Post: #1

Hey guys, maybe someone can give some insight on this. I am becoming resentfull, kind of "revengefull" towards women. Let us break this down: I was raised in a two parent household but my mother always had the control over EVERYTHING, plus I had a bossy sister, 6 years older than me. That, adding to it the public education, media indoctrination, general culture of pedestaling, glorifying of women. I didn't know all this "Game, MGTOW, PUA, Red Pill" knowledge until roughly one year ago. I was redpilled on politics, on some (((people))), on religion, economics... but I was totally blinded that the woman factor is HUGE, more than ever in human History.

Now Im realizing it all, this huge trap, how pointless it is to pursue pussy OR being pursued by pussy, how futile to bring kids in a traditional society is anyway. All this party, bachelor lifestyle, all morals and traditions, all of it doesn't seem to satisfy, all seems part of the illusion.

What I'm getting to, finally, is a place where I have deep hate against the women in general. Whereas men I don't care about, I see them as a formless mass, sometimes worthy people, others scum, interesting and inspiring or just filth of the Earth, doesn't matter to me much. But women! I just can't stand talking to them, seeing them smiling to me... all these years of bad experiences (or rather LACK of experiences) with women just make it unbereable to have a healthy communication and contact with them, because they have fallen from a very high totem right to the ground. As a kid they put a fantasy in my mind, and now I see the reality with my own eyes.

So this is the point: I can (and I do) withhold from sexual activity for very long periods of time, I mean, without orgasming or eyaculating, or without even touching or having pleasure in general (even though I would want to have said activity). Im talking about MONTHS without ejaculating/orgasming (im not into sexual yoga "press your prostate" stuff), and YEARS without contact with a woman, no sex. Im only 25 years old. People my age seem to NEED to wank or fuck at least 3-4 times a week to stay sane. I think its crazy, it reminds me of when I was 15 and would wank 2 even 3 times a day, because I had no access to women (not because I didnt try, and I come from Spain too... you guys from the anglosphere have a very distorted view of what Spain is like, you have no idea if you dont live here... you even complain of "sluts"! Where are those sluts? Lead me to them). Now I feel like when I get to be with a female in a sexual mood, it seems as if I would only enjoy the act of getting her to have sex, but I dont care about the sex at all! As if there is no enjoyment in the physical act of sex. I THINK THAT, WHEN I GET WITH A WOMAN (maybe in 1 or 2 years ahead of now, hopefully sooner) I WOULD BE CONTENT JUST TO GET TO PENETRATION AND THEN JUST STOPPING after a minute or two and she mustn't necessarily go, I would like her to stay to talk, for my goal would be done, which is having ACCESS to sexual contact. I fantasized, on the other hand, about trolling her, pulling out right right before she has the orgasm or while she is having it (I am by the way not bad at sex, I made several women have pleasure and orgasm. Im not deformed or autistic, im average and fit. And no I dont look like a refugee). Or flaking when she is really into you, seems like it would be a huge enjoyment too!

I even try not to look at them, because the more I look and desire the more I suffer because I know I can't get it. Well theoretically YES I can get it, I got in the past, but now it is just not happening even though I ran game extensively last summer. I was literally unemployed, all I did was try to get pussy (small german city). Something is very fucking wrong. Can anyone relate to this? Is this healthy at all? It feels like being trapped inside a sewer, seeing the light but not being able to go out, seeing the women but not being able to have sex with them. Men are indeed starved of sex and affection, and it seems as though things will get more extreme as days go by in todays society. Nowadays Im seeing on a daily basis 18 year olds with acne, belly, skinnyfat, braces, glasses, child hairstyle, child clothing, high pitched voices SOMETIMES ALL AT THE SAME TIME... walking around hand in hand with same aged feminine cute girls with nice bodies. I don't know if they are fucking anyway. Maybe those guys are always paying for lunch.

And no, Im not going to visit prostitutes like many spaniards do. And yes I had a failed LTR years ago. And yes I am a whiny bitch. What THE HELL is going on guys?

(I guess this thread belongs in "newbie" subforum, if not please moderators move to where it belongs)

Post: #2

I used to be like you. When I broke up with my very first girlfriend, I ended up hating women for a few years and had very similar thought processes to you.

The key issue with this is that hating women leads to bad game. Women are experts at reading body language and how you come across. If you have a constant hatred for women, it's obviously going to show in your approaches, and will ultimately put women off. This is particularly frustrating because at the same time, deep down you desire sex with and attention from women. Ultimately, you end up being your own worst enemy, as your negative thought processes adversely impact your behaviour with women, which leads to further rejection and thus a reinforcement in the negative thoughts... and so the cycle continues.

You say that you no longer put women on a pedestal, which is good. Whilst I can understand that this realisation is raw and can therefore make you angry (you thought women were amazing, could do no wrong etc), you need to realise that women are biologically different to men, and therefore their thoughts and behaviours are also going to be different. What does this mean? Well, in order for you to overcome your hatred of women and in turn have better chances of getting with them, you need to accept the above. I admit it's frustrating that most women are over-emotional and irrational beings, but that is just who they are; it is purely their nature to be this way. Getting angry at things you cannot control is a fruitless exercise. The sooner you accepts this the better off you will be.

Your post also seems to imply that you lack some sort of direction in your life. You say that everything you have been told in life is a lie, that everything is an 'illusion', and is unsatisfactory. I too had this initial thought when I stumbled upon the 'manosphere', but I never felt better for it. I just felt miserable. Such a nihilistic outlook on life is dangerous for a man; life without a purpose leads to rot and decay, whilst the rest of the world grows and leaves you behind. Now, a 'purpose' does not necessarily have to be self-actualisation (although this is an ideal end-point). A purpose could be something as mundane as sweeping the leaves off your street on a daily basis, but it is still giving you some sort of meaning in your life, however arbitrary it may seem. In your case, you said that you were unemployed - is this still the case? If so, I think this would be a good place to start. Alternatively, if you are employed, are you happy with your job, or would you change it if you could? Ultimately, having some sort of meaning in your life which is unrelated to women will do wonders for your well-being.

Post: #3

I recommend reading How to Win Friends and Influence People, which can tell you how to develop your social life and become more interested in others, in addition to how to be more socially skilled.

There's a lot to enjoy about spending time with women, honestly, you sound like a girlfriend would be great for you. Branch out more and you'll see there's lots of interesting girls out there

Post: #4

Oh, boy. Luckily for you, you ended up here, and not on an incel forum...

Jokes aside, when you start having thoughts about certain things being futile, you will come to the conclusion that everything is futile. Don't feed those thoughts.

As RedPill said, you must find a purpose in your life. Set goals for yourself, fake it till you make it, and the rest will fall into place.

You ARE here, on this Earth, and you will remain on it for 50 more years, so you might as well fucking make the best of it, buddy.

Find a job, work out, play pool, soccer, cards or paintball with your friends. Get yourself a manly hobby.
Read classic novels about aspiring heroes, good male role models, not the contemporary anti-hero existentialist shit for pussies.

And remember - a girlfriend is meant to complement your life, not fulfill it.

You must be a Man, with a capital M, with a job, goals, success, interests, social circle; with a built character and a backbone.

I wish you all the best. Keep growing, bro.

Post: #5

Fortunately there is a thread by LOZ that describes(almost) what you're describing and the solution: /thread-37819.html

It's catered to normal guys who feel those things, though. If you have psychological problems you should do a variant of CBT to try and reduce/eliminate your envy/resentment.

Post: #6

PLEASE OP, read the LOZ thread above. We need to take control of the narrative back from those who would slander men just for recognizing the hypocritical nature of the world we live in.

That aside: You've got a bunch of limiting beliefs that are holding you back, but please for all that is good and holy, don't take this the wrong way. The problem isn't the women.

The problem is you. Everything in life IS YOUR FAULT.

Read that three times, think about it, and then read it three more times. That is your path to freedom. It's hard, but the rewards are well worth it!

Understand?

Right now my friend, your twisted view on women is probably borne of too much time spent in isolation, and definitely too much time spent on the internet. If you're going to beat this, the first thing you have to do is get off the computer.

Take a second to think about this: one of the women in this world right now is my younger sister. She is studying to be a nurse. She spends tons of time volunteering and helping others out. She is kind and thoughtful and has hopes and dreams just like you do.

Would you want to do something cruel to a good person like that? I really hope not. Because even in Spain, there are plenty of good women like my sister.

Now, if you really want to change this, you're going to have to have experiences with women. There's no way around it; not having feminine contact warps and twists men into bitter shells of what they are truly meant to be.

The reality of women is this: there are good ones, and there are bad ones. It's the same as men. It's a good thing you have no expectations, so you can't be disappointed. But on the other hand, there are millions of women that will exceed your expectations.

I'll tell you a story.

When I was a teenager, I went through a particularly traumatic event that left me feeling as low as I've ever felt in my life. Honestly, if I was alone, I don't know if I would still be here today. I was extremely bitter and resentful.

My neighbor at the time was the same age as me. She saw something was wrong, and broke into my house to make sure I wasn't alone. I'm not kidding. I locked all the doors and she literally climbed in a second story window to make sure I was okay. She was a straight A student and skipped school for three days just to be with me.

This girl was sexually promiscuous, and what many people here would consider a "red flag woman". However, she was (and still is!) a great fucking person. Don't let the internet cloud your head. RVF can be a sounding board sometimes. There's a subset of people here that have a very anti-woman worldview. If that brings them happiness, then great. But I doubt it. Negativity breeds negativity.

Don't let that be you! You may not have experienced female kindness in the ways that I have yet, but I promise you, there are unbelievably sweet and caring women out there! You just have to take the chance to put the best part of you out there, and eventually you will run across one of them!

Now, how should you find these women? Based on what you've said here I don't think you're emotionally ready to handle the ups and downs of online dating. What do you like to do?

I met my first girlfriend through running! I was just enjoying myself with no expectations and we connected. It doesn't matter what you like, but you need to get off the computer and go do things. Talk to women that you'd sleep with, and with women you wouldn't. You just need to clear this malaise out of your head, and there's no better way to do that than while doing something else you already like.

You'll quickly realize that as you experience these things you call illusions (a family, the playboy lifestyle, traditions, etc) that there's a lot more substance than you think. Before I had sex for the first time I used to lament that there was nothing more than sex. Then I went and had sex, and I haven't thought about that in almost a decade. Try it, and see how it benefits you.

If you take one thing from this entire post: PLEASE understand that you hold the power in your hands right now to change this negative belief. The world is a beautiful place and full of wonders, and women are a part of those. There is unbelievable beauty and kindness out there. As long as you have hope that it exists, you can, and will find it.

Please avoid any incel/MGTOW forums as well. Stay here with RVF only.

Post: #7

You are right, women are practically useless and their position in modern society is utterly contemptible. Lift, meditate, work hard and try and find a good one, one day

Post: #8

LFE buddy, you need to slow down and step back. I can understand and even relate to your frustration but that rabbit hole won't lead you anywhere good.

1- I second (third?) the advice to read the LOZ thread besides Investment Bro's solid post above.

2- Be honest with yourself. Sounds like you resent women because you can't get a girl. Upside is that it's really easy to fix. You already have the resources here.

3- Don't hate women for what they are. They're just doing what they were programmed to do, as we all are on some level. Try to remember that when times are tough.

4- When you see an "acne, belly,..." guy with a pretty girl, use it as motivation. If he can do it, you definitely can too. Even give him mental kudos and look for style, fitness or other pointers you can use.

5- Find something that you enjoy and can progress on (other than sex, you rascal you). Music, sports, even crafts. Do it and get better at it with time. You’ll feel better. Bonus points if it's a group activity.

Reality sucks sometimes but it's not all doom and gloom. Beware the poisonous black pill, my friend.

Post: #9

It’s perfectly normal and healthy for men to feel anger or even hatred toward women. It’s difficult to forgive women for the unsatisfied desire which they inspire to us.

The more pussy you get, the weaker it gets, but it never goes away. The virtuous man treats women fairly and respectfully *in spite* of that anger.

Post: #10

No, it's not perfectly normal or healthy unless you're a would-be serial killer.

Post: #11

LOL if people killed everyone they hate, we’d have a genocide.

FYI Anger is a very normal and extremely common human emotion, which only exceptionally results in homicide (or homicidal thoughts for that matter).

Post: #12

(09-06-2018 08:19 AM)Montrose Wrote:  It’s perfectly normal and healthy for men to feel anger or even hatred toward women. It’s difficult to forgive women for the unsatisfied desire which they inspire to us.

The more pussy you get, the weaker it gets, but it never goes away. The virtuous man treats women fairly and respectfully *in spite* of that anger.

The root of anger is fear. I disagree, if you're finding yourself angry or hating women you have something wrong that you need to address. You really have to ask yourself - what am I honestly afraid of? More often than not it's ending up alone that men are really afraid of.

If you're living your life continuously afraid of something, your life will get measurably better by doing what you can to allay your fear. Choose accordingly. Part of being a man is forgiveness. Hate and anger flourish when a man isn't strong enough to let them go.

Post: #13

This song always comes to mind whenever I read virgintow/incel writings.



"People are strange, when you're a stranger, women seem wicked when you're unwanted."

Those lyrics; that's what it boils down to.

Sounds like you have a massive superiority complex OP. Hope as you grow older you humble yourself. Life is short enough as it is. Hell of a shame to go through it bitter and jaded and hating women. Gotta stop and smell the roses.

Post: #14

Quote: the root of anger is fear

Says who? Anger and Fear are two of the most basic human emotions with Joy Sadness Surprise Shame Disgust

They are entirely independent. Anger does not beget Fear nor is the reverse true (although they can be coincidental)

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/...c-emotions

(Incidentally, Fear is also a healthy emotion. Many men are scared of women; although vastly inefficient, it is not unhealthy per se)

Post: #15

I think that anyone that gets into this sphere can be tainted by what we think of as the "unfairness" of the world around us, specifically with women and the sexual marketplace. It's easy to feel this way; but in life, you should never take the easy path. There is a process in unplugging from what society has taught you, and obviously, there is a phase of disbelief, followed by a period of anger, and finally, an intense feeling of calm at the very end. You begin to love women for what they ARE instead of the Idealized figures that have been shoved down your throat from day one.

This means that there are most definitely women that you do not want to be around; there are also many men you do not want to be around. But, there are exceptional people out there that are just waiting to be found.

But, you must ask yourself: Why would a beautiful woman want to be around me? If the answer is honestly "no reason" then you need to work on yourself, yesterday.

What Investment Bro says is absolutely true: you control your own life, and you create the Youniverse that you live in. That means that you decide who stays in your life (you can only partially decide who comes into your life), you decide what actions you take to create the world that you want to live in, and you decide from the ground up how that world will look. That is the most powerful feeling you will ever have in this life; you control where you are going, you control who you become, and YOU CONTROL YOUR LIFE.

If you are shrouded in darkness, anger, negativity, and sadness, then you will project that unto the world, and you reap what you sow: your personal interactions will greatly suffer. It is sometimes difficult to get out of a rut, especially if you have nobody else in your life, but what you need to do is stop reading, and start being an active participant in your life. That means making sure that your health, wealth, and happiness are all on track, and that you are getting better on a daily basis. That's where you start. Then, you can slowly wade into approaching women and getting into game. But, what comes first is you, your well-being, and getting to a point that you are happy to say you are you.

Then, and only then, can you build a world around you that makes you feel inspired, find women that are exceptional human beings, and live a life that you can be happy in.

Post: #16

In an ideal world we would all be happy and joyful and gay (no homo). In real life we are (at least sometimes) angry and sad and scared. Pretending otherwise will only lead you to misery and madness. Don’t lie to yourself. Controlling one’s emotions is extremely difficult. Deal with it. It’s normal.

Post: #17

Courage is not the absence of fear but the will to overcome your fear
Compassion is not the absence of anger but the will to do good in spite of your anger
Energy is not the absence of sadness but the power to act despite your sadness

Post: #18

I wonder, though, if a place like this self-selects for people that possess a critical mass of traits that are desired by women and simply teaches them to use those traits. Look at Investment Bro's story. I have never been subject to an unconditional act of kindness from women my own age. So I have to wonder, what is he leaving out? Or what did she have to gain? I think it is possible that you are looking at the wrong order of cause and effect with some of the people that you deem to have too much of those negative traits that cause their unhappiness.

I find myself in a very similar place as the OP, although I am trying to build my desire for women. People as a collective seem to like me, but individual women do not. For example, in Bang/Day Bang Roosh talks about women engaging in polite conversation but displaying disinterest. I get outright ignored. I'm not some autistic sperg that can barely stutter out a "hello," but I will sit down next to a girl in class or try to chat with a girl hanging around campus and she will not utter a word to me. I talk, they look at me, and they go back to whatever they were doing. This happened twice today.

You cannot honestly tell me that you think one needs game just to chat. There must be something else going on. I never have those problems when I engage a group of people, even ones of all women. There's not a smooth curve on the graph of quality men for who women are receptive to. There is a sharp cliff where after a certain point women regard you as almost nonhuman. So while both the OP and I can certainly rectify this by improving ourselves, don't make believe that our attitude and negativity sprang from nowhere to cause our failure.

Post: #19

You know when we talk about red flags on women and damaged women? Well, let's say men who use terms like "strong hatred of women" and "fear of women" send women running for their lives even before they open their mouths. And rightly so, literally. This is the kind of language you hear from the likes of Eliot Rodger.

Fix yourselves first before you even expect your damaged vibes to attract women.

Post: #20

(09-06-2018 05:28 PM)The Stronger Sex Wrote:  You know when we talk about red flags on women and damaged women? Well, let's say men who use terms like "strong hatred of women" and "fear of women" send women running for their lives even before they open their mouths. And rightly so, literally. This is the kind of language you hear from the likes of Eliot Rodger.

Fix yourselves first before you even expect your damaged vibes to attract women.

You're missing my point. We didn't pop out of the womb hating women. It's learned.

For me, it's from being their number one target of ridicule during my childhood. When guys harassed me as a kid I could kick their asses, women got a free pass. That bred a lot of resentment. I'm mostly over that at this age, but I still don't particularly like women as people. So laying all the blame at the feet of the OP for his negativity is like telling a paraplegic "just put one leg in front of the other and you can walk, it's that easy."

It's also a good way to discourage people that may have a lower starting point than yourself. I'd wager that most of the successful people here had an average starting point.


To the OP, that is the harsh reality of it. It may not be your fault that you've ended up where you are, but it's your responsibility to work and fix it. I'm right there with you and I wish you luck.

Post: #21

(09-06-2018 04:20 PM)Professor When Wrote:  I wonder, though, if a place like this self-selects for people that possess a critical mass of traits that are desired by women and simply teaches them to use those traits.

I'd say it's 50/50. Some guys are just naturals. Even before I "knew" game, I never had a problem connecting with women. I've never taken myself too seriously and that has always made it easy for me. I wouldn't say I was a natural like others here, however.

If you spend enough time here you'll see complete 360 degree turnarounds, but it does take time. I promise that you have traits that are desired by women, but for whatever reason those aren't readily presented or developed yet. Bringing those out is really what game boils down to in the end. Basically expressing the best, and most attractive parts of you in a natural way.

(09-06-2018 04:20 PM)Professor When Wrote:  Look at Investment Bro's story. I have never been subject to an unconditional act of kindness from women my own age. So I have to wonder, what is he leaving out? Or what did she have to gain?

The part that was left out was mentioned above. We had a good connection. Also, we were both younger and much less cynical.

I can understand why you would view this as a give and take. Had I not been successful early, I can see myself feeling the same way. The thing with women that I realized early, as long as you maintain strong emotional engagement with them, they will continuously give to you without you having to give much in return.

You tell me, do you think you're lacking in your ability to emotionally engage women? This is an honest question.

(09-06-2018 04:20 PM)Professor When Wrote:  I think it is possible that you are looking at the wrong order of cause and effect with some of the people that you deem to have too much of those negative traits that cause their unhappiness.

Both you and the OP are caught in the same negative feedback loop, but thankfully both of you know it. That means you can break free.

The cause of the problem: lack of positive emotional and sexual experiences with women.

The effect: Greater difficulty having positive emotional and sexual experiences with women. Leads to further resentment, which leads back to a lack of positive emotional and sexual experiences.

(09-06-2018 04:20 PM)Professor When Wrote:  I find myself in a very similar place as the OP, although I am trying to build my desire for women. People as a collective seem to like me, but individual women do not.

Numbers my friend. Most women don't like me either!

(09-06-2018 04:20 PM)Professor When Wrote:  For example, in Bang/Day Bang Roosh talks about women engaging in polite conversation but displaying disinterest.

I don't necessarily agree with Roosh on this. If a woman is actively showing interest in you, then pulling back and displaying indifference works. But if you're indifferent from the get go, you're going to elicit a similar response from women unless there's other physical or environmental factors going for you.

Indifference doesn't get their emotions going until they're interested in you. Other than the women that are an immediate no, you'll have two groups of yes women. The ones that like you just enough to give you a chance, and the ones that REALLY like you from the get go (5-10%). With both of these groups you need to throw bait to get them to engage. That means being engaging yourself! You can still do the polite talk, but engage a little bit yourself. Smile, say something outlandish to see how she reacts, and then go from there. You'll be amazed what you can get away with saying if you've got a good shit eating grin.

The effing shit eating grin has gotten me more bangs than I care to count.

(09-06-2018 04:20 PM)Professor When Wrote:  I get outright ignored. I'm not some autistic sperg that can barely stutter out a "hello," but I will sit down next to a girl in class or try to chat with a girl hanging around campus and she will not utter a word to me. I talk, they look at me, and they go back to whatever they were doing. This happened twice today.

Can you tell us a little bit more about how you opened them? This definitely happens to all of us, but do you think you're coming off as a little bit mechanical? That's the sense I'm getting based on your general tone.

(09-06-2018 04:20 PM)Professor When Wrote:  You cannot honestly tell me that you think one needs game just to chat. There must be something else going on. I never have those problems when I engage a group of people, even ones of all women. There's not a smooth curve on the graph of quality men for who women are receptive to. There is a sharp cliff where after a certain point women regard you as almost nonhuman. So while both the OP and I can certainly rectify this by improving ourselves, don't make believe that our attitude and negativity sprang from nowhere to cause our failure.

You're definitely right, negativity does not just spring up on it's own, nor did I suggest that. Can you tell me a little bit more about the attempts at conversation? It's very possible you just opened some mean spirited bitches. Happens to the best of us.

The degree to which women are receptive is so situationally complex. That's part of the reason there's such an emphasis initially on reading IOIs. It's a lot easier talking to a receptive woman as opposed to just sitting next to someone and trying to strike up conversation. Of course, you should attempt to open as many women as possible, but understand that the majority of them will not like you. I'm tall, in good shape, and average looks. Even with what I would say is good game, I do get ignored.

I promise though, the rewards are worth it. There's nothing like your first real game success. The second you have it, you'll find yourself in a much different place.

Post: #22

(09-06-2018 10:38 PM)Investment Bro Wrote:  

(09-06-2018 04:20 PM)Professor When Wrote:  Look at Investment Bro's story. I have never been subject to an unconditional act of kindness from women my own age. So I have to wonder, what is he leaving out? Or what did she have to gain?

The part that was left out was mentioned above. We had a good connection. Also, we were both younger and much less cynical.

I can understand why you would view this as a give and take. Had I not been successful early, I can see myself feeling the same way. The thing with women that I realized early, as long as you maintain strong emotional engagement with them, they will continuously give to you without you having to give much in return.

You tell me, do you think you're lacking in your ability to emotionally engage women? This is an honest question.

Probably. I'm not even sure what it means to emotionally engage them. I tend to be funny and charming, but there's always the issue of being at arms length. Many seem to enjoy my company, but there is always the problem where if I am not the one making contact and forcing myself into their view, they just sort of forget about me. You may have seen how I go through constant cycles of LJBF and ghosting women while they seem perfectly content to let me move on.

Quote:

(09-06-2018 04:20 PM)Professor When Wrote:  I think it is possible that you are looking at the wrong order of cause and effect with some of the people that you deem to have too much of those negative traits that cause their unhappiness.

Both you and the OP are caught in the same negative feedback loop, but thankfully both of you know it. That means you can break free.

The cause of the problem: lack of positive emotional and sexual experiences with women.

The effect: Greater difficulty having positive emotional and sexual experiences with women. Leads to further resentment, which leads back to a lack of positive emotional and sexual experiences.

For me, the best way to end this loop is to become more physically attractive. I hope to build from there, since it's very hard to get any experience when I can't get past the first line.

Quote:

(09-06-2018 04:20 PM)Professor When Wrote:  I get outright ignored. I'm not some autistic sperg that can barely stutter out a "hello," but I will sit down next to a girl in class or try to chat with a girl hanging around campus and she will not utter a word to me. I talk, they look at me, and they go back to whatever they were doing. This happened twice today.

Can you tell us a little bit more about how you opened them? This definitely happens to all of us, but do you think you're coming off as a little bit mechanical? That's the sense I'm getting based on your general tone.

The last few went like this:
1) The first class was held in a library screening room with nice leather chairs. I sat next to a girl and commented "That's comfy. Are all of the classroom here this relaxing?" She looked at me for a second then went back to her phone.

2) A later class had the professor cracking obnoxious jokes and generally having fun explaining the premise of the class. I noticed one of the girls near me was laughing a lot and nodding along. As we walked out I commented "You looked like you were having fun, have you been in [teacher]'s classes before?" She said "yeah," then ducked into a nearby bathroom.

3) Last one I was outside a classroom early and the door was locked, a girl walks up and tries the door so I ask "are you looking for [class]?" she was, then she sat down on the bench next to me and waited. I said "This class seems like it will be really interesting, are you excited for the first day?" She grunts at me then whips out her phone.

They mostly go like that. I ask an innocuous question and she gives me nothing to work with. I wouldn't say I'm mechanical, but I tend to be overly eloquent based on the way my parents raised me. People sometimes give me shit about it, so I do work to dumb down my speech patterns a bit.

Quote:

(09-06-2018 04:20 PM)Professor When Wrote:  You cannot honestly tell me that you think one needs game just to chat. There must be something else going on. I never have those problems when I engage a group of people, even ones of all women. There's not a smooth curve on the graph of quality men for who women are receptive to. There is a sharp cliff where after a certain point women regard you as almost nonhuman. So while both the OP and I can certainly rectify this by improving ourselves, don't make believe that our attitude and negativity sprang from nowhere to cause our failure.

You're definitely right, negativity does not just spring up on it's own, nor did I suggest that. Can you tell me a little bit more about the attempts at conversation? It's very possible you just opened some mean spirited bitches. Happens to the best of us.

The degree to which women are receptive is so situationally complex. That's part of the reason there's such an emphasis initially on reading IOIs. It's a lot easier talking to a receptive woman as opposed to just sitting next to someone and trying to strike up conversation. Of course, you should attempt to open as many women as possible, but understand that the majority of them will not like you. I'm tall, in good shape, and average looks. Even with what I would say is good game, I do get ignored.

I promise though, the rewards are worth it. There's nothing like your first real game success. The second you have it, you'll find yourself in a much different place.

That's what I'm hoping. Once I start seeing more success I'll begin to enjoy the process, failures and all. In my current state I often question if it's worth it to bother. OP seems to be even further down that path. Unfortunately, given that he hasn't responded to this thread in 3 days, I think he may have been scared off.

Post: #23

Professor when.

To engage with the top part of your post and not much else.

So even though we're in the slut filled decline of our civ. All women desire commitment, love and other fairytale nonsense. What they feel as "emotional engagement" is of course you being witty, charming, and attractive as a pre-requisite but possibly the most important part is taking action to fulfil their self-actualized fantasies of love and comittment and belonging. What I mean by that is that a girl can be extremely attracted to someone but if the guy doesn't take commitment styled actions she won't be "emotionally fulfilled".

Their emotions on that level are just a basic driver to fulfil their purpose as biological incubators and even in their worst moments are wise to listen to those emotions as it's a grandfsthered in feature to through a long evolutionary process to ensure the success of humanity.

Essentially emotionally engaging with women is upping the stakes, or at least pretending to. There's a lot of ways to go about it.

If you're on some cold hearted shit and can fake it you can exploit this irrationality to your benefit. If you're q chump a woman may love you for a while for it but it will blind you and make you less of a man. I find somewhere in the middle the best way.

Basically just show you care in ways that plays to a woman's comfort in having offspring with you. Even if she never plans to theirs a undeniable attraction to it and it will solicit emotional investment from women

Post: #24

@ Eugenics,
Could you give me an example of caring without coming off as beta or overdoing it ?
I just want to know the line between too much caring and too little caring .

Thanks

Post: #25

I would say, that problem here is not on the women´s side but inside of you and this feelings come from some kind of unfulfillment of your man´s needs.
Women are women and you can´t change them. If you keep telling yourself you hate them, it won´t harm them, it will harm only you.
Everybody from this forum has some basic knowledge about true nature of women and there are some guys who have pretty good knowledge, how to deal with them. But you can´t find hate in their wisdom.

I would say that art of life is in accepting, that you can´t change the most of the things around you, while approaching yourself, like it´s not like that. There are things like nature of women, that can´t be changed and then there are you, who can change himself in any way. Victorious spot is somewhere between, it´s the place where you got yourself by your attitude and hard work and where this all met with women environment.

Think of two persons:
1) Thinks he has done enough, but it doesn´t bring him his desired reward, so he start to blame women and act hostile towards them. This makes his position even worse.
2) Knows that no matter how hard he tries, women always will be women and nothing will be perfect. But he is able to settle with knowledge, that he can at least get the most out of it. Women are bad, but they are also very sweet and to taste the sweet from time to time is much better then live with depression and hatred.