Post: #51

Hey Winston,
Welcome here man! You've got a great site there! Hoping that you will be posting regularly here about your insight on living abroad and dating women abroad.

Since the forum doesn't allow anymore posts to be edited (Yo Roosh, when did that change?), I can't edit the post however, I'm posting here the correct link:
http://www.happierabroad.com/forum/viewt...hp?t=12155

Cheers,
VP.

(01-01-2012 02:04 AM)WWu777 Wrote:  Happy New Year Everyone! I just registered.

This is Winston of HappierAbroad.com.

Vacancier Permanent, thanks for posting my anti-marriage essay here, but you posted the wrong URL. You forgot to add a 5 at the end of the link. This is the correct URL:

(unable to post URL's here, just add a 5 to the end of the URL you have)

Also, I've updated the 7 reasons to 10 now, and added many more logical points and arguments. Can you update the version in this thread to the new updated version at the link above?

Thanks for sharing my essay here.

Regards,
Winston

Post: #52

(12-18-2011 06:37 PM)Pilgrim37 Wrote:  As you get older trawling the bars gets old,you won't have many if any friends similar age doing the same and it will be a lonely existence.

Marriage or shacking up together is just the next stage,if you're into somebody.
You can't go into every relationship thinking how badly it might turn out!

If you haven't sown your oats by 45 then you probably never will.

If I turn 45 without a girl and kids I'll feel I've wasted time.

It's the law of diminishing returns,when you're young you think it's going to last forever..It doesn't !

And if you're not careful you end up as that sad case in the supermarket buying that Christmas TV dinner for one!

Take heed

Just because someone is 45+ and single does not mean they will be "trawling bars" while their friends are home with their families sipping egg nog on Christmas eve.

I think this "old and lonely" characterization is the product of a feminist society. It's nothing more than a scare tactic meant to scare men into settling down with a woman to start a family. Just like women scare other women by saying "you'll be an old and lonely cat lady."

With a 50% divorce rate in America today, it's become much more common for people to be single in their later (50+) years. It's also much more common for people to be married again or even for the first time in their later years. There are many reasons men don't marry in their 20's, 30's or 40's and I'd bet the biggest is not wanting to simply "settle."

Post: #53

(01-01-2012 11:06 PM)Smitty Wrote:  

(12-18-2011 06:37 PM)Pilgrim37 Wrote:  As you get older trawling the bars gets old,you won't have many if any friends similar age doing the same and it will be a lonely existence.

Marriage or shacking up together is just the next stage,if you're into somebody.
You can't go into every relationship thinking how badly it might turn out!

If you haven't sown your oats by 45 then you probably never will.

If I turn 45 without a girl and kids I'll feel I've wasted time.

It's the law of diminishing returns,when you're young you think it's going to last forever..It doesn't !

And if you're not careful you end up as that sad case in the supermarket buying that Christmas TV dinner for one!

Take heed

Just because someone is 45+ and single does not mean they will be "trawling bars" while their friends are home with their families sipping egg nog on Christmas eve.

I think this "old and lonely" characterization is the product of a feminist society. It's nothing more than a scare tactic meant to scare men into settling down with a woman to start a family. Just like women scare other women by saying "you'll be an old and lonely cat lady."

With a 50% divorce rate in America today, it's become much more common for people to be single in their later (50+) years. It's also much more common for people to be married again or even for the first time in their later years. There are many reasons men don't marry in their 20's, 30's or 40's and I'd bet the biggest is not wanting to simply "settle."

I agree 100%. Men don't lose their reproductive power as they age(no menopause). Women also say if a man isn't married by 34, then he is automatically gay, textbook shaming tactics. The motto for Western Society currently is: "Anything to benefit the women, no matter the cost!".
Imo marriage 2.0 creates this Catch-22: Women say they want marriage but they hate beta men and will do anything to escape them. Being tied to a girl make a man complacent and more beta. The thing women "want" creates men they're not attracted to. Besides settling, men see that they can get wiped out(alimony) by it and are deferring it as long as possible.

Post: #54

I think may come in handy here

Post: #55

Here you go...
http://www.themostselfishwomaninamerica....ith-yours/

You've all been warned

Post: #56

Hi VP,
Thanks. Well I have little time, but I'll try. Everything I have to say is already on my site.

I thought you were the Vice President here, and had authority, so wouldn't you be allowed to edit posts?

Btw, this celebrity/fashion blogger named Jezebel posted an attack of my anti-marriage essay. It's pretty funny. You guys should see it, but I'm not sure if I can post the link here or not. I'll try though. Here it is.

(whoops, the system won't let me post links yet, so I'll just PM it to you so you can post it)

(01-01-2012 01:41 PM)Vacancier Permanent Wrote:  Hey Winston,
Welcome here man! You've got a great site there! Hoping that you will be posting regularly here about your insight on living abroad and dating women abroad.

Post: #57

Getting married in a 3rd world country might be a good idea for someone willing to get married.

Post: #58

I'm posting this interesting link that Winston pmed me.
http://jezebel.com/5873827/founder-of-po...f-marriage

Some of the comments are hilarious and show the typical entitled feminazi girl..have fun.

Post: #59

Btw, speaking of marriage or rather, my decision of not falling into that trap, a few days ago, someone in my family asked me if I was gay or categorically refusing to even talk about it? If only she knew...since I respect that person a lot, I just laughed it off. Anyone had this happen before?

Post: #60

(01-16-2012 12:10 AM)Vacancier Permanent Wrote:  Btw, speaking of marriage or rather, my decision of not falling into that trap, a few days ago, someone in my family asked me if I was gay or categorically refusing to even talk about it? If only she knew...since I respect that person a lot, I just laughed it off. Anyone had this happen before?

Girl asks if you're gay = she wants to fuck

Cousin or not.

Post: #61

Roosh highlights very well the horrors of marriage:

Every time a high-quality man gets married, it’s not out of desire to legally obligate himself to a woman, but out of fear of loneliness and getting old. He thinks that a wife will alleviate these problems, but from my observation, they only make it worse. You haven’t met a lonely man unless you’ve met one married for over 10 years, detached from masculine social activities with no regular male friends he can confide in, reduced to tinkering in the garage not necessarily because he likes it but because he wants to spend time away from his wife, for a desire of loneliness. When it comes to aging, the only thing that can reduce a man’s sparkle and turn his face into a leathery shadow is a wife.

So if marriage isn’t the answer, what is? The answer seems to be eternal bachelorhood. The answer is freedom. The answer is understanding that it does not get better for the modern man than banging a variety of attractive women with the occasional mini-relationship. Therefore man has two choices—learn game and be free or marry the next broad that tolerates him out of fear and laziness. My choice has been made.

http://www.rooshv.com/marriage-doesnt-make-sense

Post: #62

There are cases where it's possible to marry wayyyy the fuck up and benefit as a male. It's definitely uncommon, but doable

Post: #63

(06-11-2016 05:19 PM)Sonoma Wrote:  There are cases where it's possible to marry wayyyy the fuck up and benefit as a male. It's definitely uncommon, but doable

Like Kevin Federline, who reportedly gets over 6 figure a month from Britney Spears in child support payments.

Post: #64

(06-11-2016 05:19 PM)Sonoma Wrote:  There are cases where it's possible to marry wayyyy the fuck up and benefit as a male. It's definitely uncommon, but doable

In the US at least, this is actually true. But only in a particular sense.

The system punishes the higher earner in a divorce. It doesn't care about gender too much. A woman making 200k and a man making 40k (or nothing) and the woman is just as screwed as a typical man in a divorce rape situation. women generally marry up due to a variety of factors but to be clear again: women CAN get divorced raped; it just is very rare to see since few women actually marry down financially speaking.

That said: A man who marries up financially is generally marrying a careerist militant feminist who is 35+ years old; of which nearly all don't have the proper mindset/are not conditioned to provide for a family and that matters when times get tough.

Then there is the issue of dealing with a careerist militant feminist and all the bullshit that entails all the time. It just isn't natural for a woman to be a provider and a man to be domestic dependent. I've never seen a happy couple where the woman was the provider and the man was the dependent; it really goes against every natural instinct that has been bred into each gender since the dawn of time.

Anyhow....to marry up financially to a submissive, feminine woman below 25 (the ONLY type of woman any man should ever consider marrying) is virtually impossible in the US. Just finding that type of woman disregarding the money part of the equation is extremely difficult as it is. You would have to find something like a humbled trust fund/daughter of big money kid (Ivanka Trump, for example), a rich celebrity, or a young successful supermodel. But to get access to the aforementioned three, you probably would need to be highly successful yourself to begin with. Not as rich as them but still very successful. And not 100k job "successful" either; like sold a company, played in a semi-known band, ran/run a company kind of successful.

How many of the aforementioned three examples do you know of that married way down, like someone of very average means? Talk about an example of a needle size box inside another needle size box in a giant haystack: A financially successful/well-off humbled woman with a submissive/feminine personality, who is willing to settle down and get knocked up before age 25? AND to a guy of relative average success and means?

There has to be less than a 100 women in the entire US (entire world?) that fit that profile.

Can a regular guy marry up financially in the US? Oh yeah... but it will be to a woman who is the epitome of everything a man should avoid in seeking a wife.

For a regular man who wants to be a sole-provider in a traditional relationship, the most important thing is being in an environment where you have some leverage as a man; particularly legal leverage (i.e. a place where you can't be divorced rape). Culture matters too but women (or people in general) cannot be financially incentivized to blow up marriages because well, people are gonna blow them up usually.

In short: There is no place today for sensible people who are somewhat risk adverse, like many good provider types, to have marriage/children in America. The proper environment simply doesn't exist today. The only solutions are to either:

1) Fix your current environment or

2) Move to an environment that will help you achieve your objectives by giving you a fair amount of leverage to protect yourself.

The former is nearly impossible and presents enormous challenges but the latter is very possible. If you want a decent chance at having a successful family life as a provider/higher earner, you must leave the US. It's unfortunately that simple.

Post: #65

If you as a man you are broke, but you marry a woman that has a net wealth of over 5 million dollars, then yeah, marriage might be an option, as an exception that proves the rule Never Get Married

Post: #66

As you get older trawling the bars gets old,you won't have many if any friends similar age doing the same and it will be a lonely existence.

Marriage or shacking up together is just the next stage,if you're into somebody.
You can't go into every relationship thinking how badly it might turn out!

If you haven't sown your oats by 45 then you probably never will.

If I turn 45 without a girl and kids I'll feel I've wasted time.

It's the law of diminishing returns,when you're young you think it's going to last forever..It doesn't !

And if you're not careful you end up as that sad case in the supermarket buying that Christmas TV dinner for one!

Take heed Smile








No, no, no, being single past 40 doesn't mean you're trawling bars. There are so many other ways to meet quality women. Try meetup.com for groups of people with common interests.

Hmmmmm.....being past 40 and single...instead of spending money on a wife and kids, you could spend it on a one-bedroom condo down by the beach, a classic car, world travel, a gym membership, and a hair transplant. Important stuff.

Post: #67

If you are older and unmarried, yes, getting out of USA to travel is a must.

Beyond that, the only real reason to get married in this day and age is if you have a faith tradition you believe in.

Apart from that, you have no real bond or reason to stay together (shit even kids don't stop breakups from happening the culture is so laissez faire and diseased), and women are unconstrained = you are asking for it.

Post: #68

Post: #69

(06-28-2016 12:55 PM)Kid Twist Wrote:  If you are older and unmarried, yes, getting out of USA to travel is a must.

Beyond that, the only real reason to get married in this day and age is if you have a faith tradition you believe in.

Apart from that, you have no real bond or reason to stay together (shit even kids don't stop breakups from happening the culture is so laissez faire and diseased), and women are unconstrained = you are asking for it.

This seems true to me. If there is no faith tradition which has a real basis for keeping marriages pure (keep the women virginal until married, faithful after, child-raisers, and encouraging men to be protectors and providers) and lasting (marriage as presumed to be for life, divorces as being wrong and tragic) and if there's no authentic community to support these, then in modern times men and women will just divorce 'because it doesn't work out' or they've 'found someone better' or are 'not in love anymore'.

It seems to me there has become no basis in reality or society for traditional marriage (in the USA) outside of a shared faith tradition.

... And EVEN THEN, I've known people who had a shared faith tradition, but later got divorced while conveniently sneaking out of their faith tradition... largely due to the narcissistic, anti-family culture of the modern USA.

Post: #70

It's not that I think anyone here should get married but I think there needs more empiricism.

There are benefits to marriage and ways to reduce the risk to negligible proportions.

FYI the downvotes are from mad MGTOWs. I didnt find a single factual disagreement in the comments so I would ignore them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cs6NL5rPyGM

Prominent MGTOWer Stardusk did make a response, and this is the response to that

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbI2o45yZ68

Post: #71

Getting married is not something I care about but I would like to have kids and be a dad.
In my mind being a good dad is providing a stable and loving environment and having a good family unit is part of that. Unfortunately I feel like that means I have to get married at some point.
I guess I'll just put it off until I get to the point where I feel like I'm ready to settle down.

Post: #72

A great many very successful men have had good wives, and their marriage has undoubtedly contributed to their success enormously.

As someone who is building a business (bricks and mortar, with employees etc), I am swamped most of the time (other than when I'm on here, right ). I am fiercely independent, and find female company very tedious for the most part, but a 'good' woman would make my life significantly easier, and probably contribute significantly to my success.

I may be in the minority on a site such as this, but whilst I enjoy the idea of the harem of nubile 18 year old nymphomaniacs (and enjoy it in practice when it falls in my lap), the practical reality of having to feign interest whilst some vapid ho talks about her fucking horses each time I want to get my leg over fills me with a special kind of despair. It is not this way for everyone, and I am sure there are many here who genuinely love the company of women.

Consequently, certain types of people may have to accept some greater or lesser trade offs. Whilst I am in no rush to marry, I recognise that with a suitably sweet and fuckable girl, with sufficient genetics to ensure the best start for my progeny, I may better address my real ambitions and get down to serious work in that regard. An extraordinary amount of my time goes to waste in cleaning my flat, cooking, talking to girls I've no interest in beyond fucking (the fucking itself obviously does not count as a waste of time, the complete reverse in fact, but the time involved in obtaining it must be accounted for). I probably lose 2-3 hours each day at least on this sort of stuff.

My ambitions are to make fuck you money, move into politics, and to continue the work that generations of my family have been engaged in - furthering the opportunities available to their children. At least two of these things would be helped significantly by having a fiercely loyal wife, dedicated to making home life as good as possible with the resources available. These women do exist. All of the women in my direct family line have been like this, and it is a significant factor, for all their other manifest weaknesses, behind my being in the position I am in today as one of the handful of most enormously privileged people ever to have lived.

I'm in no rush to 'settle down', and will let life come to me as it wills. But if such a girl presented herself to me, I would consider something more permanent with her very seriously, despite its many and varied frustrations and limitations.

Post: #73

(07-07-2016 05:29 AM)H1N1 Wrote:  At least two of these things would be helped significantly by having a fiercely loyal wife. These women do exist. All of the women in my direct family line have been like this

I'm in no rush to 'settle down', and will let life come to me as it wills. But if such a girl presented herself to me, I would consider something more permanent with her very seriously, despite its many and varied frustrations and limitations.

These kind of women which were plentiful in the history,
nowadays are very rare unicorns.

Have you even met such a woman who is honest, faithful, humble,
loving, dedicated fully to her boyfriend and her children?

Now, in 2016, I mean

we're not talking about the 1950s when of course,
such a good woman was the norm

Post: #74

(07-07-2016 09:31 AM)seniol Wrote:  

(07-07-2016 05:29 AM)H1N1 Wrote:  At least two of these things would be helped significantly by having a fiercely loyal wife. These women do exist. All of the women in my direct family line have been like this

I'm in no rush to 'settle down', and will let life come to me as it wills. But if such a girl presented herself to me, I would consider something more permanent with her very seriously, despite its many and varied frustrations and limitations.

These kind of women which were plentiful in the history,
nowadays are very rare unicorns.

Have you even met such a woman who is honest, faithful, humble,
loving, dedicated fully to her boyfriend and her children?

Now, in 2016, I mean

we're not talking about the 1950s when of course,
such a good woman was the norm

Yes, all the women in my direct family. Most of my friends' parents. Most of their children have been brought up similarly too. That's not to say they haven't slept around a bit, but I'm skeptical as to how much of a golden era of chastity the 50s was anyway. I'm also pretty skeptical as to how much damage a bit of casual shagging about (beyond the extremely over-hyped health and pregnancy risks) actually does to a civilization. These prudish, Victorian sexual mores have still not been fully shaken off, but they themselves have been a fairly transient thing. During the ascendancy of the British Empire, from c. 1700 onwards until about 1850, attitudes towards sex were similar (indeed probably less inhibited) than many of ours are today (allowing for the changes wrought by viable contraception).

Many who preach the red pill still seem to pedestalise these 'unicorns', which I doubt have ever really existed. Women behave a certain way, for the most part, when opportunity and lack of consequence combine. Thus it is, and thus it has always been. Of course, we have plenty of opportunity and lack of consequence these days. But what is good for the goose is good for the gander. Ultimately, if you do not rush into anything, and do not allow emotion to cloud good judgement, there should be plenty of women who will still make good wives and mothers, even if they have sucked a dick or two in their day.

A woman's chastity matters less than many here think. There are few things more tedious on earth than some simpering, overly cutesy, incessantly giggling virgin. Far more attractive, and endurable, is a girl with some spark and some mischief, who is still intensely feminine in her mannerisms. When you meet a girl who really oozes sex, who is deeply alluring in her femininity, the likelihood of her being a virgin is pretty much zero.

There is a good deal to be said for a girl who has seen a bit of the world, for a girl who can make some comparisons and to the extent her species is capable of so doing, make an informed decision. Your angelic madonna-whore seems far more likely to me to sate her curiosity at the well of mandingo if you are all the experience she has to go by than she is if she's sucked a few dicks and scraped some of the sheen off the whole experience with her perfectly flossed teeth.

Most of my generation are either too young to be married or have not been married long enough to provide any useful data. That in itself suggests that perhaps your question is the result of too much abstract thought rather than empirical evidence. You may well think: 'X is a vapid slut, so are all her friends, I wouldn't date them', and you might well be right - thank god there are enough desperate men to take on those harpies. But there are quality girls, just as there are quality men (though their qualities are laughably different). You cannot force the world into handing you some perfect woman on a plate, and it is madness to feel you are owed such a thing, or that failure to obtain it means your life is worthless. You will come across plenty of women who would make decent wives and mothers over the course of your lifetime. If you don't, then a significant proportion of the blame to be alloted must be yours.

Post: #75

"Casual shagging" ?

I though the definition of a man who accepts a (broken) woman who has taken inside her dicks of other
30 of more men, before him, is a "cuck" or did it change recently?