Post: #1926

Looks like it's down to either Leadsom or May:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world.../86793240/

Quote:members of the ruling Conservative Party chose Home Secretary Theresa May and Energy Minister Andrea Leadsom as the final two candidates to succeed Prime Minister David Cameron, who announced his resignation after the United Kingdom voted to leave the European Union.

The new leader will be chosen by 150,000 Conservative Party members on Sept. 9, after the women campaign around the country, and will also become prime minister unless a new parliamentary election is called first.

Justice Secretary Michael Gove was eliminated in Thursday's vote by Conservative members of Parliament. Gove entered the race last week after unexpectedly withdrawing his support from the early favorite to be prime minister, former London mayor Boris Johnson.

Post: #1927

Quote:British government rejects petition calling for second EU referendum

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britai...SKCN0ZP0D4

"The Prime Minister and Government have been clear that this was a once in a generation vote and, as the Prime Minister has said, the decision must be respected," it (The Foreign Office) said.

"We must now prepare for the process to exit the EU and the Government is committed to ensuring the best possible outcome for the British people in the negotiations."

Both candidates to replace David Cameron as leader of the ruling Conservative Party and prime minister have said the result of the referendum should not be questioned and Brexit should be delivered.

"Brexit means Brexit," front-runner Theresa May, the interior minister, said in a speech announcing her bid. May had advocated staying in the bloc, but was not a leading figure in the "remain" campaign.

Post: #1928

Post: #1929

The man is a legend.

Post: #1930

I must say, it looks like I'm going to be wrong about Britain, I thought for sure they would fall to Multi-Culturalism and remain part of the EU, and while it remains to be seen if they can control their immigration problem, it sure looks like if they can get out of the EU (which they are) they'll figure out how to reduce immigration as well.

Talk about a close shave for them though. London is lost and I believed the remaining countryside would not be able to do anything to save their country but they did. It goes to show that capital cities are extremely powerful but are not in fact the lifeblood of the country.

It remains to be seen if the other European countries will be able to save themselves as well. I still think France and Germany, especially Germany, are most likely doomed. But the French also have a very distinct culture apart from Paris and it may be enough to tip the scales there as well too.

Post: #1931

It's amazing what Farage accomplished, being totally dedicated to that single issue for so long, in the face of so many naysayers. Inspiring, to say the least.

Post: #1932

(07-09-2016 04:29 PM)Requiem Wrote:  The man is a legend.

Thanks for posting this.

While some men here will be familiar with this Rudyard Kipling poem, many are likely not and so I'm posting the words below. I've always thought that if any poem encapsulates the ethic of this forum, "If" is it. Britain also seems to be once again worthy of the poem that has been culturally central to their nation.

"If'

If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you;
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
But make allowance for their doubting too:
If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
Or, being lied about, don't deal in lies,
Or being hated don't give way to hating,
And yet don't look too good, nor talk too wise;

If you can dream---and not make dreams your master;
If you can think---and not make thoughts your aim,
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same:.
If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken,
And stoop and build'em up with worn-out tools;

If you can make one heap of all your winnings
And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
And lose, and start again at your beginnings,
And never breathe a word about your loss:
If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
To serve your turn long after they are gone,
And so hold on when there is nothing in you
Except the Will which says to them: "Hold on!"

If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
Or walk with Kings---nor lose the common touch,
If neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,
If all men count with you, but none too much:
If you can fill the unforgiving minute
With sixty seconds' worth of distance run,
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And---which is more---you'll be a Man, my son!

Post: #1933

I've always thought that poem to be stoicism, well-encapsulated.

Post: #1934

(07-09-2016 08:16 PM)hydrogonian Wrote:  Thanks for posting this.

While some men here will be familiar with this Rudyard Kipling poem, many are likely not and so I'm posting the words below. I've always thought that if any poem encapsulates the ethic of this forum, "If" is it. Britain also seems to be once again worthy of the poem that has been culturally central to their nation.

<snip>

Thanks for posting it, Id not heard of it before today. It sounds like Michael Caine in the video, fantastic oratory.

Post: #1935

I know that this documentary is a little bit dated now, but still, it is quite good. For those who are not familiar how the fascist EU works, and what effects it had on the UK, it is a good place to start:

Post: #1936

I just read a very disappointing anti-Brexit article by Mario Vargas Llosa.

http://elpais.com/elpais/2016/07/07/opin...24668.html

Here's a corrected Google translation:

Quote:I lived many years in London, and there I learned to admire the English virtues pragmatism vaccinating its citizens against ideological fanaticism, individualism, breadwinners for their eccentric, tolerant and democratic spirit, respect for the institutions, laws and traditions. In the days before the referendum I was there and all those virtues wereconspicuous by their absence; so much I seemed to be in another country. A festering country prey to the most ridiculous and xenophobic nationalist demagogy, poured pouring by advocates of Brexit. These had the outlet of the United Kingdom of the European Union as "the restoration of independence of the nation," a panacea that Britain would obtain prosperity and absolute control of immigration Nigel Farage, the leader of the Party for UK independence showed a racist poster like a mad invasion of black underdeveloped, mulattos, Africans and Asians, while the former mayor of London, Boris Johnson, expressed his fear that Turkey, whose incorporation into Europe presaged imminent, had the right to flood the UK with 78 million Turks.

Demagoguery, most chauvinistic and stupid nationalism, racial prejudice, seemed to have transformed from overnight to Britain in a third world little country. And this impression for me reached its peak when Boris Johnson, the Conservative leader unkempt and garrulous, beating the record of all lies protesting because, according to him, the Brussels eurocrats -the enemies defeated to restore freedom to the Kingdom- taxation of British citizens spent subsidizing the cruel bullfights in Spain!

While advocates Brexit with good support from the media flooded the country with exaggerations, falsehoods, calumnies and jingoism and low-class banner, advocates that Britain will continue in Europe I am thinking especially in the Labour Party showed languor and pessimism such, starting with its lethargic leader, Jeremy Corbyn (now questioned by many of his comrades who demand the resignation for not having defended better what was the official policy of the Labour party), which, it seems, were resigned to advance a defeat that, some of them at least secretly wanted. It is not surprising, therefore, that workers citadels of England, the vote in favor of leaving Europe ran over the output of permanence.

The only one who defended this option with energy was prime minister, David Cameron, that is, the same as with an unnecessary and unfortunate precipitation, called this referendum without legal necessity whatsoever, for political opportunism of circumstances, something that he has paid with the end of his political career and an error hardly the future history of England will excuse.

And now that? Europe will suffer a considerable decrease with distance from the UK, the country, it is worth remembering now more than ever, with unparalleled heroism saved the old continent of Hitler and the Nazis. And not only because Britain is the second European industrial power, but because she was within Europe, the strongest advocate of free trade policies and integration of all markets in the world. The triumph of Brexit sets a bad precedent and is an invaluable help to parties, movements and anti-European factions and generally fascistic as the Front National of Marine Le Pen in France, the Alternative for Germany, the front headed by Geert Wilders in the Netherlands, and those in Poland, Austria, Hungary and the Scandinavian countries would like, on behalf of nationalism, give the final blow to the most ambitious democratic enterprise in the West in modern times.

But probably, as Chris Patten has written one of the most lucid articles I have read on the outcome of the British referendum, the greatest damage is made to the UK itself. Britain disappears, with the secession of Scotland and own Northern Ireland, which, as a result of Brexit will lose its open borders with the Republic of Ireland is a perfectly possible perspective, especially in the case of Scotland, where more than 62% of voters defended the European option.

But more serious than its possible dismemberment, threatening now to England is a slow decline, a victim of an outmoded political and economic nationalism, which goes against the prevailing trend in the rest of the world, and especially in West, a trend that prompted UK precisely in the years of the governments of Margaret Thatcher, John Major and Tony Blair and has now renegade little less than suicidal manner.

A cursory analysis of the results of the referendum shows an unmistakable generational and intellectual division: the more aware of the risk for future involving isolation, younger and better educated English voted for Europe; the oldest and least prepared for departure. Nostalgia for a world that was, that is not coming back, prevailed over realism; and prefer unreality and dreams to the real world only brings benefits in the field of art and literature; in political and social life, usually it generates catastrophes.

The disappointment of the winners of the referendum will be very close and very large with respect to immigration, when warn that his victory will not prevent or diminish one iota, the arrival of the feared outsiders, because what Orwell called ironically in one of his best essays England your England simply no longer exists, except in the fantasy pasadista some dreamers. (In the midst of the campaign was discovered, for example, that the albionic Boris Johnson, champion of British nationalism, had Turkish ancestors). And that is not the European Union that brings these waves of immigrants to its shores, but the need for Britain to them to provide the jobs that the British no would no longer do even by force, and social laws, more generosity realism, they were in good times to favor immigration that then seemed so necessary. (It still is, more than ever, although nationalist prevent crusting now see, if developed countries seek to maintain their high levels of existence).

In The Lion and the Unicorn Orwell speaks fondly of England, and highlights, rightly, the virtues of the people of common, their love of freedom, sobriety, respect for others, his belief that the laws are made to promote good and good and therefore must be met. He sums up his ideas (I quote from memory): "It's a good country, with the wrong people in control". I remembered a lot that beautiful essay in these depressing days. Because if the "control" of England will now be in the hands of Brexit men as requested by the little fuhrer Nigel Farage, the land of Shakespeare himself will be transformed so that soon not even the good mother that bore it will recognize it.

the most ambitious democratic enterprise in the West in modern times.

He does not address a single one of Leave supporters' arguments, and simply repeats globalist bullshit, even going so far as stating this will be the end of Britain. Not a single mention about how the people of the UK are subject to laws they had no input in creating, among other things.

Very disgraceful coming from such a renowned author, I would have expected him to do a serious research and analysis beforehand, but I guess he's now resting on his laurels and is too good for it now.

The last part where he calls Nigel Farage "little fuhrer" is the icing on the cake, playing the Nazi card, very classy.

Post: #1937

^^^ Nothing makes me happier knowing that the basket case country and it's lazy citizens have to leave the UK.

Don't let the migrant hit you on way out. Good riddance.

Post: #1938

(07-09-2016 04:29 PM)Requiem Wrote:  The man is a legend.

Anyone that survives a plane crash of ANY sort just instantly gets 10-ton brass balls. It's a pretty strong answer to a lot of bullshit:

"Oh yeah, well I survived a FUCKING PLANE CRASH. So stop bitching about _____".

"Are you threatening me? I survived a FUCKING PLANE CRASH. What can you do to me?"

etc.

Post: #1939

With a lot of the pro EU leftists, it really is an emotional thing. They are viscerally against nationalism.

Post: #1940

They have a total contempt for democracy.

Post: #1941

Post: #1942

The establishment fronted by the BBC gets Leadsom's scalp.

Post: #1943

Yes. This is very disappointing. Lip service will be paid to Brexit, but it now looks like business as usual. It is particularly disappointing as Leadsom definitely had the majority support of the party membership. All of the straw polls and informal canvasing I've seen suggest she would have won.

Still, if she can't handle the heat of a leadership fight, she certainly won't have the grit for PM, so it's better we find out now. May will be dreadful. I have met her several times. Once, whilst I was at university and had a job as a waiter, I served her and she was rude and dismissive, which is always a good indicator to me of someone's character. I've since met her on an equal footing and she was utterly uninspiring, void of charisma or charm.

Perhaps most importantly, and something that is underestimated, is that she has no sex appeal. She cannot introduce the frisson of sexual tension that would be such a potent weapon on the world stage, properly handled. Thatcher (as unlikely as it may sound) had just a hint of sexiness, or coquettishness about her, that gave her something her male colleagues could not compete with. May has none of this, and will only be able to try to out-man better men than her.

Post: #1944

Seems like Andrea Leadsom was out of her depth when it came to dealing with the media.

Very disappointing.

Post: #1945

It's a disaster. Fucking Boris. Why did he have to flounce out?

Post: #1946

We should be aware of what has just happened. A cosy cabal of Tory MPs have colluded to smear, undermine, and ultimately ensure that Andrea Leadsom would not be put to the party membership as a possible candidate. There has been some very serious political maneuvering behind the scenes from what I've heard. This is a flagrant move to undermine Brexit, and it has succeeded.

The vast majority of Tory MPs were Remainers, as was May. They have conspired to ensure that one of their own ended up in the hot seat. This is a sort of soft tyranny.

The very best we can now hope for is a kind of Brexit-lite. Free movement will remain on the the table, as will (I suspect) some form of ever closer integration (probably by more insidious, but soft-sounding means).

This is a very serious blow to the Brexit cause. Every single voice in the Vote Leave is now thoroughly discredited or removed from influence. Gove is ruined; so too is Boris; Leadsom will be seen forever as someone who can be rolled over; Farage is just another MEP; Hannan has backtracked shamelessly on key issues. May is entirely unopposed. The last vestige of hope hanging folornly from the corpse of Brexit is that May appoints a cabinet with Brexiters in prominent positions - Gove, Boris, Leadsom et al. But even then, all of them now appear rather toothless in the face of the Parliamentary Conservative Party.

I would say, unemotionally, that this is a significant defeat. We should be prepared for many more over the coming months.

Post: #1947

Pretty gutted. I don't trust May at all and the opposition is in a pathetic state.

Leadsome needed to be more stubborn. The only Female PM we've had was called the Iron Lady. She must have known it'd take some toughness to do the job half well as a woman.

Post: #1948

(07-11-2016 07:03 AM)Brendan Wrote:  Pretty gutted. I don't trust May at all and the opposition is in a pathetic state.

Leadsome needed to be more stubborn. The only Female PM we've had was called the Iron Lady. She must have known it'd take some toughness to do the job half well as a woman.

That is understandable, and justified. However, we have the summer recess coming up, with the Labour party in turmoil.

There's no need for immediate solidarity, or snap decision making on the part of the MPs (and there will be a good few of them) who are likely to be extremely pissed off by this stitch up.

There is still a good deal of opportunity for 'our guys' to form a splinter party, or otherwise affect the course of events over the coming months. The Tories have a very small majority - far smaller than the number of MPs I suspect are considering their next move as a result of this maneuver.

There were bound to be defeats, and there are bound to be many more. But we may still see some interesting things come out of all this. Do not be too depressed yet!

Post: #1949

Labour have demanded a snap election. They will be decimated.

Post: #1950

I would be concerned that if Article 50 is not invoked very soon, you will see lefties mount many ugly protests to try and stop it from happening.