. My luck this time with women was zero -- though I did go out quite a bit --day and night. Things just never clicked. I did meet a girl outside club 281 --but I sensed her to be a gold digger -- though she was very friendly -- I gave up on her.

Even the famous Montreal porn producer Bruno B said: He was tired of going to clubs and buying girls drinks all night and never getting laid.

I will go again to Montreal -- have not given up on t just yet.

Do you think your race was a factor? You're a brother, right?

(06-25-2013 10:35 AM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

(06-25-2013 12:25 AM)pbw Wrote:  Just got back from one week in Montreal. Back in the TO dungeon. I must say Montreal is a vibrant city -- I would also rate it among the world's best. It has a lot going for it.

However, Montreal women are by no means easy. If you have lots of money to spend, then yes some Montreal women may be accessible. My luck this time with women was zero -- though I did go out quite a bit --day and night. Things just never clicked. I did meet a girl outside club 281 --but I sensed her to be a gold digger -- though she was very friendly -- I gave up on her.

I have been saying that all along. The "easy" part of Montreal girls is hype.

America is easier than Montreal.

Does anybody disagree with this?

Post: #185

(06-25-2013 01:13 PM)Hencredible Casanova Wrote:  If you're talking about everything about restaurants EXCEPT food, agreed. But I have yet to go to a city - anywhere in the world - where the quality of food is on par with SF.

Yeah, that is why I said "Possibly on par with SF".

Honestly, I am not well versed enough in SF food (been there a million times, and eaten tons of sick restaurants) but I have never lived there for months on end so I wouldn't consider myself a "SF restaurant expert".

However, the places that I really loved in Montreal were on par with the places I love in SF.

Keep in mind, my view is slightly skewed as oysters, tartare and foie gras are three of my favorite foods and very plentiful in Montreal.

Post: #186

I tried Le Club Chasse & Pêche with my date, good apetizers, good indoors but a bit overpriced. Huge selection of wine though.

We went to Piano after, cool Piano bar, I recommend it for dates.

Post: #187

(06-27-2013 01:41 AM)More and more Wrote:  

(06-25-2013 12:25 AM)pbw Wrote:  Just got back from one week in Montreal. Back in the TO dungeon. I must say Montreal is a vibrant city -- I would also rate it among the world's best. It has a lot going for it.

However, Montreal women are by no means easy. If you have lots of money to spend, then yes some Montreal women may be accessible. My luck this time with women was zero -- though I did go out quite a bit --day and night. Things just never clicked. I did meet a girl outside club 281 --but I sensed her to be a gold digger -- though she was very friendly -- I gave up on her.

Even the famous Montreal porn producer Bruno B said: He was tired of going to clubs and buying girls drinks all night and never getting laid.

I will go again to Montreal -- have not given up on t just yet.

Do you think your race was a factor? You're a brother, right?

(06-25-2013 10:35 AM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

(06-25-2013 12:25 AM)pbw Wrote:  Just got back from one week in Montreal. Back in the TO dungeon. I must say Montreal is a vibrant city -- I would also rate it among the world's best. It has a lot going for it.

However, Montreal women are by no means easy. If you have lots of money to spend, then yes some Montreal women may be accessible. My luck this time with women was zero -- though I did go out quite a bit --day and night. Things just never clicked. I did meet a girl outside club 281 --but I sensed her to be a gold digger -- though she was very friendly -- I gave up on her.

I have been saying that all along. The "easy" part of Montreal girls is hype.

America is easier than Montreal.

Does anybody disagree with this?

G is right in that American girls are quicker to bang. You get them drinking and most of the job is done already . MTL takes a bit of time and finesse but the bang for the buck is incomparable. That's why guys love it. The demeanor, style and sophistication of the chicks up there is light years ahead of the US. So, fundamentally, MTL is still worth it and better.

Post: #188

(06-27-2013 10:52 PM)MrRoundtree Wrote:  I tried Le Club Chasse & Pêche with my date, good apetizers, good indoors but a bit overpriced. Huge selection of wine though.

We went to Piano after, cool Piano bar, I recommend it for dates.

What is Piano bar like?

Agreed that Le Club Chasse & Pêche is a little overpriced.

This was my thoughts on the place last summer:

Quote:Le Club Chasse Et Peche – This is the other restaurant owned by the people from Le Filet in Old Port. Real good. Not as good as Le Filet though. And a little more expensive if my memory serves me correct.

(06-27-2013 11:33 PM)Hencredible Casanova Wrote:  G is right in that American girls are quicker to bang. You get them drinking and most of the job is done already . MTL takes a bit of time and finesse but the bang for the buck is incomparable. That's why guys love it. The demeanor, style and sophistication of the chicks up there is light years ahead of the US. So, fundamentally, MTL is still worth it and better.

Yeah, you definitely can get one night stands in Montreal. I just think they are more common in America.

Quote:demeanor, style and sophistication of the chicks

I would say this is the draw. And the novelty.

I mean, which would you rather swoop?

1. A girl born in Fullerton in Ugg boots who doesn't know where Canada is on a map.

2. A fly brunette French girl with crystal blue eyes an a French accent that dresses in high heels.

Pretty easy choice in my book.

If Montreal was part of America, it might be the third or fourth best city "overall" with a heavy emphasis on girls and nightlife in the criteria.

Throw in perfect weather in the summer time (unlike say Las Vegas or Miami) and you have yourself a homebase for a few months.

It is pretty much that easy why the appeal is there.

I mean hell, where else in North America do you have perfect weather, unique culture, great restaurants, fly girls, liberal smoking laws (generally speaking), late last call, great logistics, user friendliness etc in summer time?

If someone steer me in the direction of a "Montreal in summer" with $3.00 cocktails, I am all ears.

Post: #189

Just on the train back to Toronto and I'm already planning my next visit.

@ G Manifisto - Shiiiiittt .. You were dead on about New City Gas. Went there for happy hour yesterday & lost my mind. Closest thing that I came to it in talent was Berns in Stolkhome. You definately have to come here on point. It was one of the few places where I wish i wore my suit, even though I still wrecked shop this with jeans, blazer and fitted shirt.

I'll post up my data sheet after I catch up on some zzz's.

Post: #190

(06-28-2013 04:26 PM)julez Wrote:  Just on the train back to Toronto and I'm already planning my next visit.

@ G Manifisto - Shiiiiittt .. You were dead on about New City Gas. Went there for happy hour yesterday & lost my mind. Closest thing that I came to it in talent was Berns in Stolkhome. You definately have to come here on point. It was one of the few places where I wish i wore my suit, even though I still wrecked shop this with jeans, blazer and fitted shirt.

I'll post up my data sheet after I catch up on some zzz's.

Yeah, glad to hear it is still on point.

-----

We are a month into summer, who has the hot updates on Montreal?

Which spots are going off the hardest on which nights?

Post: #191

I heard great things about New City Gas, will try to hit it up next time, although my friends are not really the club type and all have girlfriends..

Piano Bar is a small bar with couches (Lounge style), very nice indoors (red lights and dark vibe) and a piano with a piano player, but a bit expensive, we had 2 mojitos and 2 cosmos and it costed about 48 $... like I said, perfect place for a date. Funny enough, there was a Bachelorette party that started there with stunning girls, an older couple in the 40es on a date and a bachelor party also starting.

Post: #192

(06-23-2013 09:30 PM)MrRoundtree Wrote:  I agree about Buennanote, Cavalli and Time (supperclub) they are somewhat upperclass bars but the people there are not upperclass, mostly showing off, I never felt the vibe of these nightclubs. Buennanote is a bit more hispanic.

Never noticed that.

Buona Notte (saw this picture online. I would say a decent representation of that place).

Quote:I agree also that the restaurants are upper class, I'm taking my next date to Le Filet next time, can't wait to try it.

What did you think?

Post: #193

Didn't try it yet, we went to Le Club Chasse et Pêche instead, but will def hit it up next time.

Post: #194

Those of you that went to New City Gas, was it a headliner night or just a residence DJ?

I've been there once for a headliner and it was crazy, but hard to game because everyone was focused on the stage.

What was cover like when you went?

Post: #195

Seeking quick advice

I am 28, but when I shave I can look anywhere from 18-21 years old. I have no qualms about going after the 18-21 year old group in Montreal, but I'm just trying to gauge how they would respond to me when they found out my real age.

What's even worse, is that I'm currently kind of broke (I have money for my trip though), and I don't have an actual career (I'm more of a freelancer), which is more like a 18-21 year old.

A 28 year old that's kind of broke and has no official career is seen as a loser. I am pretty good at conversations though, more like a 28 year old.

Will my telling them my real age scare some off?

Post: #196

Heading here in late October(Halloween wknd) with a couple friends. Is there anything particularly interesting to see or do around this time of year that you guys recommend, in addition to gaming?

Post: #197

I apologize if I am wrong to post this here, but this seems the most appropriate thread by rationale of traffic and heavy hitters on the matter of MTL knowledge.

A car in Montreal: is it a desire, necessity, or nuisance?

I will be living in Montreal for the summer, but I am unsure whether to take a car there or not (Mercedes E 550 Cabriolet or Maserati Ghibli).

Either way, the car will not be a common one yet not overly ostentatious (one should never test the limit of either in my opinion), which I’d like thoughts on in terms of the cultural as it relates to various activities such as picking a girl up for a date, valeting at a restaurant/club, pulling up to a skate spot, rock show, etc. I’d also like thoughts on city drivability, as well: walking is great, but skating and driving cities to learn them is also killer.

With Uber only doing taxis there and my not being a fan of public transit, I’m inclined to say a car would be a nice additional option to have in certain scenarios.

-AEB

Post: #198

(03-07-2014 09:29 PM)polista Wrote:  
I apologize if I am wrong to post this here, but this seems the most appropriate thread by rationale of traffic and heavy hitters on the matter of MTL knowledge.

A car in Montreal: is it a desire, necessity, or nuisance?

I will be living in Montreal for the summer, but I am unsure whether to take a car there or not (Mercedes E 550 Cabriolet or Maserati Ghibli).

Either way, the car will not be a common one yet not overly ostentatious (one should never test the limit of either in my opinion), which I’d like thoughts on in terms of the cultural as it relates to various activities such as picking a girl up for a date, valeting at a restaurant/club, pulling up to a skate spot, rock show, etc. I’d also like thoughts on city drivability, as well: walking is great, but skating and driving cities to learn them is also killer.

With Uber only doing taxis there and my not being a fan of public transit, I’m inclined to say a car would be a nice additional option to have in certain scenarios.

-AEB

Huge fucking nuisance and entirely unnecessary. I took my car to Montreal from June to Dec. last year and it was a monumental waste of time and money. Here are the reasons why:
1. Parking is a bitch- Street parking is scarce, and street cleaning happens twice a week, so you have to move your car at least twice a week, and everyone is fighting for spare spots. You could pay for a permanent spot somewhere off Craiglist or something, but this leads to point 2-
2: It's not necessary- Montreal is a fairly condensed city with everything you need within walking distance. I stayed in an apartment off of St. Laurent, one of the main streets, and had groceries, gym, and a million bars within walking distance.
3. Vandalism- In the time I was there my car was busted into and egged, 2 separate occasions. While Montreal is a very safe place, they have lots of petty crime related to vandalism.
4. Good public transport- Even if you don't like using it, the metro system in Montreal is very fast and efficient. It's also a very safe and standard way of traveling that locals use regularly.
5. Traffic- It's pretty much bumper to bumper all the time in Montreal, not really a city you want to be traveling around in a car, it's super inefficient.

That about covers it, I'd say land on your feet and enjoy having every convenience nearby!

Post: #199

Taxi is also dirt cheap compared to other Canadian cities and especially europe. And I don't know if you guys heard about that but some bars and clubs (areas) will be open until 5am-6am, basically when the metro will start running again. This new law should be passing soon.

Anyway here's a few updates:

New City Gas: Awesome place, crazy parties, only went to see a DJ with friends but the talent was everywhere: hipsters, hippies, woo-girls, fly girls..very pleasant for the eyes. but mad expensive... i didn't go on thursdays or for happy hour, will have to check that out sometimes. On saturdays, seems like a very hard place to game because everyone will be focused on the stage. This experience was similar to Razzmatazz without as many separate dance floors. I think once the place stays open until 5am and the DJ finishes playing, it will become a huge dancefloors like Razzmatazz and a crazy party place. Will definately return once the new law applies.

All those bars are great for young professionals

Waverly, St-Edouard, Le confessionnal

Newtown: Next to where I work, lots of fly girls, not a crazy party bar but was still occupied by lots of girls.

I suggest you guys to hit La Champagnerie in old port, it's very french, something nobody will find outside Montreal in North america
http://www.montrealfooddivas.com/la-champagnerie/

I'm moving to Mile-End soon, excited to be close to the night life of Le Plateau

Post: #200

(03-09-2014 06:27 PM)MrRoundtree Wrote:  I'm moving to Mile-End soon, excited to be close to the night life of Le Plateau

As you should be. Although it's very french, people are a lot more friendly and down to earth in average, than on St-Laurent, I'd say. I find the music is better, the bars are cheaper, the girls are fly (and freaky as well.)

I've been going out almost inclusively in that area for over 5 years, and now I am welcomed with shots in almost every bar on Mont Royal Avenue. I think Plateau is probably the closest thing to a European nightlife in North America. I understand many guys like high class clubs with dimes & silicone, but I've grown allergic to that ratchet ass/goldigger attitude. You'll see 8's and 9's on the Plateau in bars sippin' on 40's bouncing to fucking ASAP Rocky not giving any fucks.

Also, it's a sector of the city that is very liberal/progressive, very community based, tons of vegetarians, (true) hipsters, granola heads, and socialism. This also means there's a lot of soft ass guys. I walk in the bar and I can tell from the way they look at me that the girls see, and smell alpha.

Overall quality of girls/having fun(music>>>)/price, it's a no brainer imo. It's an older, more mature crowd than the big clubs. I find we (frenchies) don't care as much about what other people think/are saying about us. That's why we can have (real) fun. It's also the very difference between Montreal and Toronto. We just aren't as stuck up & we don't take ourselves too seriously. Self-deprecation isn't given to everyone.