Question:

Apple Cider Vinegar is popular only because of Bro-Science, right???

I have never seen anyone post any scientific data or evidence that supports the use of acv.. Other then saying that they wake up with a boner.

I can't notice a difference because I have woken up with a boner everyday of my life.

Is Apple Cider Vinegar 100% Bro-Science???

ACV is so famous there was even a Supreme Court case about it in the 1920's: United States v. Ninety-Five Barrels Alleged Apple Cider Vinegar

(11-18-2013 03:06 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  Question:

Apple Cider Vinegar is popular only because of Bro-Science, right???

I have never seen anyone post any scientific data or evidence that supports the use of acv.. Other then saying that they wake up with a boner.

I can't notice a difference because I have woken up with a boner everyday of my life.

Is Apple Cider Vinegar 100% Bro-Science???

A quick search turned up this:

Effect of apple vinegar cider in the expression of aromatase enzyme and estrogen receptors in gonadal tissues of male rats

Well, there might be something to it. Of course what you can extrapolate and apply to humans may be limited.

Quote:These results indicate that apple vinegar cider is beneficial for spermatogenesis and likely improves the protection of the cells via an increase of aromatase/ER gene expression.

See also http://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-30147.html

(11-18-2013 04:02 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  

(11-18-2013 03:06 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  Question:

Apple Cider Vinegar is popular only because of Bro-Science, right???

I have never seen anyone post any scientific data or evidence that supports the use of acv.. Other then saying that they wake up with a boner.

I can't notice a difference because I have woken up with a boner everyday of my life.

Is Apple Cider Vinegar 100% Bro-Science???

A quick search turned up this:

Effect of apple vinegar cider in the expression of aromatase enzyme and estrogen receptors in gonadal tissues of male rats

Well, there might be something to it. Of course what you can extrapolate and apply to humans may be limited.

Quote:These results indicate that apple vinegar cider is beneficial for spermatogenesis and likely improves the protection of the cells via an increase of aromatase/ER gene expression.

See also http://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-30147.html

@ Gio:

I had been looking into this question of science behind ACV as well, and I get the sense that there is NOT much funding of science going regarding ACV b/c there is little to NO profit motive incentive. Accordingly, there is a certain amount of bro-science, here, but it is NOT 100% bro-science – maybe more like 50% bro-science… just guessing… .
I get the sense that RexImperator’s cited information is decent with potential. Additionally, I get the sense that there is a little bit of scientific support for ACV having at least one effect on the body, which could thereafter cause other effects. In this regard, there seem to be several studies that ACV helps to bring down blood glucose to a small extent – which if true, can cause a lot of positive rippling effects (such as better fat burning, more time in ketosis (which thereby increases HDL levels and lowers triglicerides), improves the bodies receptivity to absorbing nutrients and improves alkaline/acid balance – to cause our blood to be slightly more alkaline – even though it is acidic).
Personally, I have been taking the stuff for a few weeks, and I have NOT really noticed any kinds of dramatic changes, except for continuing to get lasting full upper body buring sensation for hours after taking it… Here’s a couple of decent weblinks that I found, and a few refer to studies, but in sum the studies seem to be somewhat lacking (except pertaining to the lowering of the blood glucose level):

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articl...-hype.aspx


http://www.undergroundhealth.com/is-appl...-says-yes/

http://www.mindbodygreen.com/0-5875/15-R...y-Day.html

http://altmedicine.about.com/od/applecid...rvineg.htm



Maybe someone on this forum will come across some better studies and/or links to provide for us, regarding this subject? Yet, I am kind of inclinded to think that there is NOT a profit motive, yet I would like to see a study that shows ACV’s affect, if any, on our blood acid/alkaline balance – because I am NOT sure about whether something like that may NOT be causing my upper body burning sensation.

(11-19-2013 02:30 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  Thanks for the reply.

I'm pretty sure Apple cider Vinegar is just based on Bro-Science.

At least, I hope it is..

Hey Gio,

I transported your response from the juicing thread over to this ACV thread to be in line with our ACV thread topic.

First, I am a little bit baffled by your “hope” that ACV is bro-science. That’s like shorting ACV on the stock market – or hoping all the good things that are said about ACV are NOT true. It’s like you are saying that you hope that all this hype about ACV is NOT true and it is all just a myth. So the only way that a guy would hope all the hype of ACV is NOT true is if he is NOT taking it and NOT wanting to get any of those supposed benefits.

Second, I would like to elaborate upon my previous posts about what I believe the science suggests is a main benefit of ACV – and that is the reduction of blood glucose levels. If it is true, that the ONLY real scientific support is that ACV reduces blood glucose, then to me, it would seem that it may NOT matter whether a guy purchased the unfiltered and raw ACV versus processed ACV.

Well, anyhow, I saw bare assertions that raw ACV is better than processed ACV; however, I did NOT see any actual studies that compared the consumption of raw ACV versus processed ACV, which would be a good thing to know.

Yet, it remains understandable and even makes sense logically that processing of any kind of food sanitizes the foods sufficiently to remove nearly all nutritional benefits – and in that regard, there seems to be various scientific studies to show that raw and unprocessed foods contain more nutrients of various sorts. Accordingly, one of the advantages of raw and unprocessed ACV is that it has fermented and accordingly supposedly would raw ACV would have pro-biotics contained therein and processed ACB would NOT have pro-biotics. Accordindly, the enemy of the survival of probiotics is heat, light and air, so we would have to be careful that any of these factors of heat, light and/or air would NOT interfere with the pro-biotic aspects of ACV.

I’m gonna stop for now, but I remain optimistic that there may be some value in ingesting ACV – even though it seems that I have little real concrete knowledge about what those benefits are, exactly, and I still am NOT really seeing anything measureable on myself, since I started taking this.

Maybe this is my additional argument for the role of government to play a role in research because regular ordinary people have NO way to be able to fund the right kinds of studies that would need to be conducted on these potential Non-profitable food products (because there is little profit motive). Accordingly, there may be some purpose in studying raw / unprocessed ACV as compared with other kinds of processed ACV to show whether raw ACV has a positive effect.

Took a shot of it with some water this morning. Wasn't what I expected. It felt refreshing and not the type acid I was waiting for; it was like a good acid that was absorbing into my body and it felt cleansing.

Not very scientific but it felt good that's all I can say.

   

(11-20-2013 08:17 PM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  Hey Gio,

First, I am a little bit baffled by your “hope” that ACV is bro-science.

Well, I am a Bro Scientist. So, I like it when things become popular because of Bro Science.

If there is no formal evidence to support the use of ACV, and ACV is still widely popular, then, that is a victory for Bro Science!

That is a victory for taking care of our bodies and maintaining our health without the need for FDA approval, government studies, private funding, corporate influence, etc.

Bro Science has been studying the human body for thousands of years. We have acquired great knowledge through trial and error, self study, and word of mouth.

We have methods and techniques that go against the advice of the American Medical Association.

They will give you pills and chemicals to treat your symptoms. These are often profit driven strategies that don't even treat the root causes of the illness.

Bro Scientists attack the symptoms by regulating the fundamental needs of the body and mind.

Think about this..

In medical school, doctors receive no education about the medicinal value of food.

Bro Scientists use food as medicine.

This is why I hope ACV is based on Bro Science. It would validate my lifestyle and philosophy.

(11-20-2013 08:17 PM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  the ONLY real scientific support is that ACV reduces blood glucose

I hope this is true. How do you know this..?

(11-20-2013 08:17 PM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  I saw bare assertions that raw ACV is better than processed ACV

I generally prefer things to be raw and not processed

(11-20-2013 08:17 PM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  it seems that I have little real concrete knowledge about what those benefits are

None of us have any "real concrete knowledge" of the benefits of ACV.

We only have the awareness of our own bodies and the experience of our trusted advisors.

Please let me know if you find any scientific studies about the effects of ACV.

Thanks for your reply.

All I know is my mother's doctor told her it would be good for her when she brought it up to him.

So apparently some doctors know about the stuff.

So far western nutritional/ medical science has done a rather poor job of helping people optimize health and prevent disease. On the other hand it's fantastic at treating disease once it occurs. This is a fairly deep topic in and of itself that could easily deserve its own thread.

(11-22-2013 06:51 AM)Hotwheels Wrote:  All I know is my mother's doctor told her it would be good for her when she brought it up to him.

So apparently some doctors know about the stuff.

Hotwheels:

Maybe your mom's doctor went to the med school of broscience?

Just increased my ACV intake to 4 tablespoons daily.

Morning

2 tbls ACV
8 oz h2o
1 dash cayenne pepper
1/2 squeezed lemon or lime

Evening

2 tbls ACV
8 oz h2o

The morning regiment curbs my appetite and I don't eat till lunch. I leave out the citrus due to drinking infused h2o throughout the day.

I'm becoming a Dr Oz fan due to his constant harping about the positive effects of ACV. May stick to the morning regiment, but take two more doses mixed with grapefruit, and cut back on the citrus in my infused h2o.

(12-03-2013 10:54 AM)DrOz Wrote:  Before every meal, try Dr. Oz’s secret swimsuit slimdown drink of a choice – a mixture of grapefruit juice and apple cider vinegar. Simply mix 1 cup of grapefruit juice with 2 tablespoons of apple cider vinegar, stir, and enjoy. The juice is loaded with vitamin C, which will help you burn fat faster, especially during exercise. In fact, a study showed that people with adequate vitamin C levels burned 30% more fat during moderate exercise than individuals low in vitamin C. Meanwhile, the acetic acid contained in the vinegar may switch on genes your body needs to pump out fat-burning proteins. If you find the drink a bit tart, add 1 teaspoon of honey, which only adds 20 calories, for sweetness. Drink Dr. Oz’s secret slimdown drink before every meal and you’ll literally burn away your fat while enjoying a citrusy delight.

http://www.doctoroz.com/videos/swimsuit-slimdown-plan

My goal is to get into my two piece before summer.

(11-22-2013 10:54 AM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  

(11-22-2013 06:51 AM)Hotwheels Wrote:  All I know is my mother's doctor told her it would be good for her when she brought it up to him.

So apparently some doctors know about the stuff.

Hotwheels:

Maybe your mom's doctor went to the med school of broscience?

Quote:From the beginning of recorded history, Apple Cider Vinegar has been utilized by all ancient civilizations, it is said that for at least 10,000 years Apple Cider Vinegar was used to treat various ailments. It is also reported to have been used as a healing elixir by Hippocrates (the father of Medicine) and has been found in Egyptian urns dating as far back as 3000 BC.

The Babylonians are said to have used it as a condiment and a preservative, whilst the Greeks and the Romans used it both for flavouring and healing purposes. Parisians during the middle ages used it as a deodorant and healing tonic and a preserver of youth.

Columbus had apple cider vinegar barrels on his sailing vessels to prevent scurvy. Japanese Samurai warriors apparently drank apple cider vinegar for strength and power, and it was used during the America civil war to disinfect and heal wounds. All in all very useful.

Is a scientific study needed for everything in life?

Has anyone tried the Braggs brand salad dressings which are made with ACV?

I know they aren't really a substitute for straight ACV, but I'm wondering how they taste.

At ~$6 they are on the pricey side for dressing. The cheapo in me doesn't want to buy it if it's gross.

(I know I should make my own dressing but some nights that doesn't happen.)

(12-03-2013 12:38 PM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

Quote:From the beginning of recorded history, Apple Cider Vinegar has been utilized by all ancient civilizations

Hippocrates (the father of Medicine)

The Babylonians are said to have used it as a condiment and a preservative

the Greeks and the Romans used it both for flavouring and healing purposes

Parisians during the middle ages used it as a deodorant and healing tonic and a preserver of youth.

Columbus had apple cider vinegar barrels on his sailing vessels to prevent scurvy.

Japanese Samurai warriors apparently drank apple cider vinegar for strength and power

America civil war to disinfect and heal wounds. All in all very useful.

Is a scientific study needed for everything in life?

Now, that is some serious Bro-Science!!!

Greeks
Romans
Babylon
Adventurers
Explorers
Soldiers
Warriors
Samurais
Dr. Oz

I'm convinced!!!

I'm getting back on this stuff today!

Guys from The South always have a good understanding of natural remedies.

(12-03-2013 02:07 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  

(12-03-2013 12:38 PM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

Quote:From the beginning of recorded history, Apple Cider Vinegar has been utilized by all ancient civilizations

Hippocrates (the father of Medicine)

The Babylonians are said to have used it as a condiment and a preservative

the Greeks and the Romans used it both for flavouring and healing purposes

Parisians during the middle ages used it as a deodorant and healing tonic and a preserver of youth.

Columbus had apple cider vinegar barrels on his sailing vessels to prevent scurvy.

Japanese Samurai warriors apparently drank apple cider vinegar for strength and power

America civil war to disinfect and heal wounds. All in all very useful.

Is a scientific study needed for everything in life?

Now, that is some serious Bro-Science!!!

Greeks
Romans
Babylon
Adventurers
Explorers
Soldiers
Warriors
Samurais
Dr. Oz

I'm convinced!!!

I'm getting back on this stuff today!

Guys from The South always have a good understanding of natural remedies.

If anything, I'd say its widespread use by a lot of cultures all over the world for a long time warrants further investigation.

Like other posters have mentioned, studies tend to function on profit motive. And rigor makes claiming that something is 'healthy' contentious.

People have said "opposites attract" for thousands of years but you could say it's bullcrap because there are no scientific studies to backup the bro/ho-science.

I'm not saying it isn't broscience. I'm just saying we have heuristics for a reason...

Personally, I've been taking it and the only difference I feel is a more settled stomach (better digestion?)

(12-03-2013 02:07 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  Guys from The South always have a good understanding of natural remedies.

Yes we do young man. I still utilize:


Dandelions
Take sulfer/molasses for blood
Tobacco for bee stings
Fat back for spider bites (just used that one)
Ramps

Luckily no one ever made me take spoonfuls of ground hog fat or smear it on my chest.

(12-03-2013 03:43 PM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  If anything, I'd say its widespread use by a lot of cultures all over the world for a long time warrants further investigation.

"further investigation"???

I'm just looking for ANY investigation. Some investigation. A little investigation.

This stuff supposedly has been used for thousands of years and there is no formal, modern investigation that proves anything!

All we have is Bro Science.

I love that!

(12-03-2013 03:43 PM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  People have said "opposites attract" for thousands of years but you could say it's bullcrap because there are no scientific studies to backup the bro/ho-science.

Actually, as a Bro-Scientist, I could prove this by using only 2 magnets.

Or, one bad boy in a Catholic School.

(12-03-2013 03:44 PM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

(12-03-2013 02:07 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  Guys from The South always have a good understanding of natural remedies.

Yes we do young man.

A good friend of mine is from the Deep South. He said that out in the country, they can't always get to the doctors office, they learned to care for themselves. They have all kinds of funny stuff that they use to treat people.

Southern Bro Science is my favorite.

Southern Women are the best in America.

Maybe you guys can start an apple cider vinegar hate thread?

(12-03-2013 05:00 PM)Aliblahba Wrote:  Maybe you guys can start an apple cider vinegar hate thread?

The stuff is simply the most important thing I consume on a daily basis. It maintains my stable blood sugar levels, so no cravings. Great appetite control. Great energy level, especially in the morning. Got some indigestion on Thanksgiving, asked the host for some apple cider vinegar, everyone there looked at me like a space alien. Drank some ACV, felt better almost instantly. Helps me burn fat, along with good cinnamon and chia seeds. For any low-budget guy who wants to buy one thing that will allow him to live the principles of this site and improve his quality of life, this is the product. I could see the most hardcore ACV user spend $20 a month on it; I probably spend $10.

For any of you who hate the taste of it, throw some stevia and pumpkin spice in with the ACV and water.

Coconut Vinegar

better than ACV imo

(12-04-2013 06:36 AM)2014 Wrote:  Coconut Vinegar

better than ACV imo

Maybe more Bro-Science?

With the claim of a neutral PH balance, the coconut vinegar seems easier to drink straight, as compared with the burning and acidic nature of ACV.

I will keep my eyes out for this product, in nature.

(12-04-2013 06:36 AM)2014 Wrote:  Coconut Vinegar

better than ACV imo

Awesome. It's called suka ng niyog in the Phils, for the players over there that want to get in on the broscience. I'll try it after my current bottle of acv is finished.

+1 from me 2014.

edit-missing quote tag.

So far grapefruit juice has been the most effective way to mask the taste of acv, about 90% of it. I'm mixing a 3:1 ratio, equaling around 8oz, which is easy to shoot. Still adding cayenne and amino collagens for a morning power drink. It curbs the appetite till noon or so.

   

Works for me. ACV, pure honey and water. Occasionally some blackstrap molasses.

Game is all bro science.

Go find some studies showing that anabolic steroids work. In fact, the position of the scientific and medical community until recently was that anabolic steroids do not work. Not kidding.

Quote:The early assertion from the medical community that "anabolic steroids have not been shown to enhance athletic ability," still in print in the 2002 Physicians Desk Reference, contributed to this phenomenon. Technically, the statement is correct; however, people misusing and abusing these drugs quickly realized that the performance-enhancing effects were real and subsequently dismissed the rest of the medical community's contraindications, dosing recommendations, and warnings.

Bros > geeks in lab coats.