Post: #1

I have done the South Beach diet, including the initial 2 week carb fast, and also am a year into Intermittent fasting. I am finally able to fast often well into the evening while keeping carbs out of my diet.

I am able to go about 12 days without carbs while doing IF but then just hit a wall of fatigue and just need carbs and end up over doing it.

I want to start putting some carbs at least once few days as an experiment to see if I can stop hitting the wall and over doing it. What are the best (or least bad) carbs out there?

I'm thinking just eating some blue berries and oranges. Is there something better that I should look at? I realize that sweet potatoes might be a way to go but I really don't like them very much on their own.

Post: #2

Better to get your vitamin C from peppers than oranges, peppers have less sugar and more Vitamin C. Anything wholewheat really. Sweet potatoes are good, but so are regular potatoes. Also oatmeal, or greek yogurt (or oatmeal mixed with greek yogurt).

Post: #3

Sounds like your pretty unhappy with your diet. What are your goals and is the diet helping you reach them?

Sweet potatoes are great if you actually make something with them (recipe) instead of nuking it and eating it plain.

There's tons of great carb sources. Squashes, beans, rices, breads, fruits, potatos.

Read the bodybuilding cheap meals thread for ideas.

Post: #4

Anecdotally, I'd say rice, potatoes, and sweet potatoes.

Post: #5

(08-30-2016 08:21 PM)beta_plus Wrote:  I have done the South Beach diet, including the initial 2 week carb fast, and also am a year into Intermittent fasting. I am finally able to fast often well into the evening while keeping carbs out of my diet.

I am able to go about 12 days without carbs while doing IF but then just hit a wall of fatigue and just need carbs and end up over doing it.

I want to start putting some carbs at least once few days as an experiment to see if I can stop hitting the wall and over doing it. What are the best (or least bad) carbs out there?

I'm thinking just eating some blue berries and oranges. Is there something better that I should look at? I realize that sweet potatoes might be a way to go but I really don't like them very much on their own.

While going hard on a low carb diet, Lyle McDonald recommends weekly refeeds of around 300g carbs, of which no more than 50g is sugar.

So have some fruit and a coke then make up the rest with rice, potatoes, that kind of thing.

Post: #6

(08-30-2016 08:51 PM)aeroektar Wrote:  Sounds like your pretty unhappy with your diet. What are your goals and is the diet helping you reach them?

Sweet potatoes are great if you actually make something with them (recipe) instead of nuking it and eating it plain.

There's tons of great carb sources. Squashes, beans, rices, breads, fruits, potatos.

Read the bodybuilding cheap meals thread for ideas.

I tend to come across as a bit negative in my writing. I'm actually pretty happy with my diet. It stopped my weight from getting completely out of control (I was starting to lose my face) and has gotten things in order. My gut is a fraction of what it used to be. Many people in my life have noticed the difference. Now, my hope is to start getting the flab and weight off, and I saw a lot of progress in that 12 days beyond the initial "flush" you get with decarbing. It used to be when I did South Beach I'd lose weight the first week and then just go to zero. This time, I got a 1.5 lb off in the 2nd week, which is a pace that I am happy with.

I'm just trying to figure out a way of going "slow & steady" in a maintainable way. I thought some "least bad" carbs every few days might be the way to go.

Post: #7

When it comes to carbs, the most sensible way to approach eating them is to consider the nutritional bang for your sugar buck.

Starches and grains, like bread, pasta, rice, white potatoes, corn, or oatmeal, provide carbohydrate calories but little else in the way of either macro- or micro-nutrients. If anything, they often contain anti-nutrients like gluten, lectins, and phytate that increase inflammation, wreak havoc on the immune system, and prevent the absorption of minerals.

(Some of these, like oatmeal, provide a few grams of fiber, but that's really their only benefit-and you can get just as much fiber, if not more, from fruits/veggies or very dark chocolate).

Fruits and vegetables, on the other hand, often contain enough vitamins, antioxidants, and polyphenols to more than make up for their sugar content.

Going by their ORAC rating, when it comes to fruit berries get you the most nutrition per gram of carbohydrate, followed by cherries, apples, pears, peaches, grapefruits, and figs. I personally buy frozen blueberries by the pound, and they're a staple of my post-workout meal (along with a tin of sardines in olive oil).

You'll want to avoid (for the most part) overly sweet fruits like pineapples, mangoes, papayas, and melons.

Very dark chocolate (>70%) and dry red wine are also good options for occasional carb snacking (emphasis on "occasional"), as like with fruits and vegetables they come packed with antioxidants (and fiber in the case of dark chocolate) that make up for the sugar they contain.

Post: #8

(08-30-2016 09:17 PM)beta_plus Wrote:  

(08-30-2016 08:51 PM)aeroektar Wrote:  Sounds like your pretty unhappy with your diet. What are your goals and is the diet helping you reach them?

Sweet potatoes are great if you actually make something with them (recipe) instead of nuking it and eating it plain.

There's tons of great carb sources. Squashes, beans, rices, breads, fruits, potatos.

Read the bodybuilding cheap meals thread for ideas.

I tend to come across as a bit negative in my writing. I'm actually pretty happy with my diet. It stopped my weight from getting completely out of control (I was starting to lose my face) and has gotten things in order. My gut is a fraction of what it used to be. Many people in my life have noticed the difference. Now, my hope is to start getting the flab and weight off, and I saw a lot of progress in that 12 days beyond the initial "flush" you get with decarbing. It used to be when I did South Beach I'd lose weight the first week and then just go to zero. This time, I got a 1.5 lb off in the 2nd week, which is a pace that I am happy with.

I'm just trying to figure out a way of going "slow & steady" in a maintainable way. I thought some "least bad" carbs every few days might be the way to go.

As long as your in a caloric deficit you'll continue to lose the weight until your where you want to be.

Issac laid out pretty much everything you need to know about good and bad carbs, according to some research certain carbs (the white starchy sources) are not natural for our bodies, we haven't evolved enough to digest/process them properly and they can cause all kinds of problems.

I personally can't live without sandwiches, rice and pasta. Just for context, I eat those things daily and maintain a muscular physique with a visible 6 pack. Your metabolism may not allow you to do that, but you can still have those things in moderation and not go off the deep end.

I guess it all comes down to how strict you want to be with it. If you want to only eat the carbs that our bodies are best suited for I'd stick to those that are provided by fruits and vegetables.

Post: #9

who are the leanest people in the world? the chinese and the japanese
who are the longest living people in the world? the italians and the japanese

i'd recommend white rice and pasta

Post: #10

You can't go wrong with brown rice and potatoes. They are my staple carbs. Low in calories and versatile. I make big batches of chicken and rice (which I usually season either Mexican or Asian style) and use a crock pot to make stews with beef, potatoes, and carrots. I also grill up chicken or steaks and have a thousand ways to prep potatoes.

A medium sized potato is only 100 calories. A cup of cooked brown rice is around 200 calories. You can stuff your face and still run a caloric deficit. Just make sure you get your protein in.

Most people eat carbs high in calories like pastas, breads, grains, etc. Junk food racks up calories too. So does alcohol.

I've had weeks where I ate 1500-1800 calories each day and felt full the whole time. Regardless of calories, I get fatigued with a low carb diet though.

Post: #11

I don't really subscribe to the idea of bad carbs, assuming we are talking about not excessively refined stuff. Pasta, rice, potatoes, bread are all great sources of energy, and delicious to boot. So long as you don't eat to excess, there's no real reason to prefer one over the other unless you're a competing bodybuilder. I eat all of them, at least one type daily, and am able to stay lean and grow muscle (I stay somewhere between 11-13%bf year round without consciously dieting). If you don't eat like a slob, it is very hard to look like one. If you have the opportunity to get fat by bouncing between La Gavroche, Alain Ducaisse, Maison aux Quatre Saisons etc, then I say you should take it, and revel in your gluttony. Otherwise, eat tasty, healthy food that relies on good quality, fresh ingredients, and you will remain lean. Eat a little more to gain weight, a little less to loose weight, and adjust your training as required.

For lunch I'm having a big bowl of homemade courgette, parsley and potato soup with a little grated nutmeg and cream in it, a few slices of homebaked sourdough bread with good, salted butter, and a big chunk of oak-smoked cheddar. For about 800 calories I'll get roughly 50g protein, and a delicious, filling meal.

Post: #12

Can't go wrong with sweet potatoes. Easy to make as well.

Post: #13

The only "bad" carbs to me are carbs that process really quickly through your body. Consuming these carbs can be fine pre and post workout as your body will use the energy, but other than that I tend to eat whole complex carbs that my body will process slowly throughout the day. Whole grain bread, whole grain pastas, potatoes, oatmeal, and long grain brown rice. The only stuff with simple carbs I generally consume are bananas, milk, and chocolate milk. I don't eat sweet potatoes because they are too sweet to me and I honestly think they have too much sugar in them.

Post: #14

If you have not had any grains or heavy starches for a while, you could try re-introducing them one at a time to see what sort of short term effects they have on your body.

For example, a small amount of oatmeal may give you a huge energy boost. Or it may make you bloated, and give you a huge energy dip after the initial spike.

Once you find the carb source that helps more than it hurts, now you have your occasional refeed source.

For preparation, I suggest using the Weston A Price methods: http://www.westonaprice.org/beginner-vid...arah-pope/ (will help with digestion)

Post: #15

I'm losing lard after an 8 month stint at a desk job. Some things I've found helpful are carefully noticing how I feel after I eat a specific thing. For instance, I love pasta and I have Italian blood but I feel dead, heavy and slow in the first half hour or more after eating pasta.

I feel much better after eating Oatmeal, although is is a bit sedating, I find the calorie/satiation ratio very high and I can easily go a long time after eating it without getting hungry.

I also am being careful to lose weight SLOWLY. I have found in the past when I go all out and cut back too much, i get destabilized so much psychologically that I fall off diet.

I'm older and I find I can lose at least a half pound a week without ever feeling hungry.

Post: #16

The key issue is Fasting Blood Glucose (FBG). There are always people who say they eat lots of carbs and still have a six pack. But for someone that is already fat, they probably have an excessively high blood sugar level. Once you get excessive blood sugar, you have insulin resistance. Your fat cells won't release fat until the insulin goes away. In a normal person, this happens two hours after every meal. In a person with insulin resistance, it never happens.

For an overweight person, you have to combine exercise and restricted carbs, to get your FBG in control. It's as simple as that. If your FBG is too high, you need to cut back on carbs, and/or exercise more.

Given this fact, it's generally true that foods with a low glycemic index are best. These cause smaller spikes in blood glucose when you eat them. If you exercise right before or right after you eat your carbs, you have an added advantage in controlling your BG levels.

It's possible to eat any kind of carbs *if* you use exercise to burn them off, such that your BG and FBG are kept under control. Unfortunately, carbs are like a drug, and if you eat enough carbs to spike your BG, you'll be more likely to take a nap than get some exercise to burn them off. Therefore, eating veggies is your best way of getting some carbs while keeping BG in control.

Post: #17

Lentils. They have a ton of fiber so they make you full.

1/4 cup + chopped non-starch veggies + 1/4 cup shredded cheese + salt = ~400 calories and a full stomach.

edit:
Full disclosure, a lot of fiber means good poops but also lots of farts.

Post: #18

(08-30-2016 11:47 PM)britabroad Wrote:  who are the longest living people in the world? the italians and the japanese

i'd recommend white rice and pasta

We're definitely not longest living people in the world for sure. Maybe Japanese are.

Post: #19

Roastbeefcurtains4me, IMHO your understanding of insulins role in fat loss is sort of primitive.

Yes it is a little counter productive but at the same time it's not going to stop fat loss.

If I ate 800 calories below maintenance with my meals spread every 1.5 hours, I would still lose weight, despite the presence of insulin in the blood stream. It's not an on/off switch, but rather an influencer.

Most "insulin resistance" is really not insulin resistance at all. It's just having too much tissue in the form of muscle and fat (because your available insulin is distributed between your fat and muscle), hence why you'll find past a certain body fat ratio you just get fatter when you eat in a caloric surplus, rather than more muscular. You hit that tipping point.

Post: #20

(02-21-2017 06:07 PM)Steelex Wrote:  Roastbeefcurtains4me, your understanding of insulins role in fat loss is sort of primitive.

Just wondering if this line was necessary to add productively to this thread.

Post: #21

OK I edited it.

Post: #22

I feel really good with Sweet potatoes, oats or brown rice.

Post: #23

This is total bro science, but I have the feeling that each of our bodies respond to a different "healthy carb". You have to find out which one that is.

I did an AIP reduction diet (basically a paleo-based diet that eliminates all potential allergic reaction / inflammatory foods). Then when I reintroduced carbs, one at a time, I saw some weird reactions:

- quinoa bloated me immediately, and made me feel like shit (even though I think it tastes great)
- both white and brown rice bloated me a little bit
- pasta, while being totally satisfying on all levels, just made me feel like I couldn't access 100% of what my body and brain had to offer
- potatoes don't give me any bad feeling at all (I'm Irish/Ukrainian so it must be in my blood), but if I am cavalier about eating them I tend to gain weight easily
- oatmeal (prepared the traditional way, after 1 day of soaking) made me feel like a superman

I have gone stretches of time with no carbs, apart from veg and fruit. I felt and looked great, but I fucked mediocre and played sports with less intensity. With a little oatmeal in my diet, I felt my edge come back.

But it's a personal thing. For you, it may be brown rice. It may be sourdough bread.

Put in the hard yards, do a reduction diet, and then reintroduce foods slowly. Listen to what your body says.

Post: #24

^ that likely is at least in part related to your gut flora. Which means that in theory, you could at least partially adapt to foods you're not accustomed to.

Post: #25

Yes, for sure.

You could mend the gut to the point where you could retry some of the foods that previously bothered you to find that they no longer have the same effect.

Long process though.