Post: #26

Thanks to all for posting. Ill have to type out more when i have time.

To everyone who is critical of open relationships, i have some straight up questions for you. please answer honestly as id also been critical of them in the past.

1) are you living life with passion doing something you really love? ideally with cool people?

2) are you living in an environment where there are tons of hot pussy and you not only have great logistics for pulling them, but you are confident you can pull with no problem THE GIRLS THAT TRULY PASS YOUR BONER TEST, not just the kinda cute ones, kinda cool ones, etc

3) Would you consider yourself a happy, positive person?

I ask these questions because i have fluctuated between having this exact lifestyle in various periods in my life. I currently do not but am working towards it now. Many of the criticisms presented have sounded like coming from a place of scarcity. How do i know this? because ive felt those exact same damn emotions when im not on my purpose, on top of my shit.

My goal is to earn $20k a month, ability to live and work anywhere in the world at anytime, playing music, doing big deals, partying, etc with HOT ASS model quality girls who are also cool as fuck.

Really imagine if you had this lifestyle or your own ideal lifestyle. Would you really care about what some local dipshit hole in the wall bar thinks about you? Would you care if one of your chicks was banging some dude who you know isnt anywhere as a catch as you, plus you got tons more women waiting for you in different area codes? Plus if youre doing your job and fucking her well, as others have mentioned, she shouldnt be looking for the d elsewhere. I never said that it was the girls who asked for this, I WAS THE ONE WHO PROPOSED THIS.

you could say i couldve just lied. well guess what? ive done that on the past. and you onow what? I was good at it. I created a whole new Facebook account. Alias. Diff email. Google voice number. All that wasted mental energy when I could be pulling thousands doing some other business shit. Also, if you lie to one person, you end up lying to everybody in your life on some level. And do you think other dudes on top of their game, their life, their businesses will fall for your bullshit. Hell no. So if you want to make a killing in business, you've got to be establish relationships with them. The moment they smell bullshit, you're out. Same with hot chicks. They get offered Dick so often, they'll see through your bullshit and its game over. I actually lost a girl who I had considered marrying because of that reason.

To the guy who recommend blackdragon, thanks. He actually is an inspiration. Also JJ Roberts, Alan Rodger Currie and especially Johnny Soporno. I think even the dude who wrote the sex God method has open relationships but it's not as next level as soporno. If you really wanna step up your game, those are dudes who had a heavy influence on me. They get pussy regularly and their philosophies work.

Guess my post ended up being a little long.

Post: #27

(01-19-2016 01:33 PM)fucksong Wrote:  Really imagine if you had this lifestyle or your own ideal lifestyle. Would you really care about what some local dipshit hole in the wall bar thinks about you? Would you care if one of your chicks was banging some dude who you know isnt anywhere as a catch as you, plus you got tons more women waiting for you in different area codes? Plus if youre doing your job and fucking her well, as others have mentioned, she shouldnt be looking for the d elsewhere. I never said that it was the girls who asked for this, I WAS THE ONE WHO PROPOSED THIS.

You asked for feedback about open relationships and your response to answers you don't want to hear is to talk trash on the membership by saying they are akin to the above?

Am I understanding that right?

Who are you trying to convince, people here, or yourself?

I think it's much more powerful to not commit to a girl but have her commit to you, but I'd be open to hearing why you think otherwise. Myself, from the sexual health perspective alone this is a better option.

Post: #28

Is a advertising link incoming then about how to make 20K a month and bang all these hot models ?

So OP fronts about his lifestyle and creates a FB persona, then wanted to wife up one of these hoes ?

I'm not sure what you're getting at here, especially your last post, when we've given you input on what we think about having open relationships with multiple girlfriends.

I agree with Aneroid, having multiple women commit to only sleeping with you is a way better option than dipping your dip into multiple pools that have been pissed in.

Post: #29

OP, I'm only quoting the relevant parts, I won't come up with answers to your questions because it's moot really, but here's a summary of what I think;

(01-19-2016 01:33 PM)fucksong Wrote:  My goal is to earn $20k a month, ability to live and work anywhere in the world at anytime, playing music, doing big deals, partying, etc with HOT ASS model quality girls who are also cool as fuck.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and just say that a guy who's cool with his girl fucking other dudes won't be making any serious cash. Nor will he be of any interest to 'hot ass model quality girls who are also cool as fuck'. These girls can go out any day of the week and get an affluent man who also happens to know how to make a woman feel like a woman.

(01-19-2016 01:33 PM)fucksong Wrote:  Really imagine if you had this lifestyle or your own ideal lifestyle. Would you really care about what some local dipshit hole in the wall bar thinks about you? Would you care if one of your chicks was banging some dude who you know isnt anywhere as a catch as you, plus you got tons more women waiting for you in different area codes?

If I start off with a girl on a casual dating / pseudo relationship frame and she comes out saying "I'm banging this other dude". At that point she can basically go fuck herself. She's immediately nexted or at the very least downgraded to last resort booty call at 3am level. If YOU'RE the catch, she should be lucky and pray to her God every day that she has the privilege of receiving your cock, let alone even THINK about banging some other scrub.

(01-19-2016 01:33 PM)fucksong Wrote:  Plus if youre doing your job and fucking her well, as others have mentioned, she shouldnt be looking for the d elsewhere. I never said that it was the girls who asked for this, I WAS THE ONE WHO PROPOSED THIS.

I had to go back and read the entire thread in order to be able to comprehend this. In every relationship there's the "reacher" and the "settler", I think it's quite clear what these terms are so I won't go out of my way to explain, anyway; so you went out and managed to reach for a girl who settled for you and instead of being worried about her fucking other dudes, you just doubled down and straight up told her that she could fuck anyone she wanted?

And you're expecting that a girl will be content with a man who says this sort of thing and won't look at other dudes?

You also mentioned that you get jealous and needy, so why the fuck exactly have you done this?

(01-19-2016 01:33 PM)fucksong Wrote:  you could say i couldve just lied. well guess what? ive done that on the past. and you onow what? I was good at it. I created a whole new Facebook account. Alias. Diff email. Google voice number. All that wasted mental energy when I could be pulling thousands doing some other business shit. Also, if you lie to one person, you end up lying to everybody in your life on some level. And do you think other dudes on top of their game, their life, their businesses will fall for your bullshit. Hell no. So if you want to make a killing in business, you've got to be establish relationships with them. The moment they smell bullshit, you're out. Same with hot chicks. They get offered Dick so often, they'll see through your bullshit and its game over. I actually lost a girl who I had considered marrying because of that reason.

Apart from the fact that this is overall a horrible frame to put yourself in, since dating and business overlap in many areas, the most important one being that if you offer real perceivable value to the other party you ARE the ka-ching and what others offer will make little difference, apart from all this. You actually considered marrying a girl that upgraded to the best available dick offer and just sifted through your back story to find something to base the dumping on.

This thread is starting to resemble the "writing letters to models" thread that was on the other week. The faggotry is accumulating by the minute. I'll go ahead and coin the term jerk off in the corner while RVF top guns go apeshit on my high school sweetheart close

Post: #30

You misinterpreted everyone that was against your opinion.

The goal of an open relationship is to have connections with a female while still being able to bang other girls.

So, this may blow your mind a bit, but you can do that without giving your girl carte blanche to ride the carousel.

We're both on the same page about wanting freedom to pursue multiple women. I do that by banging multiple women and not settling down with one. You however seem to have some fetish about other dudes fucking your girl and are rationalizing it away with this "open-relationship" concept, or you just are scared to lose her to another guy so you let her do it anyways.

To each his own man. Where do you live, I'll do you a favor and take your girl out for a few nights on the town while your busy. She's gotta pass my boner test first though.

Post: #31

(01-19-2016 02:37 PM)AneroidOcean Wrote:  

(01-19-2016 01:33 PM)fucksong Wrote:  Really imagine if you had this lifestyle or your own ideal lifestyle. Would you really care about what some local dipshit hole in the wall bar thinks about you? Would you care if one of your chicks was banging some dude who you know isnt anywhere as a catch as you, plus you got tons more women waiting for you in different area codes? Plus if youre doing your job and fucking her well, as others have mentioned, she shouldnt be looking for the d elsewhere. I never said that it was the girls who asked for this, I WAS THE ONE WHO PROPOSED THIS.

You asked for feedback about open relationships and your response to answers you don't want to hear is to talk trash on the membership by saying they are akin to the above?

Am I understanding that right?

Who are you trying to convince, people here, or yourself?

I think it's much more powerful to not commit to a girl but have her commit to you, but I'd be open to hearing why you think otherwise. Myself, from the sexual health perspective alone this is a better option.

I specifically asked for feedback FROM GUYS WHO HAVE HAD OPEN RELATIONSHIPS. I drove 8 hrs yesterday for work and have been feeling under the weather so I've only had a chance to glance over this thread but I believe only two dudes posted up about THEIR EXPERIENCES having an open relationship. If I was mistaken, my apologies in advance. However, since this is a public forum and my goal is to be positive, I tried to add value in my last post via the initial four questions.

You are correct in that I'm not even sure, thUs was inspired to create this thread when I found out that another guy had also had open relationships. But I don't want to suddenly become an advocate for or against it. And to suddenly be labeled a cuckcold when I'm getting pussy regularly from girls who get offered dick all the time. On one hand, it shouldn't phase me but on the other hand, it's a waste of my time and energy to deal with when I specifically asked for feedback from guys WHO HAD EXPERIENCE (please see my post title)

Thank you

(01-19-2016 03:14 PM)kaotic Wrote:  Is a advertising link incoming then about how to make 20K a month and bang all these hot models ?

So OP fronts about his lifestyle and creates a FB persona, then wanted to wife up one of these hoes ?

I'm not sure what you're getting at here, especially your last post, when we've given you input on what we think about having open relationships with multiple girlfriends.

I agree with Aneroid, having multiple women commit to only sleeping with you is a way better option than dipping your dip into multiple pools that have been pissed in.

No dude. No fronts here. When I said I created a fake Facebook profile, that was when I was cheating on my ex-gf several years ago. That's part of the reason I started considering open relationships. I'm typing from an iPhone/ipad, thus the reason my grammar and spelling were off.

No advertising links coming either. That lifestyle is a GOAL I HAVE. So how can I advertise something I haven't accomplished yet. I'm actually pretty broke right now but my mindset is still strong.

Anyways I can see the thread is going a different direction so whatever. It was worth a try.

I should've put it in bold that I was asking for feedback from guys with experience

(01-19-2016 04:24 PM)AntiTrace Wrote:  You misinterpreted everyone that was against your opinion.

The goal of an open relationship is to have connections with a female while still being able to bang other girls.

So, this may blow your mind a bit, but you can do that without giving your girl carte blanche to ride the carousel.

We're both on the same page about wanting freedom to pursue multiple women. I do that by banging multiple women and not settling down with one. You however seem to have some fetish about other dudes fucking your girl and are rationalizing it away with this "open-relationship" concept, or you just are scared to lose her to another guy so you let her do it anyways.

To each his own man. Where do you live, I'll do you a favor and take your girl out for a few nights on the town while your busy. She's gotta pass my boner test first though.

Yes, I agree with you. That's why I prefer the idea of a "relationship" vs just fucking a girl. Either I have to be totally into a girl or it just ain't worth my time. So if I'm totally into a girl, I want that connection. Otherwise, might as well whack off to porn as it'd be more time efficient and save money.

As for this fetish about other dudes wanting to fuck my girl, I never fucking said that. Damn shit man. That was some other dude talking about his neighbor or some shit like that.

LET ME MAKE THIS CLEAR. I DO NOT WANT ANY CHICK I'M WITH TO BE FUCKING OTHER DUDES

BUT....

Right now in my life, I can't promise monogamy so this is the best solution I've been able to come up with based on REAL LIFE EXPERIENCE FROM GUYS LIKE JOHNNY SOPORNO, BLACK DRAGON AND JJ ROBERTS. (No, i don't get a single cent from those dudes but their lifestyle and philosophies speak to me vs haters)

It's fair. Plus, I fuck my girls well. If I'm on my job, they wont be searching elsewhere for the D.

In fact, I would also argue for those of you who want to keep them around, that by truly connecting with them, they definitely won't be going elsewhere.

But the beauty is...

DRUM ROLL PLEASE...

I AM FREE TO SLEEP WITH OTHER GIRLS while still having integrity and intimacy with the current girls I have.

There's also a lot of talk about the setting up of the relationship. I'm not getting paid to defend this shit so you'll have to research this shit on your own. It's all in the setup.

Okay, I'm tired now.

GOING FORWARD, I WILL ONLY RESPOND TO GUYS WHO HAVE HAD ACTUAL EXPERIENCE IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS SHARING THEIR THOUGHTS AND OPINIONS.

Post: #32

(01-19-2016 10:23 PM)fucksong Wrote:  

(01-19-2016 02:37 PM)AneroidOcean Wrote:  

(01-19-2016 01:33 PM)fucksong Wrote:  Really imagine if you had this lifestyle or your own ideal lifestyle. Would you really care about what some local dipshit hole in the wall bar thinks about you? Would you care if one of your chicks was banging some dude who you know isnt anywhere as a catch as you, plus you got tons more women waiting for you in different area codes? Plus if youre doing your job and fucking her well, as others have mentioned, she shouldnt be looking for the d elsewhere. I never said that it was the girls who asked for this, I WAS THE ONE WHO PROPOSED THIS.

You asked for feedback about open relationships and your response to answers you don't want to hear is to talk trash on the membership by saying they are akin to the above?

Am I understanding that right?

Who are you trying to convince, people here, or yourself?

I think it's much more powerful to not commit to a girl but have her commit to you, but I'd be open to hearing why you think otherwise. Myself, from the sexual health perspective alone this is a better option.

I specifically asked for feedback FROM GUYS WHO HAVE HAD OPEN RELATIONSHIPS. I drove 8 hrs yesterday for work and have been feeling under the weather so I've only had a chance to glance over this thread but I believe only two dudes posted up about THEIR EXPERIENCES having an open relationship. If I was mistaken, my apologies in advance. However, since this is a public forum and my goal is to be positive, I tried to add value in my last post via the initial four questions.

You are correct in that I'm not even sure, thUs was inspired to create this thread when I found out that another guy had also had open relationships. But I don't want to suddenly become an advocate for or against it. And to suddenly be labeled a cuckcold when I'm getting pussy regularly from girls who get offered dick all the time. On one hand, it shouldn't phase me but on the other hand, it's a waste of my time and energy to deal with when I specifically asked for feedback from guys WHO HAD EXPERIENCE (please see my post title)

Thank you

(01-19-2016 03:14 PM)kaotic Wrote:  Is a advertising link incoming then about how to make 20K a month and bang all these hot models ?

So OP fronts about his lifestyle and creates a FB persona, then wanted to wife up one of these hoes ?

I'm not sure what you're getting at here, especially your last post, when we've given you input on what we think about having open relationships with multiple girlfriends.

I agree with Aneroid, having multiple women commit to only sleeping with you is a way better option than dipping your dip into multiple pools that have been pissed in.

No dude. No fronts here. When I said I created a fake Facebook profile, that was when I was cheating on my ex-gf several years ago. That's part of the reason I started considering open relationships. I'm typing from an iPhone/ipad, thus the reason my grammar and spelling were off.

No advertising links coming either. That lifestyle is a GOAL I HAVE. So how can I advertise something I haven't accomplished yet. I'm actually pretty broke right now but my mindset is still strong.

Anyways I can see the thread is going a different direction so whatever. It was worth a try.

I should've put it in bold that I was asking for feedback from guys with experience

(01-19-2016 04:24 PM)AntiTrace Wrote:  You misinterpreted everyone that was against your opinion.

The goal of an open relationship is to have connections with a female while still being able to bang other girls.

So, this may blow your mind a bit, but you can do that without giving your girl carte blanche to ride the carousel.

We're both on the same page about wanting freedom to pursue multiple women. I do that by banging multiple women and not settling down with one. You however seem to have some fetish about other dudes fucking your girl and are rationalizing it away with this "open-relationship" concept, or you just are scared to lose her to another guy so you let her do it anyways.

To each his own man. Where do you live, I'll do you a favor and take your girl out for a few nights on the town while your busy. She's gotta pass my boner test first though.

Yes, I agree with you. That's why I prefer the idea of a "relationship" vs just fucking a girl. Either I have to be totally into a girl or it just ain't worth my time. So if I'm totally into a girl, I want that connection. Otherwise, might as well whack off to porn as it'd be more time efficient and save money.

As for this fetish about other dudes wanting to fuck my girl, I never fucking said that. Damn shit man. That was some other dude talking about his neighbor or some shit like that.

LET ME MAKE THIS CLEAR. I DO NOT WANT ANY CHICK I'M WITH TO BE FUCKING OTHER DUDES

BUT....

Right now in my life, I can't promise monogamy so this is the best solution I've been able to come up with based on REAL LIFE EXPERIENCE FROM GUYS LIKE JOHNNY SOPORNO, BLACK DRAGON AND JJ ROBERTS. (No, i don't get a single cent from those dudes but their lifestyle and philosophies speak to me vs haters)

It's fair. Plus, I fuck my girls well. If I'm on my job, they wont be searching elsewhere for the D.

In fact, I would also argue for those of you who want to keep them around, that by truly connecting with them, they definitely won't be going elsewhere.

But the beauty is...

DRUM ROLL PLEASE...

I AM FREE TO SLEEP WITH OTHER GIRLS while still having integrity and intimacy with the current girls I have.

There's also a lot of talk about the setting up of the relationship. I'm not getting paid to defend this shit so you'll have to research this shit on your own. It's all in the setup.

Okay, I'm tired now.

GOING FORWARD, I WILL ONLY RESPOND TO GUYS WHO HAVE HAD ACTUAL EXPERIENCE IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS SHARING THEIR THOUGHTS AND OPINIONS.

Dude.. gay

Post: #33

This entire thread is making my head hurt. Fucksong, I'm not sure where the confusion is. If you're simply fucking a girl that's also getting other dick on the side, there's nothing that needs to be said other than ENJOY. But you're using words like "connection" and "intimacy" which is very concerning. If you're emotionally invested and "connecting" to a girl that's fucking other dudes, you're a cuck and unless that's something you're into you need to stop if you have any respect for yourself.

Post: #34

No one in this community is into these types of "open relationships" you speak of so you're not going to get any experienced advice. Plain and simple.

We do no advocate or partake in serious relationships with women who have sex with other men. The only kind of "open relationship" that any of us would know about are the kind where we fuck multiple girls and maybe one of them is a "main" girl who does not fuck anyone else besides us.

Post: #35

Your OP:

(01-17-2016 09:16 AM)fucksong Wrote:  Hey all,

Begriff's thread here: /thread-53048...pid1194577 lead to the topic of open relationships so decided to create a new thread so as not to derail that thread. I actually did a search for threads on open relationships but I didn't find them helpful.

Why?

Because they all seemed to focus on "the girl" and I think in order to have a truly open relationship, you've got to be really secure with yourself, be happy with your life and have so many cool, exciting things going on, you won't even care what your chick is doing because you have options too.

Doesn't really jive with this:

(01-19-2016 10:23 PM)fucksong Wrote:  LET ME MAKE THIS CLEAR. I DO NOT WANT ANY CHICK I'M WITH TO BE FUCKING OTHER DUDES

BUT....

Right now in my life, I can't promise monogamy so this is the best solution I've been able to come up with based on REAL LIFE EXPERIENCE FROM GUYS LIKE JOHNNY SOPORNO, BLACK DRAGON AND JJ ROBERTS. (No, i don't get a single cent from those dudes but their lifestyle and philosophies speak to me vs haters)

It's fair. Plus, I fuck my girls well. If I'm on my job, they wont be searching elsewhere for the D.

In fact, I would also argue for those of you who want to keep them around, that by truly connecting with them, they definitely won't be going elsewhere.

But the beauty is...

DRUM ROLL PLEASE...

I AM FREE TO SLEEP WITH OTHER GIRLS while still having integrity and intimacy with the current girls I have.

There's also a lot of talk about the setting up of the relationship. I'm not getting paid to defend this shit so you'll have to research this shit on your own. It's all in the setup.

Okay, I'm tired now.

GOING FORWARD, I WILL ONLY RESPOND TO GUYS WHO HAVE HAD ACTUAL EXPERIENCE IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS SHARING THEIR THOUGHTS AND OPINIONS.

But if conflicting your own views is working for you, rock the fuck on. Just don't try to sell us on your definition of an "open relationship" being effectively a one-side open relationship which is what you would rather have by your very own admission.

Also, let's look at this statement a little further:

Quote:I AM FREE TO SLEEP WITH OTHER GIRLS while still having integrity and intimacy with the current girls I have.

This is what most guys on here are talking about when they say they've got a harem and haven't committed to monogamy with any girl.

It's also the same thing I've had up until my last/current girl. If I broke up tomorrow with my girl it's the same thing I'd get again until another top-notch girl made me forget about the rest.

The biggest pussy-slayer I know is still blown away that I had multiple girls in an exclusive relationship with me for over a year and they didn't up and quit.

What you seem to be relishing in is the freedom of honesty/openness. This is a great thing, but you're missing one key factor.

If you were truly honest/open with these girls, you'd tell them that you won't tolerate them being with anyone else but that you're not comfortable committing yet.

Thing is, you're worried about losing them if they can't tolerate the truth.

Post: #36

Quote:Because I've got two open girlfriends (for first time in my life, NOT fuck buddies or cheating) but actual girls I love and care about and yes, I will get jealous and needy. But it's been at times where I was unhappy with myself so it's forced me to look at my life to see what needs changing (lifestyle, job, money, etc) But it's been a great experience because it's forced me to step up my game and my life since when I'm truly living life with passion and purpose, whatever my girl is doing is a non-issue.

This thread in a nutshell - OP is getting cuckolded, blames it on himself, and attempts to justify it.

Post: #37

(01-20-2016 01:48 AM)General Stalin Wrote:  No one in this community is into these types of "open relationships" you speak of so you're not going to get any experienced advice. Plain and simple.

We do no advocate or partake in serious relationships with women who have sex with other men. The only kind of "open relationship" that any of us would know about are the kind where we fuck multiple girls and maybe one of them is a "main" girl who does not fuck anyone else besides us.

This exactly, right here.

To OP, I held out judgment initially because I wanted you to clarify what you meant by open relationship first. Now you are saying after the fact that 1) You want to keep your options open with women in your life, 2) You don't want your girlfriends sleeping around with other guys, and 3) That the other posters in this thread aren't already doing this so they aren't in any position to comment on it.

I would venture a guess that many, if not most here are already doing this or working on it. It's called harem management, not an open relationship. There's a difference. Why do you feel the need to lash out at people for pointing this out?

In an open relationship, it's implied that you are giving up your time, effort, and resources to a woman who makes no promises of loyalty to you. A woman is after a man's resources and protection, and a man is after a woman's intimacy. In this arrangement, she is getting all the benefit without offering up the same level of reciprocity. The other guy isn't helping her through her problems, taking her out to dinner, or doing any of that stuff you have to do, but still gets what he wants. He's putting in less effort and getting the same thing that you have to work for. Who do you think she respects more in this arrangement?

To put it in another light, it would be similar to a woman who sleeps with a guy who won't take her out to dinner, go on vacations with her or take her out in public, but is happy to do all of that with another woman. Who do you think he values more? Woman are serial monogamists. Yes they sleep around, but there's usually only one guy that's number one in their minds. If she feels the need to get dick on the side, you're not it.

For women, sex is their leverage. For men, commitment is. This was widely recognized throughout all of human history. Look at the most powerful and successful men throughout the millenia. They practiced polygyny, where a man took multiple wives while demanding sexual exclusivity from them. In return, he provided them with resources to survive, provided shelter, and protection. In many cultures, it's acceptable for a man to keep a mistress as long as he doesn't rub his wife's face in it, and doesn't spend too much money on her.

The closest you could come to an equal and open relationship would be an arrangement where the guy gets to sleep around with other women but his main girl gets the majority of his time and resources. The girl would give herself only to the main guy, but she'd be able to get taken out to dinner or movies by friend zoned guy friends. Again, you see examples of this all the time, and it shows that men and women have different priorities.

On the other hand, there's harem management, or 'spinning plates'. You get to keep your options open with women, and if you start to connect with one, you've got the freedom of where to take it. It doesn't imply that you're being disingenuous. At most, it's lying by omission in being open ended or vague about your status. To be more than just a FB, she has to show you she deserves it, and it's normally the woman who brings it up first with something like "So, we've been hanging out for a while and have a lot of fun together, what are we, exactly?"

A woman has to work for the commitment of a man with options. A man who is fast to commit to anyone is like a woman who is fast to sleep with anyone. A lock that opens for any key isn't a very good lock. For a woman to get special treatment, she needs to make herself worthy of it. No need to broach it before she does. She will bring it up eventually, and it's then you can be real with her. Blackdragon even talks about this here: http://www.blackdragonblog.com/2015/08/1...correctly/

If you disagree, I think you're either having difficulty accepting that men and women are different, or you've put yourself in a one-sided arrangement and your ego doesn't want to face the music. There seems to be a lot of anger and frustration in your response. If you're really happy in that situation as you say you are, why do you think this is?

Post: #38

(01-19-2016 10:23 PM)fucksong Wrote:  Anyways I can see the thread is going a different direction so whatever.

I can't believe I'm the first to notice ...

This thread is not going in the direction the OP hoped for.

Post: #39

(01-20-2016 10:36 AM)thoughtgypsy Wrote:  

(01-20-2016 01:48 AM)General Stalin Wrote:  No one in this community is into these types of "open relationships" you speak of so you're not going to get any experienced advice. Plain and simple.

We do no advocate or partake in serious relationships with women who have sex with other men. The only kind of "open relationship" that any of us would know about are the kind where we fuck multiple girls and maybe one of them is a "main" girl who does not fuck anyone else besides us.

This exactly, right here.

To OP, I held out judgment initially because I wanted you to clarify what you meant by open relationship first. Now you are saying after the fact that 1) You want to keep your options open with women in your life, 2) You don't want your girlfriends sleeping around with other guys, and 3) That the other posters in this thread aren't already doing this so they aren't in any position to comment on it.

I would venture a guess that many, if not most here are already doing this or working on it. It's called harem management, not an open relationship. There's a difference. Why do you feel the need to lash out at people for pointing this out?

In an open relationship, it's implied that you are giving up your time, effort, and resources to a woman who makes no promises of loyalty to you. A woman is after a man's resources and protection, and a man is after a woman's intimacy. In this arrangement, she is getting all the benefit without offering up the same level of reciprocity. The other guy isn't helping her through her problems, taking her out to dinner, or doing any of that stuff you have to do, but still gets what he wants. He's putting in less effort and getting the same thing that you have to work for. Who do you think she respects more in this arrangement?

To put it in another light, it would be similar to a woman who sleeps with a guy who won't take her out to dinner, go on vacations with her or take her out in public, but is happy to do all of that with another woman. Who do you think he values more? Woman are serial monogamists. Yes they sleep around, but there's usually only one guy that's number one in their minds. If she feels the need to get dick on the side, you're not it.

For women, sex is their leverage. For men, commitment is. This was widely recognized throughout all of human history. Look at the most powerful and successful men throughout the millenia. They practiced polygyny, where a man took multiple wives while demanding sexual exclusivity from them. In return, he provided them with resources to survive, provided shelter, and protection. In many cultures, it's acceptable for a man to keep a mistress as long as he doesn't rub his wife's face in it, and doesn't spend too much money on her.

The closest you could come to an equal and open relationship would be an arrangement where the guy gets to sleep around with other women but his main girl gets the majority of his time and resources. The girl would give herself only to the main guy, but she'd be able to get taken out to dinner or movies by friend zoned guy friends. Again, you see examples of this all the time, and it shows that men and women have different priorities.

On the other hand, there's harem management, or 'spinning plates'. You get to keep your options open with women, and if you start to connect with one, you've got the freedom of where to take it. It doesn't imply that you're being disingenuous. At most, it's lying by omission in being open ended or vague about your status. To be more than just a FB, she has to show you she deserves it, and it's normally the woman who brings it up first with something like "So, we've been hanging out for a while and have a lot of fun together, what are we, exactly?"

A woman has to work for the commitment of a man with options. A man who is fast to commit to anyone is like a woman who is fast to sleep with anyone. A lock that opens for any key isn't a very good lock. For a woman to get special treatment, she needs to make herself worthy of it. No need to broach it before she does. She will bring it up eventually, and it's then you can be real with her. Blackdragon even talks about this here: http://www.blackdragonblog.com/2015/08/1...correctly/

If you disagree, I think you're either having difficulty accepting that men and women are different, or you've put yourself in a one-sided arrangement and your ego doesn't want to face the music. There seems to be a lot of anger and frustration in your response. If you're really happy in that situation as you say you are, why do you think this is?

Great breakdown here by thoughtgypsy.

Post: #40

262 wrote;

"fucksong Wrote:
Anyways I can see the thread is going a different direction so whatever.

I can't believe I'm the first to notice ...

This thread is not going in the direction the OP hoped for.
"

Ha ha ha ha! Just what I was thinking.

I also think that the OP should buy gold membership and change their user name to "Cucksong".

Post: #41

Your responses are not worthy of investment so I'll sum it up.

It's a zero sum game therefore:

- can your ego handle it?
- if so, are you a cuck?
- if not, can you outbang and ensure you are getting the better end of the deal?
- to what extent is this a relationship and not plain old swinging?


thoughtgypsy nailed it (kudos for your time spent).

You want that a harem but you are using chick-speak.

Post: #42

I read through a lot of the blackdragon blog posts after reading this thread. I mostly agree with the rvf guys in this thread and less with fucksong and blackdragon's ideas of open relationships but I'm not quite as dismissive of fucksong's comments.

The blackdragon blog is well written by a guy with a lot of experience. He makes a good case for why monogamy doesn't make sense for men or women. His method for attracting and maintaining attractive women involves avoiding creating rules for the women which will push them away and fucking the women well so they keep coming back. It seems to work for him.

My main problem with blackdragon's method is the idea that a guy can be in a serious relationship or love a woman while both the man and women can have sex with other people. I don't think men's brains are wired to do that and it is easier for the woman to get sex outside of the relationship which creates an imbalance of power. As others have already explained - men and women are different - "For women, sex is their leverage. For men, commitment is." so this definition of open relationship is "all cons no pros" for men.

Blackdragon's model of relationships includes FB, MLTR, and OLTR. FB is "friends with benefits" or "fuck buddies". MLTR is "multiple long term relationship" where both the man and women are allowed to have other FBs or MLTRs. OLTR is "one long term relationship" where both the man and woman are allowed to have other FBs but no other MLTRs hence they are emotionally committed but not sexually committed.

I agree that this OLTR concept is not reasonable (see thoughtgypsy's post). Also, a big red flag is that blackdragon doesn't have OLTRs or at least he had never had an OLTR as of December 2013 when he wrote this post - http://www.blackdragonblog.com/2013/12/0...ly-look-s/ - so it is a well written blog with a lot of valuable information and he has a lot of experience with FBs and MLTRs but he isn't very experienced with his concept of OLTRs.

The other concept I don't like is blackdragon's broad definition of MLTR. The lower end of these MLTRs seem to be a lot more like "dating" than "relationships" and I think this causes a lot of the confusion. Example - what if I had several girls that I saw a few times per month each for simple inexpensive dates and had sex with them? They are more than FBs according to blackdragon's definition because I'm buying them a couple drinks and letting them sleep at my house but I don't consider these long term relationships so MLTR doesn't seem to apply either. Some of these girls are going to be sleeping with other guys but I don't think that is being cuckolded because it isn't a relationship.

Some of the good advice that blackdragon gives is to categorize women within the first few weeks and it is imperative that your behavior is congruent with how you categorize them, i.e. never take FBs out on dates or treat LTRs like FBs because that will lead to a lot of hurt feelings with the girls and drama for you to deal with. I've experienced this first hand when I haven't really known what I wanted and confused girls with my intentions. Also, I've seen some forum members who have extremely efficient game and I think the primary reason for that efficiency is knowing exactly what they want from a specific girl and their behavior always being congruent with what they want.

So I don't agree with fucksong but I'm glad he started this thread and made the points that he did. I had to downgrade a new girl after reading all of this. My judgement was off because she was one of the hottest girls I've ever been with and there was an emotional connection. I was about to put myself in a weak position but I was able to avoid that after reading this thread.

Post: #43

I can't take any guy in an "open relationship" seriously.

You can fuck some girls. You can take them out for a night on the town. You can let them sleep over. You can do this without establishing boundaries and instead just enjoy the time/fucking together.

But the second you willingly establish an "open relationship", you're weak. Hamsterbate all you want, but a man does not allow other men to fuck his girl.

Post: #44

I'm not sure who you are saying is hamsterbating. If you are saying I am then I suggest reading that book I wrote again because I think we are in agreement. If you are saying that fucksong is then I understand you but I'm just suggesting that we cut him some slack. I agree that he is wrong but it is a confusing topic due to all the different definitions of FBs, dating, and relationships and the blackdragon blog is easily believable until you really dig into it and realize the guy doesn't have any experience with his OLTR concept and his MLTR concept is poorly defined.

Post: #45

With repect to the Black Dragon blog, the blogger starts with the premise that both women and men cannot truly be happy and faithful beyond the first two to three years of a relationship. During that time “new relationship energy” is present, so the couple is really happy and straying is not a problem. But after that, its all downhill, with eventual cheating by one or both of the partners. I am reminded of the saying “show me a beautiful woman and I’ll show you a guy that’s tired of banging her.” Therefore, the author maintains that any attempt at long term monogamy is futile and he offers these “open” relationships as an alternative.

Putting aside the open relationship issue, I’m more interested in the premise that all long term monogamous relationships are destined to fail. My experience with long term relationships has mirrored this somewhat, but I’m not sure I’m sold on the inevitable collapse of all or most long term relationships. However, the divorce statistics are pretty grim and he makes a good point that “success” is measured by the marriage staying intact, but with no guarantee that the spouses are happy. The older I get, the more I realize that many couples are deeply unhappy but stay together for various reasons.

What do you guys think? Is monogamy still viable in this climate of unrestricted open hypergamy?

Post: #46

I'm 27 and have had 3 ltrs, around three years each. They have all imploded around the same time frame.

This is pure speculation but maybe women have some built in evo biology reaction to getting pounded for 3 years straight without a pregnancy that makes them abort mission and move on to "fertile" wang.

Post: #47

No posts for two weeks now, Cucksong seems to have abandoned thread!