Post: #26

Approached 2000 - 3000 women? Only one bang? OP, you think it's the women in your environment? I'm sorry, I think it's you and probably time for you to do some soul searching to figure out how you're coming off to other people especially to women.

Post: #27

(05-07-2016 10:11 AM)BassPlayaYo Wrote:  Approached 2000 - 3000 women?

That's correct.

Quote:Only one bang?

From day game? That, too, is correct.

Quote:OP, you think it's the women in your environment?

Absolutely. I find it strange that you question that when the whole premise of this forum is that Western women aren't that great and men would have better dating experiences abroad.

And it all comes down to the market. If you are selling Natty Boh to a bunch of nuns it won't sell. If you sell it to college students, it is going to fly off the shelf. Nothing wrong with the product, just the market.

Moreover, you overestimate the importance of game. Do you think that sloppy guys in Eastern Europe with beautiful women know of, of even heard of, game? Or are they just in a favorable market?

You can go to they gym, dress well and approach but if you do that and aren't getting results after a period of time, you just need to change your location.

Quote:I'm sorry, I think it's you and probably time for you to do some soul searching to figure out how you're coming off to other people especially to women.

Or not. I am not looking for an assessment of my game. The thread title isn't "Why isn't game working?" I read the game books. I gotten more numbers that flaked than most guys have done approaches. I'm good with that.

The only reason I addressed my approach history at all is because someone asked me why my environment is not great for dating and asked about my game experience. I answered the questions because I realize they are trying to help. But that is not my focus. I am not looking for game feedback.

The reason I made this thread at all is to ask older guys whether it would be better just to stay with a good girl or bang a bunch of women to get it out of my system.

It seems the consensus is to do both and don't let a woman interrupt your plans. Sounds like excellent advice to me!

Post: #28

(05-07-2016 08:30 AM)therealpoder Wrote:  Sir, I respect your opinion but your opinion is wrong. Very wrong, in fact. All my lack of success means is for whatever reason, the women in my particular location are not attracted to me. Nothing more, nothing less.

According to your numbers you've had between 40 and 75 first dates with girls you met from day game but only 1 bang. Those 40 to 75 girls were attracted enough to give you their number and go on a date with you so your reasoning ("the women in my particular location are not attracted to me") is a rationalization.

I could disprove almost everything else that you said in response to Scorpion and BassPlayaYo. That isn't the point and I don't have time to go through every line you have written but most of what you have said is rationalizations.

All of the statistics you have given us about your approaches and dates suggest that you are doing a lot wrong.

It is obvious that you are missing something and making big mistakes so some of us may suggest things other than the two multiple choice answers you want us to choose from.

(05-07-2016 11:06 AM)therealpoder Wrote:  The reason I made this thread at all is to ask older guys whether it would be better just to stay with a good girl or bang a bunch of women to get it out of my system.

Your question doesn't make sense because you have demonstrated that you are not capable of banging a bunch of women so that isn't an option for you. Scorpion answered the question but you responded to him with a very emotional and defensive comment which suggests that something Scorpion said is true but you don't want to admit it to yourself.

I doubt you will find the answer to your problems in a book or on a forum.

I think you need feedback from people you have met in person. I don't know if that means meeting forum members, hiring a dating coach who has experience helping guys with social disorders, or hiring a psychologist to resolve the underlying issues that are causing your problems. I do know your problems are the result of something much bigger than your question about a specific girl or if you should move to NYC.

This may not be want you want to hear but it is meant as advice rather than criticism.

Post: #29

(05-07-2016 12:58 PM)birthday cat Wrote:  

(05-07-2016 08:30 AM)therealpoder Wrote:  Sir, I respect your opinion but your opinion is wrong. Very wrong, in fact. All my lack of success means is for whatever reason, the women in my particular location are not attracted to me. Nothing more, nothing less.

According to your numbers you've had between 40 and 75 first dates with girls you met from day game but only 1 bang. Those 40 to 75 girls were attracted enough to give you their number and go on a date with you so your reasoning ("the women in my particular location are not attracted to me") is a rationalization.

There were variety of reasons why those dates didn't work out. It just wasn't one factor. Sometimes it was my fault, other times it was factors outside of my control. Some of the women thought I was older than I was and lost interest when they found out my real age. A few of those dates I could've banged but I failed. Some of those dates, we did not get along. Some of the dates, I tried to bang on the first date but they did not like it and rejected me; I probably could've banged if I waited a couple dates. Some of the dates went well in my opinion and I just never heard from them again. Some of those dates, I met the women online and they looked much worse in person. Obviously I made mistakes with some of those women and in a lot of those cases, it wasn't going to work out regardless of what I did.

Quote:I could disprove almost everything else that you said in response to Scorpion and BassPlayaYo. That isn't the point and I don't have time to go through every line you have written but most of what you have said is rationalizations.

I don't think so but agree to disagree. One person's reasons will reasons will be merely rationalizations to another person. I don't care about debating it or defending it one way or the other.

Quote:All of the statistics you have given us about your approaches and dates suggest that you are doing a lot wrong.

It is obvious that you are missing something and making big mistakes so some of us may suggest things other than the two multiple choice answers you want us to choose from.

Fair enough, I don't mind constructive criticism. I'm not perfect by any means.

Quote:Your question doesn't make sense because you have demonstrated that you are not capable of banging a bunch of women so that isn't an option for you. Scorpion answered the question but you responded to him with a very emotional and defensive comment which suggests that something Scorpion said is true but you don't want to admit it to yourself.

Scorpion did not answer my question. He basically said that I suck with women, will never be good and I should accept that. I don't mind constructive comments but if you are going to tell me how I can't do something, I'll be dismissive and maybe insulting toward you.

Quote:I doubt you will find the answer to your problems in a book or on a forum.

I think you need feedback from people you have met in person. I don't know if that means meeting forum members, hiring a dating coach who has experience helping guys with social disorders, or hiring a psychologist to resolve the underlying issues that are causing your problems. I do know your problems are the result of something much bigger than your question about a specific girl or if you should move to NYC.

This may not be want you want to hear but it is meant as advice rather than criticism.

I don't mind meeting other forum guys. I am not sure how hiring a dating coach or a psychologist will help since I always know how to approach and don't have mental issues. And you never met me. How do you know me well enough to state whether my problems are bigger than moving or any particular girl? But thanks for the advice anyway.

Post: #30

Therealpoder, I think you have raised a great, ever-relevant topic; "I have found a cool girl, should I settle down or keep looking?" You also get some props from me for doing so many approaches even amidst the constant rejection.

(05-05-2016 04:50 PM)therealpoder Wrote:  The reason I ask it that I am 30 and, despite putting in a lot of effort in approaching/game/fitness when I was in my 20s, I was not successful with women. I attribute that in large part to living in a bad dating environment...

Here you acknowledge that, despite putting in a lot of effort, you have not been getting the intimacy that you wanted. Therefore logic would dictate that, in order to gain a different output (e.g., sex), you need to change the input (e.g., gaming style). However, as you seem to place the blame on the location, it is unsurprising that you later state:

(05-07-2016 11:06 AM)therealpoder Wrote:  ...I am not looking for game feedback.

Now, I can understand that it is difficult to admit personal weakness or to consider the possibility, as Scorpion suggested, that you are not destined to be a player. I nonetheless have a number of concerns with this defensive, "I don't need any help" comment. Firstly, you noted:

(05-07-2016 11:06 AM)therealpoder Wrote:  The reason I made this thread at all is to ask older guys whether it would be better just to stay with a good girl or bang a bunch of women to get it out of my system. It seems the consensus is to do both and don't let a woman interrupt your plans. Sounds like excellent advice to me!

No matter what you decide, the fundamental principles of male-female relations will not change; the game never ends.

>If you want to bang more women, then you will need to improve your "game".
>If you want to develop your FIRST relationship into a long-term loving bond, then you will need to improve your "game".

So, if you continue to mistake stoic pride and stubbornness for psychological strength, then you will miss out on continual opportunities to grow. Yes, having self-confidence is good. Without a solid image of ourselves, we would crumble. But without a measure of self-awareness and self-acceptance, we are developmentally stuck and unable to fulfill our potential. Further, taking individual responsibility is a pillar of the Neomasculine movement and you could be wasting a great opportunity to learn from the fellow RvF gents due to your attitude of "Thanks but not thanks".

May I offer you one example of humility to illustrate its importance. The topic is 'The AnonymousBosch [AB Appreciation Thread', and the post is by AB - click here to read the post in full. In it, he writes "Don't ever think I have it all figured out." Yet AB is one of the intellectual giants of the RvF community (you can read through that thread or see his reputation 'details' for some examples ). And elsewhere, he has also noted that he has mentors.

You see, even kings seek counsel.

I would speculate that, among many other untold reasons, it was this humility and quest for development/knowledge that in part allowed AB to become such a beacon of insight. Conversely, I would speculate that one key reason that you have done so many approaches for so little gain, is because you have failed to adequately reflect on the lessons from these interactions and use those points of learning to grow stronger. I know this pill may be hard to swallow, but I really do believe it is for your own longer-term good.

Personally, I really sucked for my first couple of years in the game and also did countless approaches to no avail. Two key things, however, that were in my favour and that eventually lead to me to a serious upswing in success was (1) I had a mindset that valued continual self-development, and (2) I sought game-aware male friends, wingmen, mentors.

I could ask you a 100 things about your game and give you 100 points of feedback, and I could also speculate that it would be wise to get some more longer-term relationship experience (committed or otherwise), however I think the best advice anyone can give you at this point is:

Meet like-minded men who are game aware and can offer feedback. (This could be in the form of RvF members, PUA dudes, a red-pill-type psychologist or life coach, etc).

(A final personal note: one of the main reasons I still contribute to men's groups -- after more than a decade of involvement -- is because of the fun I've shared and the bonds I've developed. I've also had the pleasure of being schooled by many solid players and maintain a number of mentor relationships to this day.)

On this point, the consensus is clear:

(05-06-2016 11:54 AM)kaotic Wrote:  I'd love for you to meet some RVF DC locals and have them critique your approaches and game...

(05-06-2016 12:03 PM)Valentine Wrote:  Yeah you should meet up with the DC crew...

(05-07-2016 05:15 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  I think guys in the big cities who have RVFers to meet up should feel lucky...

(05-06-2016 12:51 PM)Designate Wrote:  Yes, absolutely he should go meet other guys...

Post: #31

Great post. It's not often I read something that changes my outlook on things. It would be useful to be more humble, seek like minded men and learn from them instead of assuming I know everything. Thanks.

Post: #32

That's great to read

Respect goes to you for taking on this feedback with such maturity.

You clearly have massive balls for being able to approach so many girls without enjoying the benefit of routine positive reception. I think this steel resolve and persistence is a great asset for overcoming life challenges. Keep at it man!

Post: #33

I'm going to assume you were honest and actually did 2-3k approach. If so, hat off to you. I'm not a noob but I'm nowhere near that amount and I dont think I'll ever have the will or the fuck given to do so.

This could actually turn out to be another great "Why hasn't game worked" like thegreenman!

Anyway...

I'm with Scorpion. I've done my share of game and I realize I'm not cut out to be the eternal player, like many others.

In your case I advise you to be in a mini-LTR. Normally I wouldn't suggest guys jumping in a LTR when still noob to game, but after 3k approaches you should have got the picture. Stay with her exclusively at first and see what works for you. You will learn A LOT being in a functioning LTR (though ironically you need to have experienced girls to know if a LTR is DOA or not)

Do not think in terms of settling in. I'm not of the school of thought that LTR are meant to last. Marriages are meant to last but they dont. Stay with this girl and when it ends, you will have learned something pretty important: are you meant to be in LTR? To be with one woman exclusively? Dealing with oneitis? Wanting kids etc. That way in the next LTR, and the next, you will know better what works in a LTR and doesn't. And if one day you want to settle down that experience will be invaluable.

IMO serial monogamy is a healthy option for guys these days, provided they learn game and oneitis first.

That aside, I would suggest eventually thinking of getting out of DC.

Post: #34

(05-07-2016 01:49 PM)therealpoder Wrote:  I don't mind meeting other forum guys. I am not sure how hiring a dating coach or a psychologist will help since I always know how to approach and don't have mental issues.

I think the consensus is to meet other forum guys as a next step.

I mentioned dating coaches and psychologists mostly to emphasize meeting people in person rather than reading books and forums. Those could still be options for a later time. Most dating coaches and psychologists are clueless so if you decided to hire someone then getting recommendations from forum members would be a good place to start.

(05-07-2016 01:49 PM)therealpoder Wrote:  And you never met me. How do you know me well enough to state whether my problems are bigger than moving or any particular girl? But thanks for the advice anyway.

Most problems can't be defined well by the person who has the problem. If the person could define the problem then they could probably fix the problem and wouldn't need help. This is a common concept in psychology, psychiatry, consulting, sales, coaching, etc. The best guys in all those fields are usually very good at asking questions, observing and listening. And in my opinion, the first response to most of the "I need help" threads should be a list of questions like this post by kaotic.

In your situation, there is easily enough information to show that you are looking at the problem from the wrong angle or not even looking at the right problem. My guess is that your conscious brain is chasing something (being a player) but your subconscious brain objects to this pursuit so it is sabotaging your efforts, possibly by making you blind to some significant problems although those problems could be easily observed by others.