Post: #26

I've been giving this some consideration lately. As a staunch Englishman, I typically drink north of 10 cups of builder's tea each day, and have done since I was 12. I would say with some confidence that I've probably not dipped below 5 cups of tea each day in the last 14 years, wherever I've been in the world (I take PG Tips abroad with me). I'd not given it much thought, because I don't drink it for an energy boost or anything like that - it is simply a cultural thing, and a thoroughly enjoyable drink. However, I have done a bit of reading around, and it seems the effects of caffeine are far less well understood, and may be far less harmless, than I had originally imagined.

I am, for the first time in my life, considering giving up builders tea. I feel much as my ancestors must have when granting India freedom from the Empire - I am sick to the stomach at the mere possibility. I enjoy hot drinks, and would like to keep them in my diet. I could make the switch to Jasmine tea, which I like having spent time in China.

Does anyone have any good ideas for exotic/delicious teas that are caffeine free? I think the best way to move away from my English tea would be to find something else to enjoy in a similar vein, without the caffeine, since as I say, I don't drink it for the stimulant effect.

Post: #27

Good replacement for builder's tea is Rooibos tea (Redbush). Dark, taste not entirely dissimilar, caffeine free, and full of good antioxidants.

Other than that -

-Caffeine free green tea is pretty good
-Fruit teas (if you're man enough)
-Lemon and Ginger tea

Seriously there are so many cool teas around these days, you can even just check out the tea section in supermarkets or go full-on and go to a specialist tea shop.

Post: #28

I've taken the plunge and been caffeine free for 3 days now. I've had a few headaches and felt slightly more lethargic, but it's not been as bad as I feared. I've gone completely cold turkey, and have simply switched to drinking peppermint tea. The nice thing about this is that I have a lot of peppermint growing in my garden, so I simply pick a load of leaves and pour the water on them. I'm expecting to start to feel a bit better in the next week or so. I'm hoping this will improve my sleep. Although I've never had trouble sleeping, I have always been very lazy in the mornings, always been very drowsy. I do not wake up energised. I am hoping that caffeine may be a factor in this. I'll report back once the effects have really kicked in.

Post: #29

I stopped drinking coffee cold turkey in the beginning of April. Drank 2 cups on average a day, so a lightweight consumer compared to many. Got a nasty headache for a few days, surprising given the light consumption.

Now roughly two months in I wonder why I didn't give it up sooner. In the end it's just a habit we keep reinforcing. When I studied, the morning walk to the coffee shop with my buddies probably did more to wake us up than habitually cramming 180 mg of stimulant into our bloodstreams.

Some pros that's been apparent to me:

- Better sleep. Always been a light sleeper; hard to fall asleep and would wake up if a fly farted outside my door. Now it's lights out in 5-10 minutes compared to 20-30+ minutes before. Sleep on average 7 hours, still might wake up once every night, but I feel rested on a more frequent basis. This is also contingent on keeping a better sleeping schedule, but I believe accumulating caffeine plays a role in sleeping issues.

- Somewhat more relaxed. I'm a typical introvert so I can be anxious, since my mind is running 24/7. But since quitting coffee my speech and movement, thus body language, is slower. Also stressful days at work don't take a mental toll as before.

- Eat more. Never realized caffeine is a hunger-suppressor. Pro since I want to gain weight.

But boy do I miss having a morning espresso and a tub of coffee on weekend nights...

Post: #30

Right, another couple of days in, and some trippy shit to report.

Day 4 for me was the roughest so far - I was literally having minor hallucinations. Nothing drastic, but seeing shit that wasn't there out of the corner of my eye that disappeared when I tried to focus on it.

It's been quite an experience - I hadn't realised the extent to which I was affected by caffeine - I have been comparatively exhausted. Usually I sleep 6 hours, 1am - 7am and am fine. I have needed more sleep, at least 7 hours, every night so far (day 6).

Headaches have gone, but I am getting spots (zits) for the first time in years. I do feel that I am much more even throughout the day, but my nighttime productivity has declined. I am hoping this will return once the adjustment is made.

The most interesting thing is the extent to which I have kidded myself that caffeine didn't affect me. I have the least addictive personality type in the world. I have no trouble at all simply deciding not to do things any more and following through. So I've not been tempted to have any caffeinated drinks, but I have in a sense stepped outside myself and watched the physical struggle, which has been shocking. Something so benign was having a very pronounced effect on my body (whether a positive or negative one as of yet I have no idea, though I already have very strong suspicions based on my physical reaction).

Post: #31

(05-19-2016 03:03 PM)H1N1 Wrote:  The most interesting thing is the extent to which I have kidded myself that caffeine didn't affect me. I have the least addictive personality type in the world. I have no trouble at all simply deciding not to do things any more and following through. So I've not been tempted to have any caffeinated drinks, but I have in a sense stepped outside myself and watched the physical struggle, which has been shocking. Something so benign was having a very pronounced effect on my body (whether a positive or negative one as of yet I have no idea, though I already have very strong suspicions based on my physical reaction).

Had the exact same realization after a few days.

"I actually need this shit!"

Another helpful member here, n/a, summed it up neatly over PMs: Caffeine is a de facto stimulant that Westerners in particular take too lightly. It has palpable effects on our body and some people are extra sensitive to it, and thus should use with caution or moderation. Or not at all.

Reduction adds to one's life more times than we realize.

Post: #32

Kudos to you brave souls that can take this on. I'm shamefully addicted. When I fully kick tobacco, Ill move on to working on coffee.

To kick my afternoon habit, I substituted dandy root which is a licorice and barley rye blend. It taste like coffee but has no caffeine. Gives you some energy.

Might help those trying to ween.

http://www.amazon.com/DANDY-INSTANT-HERB...B005P0XDJK

Post: #33

Just passed the month mark without a drop of the delectable poison passing my lips.

It has been thoroughly unenjoyable.

Day to day, for most of the past month I have been having real peaks and troughs in energy.

For a two week period in the middle I got a lot of spots, and I pretty much never have those (though at 26 I am still hoping to hit puberty some day).

The headaches have gone and my mind feels noticeably clearer.

My physique has improved significantly, without changing any other variables. It may not be all due to giving up tea/caffeine, but I suspect the fact that milk is more or less gone from my diet has reduced some stubborn bloating. Perhaps it is possible that drinking fresh peppermint tea has helped my digestion, I don't know. I know incidentally that IBS suffers are prescribed peppermint pills for their guts, though that may just be a small act of mercy for those forced to share confined spaces with them.

Sleep quality has improved significantly. I'm still idle by nature, so I haven't cut much time in bed yet.

I'm more even temperamentally too, I believe, though I am cantankerous by nature. This does not mean that I am consistently fractious now.

That said, I am acutely aware that the past few days have felt different, as though the back of it were broken. I am full of energy, to the point where I am extremely restless when sat in my chair. I feel an urge to get up and move all the time. It seems ironic that it is stopping caffeine that has made me feel like this.

I'd love to go back to drinking tea, it is one of life's little pleasures. However, the difference is marked, and positive. Since one cup of tea quickly becomes two, I find it much easier whenever I cut things from my diet or life to simply go cold turkey and move on from that thing permanently.

Post: #34

(06-07-2016 05:16 PM)H1N1 Wrote:  ...

Props to you for being so disciplined and reporting back on the results in detail.

I wholeheartedly support this and other ideals like the 'No fap' threads, in which we strive to mentally discipline ourselves for the sake of longer-term well-being and happiness. The evidence is clear - cultivating impulse control and self-discipline is one of the keys to personal mastery, social outcomes, professional success and physical health (ref 1). And... thinner women.

My main compulsion to drink coffee comes when I am about to start a workout and am feeling drowsy. Secondly, it is before work or mid-way through the day when I'm feeling mentally fatigued or sleepy. Now, I recall that you lift - what do you do now before the gym to pump you up, if you're feeling low on energy?

Also:

(05-04-2016 05:05 AM)H1N1 Wrote:  Does anyone have any good ideas for exotic/delicious teas that are caffeine free?

You may like to consider chamomile tea - I am drinking it with lemon, honey and ginger right now =)

Ref 1: Moffitt, Terrie E., et al. "A gradient of childhood self-control predicts health, wealth, and public safety." Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences 108.7 (2011): 2693-2698 - LINK

Abstract:

Quote:Policy-makers are considering large-scale programs aimed at self-control to improve citizens’ health and wealth and reduce crime. Experimental and economic studies suggest such programs could reap benefits. Yet, is self-control important for the health, wealth, and public safety of the population? Following a cohort of 1,000 children from birth to the age of 32 y, we show that childhood self-control predicts physical health, substance dependence, personal finances, and criminal offending outcomes, following a gradient of self-control. Effects of children's self-control could be disentangled from their intelligence and social class as well as from mistakes they made as adolescents. In another cohort of 500 sibling-pairs, the sibling with lower self-control had poorer outcomes, despite shared family background. Interventions addressing self-control might reduce a panoply of societal costs, save taxpayers money, and promote prosperity.

Post: #35

(06-08-2016 08:05 AM)Artiste Wrote:  

(06-07-2016 05:16 PM)H1N1 Wrote:  ...

Props to you for being so disciplined and reporting back on the results in detail.

I wholeheartedly support this and other ideals like the 'No fap' threads, in which we strive to mentally discipline ourselves for the sake of longer-term well-being and happiness. The evidence is clear - cultivating impulse control and self-discipline is one of the keys to personal mastery, social outcomes, professional success and physical health (ref 1). And... thinner women.

My main compulsion to drink coffee comes when I am about to start a workout and am feeling drowsy. Secondly, it is before work or mid-way through the day when I'm feeling mentally fatigued or sleepy. Now, I recall that you lift - what do you do now before the gym to pump you up, if you're feeling low on energy?

Also:

(05-04-2016 05:05 AM)H1N1 Wrote:  Does anyone have any good ideas for exotic/delicious teas that are caffeine free?

You may like to consider chamomile tea - I am drinking it with lemon, honey and ginger right now =)

Ref 1: Moffitt, Terrie E., et al. "A gradient of childhood self-control predicts health, wealth, and public safety." Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences 108.7 (2011): 2693-2698 - LINK

Abstract:

Quote:Policy-makers are considering large-scale programs aimed at self-control to improve citizens’ health and wealth and reduce crime. Experimental and economic studies suggest such programs could reap benefits. Yet, is self-control important for the health, wealth, and public safety of the population? Following a cohort of 1,000 children from birth to the age of 32 y, we show that childhood self-control predicts physical health, substance dependence, personal finances, and criminal offending outcomes, following a gradient of self-control. Effects of children's self-control could be disentangled from their intelligence and social class as well as from mistakes they made as adolescents. In another cohort of 500 sibling-pairs, the sibling with lower self-control had poorer outcomes, despite shared family background. Interventions addressing self-control might reduce a panoply of societal costs, save taxpayers money, and promote prosperity.

Thank you for your kind post mate.

To answer your question, I don't need it any more. Or at least, I haven't for nearly a week or so now. Having seemingly got over the hump, I am simply not drowsy mid-afternoon, or at 6pm-ish when I typically lift. In fact it has been one of the most notable things about this that those slumps have disappeared. These last few days I have been itching to go and train because I have so much energy and frustration from sitting around all day. This is a very significant change from when I was drinking caffeine, as then I would always have a cup of tea at around half five, and my lifting would suffer without it.

It's too early to tell how long lasting or how deep the effects go, so I have to be cautious about sounding like a zealot. That said, it does seem so far to have been a beneficial change with serious implications. Keep in mind though that I was having more than 10 cups of tea per day, every day without fail (I took PG tips abroad with me wherever I went), for at least 14 years. That's roughly 120micrograms of caffeine per day, which I gather from my basic research on the subject is quite a lot.

Post: #36

(05-03-2016 10:35 PM)semibaron Wrote:  I'm right in the middle of cutting that shit out. Day 9 already without caffeine.
To be honest, I think the only successful method is a cold turkey. For this you need at least 2 weeks of spare time.

Most people do not have 2 weeks to spare. I'd say this is the best approach:

(04-25-2016 07:20 PM)Valentine Wrote:  Buy caffeine pills from a bodybuilding website (way cheaper) and cut them up to take every day. Keep lowering the dose until you don't need it anymore.

That way you don't need to give up 2 weeks of your life.

Post: #37

Not sure what you drink OP, i.e. coffee or energy drinks, but I've found that replacing coffee with tea after noon has worked pretty well for me.

I used to be a very heavy coffee drinker. I'd start a pot while I was showering, and filled my thermos with whatever I didn't finish during breakfast. Once that was done, I'd have 2-3 12oz cups from the office Keurig. Then there was a mid-afternoon coffee run with a couple coworkers. Once I got back home I'd finish off the morning's pot if anything was left. Then I'd make another pot of coffee and fall asleep watching the TV. On weekends I'd just keep making more coffee until I had to leave the house for whatever reason.

Probably around 80-100oz of coffee a day on average. I know a guy who has a gallon most days, but he's a freak of nature on all accounts.

Post: #38

^ geez bro, that's a lot of coffee

Post: #39

I have never really given any thought to my coffee consumption before reading this thread so I had to step back and think how much I drank today.

About 2 litres, black.
I think I would land between 1,5-2 litres on a daily basis.
Now, I feel just fine and needless to say, I love my coffee.

H1N1 and others, what is the most positive effect of quitting caffeine?

I see no reason for me personally to quit, but I'm curious about this.

Post: #40

I recently abstained from booze, weed and caffeine for 30 days. The most notable difference was my sleep. I fell asleep easily, slept deeply while having wild vivid dreams, then woke up effortlessly in the morning feeling thoroughly rested. Upon returning to chemical indulgence last weekend, the brain fog and general feeling of lethargy was significant. If I have a few beers and/or smoke a joint at night, I then have to drink a lot of coffee the next morning to get my head straight. And if I feel wired from too much coffee in the day, then I need to have a drink or a puff to unwind at night. I never fully appreciated it before, but that cycle affects me quite strongly. I don't necessarily want to live like a monk all the time, but I have to admit that I felt much better when I'm not on that chemical roller coaster.

Post: #41

^ In all seriousness you can blame those symptoms solely on weed and booze.

Post: #42

You guys had me thinking here. Ironically I'm sitting here with a lovely pot of fresh brewed coffee.

What got my attention is that my sleeping needs have gotten shorter. (4-7 hours a day).
Now I don't know if I can blame that on caffeine or the white nights. We got no darkness here at all at this time of the year.

I'm working out pretty hard almost daily. I haven't had a drink or a smoke in about 6 months so when I'm going to bed I'm drifting off to sleep in 5-10min.

Perhaps I should try cut down my coffee consumption with 50% but I sincerely love the taste of black coffee. Have anyone tried caffeine free coffee?

Post: #43

I replaced it with herbal teas. Not exactly the same, but it was that routine of a hot drink when I was bored or tired that I craved.



*I was a five cup a day guy. Now it's replaced with non-caffeinated tea. Also: There are studies which have proven that such drinks can wake you up as good, if not better than coffee. For what it's worth - I have found that they are likely accurate from personal experience.

Post: #44

I'm not sure there is any one benefit greater than the others, and it certainly isn't like quitting opiates or anything like that.

The improvements are small, but noticable. Mild, but I think probably worthwhile. Depth of sleep has improved, certainly. For me, my teeth stain badly from caffeine, so not looking like I've been chewing on a turd is also a major plus. My energy isn't dependent on caffeine intake, so I don't get slumps when I haven't had some caffeine for a few hours any more.

Post: #45

I am taking a break from caffeine. I didn't think it was too much of an issue, but after countless mornings of waking up like a zombie, creeping my way to the kitchen to get my fix, I decided this was too much. I always say the way to tell how addicted you are to something is to stop doing it and see how you feel. I've done alcohol cleanses for a while, and I never really missed the sauce. I missed the fun times and the girls, but that's about it. I didn't crave being drunk.

Caffeine has been a different story. It's been 12 days and I still feel the itch. If it's not first thing in the morning, it's two hours later...or after that, or later in the day.

Half of the battle seems to be our jobs. I don't feel like I have more or less energy, but I feel that the "buzz" from caffeine definitely helps me concentrate when I am required to sit in an office for 8 hours a day. Because so many people work office jobs (myself included), that buzz helps with the soul sucking/boredom that comes with working in an office. I was talking with a friend who's quitting chewing tobacco and he said the same thing, it's not like he loves tobacco, but it's something to do, something to keep your head screwed on. As men, our bodies want to work, they want to play, run, lift, and sitting in an office job goes against what centuries of progress has trained us for. Coffee helps alleviate that.

My energy has been fine, but really, my brain feels slower. I don't have that twitch that makes me get things done, I have to work on focusing and concentrating more.

The best benefit has been sleep. Around 10 o'clock my body feels exhausted, especially if I've lifted, and I fall asleep within seconds. Combined with Bright Light Therapy, sleep has been amazing.

Post: #46

Been considering the same thing, and not just because I'm moderately addicted to coffee. I want to stay hydrated, and coffee does a wonderful job of cancelling out the water/club soda I try to drink every day.

Post: #47

(04-10-2016 04:11 PM)Rendőrség Wrote:  Hi everybody.

I must admit that I developed caffeine addiction. Why? Because It just doesn't help me to be more energetic and it just make me anxious. At the beginning when I started taking caffeine(many years ago). I fully enjoyed the benefits of it but now I can notice that I've developed an insane tolerance and increasing the dose doesn't help.

I tried to quit caffeine many times but after the second day I gave up. It kinda remembered the post that Roosh Opened long time ago referring to the ithdrawal symptoms associated to the disuse:

http://www.rooshv.com/what-happened-when...or-a-month

Any tips about how to overcome this? I just would like to use it on workout days... I also have a job that requires my focus and I don't want to be co-dependent on this "drug"

Donate all your coffee, coffeemaker, filters, etc; to a food shelf or thrift store. Or just give them away.

When you're out and about, don't carry any cash or change. Just a credit card or something.

Done - you've quit caffeine. Can't consume what you don't have. I do the same thing to quit cigarettes for a while, just don't have them on hand and suffer through the anxiety/withdrawal. Ibuprofen, cold showers, etc; seem to help a lot.

Post: #48

I recommend a window approach to reducing your intake.

Set a time limit in the late afternoon. No caffeine past that (except for emergencies...don't crash your car now, I'm not responsible). Caffeine has a half life of about 5 hours, so 5pm or earlier. This will help you sleep better at night.

Every week, set your limit back by 15 to 30 minutes until you're back to 1pm or earlier.

Then, work on delaying your first caffeine of the day. It works better as a stimulant if you are already awake, rather than as an aid to wake up. So for anyone keeping a 9-5, not before 9:30 or 10.

Finally, work on reducing your intake within your window. Switch from coffee to tea, from black tea to green tea, to herbal tea. And eliminate soda.

Post: #49

I used to drink a lot of coffee, several cups a day although I would never drink any past say 1 or 2pm. Although sometimes I would drink tea after that if offered to me. I saw this thread and thought I would give it a try and reduce my coffee intake to one cup first thing in the morning. It was easy! And I feel better and more energetic, I am much more sleepy in the evening and I think I end up getting better sleep which makes me feel better the next day. I have had no headaches and no cravings or anything like that.

I do my best to avoid all tap water, so I only drink coffee or tea that I've made now these days anyway, that might have helped me resist the urge to have one.

Now a couple weeks later, I'm not drinking any, apart from feeling sleepy sometimes and having a couple naps. I think I'm getting used to this. There's some decaf coffee here where I'm staying so I've drunk that a couple times, it tastes alright and I feel like I don't really need it, or I built up a tolerance to caffeine a long time ago, so it barely has any effect anyway.

Post: #50

Day 20 of NoCaff.

Overall - I feel much better. Energy is overall lower, but stable. I no longer have high peaks of productivity. I find myself still able to work through and get things done. My mental stability is also much better, I am focusing clearer overall and enjoy it. I might never go back to using caffeine, but I admit I do miss the feeling of my brain neurons firing up at the first sip of coffee in the morning.

That being said, this would be absolutely miserable without getting plenty of sleep (seven hours minimum) and Bright Light Therapy. Every morning I wake up ready to roll, knowing that I've slept well and should be ready to go. Whenever I start feeling tired I remind myself that I've had enough sleep, and to stop being a pussy and get it done instead of depending on substance.