Post: #101

If it was muslims or someone else who burned it down.

It doesn't matter, the real loss is that it is impossible to rebuild.

No architect exists who wants or knows how to build the beautiful or the sublime, they only know marxist brutalism.

No stone masons, glass workers, sculptors exist, they've all been replaced with chinese steel and glass.

No spiritual rulers who understand the need for the divine and everlasting.

No artists to paint the portrait and paintings, they only paint ugly degenerate images.

Tell me about the superiority of modernity, once the rebuilding efforts fail.

Post: #102

(04-15-2019 03:36 PM)Syberpunk Wrote:  I was watching Euronews (spits) and they had a young architect skype calling from the street saying that if it is rebuilt and France (its people) has changed and can never be rebuilt the same way, never will feel the same.

I couldn't figure out if he was happy or sad or didn't care.

Prepping the people for a triangle monstrosity in its place?

I suppose the thing to do is keep the now ruins of Notre Dame, stabilized to the point they can be. Run a "Never Forget" campaign.

Post: #103

So in one month, the 3 most-famous cathedrals, churches or basilicas of France have been (partially) destroyed.

First, Saint-Sulpice, read below. Then, an illegal Pakistani migrant partially destroyed, in March, the inside of the Basilica of the Kings of France (in Saint-Denis). Three days ago, this illegal migrant was discreetly judged, and jailed.

http://www.leparisien.fr/seine-saint-den...052141.php

Now I wonder, is all this part of a global Jihadist offensive? Or just coincidences?

(04-15-2019 04:07 PM)budoslavic Wrote:  

Quote:Twelve French Churches Attacked, Vandalized in One Week

by Thomas D. Williams, PH.D. | 20 Mar 2019

A dozen Catholic churches have been desecrated across France over the period of one week in an egregious case of anti-Christian vandalism.

The recent spate of church profanations has puzzled both police and ecclesiastical leaders, who have mostly remained silent as the violations have spread up and down France.

Last Sunday, marauders set fire to the church of Saint-Sulpice — one of Paris’ largest and most important churches — shortly after the twelve-o’clock Mass.

Police have concluded that the fire was the result of arson and are now looking for possible suspects. The restoration of the church from the damage caused by the fire will reportedly cost several hundred million euros.

In Nimes (department of the Gard), near the border with Spain, the church of Notre-Dame des Enfants was desecrated in a particularly odious way, with vandals painting a cross with human excrement, looting the main altar and the tabernacle, and stealing the consecrated hosts, which were discovered later among piles of garbage.

Likewise, the church of Notre-Dame in Dijon, in the east of the country, suffered the sacking of the high altar and the hosts were also taken from the tabernacle, scattered on the ground, and trampled.

In Lavaur, in the southern department of the Tarn, the village church was assaulted by young men, who twisted one arm of a representation of the crucified Christ to make it appear that he was making an obscene gesture.

In the peripheries of Paris, in the department of Yvelines, several churches have suffered profanations of varying importance, in Maisons-Laffitte and in Houilles.

Although commentators have been reluctant to attach a particular religious or cultural origin to the profanations, they all share an evident anti-Christian character.

In recent months, anti-Semitic gangs have desecrated Jewish cemeteries, signing their actions with swastikas. In the case of the desecration of Catholic churches, the vandalism has spoken for itself: ridicule of the figure of Christ on the cross and desecration of major altars.

The Catholic hierarchy has kept silent about the episodes, limited themselves to highlighting that anti-Christian threat and expressing hope that politicians and police will get to the bottom of the crimes.

Reports indicate that 80 percent of the desecration of places of worship in France concerns Christian churches and in the year 2018 this meant the profanation of an average of two Christian churches per day in France, even though these actions rarely make the headlines.

In 2018, the Ministry of the Interior recorded 541 anti-Semitic acts, 100 anti-Muslim acts, and 1063 anti-Christian acts.

The burning of Notre Dame could also be related to yesterday's controversy , when a teen Native French, called... Hugo (like the writer of Notre Dame de Paris) had "jokingly" disrespected the Mecca building of Islam, thus unleashing a huge backlash and threats of retaliation from the local islamists.

https://www.francetvinfo.fr/internet/res...97817.html
https://twitter.com/JeanMessiha/status/1...-la-veille

Another strange coincidence is that the French president was about to deliver the most important speech of his mandate (against the Yellow Vests) just when the fire started...

Post: #104

Yes old buildings can catch fire quite easily and many, if not all of them have poor fire prevention. Hundreds of years of oil and other chemicals put into the wood on top of other materials makes it a very deadly combination under the right conditions.

The design of a Cathedral would allow a fire to build quite quickly as the stone blocks would act as an oven with the windows acting as air gaps.

However also bear in mind France has a serious Islamic terrorist problem and the authorities love to down play it I will keep my mind open as to the cause. Those who choose to ignore this by insulting others and crying conspiracy theories haven't been paying that much attention in recent years.

The fire fighters were busy getting precious art and other treasures out of the building. A fire of that magnitude requires specialist equipment and not everywhere in paris would have it.

Post: #105

(04-15-2019 04:19 PM)Going strong Wrote:  So in one month, the 3 most-famous cathedrals, churches or basilicas of France have been (partially) destroyed.

First, Saint-Sulpice, read below. Then, an illegal Pakistani migrant partially destroyed, in March, the inside of the Basilica of the Kings of France (in Saint-Denis). Three days ago, this illegal migrant was discreetly judged, and jailed.

http://www.leparisien.fr/seine-saint-den...052141.php

Now I wonder, is all this part of a global Jihadist offensive? Or just coincidences?

(04-15-2019 04:07 PM)budoslavic Wrote:  

Quote:Twelve French Churches Attacked, Vandalized in One Week

by Thomas D. Williams, PH.D. | 20 Mar 2019

A dozen Catholic churches have been desecrated across France over the period of one week in an egregious case of anti-Christian vandalism.

The recent spate of church profanations has puzzled both police and ecclesiastical leaders, who have mostly remained silent as the violations have spread up and down France.

Last Sunday, marauders set fire to the church of Saint-Sulpice — one of Paris’ largest and most important churches — shortly after the twelve-o’clock Mass.

Police have concluded that the fire was the result of arson and are now looking for possible suspects. The restoration of the church from the damage caused by the fire will reportedly cost several hundred million euros.

In Nimes (department of the Gard), near the border with Spain, the church of Notre-Dame des Enfants was desecrated in a particularly odious way, with vandals painting a cross with human excrement, looting the main altar and the tabernacle, and stealing the consecrated hosts, which were discovered later among piles of garbage.

Likewise, the church of Notre-Dame in Dijon, in the east of the country, suffered the sacking of the high altar and the hosts were also taken from the tabernacle, scattered on the ground, and trampled.

In Lavaur, in the southern department of the Tarn, the village church was assaulted by young men, who twisted one arm of a representation of the crucified Christ to make it appear that he was making an obscene gesture.

In the peripheries of Paris, in the department of Yvelines, several churches have suffered profanations of varying importance, in Maisons-Laffitte and in Houilles.

Although commentators have been reluctant to attach a particular religious or cultural origin to the profanations, they all share an evident anti-Christian character.

In recent months, anti-Semitic gangs have desecrated Jewish cemeteries, signing their actions with swastikas. In the case of the desecration of Catholic churches, the vandalism has spoken for itself: ridicule of the figure of Christ on the cross and desecration of major altars.

The Catholic hierarchy has kept silent about the episodes, limited themselves to highlighting that anti-Christian threat and expressing hope that politicians and police will get to the bottom of the crimes.

Reports indicate that 80 percent of the desecration of places of worship in France concerns Christian churches and in the year 2018 this meant the profanation of an average of two Christian churches per day in France, even though these actions rarely make the headlines.

In 2018, the Ministry of the Interior recorded 541 anti-Semitic acts, 100 anti-Muslim acts, and 1063 anti-Christian acts.

"Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it’s enemy action. "

Auric Goldfinger in 'Goldfinger' by Ian Fleming

Post: #106

(04-15-2019 04:15 PM)nomadbrah Wrote:  If it was muslims or someone else who burned it down.

It doesn't matter, the real loss is that it is impossible to rebuild.

No architect exists who wants or knows how to build the beautiful or the sublime, they only know marxist brutalism.

No stone masons, glass workers, sculptors exist, they've all been replaced with chinese steel and glass.

No spiritual rulers who understand the need for the divine and everlasting.

No artists to paint the portrait and paintings, they only paint ugly degenerate images.

Tell me about the superiority of modernity, once the rebuilding efforts fail.

I agree with this that rebuilding Notre Dame is going to be damn near impossible. The craft skill-set is nearly extinct, if not already. Fortunately, it appears that they did save the basic structure (the two front towers are intact as are the great bells). So maybe there is a chance after all.

It would be a travesty on a tragedy to rebuild with some kind of brutalist architecture. I despise brutalism and especially despise Le Corbusier, who was the originator of it.

Post: #107

video of french people singing in the streets. Heartbreaking.

https://twitter.com/Inaki_Gil/status/111...2785802242

Post: #108

Of course they fought to save the front towers: under their "new plan" they won't have to build a minaret from zero.

Post: #109

The damage is too extensive. A country in decline cannot simply "rebuild" their most sacred landmark. And if they try, it would take a decade or more.

Consider that it took 13 years for the World Trade Center to be replaced, and that was a standard skyscraper.

Post: #110

I'm catholic and I feel ready for war honestly. Atfirst I thought this was just blood lust sparked from alot of anger build up from these last couple of weeks (betrayal, family member's death, The closing of my own church that I grew up in plus the closing of the combined high school I attended)But as soon as I saw the actual video of the church falling and the haunting voice of the news reporter I felt the same feeling (only less dramatic) as I felt when my grandfather died.

I just get a strong feeling that this is leading u to something huge.

Post: #111

(04-15-2019 04:21 PM)Foolsgo1d Wrote:  ...
However also bear in mind France has a serious Islamic terrorist problem and the authorities love to down play it I will keep my mind open as to the cause. Those who choose to ignore this by insulting others and crying conspiracy theories haven't been paying that much attention in recent years.
...

Muslim migrants throughout Western Europe will still continue to vandalize and destroy any and all churches. Government isn't doing anything about it. When will people ever take the stand and fight back?

Quote:Christianity Under Attack In Europe—Few Care.
April 15, 2019

European Churches: Vandalized, Defecated On, and Torched “Every Day”
by Raymond Ibrahim

April 14, 2019 at 5:00 am
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/14044...vandalized

Summary

In Germany, four separate churches were vandalized and/or torched in March alone. “In this country,” PI-News, a German news site, explained, “there is a creeping war against everything that symbolizes Christianity: attacks on mountain-summit crosses, on sacred statues by the wayside, on churches… and recently also on cemeteries.”

In virtually every instance of church attacks, authorities and media obfuscate the identity of the vandals. In those rare instances when the Muslim (or “migrant”) identity of the destroyers is leaked, the desecraters are then presented as suffering from mental health issues.

“Hardly anyone writes and speaks about the increasing attacks on Christian symbols. There is an eloquent silence in both France and Germany about the scandal of the desecrations and the origin of the perpetrators…. Not a word, not even the slightest hint that could in anyway lead to the suspicion of migrants… It is not the perpetrators who are in danger of being ostracized, but those who dare to associate the desecration of Christian symbols with immigrant imports. They are accused of hatred, hate speech and racism.” — PI News, March 24, 2019

Full Story

In February, vandals desecrated and smashed crosses and statues at Saint-Alain Cathedral in Lavaur, France, and mangled the arms of a statue of a crucified Christ in a mocking manner. In addition, an altar cloth was burned.

Countless churches throughout Western Europe are being vandalized, defecated on, and torched.

In France, two churches are desecrated every day on average. According to PI-News, a German news site, 1,063 attacks on Christian churches or symbols (crucifixes, icons, statues) were registered in France in 2018. This represents a 17% increase compared to the previous year (2017), when 878 attacks were registered — meaning that such attacks are only going from bad to worse.

Among some of the recent desecrations in France, the following took place in just February and March:

Vandals plundered Notre-Dame des Enfants Church in Nîmes and used human excrement to draw a cross there; consecrated bread was found thrown outside among garbage.

The Saint-Nicolas Church in Houilles was vandalized on three separate occasions in February; a 19th century statue of the Virgin Mary, regarded as “irreparable,” was “completely pulverized,” said a clergyman; and a hanging cross was thrown to the floor.

Vandals desecrated and smashed crosses and statues at Saint-Alain Cathedral in Lavaur, and mangled the arms of a statue of a crucified Christ in a mocking manner. In addition, an altar cloth was burned.

Arsonists torched the Church of St. Sulpice in Paris soon after midday mass on Sunday, March 17.

Similar reports are coming out of Germany.

Four separate churches were vandalized and/or torched in March alone. “In this country,” PI-News explained, “there is a creeping war against everything that symbolizes Christianity: attacks on mountain-summit crosses, on sacred statues by the wayside, on churches… and recently also on cemeteries.”

Who is primarily behind these ongoing and increasing attacks on churches in Europe? The same German report offers a hint: “Crosses are broken, altars smashed, Bibles set on fire, baptismal fonts overturned, and the church doors smeared with Islamic expressions like ‘Allahu Akbar.'”

Another German report from November 11, 2017 noted that in the Alps and Bavaria alone, around 200 churches were attacked and many crosses broken: “Police are currently dealing with church desecrations again and again. The perpetrators are often youthful rioters with a migration background.” Elsewhere they are described as “young Islamists.”

Sometimes, sadly, in European regions with large Muslim populations, there seems to be a concomitant rise in attacks on churches and Christian symbols. Before Christmas 2016, in the North Rhine-Westphalia region of Germany, where more than a million Muslims reside, some 50 public Christian statues (including those of Jesus) were beheaded and crucifixes broken.

In 2016, following the arrival in Germany of another million mostly Muslim migrants, a local newspaper reported that in the town of Dülmen, “‘not a day goes by’ without attacks on religious statues in the town of less than 50,000 people, and the immediate surrounding area.”

In France it also seems that where the number of Muslim migrants increases, so do attacks on churches. A January 2017 study revealed that, “Islamist extremist attacks on Christians” in France rose by 38 percent, going from 273 attacks in 2015 to 376 in 2016; the majority occurred during Christmas season and “many of the attacks took place in churches and other places of worship.”

As a typical example, in 2014, a Muslim man committed “major acts of vandalism” inside a historic Catholic church in Thonon-les-Bains. According to a report (with pictures) he “overturned and broke two altars, the candelabras and lecterns, destroyed statues, tore down a tabernacle, twisted a massive bronze cross, smashed in a sacristy door and even broke some stained-glass windows.” He also “trampled on” the Eucharist.

For similar examples in other European countries, please see here, here, here, here, and here.

In virtually every instance of church attacks, authorities and media obfuscate the identity of the vandals. In those rare instances when the Muslim (or “migrant”) identity of the destroyers is leaked, the perpetrators are then presented as suffering from mental health issues. As the recent PI-News report says:

“Hardly anyone writes and speaks about the increasing attacks on Christian symbols. There is an eloquent silence in both France and Germany about the scandal of the desecrations and the origin of the perpetrators…. Not a word, not even the slightest hint that could in anyway lead to the suspicion of migrants… It is not the perpetrators who are in danger of being ostracized, but those who dare to associate the desecration of Christian symbols with immigrant imports. They are accused of hatred, hate speech and racism.”

Raymond Ibrahim, author of the new book, Sword and Scimitar, Fourteen Centuries of War between Islam and the West, is a Distinguished Senior Fellow at the Gatestone Institute and a Judith Rosen Friedman Fellow at the Middle East Forum.

Also, let's not forget Christian persecutions and genocide are happening in some parts of the world as well.

Post: #112

Post: #113

(04-15-2019 04:42 PM)Roosh Wrote:  The damage is too extensive. A country in decline cannot simply "rebuild" their most sacred landmark. And if they try, it would take a decade or more.

Consider that it took 13 years for the World Trade Center to be replaced, and that was a standard skyscraper.

From looking at that picture, it is like looking at a cross.

Edit. Might as well say The Lord's Prayer.


Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name;
Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trepasses,
as we forgive those who trepass against us,
and lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.
For Thine is the kingdom and the power and the glory of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
now and ever and forever.

Amen.

Post: #114

If I see Cuck Francis kissing the feet of Muslims one more time...................

Post: #115

(04-15-2019 04:44 PM)budoslavic Wrote:  

(04-15-2019 04:21 PM)Foolsgo1d Wrote:  ...
However also bear in mind France has a serious Islamic terrorist problem and the authorities love to down play it I will keep my mind open as to the cause. Those who choose to ignore this by insulting others and crying conspiracy theories haven't been paying that much attention in recent years.
...

Muslim migrants throughout Western Europe will still continue to vandalize and destroy any and all churches. Government isn't doing anything about it. When will people ever take the stand and fight back?

Quote:Christianity Under Attack In Europe—Few Care.
April 15, 2019

European Churches: Vandalized, Defecated On, and Torched “Every Day”
by Raymond Ibrahim

April 14, 2019 at 5:00 am
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/14044/europe-churches-vandalized

Summary

In Germany, ....

The Gatestone Institute is a zionist propaganda outlet, they are pushing their narrative while people are angry and highly susceptible to psychological manipulation.

The recent pattern of church desecrations in France is mostly satanic in nature:

Quote:In Nimes (department of the Gard), near the border with Spain, the church of Notre-Dame des Enfants was desecrated in a particularly odious way, with vandals painting a cross with human excrement, looting the main altar and the tabernacle, and stealing the consecrated hosts, which were discovered later among piles of garbage.

Likewise, the church of Notre-Dame in Dijon, in the east of the country, suffered the sacking of the high altar and the hosts were also taken from the tabernacle, scattered on the ground, and trampled.

In Lavaur, in the southern department of the Tarn, the village church was assaulted by young men, who twisted one arm of a representation of the crucified Christ to make it appear that he was making an obscene gesture.

In the peripheries of Paris, in the department of Yvelines, several churches have suffered profanations of varying importance, in Maisons-Laffitte and in Houilles.

Although commentators have been reluctant to attach a particular religious or cultural origin to the profanations, they all share an evident anti-Christian character.

Feces, obscene gestures - those are the hallmarks of satanists -.

I doubt this was an accident though, it has the halmarks of "shock and awe" terrorism, the image of the spire collapsing and the church nave in flame is going to be engraved in people's psyches...

Best to wait and see until the forensic details emerge.

Post: #116

They aren't going to release objective forensics details.

Post: #117

I was already going to join the military but this has fueled the idea even more. TRAINING for what is to come.

Post: #118

I really have a hard time believing it was just a renovation accident. If the risk of fire was that great for a priceless building then they'd have fire-prevention equipment.

Post: #119

This concrete monstrosity, the Sagrada Familia, began construction in 1882 and its still not finished. They're not rebuilding Notre Dame in a hurry.

Post: #120

(04-15-2019 04:46 PM)budoslavic Wrote:  

(04-15-2019 04:42 PM)Roosh Wrote:  The damage is too extensive. A country in decline cannot simply "rebuild" their most sacred landmark. And if they try, it would take a decade or more.

Consider that it took 13 years for the World Trade Center to be replaced, and that was a standard skyscraper.

From looking at that picture, it is like looking at a cross.

Cathedrals and churches are often built in the shape of crosses.

They now say the structure will be saved.

If it takes ten years or more to rebuild, that's an opportunity. The medieval cathedrals took hundreds of years to build.

The building process itself was a way to show public reverence. Mobilize people and let them participate in different ways.

Even in modern times, construction of Sagrada Familia in Barcelona is taking 140 years, and the process of building itself is an attraction.

It could be the same way with Notre Dame. This is an opportunity to revive reverence for God along with crafts like stained glass. Yes, it won't be the same, but the process or rebuilding is a kind of worship.

Post: #121

(04-15-2019 04:26 PM)Abelard Lindsey Wrote:  

(04-15-2019 04:15 PM)nomadbrah Wrote:  If it was muslims or someone else who burned it down.

It doesn't matter, the real loss is that it is impossible to rebuild.

No architect exists who wants or knows how to build the beautiful or the sublime, they only know marxist brutalism.

No stone masons, glass workers, sculptors exist, they've all been replaced with chinese steel and glass.

No spiritual rulers who understand the need for the divine and everlasting.

No artists to paint the portrait and paintings, they only paint ugly degenerate images.

Tell me about the superiority of modernity, once the rebuilding efforts fail.

I agree with this that rebuilding Notre Dame is going to be damn near impossible. The craft skill-set is nearly extinct, if not already. Fortunately, it appears that they did save the basic structure (the two front towers are intact as are the great bells). So maybe there is a chance after all.

The knowledge and skills still exist in Eastern Europe.

They'll have to bring in lots of artists and craftsmen from Poland and Russia if they want to have a decent chance of faithfully rebuilding it.

Post: #122

   

The muzzies aren't too sad over this.

Post: #123

^^^^^ Well I used to be neutral but now......

(04-15-2019 05:00 PM)LEMONed IScream Wrote:  I was already going to join the military but this has fueled the idea even more. TRAINING for what is to come.

Same feeling

Post: #124

So, today is exactly one month after the Christchurch mosque events.

But I'm sure that's just coincidental. That must be why no one is mentioning it.

WTF is going on here!?! This is the start, or continuation, of something quite dire, I'm afraid.

Post: #125

There are actually a lot of skilled craftsmen in France constantly working on restoring monuments. There is some art that might not be replicated to the same level, like for example the stained glass, which medieval craftsmen have perfected over generations, but I am sure that Notre Dame will be rebuilt to high standards.

The model here is Dresden Frauenkirche, which was razed in WW2 in arguably the most horrific bombing operation in European history, which sustained greater damage and was entirely rebuilt:



Notre Dame is a much older cathedral than the baroque Frauenkirche, but the scale of the work is similar.