Post: #1

Average men with no ambition will look down on men of achievement and disparage them, belittling the accomplishments of others so they can feel better about themselves. This is the classic "knock down the other towers so that mine is the highest" approach. This path leads to mediocrity and men of substance have no time or interest for that.

I doubt that many of the men on RVF fit into this former category.

Conversely, men of ambition and drive will look up to men of achievement and take inspiration from them. But as ambitious men, we must be careful to avoid crossing the line from inspiration into desperation or jealously because other men seem to be far ahead of us in one particular area. Focusing on other's achievements and comparing them to your own is a fantastic way to be completely miserable. In extreme cases it can lead to depression and a sense of purposelessness or hopelessness. What's the point of even trying, you might say, if you can never be as good at X as Y.

There are two important points to bear in mind when facing these kinds of thoughts.

Live Your Own Story

Remember that losers focus on winners, and winners focus on winning. Focusing outwards onto other people who are winning will not bring you success and fulfilment in your own life. The correct path, and the one that all winners follow is to look inwards to your own experiences and fulfil your own life story.

Other people live their life story. They are not you. They have different experiences, resources, skills, genetics and contacts than you do. It does not make sense for you to try to live their story. Instead you must look inside yourself, find your own story and live that. Every time you see a man with some achievement and think "I wish I had that", look inside and decide whether working towards that goal fits with your life story or not. If it doesn't, you can move on happily knowing that it wasn't your path.

I tried to learn guitar for years because I saw other men doing it and thought that I had to learn it to "catch up" and have what they had. I finally gave it up because it never came naturally to me, and I realised that it wasn't part of my life story. It turns out that programming WAS part of my life story and came completely naturally to me, so I focused on that with outstanding results.

You know something is part of your life story when it comes to you in visions and dreams.

You Do Not Know What They Sacrificed

I have a friend who is on track to break a million dollars before he hits 30. Some men might look at him, compare to their own bank account and feel despondent because they are not on track for the same goal.

But they have no idea what price he has paid for it. I know personally this man has spent years since his early twenties grinding away at 12-14 hour days in a major city, day in, day out. He has not had extensive travel experience. He does not speak any other languages. He is not particularly successful with women. When he reaches his goal, what will he have apart from a big number in his bank account?

I have another friend who is wildly successful with women. He has bedded hundreds of girls, many of whom are models. He lived a party lifestyle and spent a lot of time on beaches and in clubs. You might compare this man's lifestyle to your own and feel envy and a sense of inadequacy that you haven't had the same success as him. But you are not seeing the whole picture.

This man is now in his early thirties with nothing to show for it. He partied away his twenties, now he has no money, no valuable skills and no professional network. Where will he go from here?

Every man lives his own story. When you find yourself facing a feeling of inadequacy, remember that the only story that matters is the one that you tell with your own life. Yes, look to other men for inspiration and learn what you can from them, but stop it there. Keep your focus on yourself, your own life and your own story. And for every action you take, think to yourself, "does this fit into my own life story?" If not, then throw it away - it's not for you.

Or, as Marcus Aurelius put it:

Waste no more time arguing about what a good man should be. Be one.

Post: #2

(02-27-2017 07:07 PM)rafaeld Wrote:  I have a friend who is on track to break a million dollars before he hits 30. Some men might look at him, compare to their own bank account and feel despondent because they are not on track for the same goal.

But they have no idea what price he has paid for it. I know personally this man has spent years since his early twenties grinding away at 12-14 hour days in a major city, day in, day out. He has not had extensive travel experience. He does not speak any other languages. He is not particularly successful with women. When he reaches his goal, what will he have apart from a big number in his bank account?

Further to the opportunity cost issues that you touched on are the very real health issues that can arise, literally killing yourself. There is a prime example in this thread.

Men will chase what they deem as success (often doggedly with an intense focus) without taking full stock of the toll it can potentially take on their physical health, mental health or a combination of both. There are always trade-offs.

This is especially true if you're in a high paced/inherently stressful career that your personality does not naturally thrive in (i.e. take things too personal, don't have the emotional resilience for it). Equally havoc wreaking is the effect that office politics and malignant higher-ups can have - decisions and actions outside of your control that eat away at your soul.

Aim high, yes, but seek balance in life. I've always interpreted the old saying "Work hard, play hard" to mean offsetting the impact that hard work can have on you with "playfulness", which can mean different things to different people but hinges on the premise of "de-loading" the stress that can build up from the daily grind.

Don't let societal pressures dictate what is right or wrong either. Listen to your instincts and let them guide your choices, they know what's best for you. It's usually when we pay them no mind that shit can go south; maybe not immediately, but definitely over time.

Post: #3

Not bashing on OP, but kind of surprised that pep talk got 3 rep points. I've seen datasheet and reports get less than that.

I disagree with several parts.

Firstly having an eye to winners, and men who have more, is very valuable. Pretty straightforward stuff: if you want to be a better golfer, observe better golfers, get taught by better golfers, and so on.

Likewise, if you want more money, observe men who have more money. If you want more or hotter women, observe men who are getting that.

The line "losers focus on winners, winners focus on winning" sounds quote-y, but it's not very insightful. Many big men, like Masayoshi Son & Warren Buffet, specifically sought out winners for guidance. Everything is in balance: you need an eye to what's possible, as well as your own drive.

Also that guy who will hit 30 with a million is a plain winner. Speaking from experience, it only takes 3 years to go from Zero with women, to Competent or even Proficient. And he can hop on a plane the day after he hits that million mark and land hotties immediately.

Fundamentally, I don't understand the point the post is trying to make. If it's just like in the title, that you "shouldn't worry about men who are doing better than you", that's wrong too.

Men who are doing better than you are the best wake-up call you can get.

Everything in balance.

Post: #4

@Pheonix,

There is a huge difference between learning from those better than you, and beating yourself up over others who are doing better than you, which is what the OP is talking about.

Comparing yourself to your neighbor is rooted in our Western culture. It's where the idiom "Keeping up with the Joneses" comes from, where you must materially keep up with your neighbors to maintain your social standing. You have a Honda, your neighbor has a Nissan, there is balance. Your neighbor buys an Audi. Now you are inferior. You buy a Mercedez to maintain balance. Now you're happy because you're not worse off socially, but are unhappy because you're worse off financially.

It's very superficial, and I think it is a part of the reason why mental illness is so prevalent in our society. Our neighbors are seen as competitors instead of cooperators. So yes, the healthy thing to do when your neighbor buys an Audi, is to congratulate him and ask him what his recent hustle is to learn to make more money like him.

The internet, and social media in particular, accentuate this problem in us. Facebook forces us to compare ourselves to our friends and makes us unhappy. We see only the top moments of everyone elses life and wonder why we're so unhappy. Of course, you only see the vacation pics, and don't see that they slaved away for 60 hours a week in order to pay for their vacation.

The OP's point is not to compare yourself, which seems obvious. Unfortunately, it's a subconscious trait for many people and that's why he brings it to attention.

Post: #5

I think the difference that you guys are getting at is that a loser will belittle a successful person because they feel bad about not being on their level while a guy who is secure in himself can smile and be happy that another man is doing well and even learn from that man.

I try to be the latter guy.

Everyone knows something that I can potentially learn so I always do my best to pay attention when someone is telling me about their successes in life.

Post: #6

(02-28-2017 09:36 AM)yeppels Wrote:  @Pheonix,

There is a huge difference between learning from those better than you, and beating yourself up over others who are doing better than you, which is what the OP is talking about.

No the difference isn't that big. Unless you're able to notice that somebody is superior to you, you can't seek them out. Unless you're able to accept you're inferior to them, you have no motivation to follow their advice.

(02-28-2017 09:36 AM)yeppels Wrote:  Comparing yourself to your neighbor is rooted in our Western culture. It's where the idiom "Keeping up with the Joneses" comes from, where you must materially keep up with your neighbors to maintain your social standing. You have a Honda, your neighbor has a Nissan, there is balance. Your neighbor buys an Audi. Now you are inferior. You buy a Mercedez to maintain balance. Now you're happy because you're not worse off socially, but are unhappy because you're worse off financially.

Does anybody actually compare themselves to their neighbors? I don't know about you, but most people don't even know their neighbors. I compare myself against men who I respect, who are of similar stats to me, on things that I value.

I don't care about cars, so if buying a better car improves my status in the eyes of those around me, I either think "is there something else I do like that would get the same effect" or "how do I live among different people?".

I also don't expect to ever be operating in the same bracket as Trump or a male model, no matter what I do, so I don't compare myself to them either.

There is nothing wrong with comparison as long as you're being reasonable and intelligent about it.

If OP is just saying "don't go overboard", OK I get that, "never being satisfied" and so on, but I don't think many men have that problem. Most men either need to do more self improvement, or are doing a good level of self-improvement which they should keep up.

Post: #7

My comparisons are always extreme, I compare my looks with brad pitt, although you might not see even 0.1% similarity. But that actually motivates me to try and get the most out of my face's capability. Although the only factor I can control is hair, on head, facial.
Women wise, girls wise* , I compare my approach success with that of the forums top G's. Although you wouldn't even consider me a beginner. I still get motivated by all that is there for me to achieve because so have other men.
Money wise, I expect reality to hit me hard, but I still think I would be one of the richest man before I'm 30. Although right now, I neither have the resources nor skills. But I still go ahead and compare myself to the likes of Mark Z.
I'm not really the most positive person, but I still go ahead and have the most positive future expectations. They're as real as I would let myself believe. Ofcourse our beliefs are not stock but flow variable.
So is expecting from yourself, killing yourself?

Post: #8

Thanks for this, this came at the right time when I've had some shitty weeks this year.

Post: #9

Never measure yourself against others, because there will always be lesser and greater than you.

Measure yourself against yourself and your own performance, improvement and weaknesses.

No one know you better than yourself. Only you know if you are slacking, if you are doing the best you can.

Post: #10

(02-28-2017 08:47 AM)Phoenix Wrote:  I disagree with several parts.

Firstly having an eye to winners, and men who have more, is very valuable. Pretty straightforward stuff: if you want to be a better golfer, observe better golfers, get taught by better golfers, and so on.

Likewise, if you want more money, observe men who have more money. If you want more or hotter women, observe men who are getting that.

I agree 100% with this statement. If you want to be the best, you have to learn from the best.

However, take a young man who's father owns a successful carpentry business. He's 5ft3 and not very athletic but his hero is Michael Jordan and he is "inspired" by him. He wants to be a basket ball player just like Mike.

Which career path makes more sense for this man: apprentice to his father to learn a trade, or go balls to the wall with basketball and try to be the next Michael Jordan?

There's no right or wrong answer, who knows, maybe he'll be the next Muggsy Bogues. But it's unlikely and can only happen if that fire comes from somewhere deep inside him. He will not get there by attempting to emulate Michael Jordan merely because he is successful. He would be better off emulating his own father. Comparing himself negatively to Michael Jordan in this case would be unhelpful. He is not Michael Jordan, he doesn't have those genetic gifts so why feel bad about not achieving the same kind of success. The smarter choice for him would be to apprentice under his father, make some cash and grow the business by hiring others when the time comes.

Yes, great men can be inspirational and lift you up. But your direction must come from within and make sense within the context of your own life.

Quote:Fundamentally, I don't understand the point the post is trying to make. If it's just like in the title, that you "shouldn't worry about men who are doing better than you", that's wrong too.

Men who are doing better than you are the best wake-up call you can get.

People need to hear different perspectives depending on where they are at. Where you are at, it sounds like you are fired up, hungry and pulled upwards by observing highly successful male examples. That's great, if it works for you keep doing it.

There are other situations where this comparison can become harmful. An example would be my own situation. In my early twenties I was highly ambitious, I observed men like Mark Zuckerberg, Elon Musk, Paul Graham, Sam Altman and others found tech startups and become wildly successful.

I read everything I could and tried to emulate these men to the best of my ability. I worked all the hours, taught myself to code and just generally busted ass and did everything these men said that they did.

Two failed startups later later I had not a lot to show for it except for becoming highly skilled at coding. Do not mistake this for regret. I regret nothing, every decision I ever made was the right one at the time I made it.

The problem comes because recently I have been guilty of evaluating myself in comparison to these men and seeing an ever widening gap which I cannot seem to get across no matter how many hours I work. This led me to anxiety, depression and during the worst of it even suicidal thoughts.

Which is nonsensical. I did not get the same results as these men because I lacked a lot of the intangibles that they had. I did not live in the same location (west coast of the US, easy access to capital) nor have the same contacts, or go to the same school (and dare I say it, luck played some part too). It had nothing to do with how hard I worked on myself or my projects, I couldn't have worked any harder without killing myself.

(02-28-2017 10:05 AM)Phoenix Wrote:  

(02-28-2017 09:36 AM)yeppels Wrote:  There is a huge difference between learning from those better than you, and beating yourself up over others who are doing better than you, which is what the OP is talking about.

No the difference isn't that big. Unless you're able to notice that somebody is superior to you, you can't seek them out. Unless you're able to accept you're inferior to them, you have no motivation to follow their advice.

Observing and learning from successful men who have achieved what you want, yes this is helpful and motivating, and indeed one of the only ways to learn.

There comes a point where more inspiration and role models crosses the line from motivating to demotivating. At this point it makes more sense to look inwards at your own life, and start telling your own story as best you can instead of worrying about copying somebody else's. That was my point with this post.

Post: #11

(03-01-2017 12:30 AM)rafaeld Wrote:  There are other situations where this comparison can become harmful. An example would be my own situation. In my early twenties I was highly ambitious, I observed men like Mark Zuckerberg, Elon Musk, Paul Graham, Sam Altman and others found tech startups and become wildly successful.

I read everything I could and tried to emulate these men to the best of my ability. I worked all the hours, taught myself to code and just generally busted ass and did everything these men said that they did.

The problem comes because recently I have been guilty of evaluating myself in comparison to these men and seeing an ever widening gap which I cannot seem to get across no matter how many hours I work. This led me to anxiety, depression and during the worst of it even suicidal thoughts.

I have seen hundreds, if not, thousands of guys making the same mistake as you in co-working and startup hubs around the world over the past 7 years.

They end up jaded, burnt out and depressed before they hit 35.

I think a lot of these guys tended to have low self-esteem and seem to think that business or financial success would make them "complete".

I encouraged them to live in the present and experience real life, and get away from their damn computers!!

Post: #12

I disagree with the OP and side with Phoenix

Quote:Conversely, men of ambition and drive will look up to men of achievement and take inspiration from them. But as ambitious men, we must be careful to avoid crossing the line from inspiration into desperation or jealously because other men seem to be far ahead of us in one particular area. Focusing on other's achievements and comparing them to your own is a fantastic way to be completely miserable. In extreme cases it can lead to depression and a sense of purposelessness or hopelessness. What's the point of even trying, you might say, if you can never be as good at X as Y.

If you just think you can show up and be great thats a recipe for disaster. But if your goal is to be the best then you have the beat the best. I've won some NCAA titles in my day and those are from me tired of getting my ass whooped when I was 7 and making a decision to do whatever it took to be the best. This shit takes time and darwinism is a thing for a reason.

Ultimately you decide to be the alpha or die off no one else makes that decision for you. You allow yourself the become frustrated and jealous. You decide to make the sacrifices necessary to beat them. You decide that you can't play guitar.

Im not going to lie to you this shit:

Quote:In extreme cases it can lead to depression and a sense of purposelessness or hopelessness. What's the point of even trying, you might say, if you can never be as good at X as Y.

If you think like this it tells me everything I need to know about you. Im a retardedly competitive person and that there is the mindset of a weak person. Period.
People with that mindset deserve every bit of failure that comes their way. It sounds like some millennial weakminded bullshit. Me and my teammates in college PREYED on people like this in competition.

"Run up in his house, eat his food, tuck in his children, and fuck his wife"
--wise basketball coach

The fact that you have to warn us like a field of sheep before a lion if fucking insulting imo.
I am the goddamn lion.

Quote:Losers focus on winners. Winners focus on winning

That is the biggest horse shit nonsense I've ever read about winning and losing. Theres only one rule about winners and losers and you need to remember it.

Winners win. Losers lose.

Point.Fucking.Blank.Period.

Aint no horse shit. You wanna win find a way to win. If you can't then you didn't really want to win in the first place.


You find someone thats winning, you focus on what they did to be successful and you do it harder and better than they do it. Success at the highest level is an unhealthy obsession. I was actually killing myself to be great. It takes that level of dedication to be awesome.

With your line of thinking. We are all fucking losers for being on this forum focussing on others and learning from what they do so we can be successful. I want to be the greatest forum member on here because I want to.

That means I have to be the most epic bad ass motherfucker here.
I have to out-roosh roosh. I have to out West Indian Archie West Indian Archie. Is this likely--of course. But I should be careful because:

Quote:In extreme cases it can lead to depression and a sense of purposelessness or hopelessness. What's the point of even trying, you might say, if you can never be as good at X as Y.

Get real. I'm not afraid to do what it takes. I am the extreme case!

I feel like this thread is an incredible slight towards those that took on the task. Understood the task. And went hard body resolve to study the game and learn how to be great in the persuit of being the best. And end the end accomplished their goal.

If you want to make the post about finding your niche and sticking to it then stick to that shit.
If you want to make the tread about people seeking greatness needing to understand what it takes--killing yourself--then say that.
But to tell people to fear pushing themselves beyond their human limit to be great is cowardly.

Like my basketball told my skinny ass in 9th grade.

"mufasa I wish I could rip the bitch out your heart and watch it die in my hands"

And then to quote Marcus Aurelius. Heres some of that real shit:

Quote:...[Marcus] did not meet with the good fortune that he deserved, for he was not strong in body and was involved in a multitude of troubles throughout practically his entire reign. But for my part, I admire him all the more for this very reason, that amid unusual and extraordinary difficulties he both survived himself and preserved the empire.

–Cassius Dio

#RNS

Edit:

Quote:The problem comes because recently I have been guilty of evaluating myself in comparison to these men and seeing an ever widening gap which I cannot seem to get across no matter how many hours I work. This led me to anxiety, depression and during the worst of it even suicidal thoughts.

No problem is you went head first with no real plan and quit. Of course its an ever widening gap your just starting to climb everest.

Quote:Which is nonsensical. I did not get the same results as these men because I lacked a lot of the intangibles that they had. I did not live in the same location (west coast of the US, easy access to capital) nor have the same contacts, or go to the same school (and dare I say it, luck played some part too). It had nothing to do with how hard I worked on myself or my projects, I couldn't have worked any harder without killing myself.

how do you know you're still alive? Those are all excuses and actually tangibles. you could have moved. you could have learned to acquire the skills to smooze with people that could get you there. You could have applied as an intern and low key learned the way. You didn't want it and were unwilling to work the process to get to your goal. And Zuck was up there at the mountain top chilling like

Post: #13

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinny_Paz

Quote:Shortly after winning the junior middleweight world title, Pazienza was forced to relinquish the title due to a serious car accident in which his neck was broken. Doctors informed him he might never walk again and would certainly never fight again. Pazienza had to wear a medical device called a Halo, a circular metal brace screwed into the skull in four spots and propped up with four metal rods. Pazienza had the Halo screwed to his skull for 3 months, during which time he maintained a workout regime--disobeying the doctors' orders.[citation needed] Pazienza returned to the ring thirteen months after the accident and beat future WBC World Jr. Middleweight Champion Luis Santana via a 10-round decision. It is considered the greatest comeback in boxing history.

edit:

Post: #14

(03-01-2017 02:50 AM)Mufasa Wrote:  If you just think you can show up and be great thats a recipe for disaster. But if your goal is to be the best then you have the beat the best. I've won some NCAA titles in my day and those are from me tired of getting my ass whooped when I was 7 and making a decision to do whatever it took to be the best. This shit takes time and darwinism is a thing for a reason.

In your rush to come in here guns blazing and combative you have missed the original point of my post and focused instead on a straw man.

Nobody is saying that you should be able to "show up and be great". Roosh wrote for ten years before getting paid anything for his first book. Mastery takes time, I know this because I know how much time I have sunk into learning code and I am by no means a master yet.

What I am saying is that by comparing yourself to arbitrary success models, you can end up trying to compete with them in an area which does not overlap with your natural talents. I am saying you should find what your natural talents are and develop them to a high degree, rather than trying to copy someone else.

Quote:Im not going to lie to you this shit:

Quote:In extreme cases it can lead to depression and a sense of purposelessness or hopelessness. What's the point of even trying, you might say, if you can never be as good at X as Y.

If you think like this it tells me everything I need to know about you. Im a retardedly competitive person and that there is the mindset of a weak person. Period.

Everyone, even the best goes through ups and downs. Labelling someone "weak" because they have moments of despair is childish and betrays a lack of understanding of what it means to get a venture off the ground.

Quote:

Quote:Losers focus on winners. Winners focus on winning

That is the biggest horse shit nonsense I've ever read about winning and losing.

I stole this "horse shit nonsense" quote from Conor McGregor. Unless you consider him a loser, maybe you should do your homework next time before you open your mouth.

Quote:You find someone thats winning, you focus on what they did to be successful and you do it harder and better than they do it. Success at the highest level is an unhealthy obsession. I was actually killing myself to be great. It takes that level of dedication to be awesome.

No disagreement here. Again, you missed the original point of my post which is to do this with something you are naturally good at, that fits with your own life story rather than picking a role model at random and trying to copy what they did.

You say you won some NCAA titles. That's great, you clearly know how to work and train hard. But you also had a great coach, great teammates and good genetics to back it up. Telling someone who grows up in the slums of India that they should compare themselves to a basketball star and feel bad about not being as good as them is retarded.

Quote:I feel like this thread is an incredible slight towards those that took on the task. Understood the task. And went hard body resolve to study the game and learn how to be great in the persuit of being the best. And end the end accomplished their goal.

Quote:The problem comes because recently I have been guilty of evaluating myself in comparison to these men and seeing an ever widening gap which I cannot seem to get across no matter how many hours I work. This led me to anxiety, depression and during the worst of it even suicidal thoughts.

No problem is you went head first with no real plan and quit. Of course its an ever widening gap your just starting to climb everest.

This reveals so much lack of understanding of the real world its almost comical. "The best laid plans of mice and men oft go awry" - in the real world, even great plans often fail to come to fruition because of the hidden unknowns. The map is not the terrain, and life is not a movie set where the main character always comes through in the end.

In the real world when taking on an ambitious plan there are struggles and setbacks, you need to know how to cope with these and keep moving forwards regardless. Comparing yourself negatively to those who made it big first time is not going to help you here. Looking within and focusing on your own strengths and resources is a far more useful application of focus.

I don't know you but I assume you are in your early twenties and haven't had any major ventures fail yet. Let's see you actually try to get a business off the ground yourself, with no coach and no team to back you, and then come back here and see what you have to say.

Post: #15

I think some guys are missing rafaeld's point. The point wasn't "don't use winners as examples". Absolutely do that. Watch the best, learn from the best, emulate the best. Like the wheel, the general principles for success haven't changed in thousands of years. Don't reinvent them.

But don't fret or obsess over other people if it's not helping you improve. That's not healthy. I know a guy, mid-20's, multimillionaire. Like Phoenix said, a plain winner. Does he feel like one? Au contraire, he feels like a big loser, no matter what anyone else tries to tell him. Why? Because his benchmark for success is low to mid 8 figure exit prior to 30 (i.e. 20 to 50 million). That's his social circle. Having his second venture stagnate isn't helping.

It's one thing to use the 50 million dollar exit guys as a learning opportunity to grow, it's a totally different thing to beat yourself up because you're not them. Do the former, don't do the latter.

The only person you should beat yourself up over not being way better than is yourself a year ago.

Post: #16

(02-28-2017 10:01 AM)Fortis Wrote:  I think the difference that you guys are getting at is that a loser will belittle a successful person because they feel bad about not being on their level while a guy who is secure in himself can smile and be happy that another man is doing well and even learn from that man.

I try to be the latter guy.

Everyone knows something that I can potentially learn so I always do my best to pay attention when someone is telling me about their successes in life.

Short and succint.

Try to remember not to look down on those who go about things different than you as long as they are cordial to you too.

Beta envy is the ugliest thing in the world.

Post: #17

(02-27-2017 07:07 PM)rafaeld Wrote:  But they have no idea what price he has paid for it.

Yes. People focus only on the fruits of labor, not what needed to be paid to achieve it.

There's only so many hours in a person's life that can be directed towards building something. This forces lots of tradeoffs. Think of the stereotypical asian tweener violinist prodigies on 60 minutes who were raised like veal. Same deal with olympic gymnasts, skaters, tennis-players, etc... Societally we celebrate anyone who rises above the norm but don't weigh in the sacrifice, which is almost always in the social realm.

The reason why women are seen as drem-killers is that deep relationships take time and energy too. Men of high ambition have a hard time with work-life balance. Look at someone like Elon Musk. He's the poster-child for this. He is alpha as fuck which attracts women like flies and yet at the same time no amount of money can keep them because he ultimately can't give them the time and attention they want. Steve Jobs is another. His personal life was also a wreck, with the illegitimate kid he denied and all that.

This is also the ammo used to bash Roosh, that by becoming a PUA jedi he has had to sacrifice making a real career for himself. There's truth to this because you simply can not move up the corporate ladder while simultaneously gaming chicks left and right. Anything you want to spend your 10,000 hours ala Malcolm Gladwell to master is going to require that you strip away almost everything else in your life to focus on it.

The alternative is...what most people do, which is live "balanced" lives which are perceived as, um, mediocre. The sort of George Bailey Savings and Loan existence. Well, it's not so bad when you think about it.

Most role models in America have dysfunctional social lives because of this necessary evil of focusing on their skill. It does warp people's perception of a life well-lived. But it's culturally at the heart of America, the rugged individualist, the rags to riches stories, the innovators and inventors.

Post: #18

(03-02-2017 09:53 AM)nomadbrah Wrote:  

(02-28-2017 10:01 AM)Fortis Wrote:  I think the difference that you guys are getting at is that a loser will belittle a successful person because they feel bad about not being on their level while a guy who is secure in himself can smile and be happy that another man is doing well and even learn from that man.

I try to be the latter guy.

Everyone knows something that I can potentially learn so I always do my best to pay attention when someone is telling me about their successes in life.

Short and succint.

Try to remember not to look down on those who go about things different than you as long as they are cordial to you too.

Beta envy is the ugliest thing in the world.

Yes.

Less and less people have healthy and stable families that promote proper maturation, physical and emotional well being. What do we get? The regression to the lowest common denominator of humans: envy and covetousness. Pride is the flip side of this for the talented, achieving transgressor. One should be careful of both in his life. My point here is that most people aren't talented enough by nature, or determined enough by nature and environment to achieve great things by definition. You know what, this is reality, there is nothing wrong with this. But everyone can theoretically at least be raised in a healthy environment. What we see now is that we don't even have that going for us anymore, at large, in the world.

If you have a healthy upbringing in the world, you accept the world as it is. This is in essence the "red pill." What is required of you? To do the best with what you've got, and when you don't, realize your failings, then work on those.

However strange it may sound, these actually are universal truths of the human existence that have built in, nonfundamental teachings, things separate the wheat from the chaff in the world religions, exposing the ones that lack truth --- and pointing to where truth seekers should go to begin the eternal quest of understanding the meaning of their life and their place in the larger plan of God. The two biggest things I would point out right now are that life:

1. is NOT a zero sum game. Because someone else does well does not, necessarily mean you can't do well or accomplish something, in some way or another. Anyone that tells you this is lying to you.

2. There is no such thing as equality. No great world religion, even ones that are off on a great many things, messes this one up. That people deserve human dignity and are special as being images of the divine is an entirely different, and [purposefully] confused, idea in order to manipulate envy into you, even though you know better.

If you are alive and you pay attention, you know with common sense, and more importantly, experience that 1. and 2. are true.

These two distortions --- that it is a zero sum game and that all people are "equal" --- or rather, specious arguments based on them in alluring but inaccurate ways, are the basis for the progressive agenda to build a utopia, one that cannot exist in this world. They create envy and covetousness with (1) because most people want to believe it, even if untrue, because for them it explains things so easily. They also want to be deceived into (2) for exactly the same reason, to not be accountable for their own failings or laziness, thereby justifying (1) to "even things out" via coercion/central planning "for the greater good".

While it is sad to say, corrupting the youth, destabilizing the family, degrading the culture, and ending up with "haves and have nots" actually turns out being the tactic to lead to the endgame of control, because once that society exists (we're there and it's increasingly so) it is so much easier for people to want to believe in (1) and (2), even though they know better. They turned off their human brain long ago in exchange for base, animal existence with emotional urges doing the "thinking" or "deciding".

Unless a group of people can expose this agenda and fight it, the chaos will continue, and the disparities will continue to grow. We're at an inflection point to stop the grand inertia of this movement, but only time will tell if the fight can be sustained and the tables turned.

Post: #19

(03-02-2017 12:57 PM)questor70 Wrote:  There's truth to this because you simply can not move up the corporate ladder while simultaneously gaming chicks left and right. Anything you want to spend your 10,000 hours ala Malcolm Gladwell to master is going to require that you strip away almost everything else in your life to focus on it.

This echoes my observations as well. I've yet to come across a corporate drone (even a successful one) that had the time, let alone skill, to game consistently.

Not saying anyone that has an office job is a failure with women, just that the ones that slog away at work haven't been the smoothest of cats...

Post: #20

(03-02-2017 03:33 PM)jselysianeagle Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 12:57 PM)questor70 Wrote:  There's truth to this because you simply can not move up the corporate ladder while simultaneously gaming chicks left and right. Anything you want to spend your 10,000 hours ala Malcolm Gladwell to master is going to require that you strip away almost everything else in your life to focus on it.

This echoes my observations as well. I've yet to come across a corporate drone (even a successful one) that had the time, let alone skill, to game consistently.

Not saying anyone that has an office job is a failure with women, just that the ones that slog away at work haven't been the smoothest of cats...

I'm almost finished with the first season of WestWorld and it sounds like the guy that likes Dolores ... haha

Post: #21

(03-02-2017 04:15 PM)Kid Twist Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 03:33 PM)jselysianeagle Wrote:  

(03-02-2017 12:57 PM)questor70 Wrote:  There's truth to this because you simply can not move up the corporate ladder while simultaneously gaming chicks left and right. Anything you want to spend your 10,000 hours ala Malcolm Gladwell to master is going to require that you strip away almost everything else in your life to focus on it.

This echoes my observations as well. I've yet to come across a corporate drone (even a successful one) that had the time, let alone skill, to game consistently.

Not saying anyone that has an office job is a failure with women, just that the ones that slog away at work haven't been the smoothest of cats...

I'm almost finished with the first season of WestWorld and it sounds like the guy that likes Dolores ... haha

Great WestWorld reference and it actually fits into the context of this discussion as well haha

Post: #22

It's too motivational and It is the truth of nowadays that person is not happy just because other person is doing good or better than him.

Post: #23

The more you hate on people who achieved more than you, the bigger loser you will be. When you see people doing better than you, the best thing you can do is congratulate them. If you can, make friends with them. This quote has been all over the Internet and has been posted everywhere but it still holds true: You are the average of your 5 closest friends.

Set your goals for yourself only - don't focus on other people's goals. If someone has a goal of making 100 million before reaching 30, encourage him, but don't take the same goal - his life isn't similar to yours.

And lastly, you need to be able to differentiate between "someone who needs motivation" and a "deadbeat loser". For example: the former might be someone very intelligent who has his own business but struggles at making it take off, while the latter is someone who whines about other people's success, is poor, and will always be.

Post: #24

The other thing to take into account is in some cities you have people who are loaded or doing v well for themselves by good fortune of timing. My cousin in London earns less than me in his 40s vs me in my 20s but his ex-council house flat which he bought for 125k with a discount in Zone 2 is now worth 820k.

The rules of the game are different now for me just two decades down the line, no point beating myself up about it.

You play the cards you get dealt and you can't make comparisons unless it's like-for-like.

Find something you want to be good at and master that.

Post: #25

Great post OP
and this:

(04-17-2017 10:01 AM)Que enspastic Wrote:  You play the cards you get dealt