Post: #26

(10-11-2015 02:38 AM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  Yes, the reality this guy talks about is real.

If you drive up to the simplest of Thai villages, their lifestyle is not that bad at all. I've been in the midst of it plenty of times with them, eaten at their tables and building real friendships, and they are probably happier than people I know back in fast-paced California by a long stretch.

A large part of what this guy is saying is also a rehash of the King of Thailand's philosophy on "self sufficiency of the thai people" which on its face appears to be a sensible piece of advice given the limited resources of the Thai government. I'm sure you've heard of it before but the King of Thailand's self sufficiency speech was all about rural Thais learning skills and making use of the land in a renewable way to live. Thais put the idea of ascetic living on a pedestal but very very few will ever do this. The real way urban Thai's live is the anti-thesis of buddhist beliefs..it's all about buying, spending lavishly, and showing off bullshit.

This guy is also pointing this out and saying that Thais in Bangkok have swung too hard in the direction of soulless consumerism and materialism. If someone has lived in Bangkok before you can see what he says actually makes some sense.

However, there's also a darker undercurrent to all this and it's deep class divisions. Basically if you read between the lines the elite in Bangkok would also prefer if rural people just make do with what they have and not urbanize too much and get involved in politics. The King of Thailand's words are also very ambiguous as well. On one hand it seems like he's advocating for a better life for the rural population but like I said if you read between the lines you can also see an entirely different agenda being pushed too.

This is why politics in Thai always blows up into this big mess every few years and why there's huge political rifts between the countryside and the city.

The thing about life expectacy statistics is that it doesn't really factor in quality of life at old age either. People may live longer but how much of that is being stuck on a death bed in a hospital in bangkok somewhere with a slow drip IV of medicine being fed into you. At a certain age if i'm invalid like that i'd much prefer death rather than being kept alive like some kind of science project.

In the developing world what kills people is usually fast disease and illness like heart disease, strokes, and flus. The reason why people live longer in the developed world is that preventitive measures that reduce death from sudden illness due to widely available vaccines, sanitation, and antibioitics makes it less likely.

All in all renewable country living is a nice thought and i've also spent some time out there in rural Thailand. I do agree with Beyond Borders that people on average are happier in rural parts but there are a lot of other issues out there too like rampant alcoholism in the rural areas. The people out there in the rural areas do eat pretty well too if they are reasonably productive. Fresh rice, free range chickens/ducks, hand fed fresh fish from reservoirs, frogs, pigs, etc.. it's good stuff out there. The vegetables out there aren't laced with pesticides either.

Post: #27

(10-11-2015 11:43 AM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  

(10-11-2015 12:00 AM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  After watching this prick for a minute, I had a desire to punch him in the face.

Then he'll find out how easy and rational life is.

He's just a little to smug, too happy, to content, too sickly saccharine. Such people irritate me. They see life as a Hallmark card, rather than the kaleidescope of passion that it truly is.

The upward progress of man, and the great achievements of history, have been marked by passion, blood, rage, love, hatred, violence, conquest, and the ecstasy of zeal.

Give me powerful, honest emotions! Give me intensity in its sincerest form, though it be at times violent and destructive!

Because sometimes we have to smash the old things, to make room for the new ones. Even ourselves.

And this was what I meant. We are dealing with moral truths here. No man of any consequence wants, or seeks, an "easy life."

Slash with your knives, jab with your bayonets, and keep the lead flying down range.

This is most of life. This is the moral truth, the quintessence of the glorious struggle that we were born for.


P.S.: I'm still your dog of war, AB...

All well written, but when's the last time you punched someone in the face for something they said or did? You were in the military and you clearly keep yourself in shape, so maybe you do know violence intimately. That wouldn't surprise me. But I don't percieve that you're a man prepared to haul back and just sock someone because they rub you wrong. You obviously live a life of far more civilized conduct than that.

So your post came across as a bit of huffing and puffing and posturing, which is why I gave it the response I did.

As for me, I lost track of all the people I've punched a long time ago, but I would never make a remark like that about some poor, humble, soft-spoken Thai guy who just wants to live in peace and make the world a better place based on what he sees that meaning. I mean, come on now....

A strong and sure man shouldn't need to bully and goad the voluntarily meek just to make himself look and feel strong. In fact, I am just the opposite of you. If I was in a room and someone tried to go at this guy for his ideas or lifestyle, they would have to come through me first. And I would (and have) put myself between them even if the guy charging him was bigger and tougher than me, so no need to take that as a direct challenge of you or your capabilities.

My point is that you, Sir, are being the bully. And some of you guys could use a few shots of humility - regardless of your battle cries, being humble IS a courageous and worthy ideal for a man and many of us in the manosphere perhaps ought to reflect on it from time to time.

Human progress and the stability of a civilization also depend on our ability to temper our passions and polish the edges of our technologies and lifestyle as we go. You can liken the balance that this creates to the difference between the undisciplined, hot-tempered boxer who swings himself out and the disciplined veteran who takes the match with controlled, measured, highly-effective aggression.

I see what this guy is doing as making what we already have more efficient. We need people like him to clean up the messes, constantly remind us to try and do things cleaner and with more order and compassion, and remind us to use what we've built already. Because progress requires refining as much as it requires charging forward, and we need people to keep the wheels of the system turning as much as we need swinging dicks breaking shit and blasting new paths into the wilderness.

Hell, I've seen your pics on your blog. You too seem to be a man who appreciates clean, peaceful, and orderly places - and you no doubt spend your hard-earned money to have other people provide them for you. Something men like this don't have such easy access to.

This guy is showing others that there are more direct routes to creating those peaceful, comfortable spaces. That it's in fact simple to create them based on what most already have in our possession (if we're willing to do some work) rather than the inefficient, indirect route of running away to the city to get an office job so we can save money and buy it instead. Thus, freeing up our time and mental energies to perhaps do other things (other things, I might add, that can also be very constructive for society).

So you can rant about the beauty of living a hard, complicated life all you want, but your reality shows that men do and always have appreciated environments of peace and order and comfort as well, and indeed, much of our struggle exists in our pursuit of them.

But I also think you guys are taking his "make life easy" testament too literally. This could just be that it doesn't translate well, as I mentioned before. He's just using the context to make a point that we don't necessarily have to make things as difficult as we make them.

In any case, there's nothing particularly "easy" in the sense you are talking about in building a house with your own hands. He's clearly producing. He didn't stop at one house but has built many, and he's now sharing his ideas (as you do) to people around the world and teaching his fellow countrymen how they can do the same.

If he was some deadbeat middle class American kid leeching off his parents or the system or somehow hurting others in his quest, I could understand your hostility towards him, but as it stands, you come across like a bareknuckled bully elbowing his way through a crowd of peaceful people who didn't come for a fight...and insisting everyone think and act the same as you.

And how consistent is that, even, with your true personality and everyday behavior?

I haven't met you, so it's at least possible that I'm wrong, but I'd wager that's not the type of man you are at all, and that's good. So perhaps a bit of caution in the attitude you encourage in others is in order...

Post: #28

(10-11-2015 10:03 PM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  that about some poor, humble, soft-spoken Thai guy who just wants to live in peace and make the world a better place

I'm sorry, but you're very naïve.

Everyone has an agenda, King or Peasant. It's telling he's targeting TedX, seeking charity from Tech Events where, as I said, tickets run $6000 a pop. This guy is building a Brand - he's trumpeted by the Natural Homes collective - and you're falling for the sales pitch.

This is 18th Century Self-Sustaining Utopian Collectivism given a post-millennial, globalisation-friendly progressive rebranding. This, naturally, appeals to the psychopathic Silicon Valley Corporations, as it allows them to spin their public image into an Ethical Company, (due to the subversive influence of Big Tech by Mental Environmentalists).

His very pitch is classic Mental Environmentalism – a strain of Anti-Authoritarian Marxism where Advanced Capitalism is perceived as the root of all evil – where Authentic Consciousness only can be achieved by refusing to partake in the consumer process, including media and branding. See also: his distaste for educational institutions that further Advanced Capitalism.

I simply don’t trust him, as I don’t trust anyone who wants to suggest theories of how to make the world ‘a better place’. As such, his ‘happiness’ is likely to be fleeting, should a Mushroom Haired woman decide to march a wave of strangers over his hill to share his land and bounty, due to her belief it makes the world ‘a better place’.

Still, I figured, by giving this talk, he's now on the radar of Rich, White Millennials who are socially-concerned. If he's 'happy' then why does he want to be there?

Curious, I researched further.

The wife of this 'poor, humble farmer':

Quote:Peggy and Jo live here with Thaan for 9 months of the year. The other three they spend in Colorado with Peggy's family.

Why would he leave Pun Pun? After all, it's not like he wants or needs anything. Why doesn't his white wife do talks, or is it so they can play on Liberal's White Guilt and Globalisation Dreams.

Now I'm really suspicious.

He's soft-spoken and polite, and but at the end of the day, Mental Environmentalism is still fucking Marxism. Quick research revealed it's the hypocritical, brand focused kind with purchasable t-shirts, Restaurants, and Organically-Branded Products. This isn't uncommon - see the branding of Adbusters, an anti-advertising magazine.

More research, suspicion confirmed. Look at the deliberate consumerist branding style of the photos in this article. This is classic lifestyle-aspiration porn for Leftist Millennials.

Fostering Virtue At Pun Pun Farm

Why would he do sell Lifestyle Porn?

Quote:Here at Pun Pun they organize internships in sustainable living projects for the international Western community

This is making sense. Looks like the experience of Pun Pun is popular with a certain type of individual. Note how their selfies are selling their desired Narcissistic Constructs to their FB / Instagram followers, and how particularly inauthentic the female pictures are:









This is now so fucking obvious to me I barely need to research further, but do.

Here's your 'poor, humble, soft-spoken' Thai Farmer, offering 3 week Internships for Rich American Leftists....

Quote:Fee: $1,200 US/person. All proceeds go towards supporting Pun Pun community to grow and continue with our seed center and outreach work.

...raking in $36,000 US per course...

Quote:2) Once you have sent your participant survey and have been confirmed, a $500 US non-refundable deposit is due to secure your spot. Please understand we cannot hold your spot until we receive your deposit. We ask you transfer this to our account. The remaining fee will be due on the first day of the course in cash in either Thai baht or US dollars.

This, as an INTJ personality - as is QC - is exactly what I expected. We recognised inauthenticity and manipulation and immediately raised our guard to protect our tribe. Note QC's words:

Quote:He's just a little to smug, too happy, to content, too sickly saccharine

You're being played, and you fell for it hook, line and sinker. Since I loathe inauthentic people trying to put one over on me, I have to resist the urge to punch him in the face myself. If that makes me a bad person, well, it's preferable to being a gullible one.

Post: #29

LOL AB, thanks for digging up that info. I thought the guy was a hustler the moment I heard him open his mouth, but it's always satisfying to see an essence realized so fully and luxuriously.

(10-10-2015 08:00 AM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  Nah, this Thai dude is just a smart lazy hustler, for which I give him full credit.

His "wisdom" consists of the fact that he figured out that working hard can be very tedious, and studying and trying to master a field of knowledge is even more so. Some people who come into possession of this wisdom become criminals, but those who have a scammer's talent and a distaste for violence realize that they can have a relatively easy life by hustling people out of their money in more peaceful ways. What better way to do it than by founding an "organic farm" based on "holistic principles" and being feted by goofy and/or nihilistic SWPL folk whose hatred for the world as it is leads them to worship an imagined farmer sage and his Oriental "wisdom".

Now I'm just wondering about two things:

(10-12-2015 02:21 AM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  

Is his wife secretly more fuckable than meets the eye? It might not seem like much but something about this picture makes me wonder. It all hinges on whether she has an ASS.

(10-12-2015 02:21 AM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  

Why is this dude standing in a hole instead of making my espresso?

Post: #30

I suspect for Pun-Pun as long as she's white and has a house in Colorado, that's all that matters.

He now has an abudence of houses, clothes, white pussy and money. And some fame to boot. Isn't that every Thai man's dream?

Instead of punching the guy in the face, we should give him a round of applause for finding a way to profit of the zeitgeist.

Sustainability, Organic, Free range, cage-free, fair-trade, white/western privilege. All marketing terms of the feminine. Pun-Pun is right. Lot of easy money to be made

Post: #31

I was just having this discussion with someone...

Greatest hits of (I've written about this before) - I was married but sort of unhappy. After the divorce, I met a gal and got an epic case of oneitis. When that fell apart (mostly because I was a total blue bill beta), I studied the shit out of game and got decent at it, trying to find validation (and revenge, sort of) through fucking a lot of women. This lead to a realization that my entire life revolved around women, one way or another, for too long. Why?

Now it's 2015. I'm self employed and have money in the bank. I don't chase women, but I find a lot of them trying to prod the "are we going to be in a real relationship? Don't you ever want to get married and have kids?"

Honestly, I find that the answer is no. Women are readily available, easily replaceable, and none of them are special. Once you're getting sex regularly, they're a distraction from important stuff - going to the gym, building a business, reading, writing, etc. It becomes a constant nag of "Can we go out to dinner tonight?" "Can I come over and see you?" "Can we just watch a movie?" "Can you get off your laptop and pay attention to me?" For the most part they live for entertainment and contribute very little to a relationship except sex. For the most part, women are overgrown children who let their emotions dictate all their actions.

There's this blue pill notion that a sexual relationship with a woman is deeper than relationships with your male peers. Nothing could be further than the truth. My male relationships are much deeper and intellectual. They're also not clouded with childish emotions. ("I saw you at the football game with Bob!!!! You said you'd take me to that game!!! I wanted to see you. Wahhh!!!"). Women are not only unnecessary for companionship, but quite frankly, they're terrible at it. If prostitution were legal, no sane man would ever be in a relationship, let alone get married. Women would be beating down the doors of men.

Learning game is necessary because it gets you laid. However, anyone who thinks they're going to find validation and happiness through women is still living in a blue pill fantasy world.

Post: #32

(10-12-2015 02:21 AM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  

I don't know about whether he's a fraud or not but..




What the fuck?? I thought Layne Staley was dead.

If he can resurrect dead rock stars surely that must count for something.

Post: #33

I think some of you are making a lot of assumptions to suggest this guy Jon Jandai is a sleazy hustler. Perhaps Jandai is a fraud but many of the comments in this thread demonstrate a clear lack of understanding that some people don't come from western culture therefore they don’t have the same values and beliefs that western people do.

Many of the comments in this thread come off as “we westerners have it all figured out”. I think there is a lot of irony in this since we are on a forum where we constantly discuss the negative aspects of western culture such as feminism, SJWs, and our contempt for many western women. There are pros and cons to everything. For example, people in western countries may have the highest life expectancy but these countries also have the highest rates of obesity, mental health problems, prescription drug consumption, etc.

Regardless of whatever Jandai’s motives are there is still a lot of wisdom in that video just as Beyond Borders said. I’m surprised more people haven’t said this because one of Jandai’s primary themes is essentially taking the red pill. His entire message is about avoiding social conditioning and thinking for yourself rather than blindly following society.

I don’t think Jandai is suggesting laziness or that people should always stay within their comfort zone. I believe he is suggesting that (1) people should take time to think about what makes them happy and fulfilled rather than blindly following society and (2) people should be able to provide themselves with a few of life's basic necessities (food & water, shelter, clothes, medicine) rather than depending on governments and corporations for these items. Depending on governments and corporations allows those organizations to control us through fear and takes away our freedom.

There are a lot of problems that come from consumerism and the mass consumption of material goods that has been a huge part of western culture since the end of the world wars. Consumerism contributes to environmental problems and causes wars over resources. Consumerism contributes to the psychological problems of people in western culture which are deeply related to many of the topics we discuss on this forum such as game and the issues we have with feminists and SJWs. I think it is unfortunate that Jandai brings a message of anti-consumerism and talks about how we should actually think rather being mindless sheep who follow everyone else in society and do whatever we are told by governments and corporations; however, many commenters in this thread only see a sleazy hustler because he charges $1200 for a 3 week internship. Even if Jandai is a fraud I think many of you are still missing the bigger picture.

Post: #34

Don't African outreach programs run a scam like this also?

They let white girls pay to volunteer to build homes or something that they can out on their resume for the low low price of xxxxx (1200usd).

Post: #35

Well, we're dealing with moral truths here, aren't we?

Or, at least, moral truths as I see them.

One needs to set out such things, and describe them; and if the emotions come from a sincere place, all the better. I want my heart to be a taught, tightly wound cord, which, when touched, resounds clearly for the world to hear.

Son coeur est un luth suspendu; sitot, qu'on le touche il resonne...(De Beranger)

What I say is this: that this Thai man, while perhaps being a very nice man, is like one of those sirens whose song lures and coaxes us to our deaths. He sedates and intoxicates us with his platitudes, with his fooleries, with his sickly-sweet prescription for the good life.

The good life is not to be found in relaxation, endless joy, and tranquility. No.

It is only to be found in the endless quest. The quest alone gives us meaning. We must seek it out, this Blood-Quest, and hunt it down.

Sometimes this is a violent process. Sometimes this is a nasty process. But it is one which all men must go through. There is no other way.

The upward movement of all men has always been marked, not by cloying sweets or voluptuous delicacies, but by struggle, fighting, agony, passion, and love.

Give me this. Don't lull me into a stupor with men like this, who grin at me with their big teeth and lure me to my death, like the Sirens would to Odysseus, among the jagged rocks.

No. No. No. I would sooner die first.

I want to punch, and I want to be punched. This is life. This is the pulse of life.

Listen, if you will, to Orson Welles here, talking about this same idea. A generation of violence and turbulence under the Borgias, but the Renaissance was produced. Five hundred years of peace in Switzerland, and that produced....the cuckoo clock:





And so this is what I mean, and this is what I meant.

We have to get down to the essentials of things. We have to get past the platitudes, past the grinning slogans, past the lectures in comfortable auditoriums where we are put to sleep by grinning charlatans in Buddhist tunics.

I don't want to be sedated, to be "happy," to be another grinning zombie who hectors me as I sit in a cushioned auditorium chair.

I want to feel the salt spray on my face as my ship ploughs through the rolling surge of life. Can you taste the tang?

I want to feel the taste of my own blood in my mouth, as I am hit by a man stronger than I.

I want to feel the satisfaction of hitting a man who deserves to be hit, perhaps.

Because there is a wisdom in this. There is a balance in this. This delicate thread that connects us all. And this, my dear BB, is the Eternal Truth, a truth far deeper than our grinning friend with the Thai accent can yet comprehend.

I call that good. I call that Life itself.

I promise nothing but struggle, hardship, and adventure. But I also promise Life itself. A real life, richly lived.

And more will follow me, than will follow him.


.

Post: #36

(10-12-2015 11:12 AM)Fisto Wrote:  Don't African outreach programs run a scam like this also?

They let white girls pay to volunteer to build homes or something that they can out on their resume for the low low price of xxxxx (1200usd).

And don't forget about the unlimited amount of selfies they're allowed to take and post of themselves being selfless.

Those kinds of pics with 3rd world children, and building huts are hard to come by.

Post: #37

Just like the "look at me enjoying the simple life and the simple things".

Reminds me of when bitches (and chumps) take photos of food or sunsets.

Post: #38

(10-12-2015 02:21 AM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  

(10-11-2015 10:03 PM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  that about some poor, humble, soft-spoken Thai guy who just wants to live in peace and make the world a better place

I'm sorry, but you're very naïve.

Uh, no, far from it, Friend. I haven't made it all these years navigating the back alleys of the places I do by being naive. I juggle grinning con-artists and scammers on a regular basis, and that with a smile on my face because this is in situations where real deal violence (the kind this guy probably saw growing up) could explode in a second and where I wouldn't dare (nor would anyone without a suicide wish) punch a guy who looks like this in the face even if I wanted to.

Because I do live life with my face in the spray, as QC waxes poetically of, almost always alone rather than with any "tribe" and constantly on ready for the consequences. I just often forget to write or even talk about it.

In any case, look, if you want to go spend twenty times more energy on this than me and dig up the guy's info just so you can insult me, be my guest; I still stand behind what I said. Perhaps I laid the adjectives down a little thick in that line you quoted, but the fact still stands that QC's post very clearly barks about punching this old dude in the face for daring to even utter these ideas in the first place - not just because he thought the guy was being false.

Just read his explanatory follow-up piece that came just after, and other than that one ambiguous sentence that you (again) choicely quoted of his, this is extremely clear. So let's not pretend he was saying something he wasn't in your effort to belittle me.

You want to take a piss at me because he's your buddy, fine. I'm not going to sit here all day and argue who this guy is and what exactly he's selling because to be honest, I don't give a shit enough. If I cared enough about that to waste more time on it than I am already now, I would have addressed it with your first attempt to draw me into that conversation about a possible funding grab. By ignoring it, I thought I made it clear I wasn't interested in that particular discussion, at which point you felt it necessary to outright insult me.

I will say that 95% of the time I hold my tongue on this forum in the interest of time and energy rather than out of a lack of more to add; as you might be able to guess from the long-winded posts I do make, I'm hardly out of things to say. So believe it or not, I've considered many of the same possibilities as you, but it's not uncommon for me to go ahead and let someone have their last word in a discussion simply because I just don't see the point.

But to make it perfectly clear, in this particular situation and conversation, whether he's the real deal or not is really of no concern to me - because the principles I'm talking about still stand either way.

These ideas he's championing are part of the progress you guys champion - with every hard charge comes a process of refinement, however clumsy it might be - whether you like it or not, and an argument could possibly even be made that charging for these ideas is inevitable when it comes to spreading them (though I can definitely see why you would call that hypocrisy in this context).

But more to the point, going on about punching this guy in the face is ridiculous and unnecessary bravado. And you guys could stand to be a little bit more humble. Which seems to be becoming a theme around here.

Look at Liz's posts, for example. One second he apologizes for being so brash and thanks me for my patient response. The next he sees a life expectancy chart (as if it took a genious to predict his next instinct was going to be to go Google life expectancy trends in Thailand) and he comes out guns blazing and elbows flying again, dropping little offhand quips at me in his post (i.e "posionous", "wisdom," etc). Even while talking about stuff he's already said he knows I believe as well.

As if I'm really so dense as to have not considered that angle already.

I mean, be humble or don't, for chrissakes - just make up your damn mind already.

The world and most people aren't so black and white, and just because you're right or think you're right or even if you do see something others don't doesn't give you license to pretend your opinions are judgement handed down; I swear, you guys are some intelligent cats, and probably much moreso than I, but sometimes you're like a pack of intellectual bulls trying to see who can make the most noise smashing through the virtual china shop.

And I think if you ever truly do reach the levels of wisdom some of you are so admirably striving for, you'll see how all of us are chock full of "things we know that just ain't so," which makes it a truly foolish act to be so hostile towards people who think differently than you (each one of us is bound to be the one wrong a considerable percentage of the time).

Back to the punching of faces, at the end of the day, none of us are going around laying people out for expressing their ideas on a stage (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong). And definitely not little old men like this one. So let's all sit down and have a glass of keep it real around here already.

Especially if the promise of such a punch comes with the assertion that hitting a guy from this background is going to teach him something he doesn't know all too well already. Again, from a first-world Westerner, that is fresh, and to me a gross error in judgement (not to mention an underestimation of the less masculine Asian man that has bitten plenty of capable men in the past).

But if you want to call me gullible for standing by that, well color me gullible, Buddy. You guys have made it clear you want to look at the world through furrowed "realist" brow, and that's your choice, I suppose, if you think there is no room for civility and humility alongside "wisdom" and progress.

Either way, excuse me while I return to my blissful naivete because I honestly have wasted far more precious attention on this rant than I should have already.

Post: #39

(10-12-2015 10:07 AM)birthday cat Wrote:  I think some of you are making a lot of assumptions to suggest this guy Jon Jandai is a sleazy hustler. Perhaps Jandai is a fraud but many of the comments in this thread demonstrate a clear lack of understanding that some people don't come from western culture therefore they don’t have the same values and beliefs that western people do.

I guess I need to check my privilege.

What is *the* classic way to manipulate people, regardless of culture? Promise them that you alone have the secret to happiness, virtue signal that you are a good and selfless person, but then demand tribute - monetary / physical labour / sexual attention to share in their happiness.

Quote:I’m surprised more people haven’t said this because one of Jandai’s primary themes is essentially taking the red pill. His entire message is about avoiding social conditioning and thinking for yourself rather than blindly following society.

I don't think you're understanding my point.

As I said, this is the particular strand of Anti-Authoritarian Marxism known as Mental Environmentalism - this is the Adbusters / Corporations are Psychopathic Entities / Culture Jamming crew that emerged in the 90's. This is every hemp-granny-dress-wearing leftist girl I banged during the late 90's, rolling a joint on the cover of No Logo beside her bed.



The key clue here is both his contempt for consumerism and government control whilst engaging in the branding process to sell his belief system and products. He doesn't practice what he preaches - standard Marxism - and partakes in the consumer dance - standard Mental Environmentalism. He does this by telling himself he's above it, and is only using the system to 'make a difference'.

Whilst the Frankfurt School floated the idea of Advanced Capitalism in the 30's, a strand of Anti-Authoritarian Marxists in the 50's - the Situationist International - were the first adopt Advanced Capitalism as the root of all societal unhappiness. They differed from the Frankfurt School's rigidity of belief by believing societal criticism was possible within the media framework itself. They used the tactic of Detournement:

Quote:"turning expressions of the capitalist system and its media culture against itself"

You already know what this is. The original punks took a lot from the Situationists:



This fed through alternative music and third wave feminist culture through 'zines, then transformed into the marketed rebellion of Culture Jamming.





I might be the only one who suspects this, but the Mental Environmentalists are currently making a huge subversive push into Silicon Valley and Tech Culture. They're doing this by using Authoritarian Marxists in the media as Useful Idiots to force corporations to act Ethically, with the intention of making them both less-effective and, therefore, less-profitable, because they'd believe Technology would be stopping people from being their authentic selves.

As this relates to Red Pill teaching: yes, Roosh and Jonathon McIntosh - he and Sarkeesian are M.E.'s pretending to be Marxists - both appear to have the same long term goal: consumerism and technology are bad - true human authenticity is lost - so unplug. The difference is Roosh is advocating Self-Improvement, Direct Political Action and Individualism to strengthen community whilst McIntosh (and Jandai) advocate Self-Negation, Subversive Political Action and Communalism to strengthen community.

Personally, I'd highly-recommend Situationist Tactics and Culture Jamming to propagandise and brand Neomasculinity. Detournement works, even on a guy who is aware of the process. This is why I no longer play video games: McIntosh is a cunning bastard who knew exactly what he was doing. This is why I find it hilarious that Games Companies think he and Sarkeesian are interested in making games better.

Post: #40

I dont think anyone is attacking you BB...

Post: #41

^ Leave me alone - I'm doing pushups!

Okay, okay. Not so sure I took it wrong, but I'll take your word for it and go to sleep.

Post: #42

Quote:What is *the* classic way to manipulate people, regardless of culture? Promise them that you alone have the secret to happiness, virtue signal that you are a good and selfless person, but then demand tribute - monetary / physical labour / sexual attention to share in their happiness.

Post: #43

I'm guesssing they don't have debates like this on Pun-Pun's farm.

Post: #44

Since I've made my rejection of Mr. Thailand's namby-pamby ethical code clear, I have an obligation to propose my own code.

My own commandments, if you will.

1. You shall not shield yourself from raw experience.

2. You shall not hide from the clash, clang, and roar of life. Instead, you will welcome it.

3. You shall find the nature of that Great Spirit that resides in you.

4. You shall obey the call of that Spirit, wherever it takes you.

5. You shall love passionately, and hate passionately.

6. You shall realize that we are, each of us, alone.

7. You shall not expect your woman to "complete" you, and neither shall you "complete" her.

8. You shall realize that Life is a brutal struggle, and you shall welcome the chance to enter the Great Arena of Life, knowing that the only way to lose is by failing to participate. Pain is good and natural. All honor and glory goes to those who participate with zeal.

9. You shall not expect the other man to be like you, or to "understand" you, on more than a few points. He is he, and I am I.

10. You shall not expect, and shall not seek, a stupefying and illusory "happiness" from the World. You are entitled to nothing except what is in you.


So there you have it. You can call it a creed, or you can call it whatever you wish.

Post: #45

(10-12-2015 09:11 AM)HankMoody Wrote:  ... Women are not only unnecessary for companionship, but quite frankly, they're terrible at it. If prostitution were legal, no sane man would ever be in a relationship, let alone get married. Women would be beating down the doors of men...

I think that's a little too much glorification of the usually fairly perfunctory services provided by even the better and more outwardly enthusiastic prostitutes.

I've had plenty of experience with them in Europe and a bit in Thailand - I'm not even slightly ashamed of using their services during weeks or occasionally months where I'm either having a string of unproductive dates, or taking a brief time out from dating or STRs.
Prostitutes are the sexual equivalent of fast food as far as I'm concerned - convenient when I can't be bothered to cook or don't have anything in the fridge, occasionally even enticing over other options when I'm in a certain mood (it was particularly tempting in Bangkok when it was right in your face, day or night, in certain areas) - but not suitable for a steady diet. I've had better sex - from a skill and "nastiness" perspective - with some pros than I have with many ONSs and some STRs, but personally I actually do like the companionship of women, conversation (I tend to date girls with above average IQ, which can be both a blessing or a curse, depending on the girl) as well as non sexual intimacy, as long as I also get the time to myself I crave on a weekly basis.

No comment on the marriage part though. I don't have any experience with that, nor at this point any desire to commit to it.

Oh, and women absolutely don't come knocking down the doors of men (except for the doors of the same top tier men as usual) in countries where prostitution is legal (or effectively treated as legal), relatively cheap and with plenty of lookers working the brothels, massage parlors, streets and Internet ads.

Post: #46

(10-12-2015 03:10 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  Since I've made my rejection of Mr. Thailand's namby-pamby ethical code clear, I have an obligation to propose my own code...

Brilliant, QC, absolutely brilliant.

Building off of that, here is the SJW version:

Quote:1. You shall shield yourself from raw experience.

2. You shall hide from life, dispassionately-observing it as a documentarian behind a camera would. You will demand personal protection from the clash and clang of it, and then extend that to demanding the government protect others from it, for their own good.

3. You shall encourage no nobility and greatness within yourself, and shall cultivate a despondent, bitter spirit that seeks to exterminate all trace of that which you lack in other people.

4. You shall follow no call but the will of your immediate desire, with the expectation of being free of the negative consequences of doing so.

5. You shall believe love is a socially-constructed illusion, whilst understanding that the appearance of empathy needs to be projected as a means to an end. The only true and genuine passion that can be felt is hate, and should be cultivated and embraced, until it is the dominant tone of all discourse framed in the name of emphatic concern for others.

6. You shall champion communalism of property and stringent, dictated peer thought out of fear of being socially-alone and self-reliant.

7. You shall believe your partner to be naught but an extension of yourself, sharing your desires and value system.

8. You shall realise Life is a brutal struggle, and blame your fear of participating in the struggle on oppressive forces, and seek to remove them in the belief Utopian Bliss will then naturally arise. Pain means hurt and hurt is all-encompassing and defines you for life. The act of complaint is a right and powerful in itself. All power goes to those who whine with zeal.

9. You shall demand conformity of beliefs, politics, language, style and demand representation of those who reflect that conformity. Those who conform are granted personhood, those who do not are unpersoned.

10. You are entitled to happiness, respect, power, success and comfort, and the ends justify the means.

Post: #47

(10-12-2015 01:12 PM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  Look at Liz's posts, for example. One second he apologizes for being so brash and thanks me for my patient response. The next he sees a life expectancy chart (as if it took a genious to predict his next instinct was going to be to go Google life expectancy trends in Thailand) and he comes out guns blazing and elbows flying again, dropping little offhand quips at me in his post (i.e "posionous", "wisdom," etc). Even while talking about stuff he's already said he knows I believe as well.

As if I'm really so dense as to have not considered that angle already.

I mean, be humble or don't, for chrissakes - just make up your damn mind already.

Damn BB, I feel like I've fallen into a Thai sinkhole (even though I don't really know if there are sinkholes there) and I can't get out. It's a sinkhole right in the middle of Pun Pun farm, and whenever I think I'm about to climb out of it, Peggy and Jo -- strangely enough -- keep pushing me back in, while Thanh is just standing there with an enigmatic smile and saying, "Why you make it hard? it's so easy.... so easy....". And I wake up in a cold sweat. A pretty low level nightmare, but there it is.

The reason I made the post thanking you for your patience was because I felt that something in the tone of my first post in this thread could possibly offend you -- and that is the absolute last thing I want to do. Of course that has nothing to do with the content of what I had said, which is what I believe to be the case, for what it's worth; but I like and respect you so much that I immediately regretted making you feel bad in any way. And what made me return to the subject to make another post (other than Peggy giving me a good shove down that hole) was Cobra's post about the magical "perspective" that "westerners" supposedly fatally lack. That is something that I strongly disagree with, and I felt the need to explain that. There were no "offhand quips", let alone ones directed at you; first, offhand quips are not my way, and second, you are not my target. More than anything I just wanted to get that Indian dude to read some Naipaul.

And finally, I'm neither humble nor (I hope) the opposite, so I don't feel like I need to make a choice either way. I simply speak my mind and communicate what I think is true, and try to do it as well and as enjoyably as I can. But I am also mindful that I am among my friends and brothers, and they are human beings whose emotions I have to make allowances for. So one tries to strike a balance and it comes out as it does.

And now with your permission I'm going to climb out of this nasty sinkhole never to return to it, dead or alive, so help me God.

Post: #48

(10-12-2015 01:31 PM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  ...they'd believe Technology would be stopping people from being their authentic selves.

As this relates to Red Pill teaching: yes, Roosh and Jonathon McIntosh - he and Sarkeesian are M.E.'s pretending to be Marxists - both appear to have the same long term goal: consumerism and technology are bad - true human authenticity is lost - so unplug. The difference is Roosh is advocating Self-Improvement, Direct Political Action and Individualism to strengthen community whilst McIntosh (and Jandai) advocate Self-Negation, Subversive Political Action and Communalism to strengthen community.

This post by durotang on Master / Slave morality is helpful for fleshing out the concepts of my post.

I'm helping my friend write a movie script, and one theme is that healthy women want a man who is "Uplifting" - highly successful across a broad range of categories, coupled with a genuine desire to help everyone. Part of what is Uplifting is moral / virtuous and the other half is aesthetic, but both are necessary to be Uplifting.

Stefan Molyneux has an intricate definition of love: Love is our involuntary positive response to virtue, provided we ourselves are virtuous; otherwise our response will be contempt. But I think he misses the second, equally important clause: Love is also our involuntary positive response to beauty, provided we ourselves have a healthy relationship with beauty; otherwise our response to beauty will be contempt.

I've posted this video before, but this is one of many examples where Stefan has an extremely negative relationship to beauty:






You don't have to listen to the whole thing; just six minutes of it will make you realize, "He isn't kidding! He feels that much negative emotional energy when looking at a woman wearing make up."

Without a healthy relationship to beauty, the illogical and contradictory argument is subtly promoted, "Wouldn't the world be more beautiful, if we could only remove peoples' desire for beauty?"

So, also, is the irrational and contradictory argument, "You should judge me by my intentions!" - (even though you'll never be able to see my intentions, because they're buried eternally inside of me.)

So, finally, is the irrational and contradictory argument, "Being authentic allows others to see Who You Really Are!" - (even though Who Anyone Really Is is so complex that we can never see it through observing their consumer purchases, nor chatting them up for an hour, nor even dating them for six months. To know Who Someone Really Is takes about 2 years, and even this is just a rough outline; we will never see Who Someone Really Is.)

So even though I haven't watched this Thai guy's video, I think you're reacting to the Beauty-Destroying mantra hidden behind his words and presentation. He thinks modern society is ugly, even though it's not. And he wants the rewards of being beautiful - (money, fame, and respect) - without being beautiful himself.

Post: #49

(10-12-2015 03:10 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  5. You shall love passionately, and hate passionately.

Amen.

Post: #50

(10-12-2015 01:31 PM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  

(10-12-2015 10:07 AM)birthday cat Wrote:  I think some of you are making a lot of assumptions to suggest this guy Jon Jandai is a sleazy hustler. Perhaps Jandai is a fraud but many of the comments in this thread demonstrate a clear lack of understanding that some people don't come from western culture therefore they don’t have the same values and beliefs that western people do.

I guess I need to check my privilege.

I'm not sure why the concept of privilege was mentioned. Cobra said "Some of the posts here even from vets just reek of an obvious lack of real perspective" and I said "many of the comments in this thread demonstrate a clear lack of understanding that some people don't come from western culture therefore they don’t have the same values and beliefs that western people do" but nothing was said about privilege. It seems like this was an attempt to reframe my argument as a SJW argument but I never said anything relating to privilege.

The point I was trying to make is that it is obvious that some of the commenters in this thread do not have an understanding of how different some cultures and their people are. People from other cultures may have a very different understanding of concepts like ambition, success, and hard work. We come from relatively new cultures that are heavily influenced by Christianity and we speak languages with the Latin alphabet. People with our background may have a difficult time understanding the perspective of someone from a culture that has been heavily influenced by Buddhism for much longer than our cultures have existed. Language is also a much more significant factor than some people may realize.

I've spent a little time in the areas that Jandai refers to in the video and it seems that Beyond Borders has also. These people simply think differently than we do and they see the world through a different lens. I don't think I could understand this concept very well without actually spending time in the region. In my opinion, the differences between Western cultures and Southeast Asian cultures are a magnitude greater than differences between North America, Europe, South America, etc.

(10-12-2015 01:31 PM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  What is *the* classic way to manipulate people, regardless of culture? Promise them that you alone have the secret to happiness, virtue signal that you are a good and selfless person, but then demand tribute - monetary / physical labour / sexual attention to share in their happiness.

Perhaps this is the classic way to manipulate people but I don't see how it applies to the youtube video. I don't interpret anything he says as promising that he has the secret to happiness, or claiming he has the secret to anything really, and I don't see him demanding any form of compensation. I interpret his message as simple and free of charge.

Some people might watch this video and see a strand of Anti-Authoritarian Marxism known as Mental Environmentalism but I see something much simpler. I see a guy who grew up poor but fairly happy because he didn't really understand he was poor. He moved to a huge and hectic city seeking other people's definition of "success" and he realized that following society's model for success and happiness didn't work for him. His story seems simple, reasonable, and I can relate to it because I've been in a somewhat similar situation before. Maybe I'm naive. Maybe others are making this more complex than it needs to be. Maybe both.