Post: #1

Ok I admit it, I would love to have a woman that I love and trust, a woman that stands by me and bears my children.

But, after seeing how most women my age act now a days, I dont know if I have any faith in that dream, How many girls have I fucked while having they have a "man", how many girls have me and my friends passed around (oh you fucked her to!? Hahaha), I have had some of my friends girls hit on me (what the fuck man...), I see how girls act with other men, I have seen how girls treat beta and its depressing which I have been there before I learned.

I definitely want kids (especially a boy so I can pass on my knowledge) but fuck even that seems fishy, how the hell can I trust any women? After taking the red pill I dont even look at women the same anymore, its like I cant even take them serious anymore.

Dont even get me started on feminism, ugh...

So yea I am not too hopeful on my future prospects of having a "good" woman and having children, I will not marry and I imagine myself getting sick of any women after a while, then again just fucking a bunch of girls while nice for a while, it feels empty, its like ok I got my nut off and thats that, Its like I want something more but how can I...

I have heard that foreign countries are different, the women are much different, here in NYC it seems like all I find are crazy sluts, artsy hipsters that are "deep" or the "Im a self made career woman! Im also 35 with no kids and cant find a man!"

Post: #2

Women cannot love men the way men WANT to be loved.

This is not to say women don't experience very strong feelings and show affection, but their brains are wired differently than our male brains. Love in women's minds is not the unconditional love we are taught to think it is. Men are the romantics, despite what the blue pill might tell you. Men's brains are wired in order to build families and society by mate guarding, and that is why we define love the way we do.

On the contrary, women are attracted to the apex of their hypergamy like magnets, and if you stay there for a long time, you could say that she "loves" you. But as soon as you fall off that apex, she wouldn't love you anymore. You're done.

The ONLY unconditional love we get is from our mothers. Or from a pet dog. As soon as you let go of expecting unconditional love from women, you free yourself from the blue-pill ideology and you gain more control over your life.

Post: #3

Hmm, so as long as you have a good status as a man you will have a women by your side that "loves" you, except what she is really attracted to is your power/status/ability to provide.

Ok I get that part, that much is evident as I have had girls attracted to me because of my popularity but as soon as I started to feel more for them and expected the same in return they backed off, with that being said I dont get why we think that way then, is it what society and our parents tell us?

It all seems like a big lie even though we see it all around us, women attracted to men for their status and money and not because they "love" him.

I swear the more I go through life while reading about the red pill and experiencing things first hand; all I can say is that everything the red pill says is true, at first its hard to accept certain things and you might feel a little messed up for looking at women in a certain light and question yourself for thinking that way but as you go through the experiences it all makes sense and its very freeing.

I admit I still struggle sometimes with wanting "true love" as people call it, when a man and a women love each other unconditionally no matter what but the more I see the less I believe in that, in fact its hard to see women in that light
anymore, I kinda just see women as pleasure and dont even take them serious anymore.

Post: #4

To quote LaidNYC:

Quote:Love

Love is a choice. There is a moment, or rather a series of moments, where you choose to love. You can choose to spend an extra night with her this week. You can choose to share your vulnerabilities and listen to her do the same. You choose to cancel other dates. You choose to trust. You make these choices enough times and gradually love builds. Love didn't just happen. You chose it.

You may be able to get sex every night of the week from a different girl but you can't find love every night of the week. Love is not like sex, it is far rarer, it takes far more time. It is scarce. Sure, there may be a girl with a nice ass in every bar in your city but finding one worthy of your time and emotions? Not quite so easy. Impossible, the jaded might say.

So love is living in scarcity. The girl who falls in mutual love with you is not easily replaceable. It would take time to build that with another girl.

That, the relationship experts will tell you, is bad. The one who has the most power is the one who needs the other one least. This is true. But the goal of making all relationships replaceable denies the human experience. You'll have all the power over relationships that don't matter at all. An autistic feels no love, is he then the most powerful man there is?

Alright, so girls don't love the way you were told they love. They're more opportunistic than Hollywood taught you. Their love for you is conditional. There are a ton of bad apples to sift through. The sum total of cautionary tales of men who have been burned by ill-fated trust can make you write the whole thing off as a sucker's game.

But it is only a man who has seen the sausage being made and witnessed the horror stories that dispel any notion of idealistic death-do-you-parts who can have any true appreciation for love. It is only after a man realizes love is actually highly conditional and opportunistic for both parties that he can free it from its unrealistic expectations. Only after you know it as something fleeting and elusive can you see the conditions that click it into place as a beautiful anomaly amidst a harsh unforgiving world.

So your brain is just tricking you because evo-biologically speaking love is two people of similar sexual market value chemically pair-bonding to ensure sufficient parental investment.

So?

Knowing that hunger is just a way for your body to get sufficient nutrients and energy does not make filet mignon any less succulent.

And yet it is the hedonist who often spurns love to instead embrace the free pursuit of new conquest. But any hedonist who willingly deprives himself of the deep, passionate pleasure of love is no hedonist at all. Sex on weed can make you feel tingly, but sex on love is something to which no drug, natural or synthesized, can compare.

Love is not marriage nor is marriage love. Love is not an endgame, it is not a contract, it is a beautiful thing to be experienced and enjoyed while it lasts, much like a sunset. It is not yours to capture and keep in a cage and the harder you try to do so the faster it fades.

So maybe today you leave your computer and make a human connection.

Maybe you meet a girl and take a leap.

Maybe love doesn't last forever.

But maybe that doesn't matter.

Post: #5

To quote Roissy:

Quote:No one goes on vacation thinking of the long ride home.

What is unique about love is that it alone among all the human desires defines by its absence the utterly meaningless life. With love, the poor person can feel rich as if the struggles of his survival were minor inconveniences. With love, the old person forgets his age. With love, the young person sheds his angst. A man can amass a kingdom’s fortune and an emperor’s power, but without love his worldly successes stand like hollow totems to unhappiness. What good is anything if it doesn’t ultimately reach a conclusion in love? The wealthy businessman who spends all his hours in his office and wastes his years whistling past the grave being too busy for love is a loser no less than the unloved degenerate street bum. Sushi tastes better than a 20 dollar bill.

The mischievous thing about love is that as vital as it is to a fulfilling stint in consciousness, it mocks its own importance with reminders that it rests precariously on a foundation of some very banal preconditions. People fall out of love and it is rarely for lofty reasons. A man loves a woman until she gains 50 pounds. A woman loves a man until he loses his job and goes unemployed for months on end. And when that pretty face turns ashen and carved with the years will it really be love anymore? Those crass attraction buttons still have to be pressed for love to appear and then to sustain itself. Self-delusion about the dirty business behind love is not only required, it’s inevitable. Why ruin the fun by obsessing over the dull ride home?

A lot of seducers mistakenly think that love is a garnish to the main course of pursuing and winning the hearts of women. They compartmentalize — it’s a bonus to feel love, but damned if they’ll let that get in the way of the good times. The worst thing to happen to a guy who gets ass regularly is not rejection (after all, rejection is the badge of honor worn by womanizers) but falling in one-sided love. Or, similarly, falling in love only to have his woman dump him. Getting dumped is part of the game, and can be expertly handled, especially if there are fallback options. But the alpha who succumbs to the folly of love opens himself up so completely that state control is no longer his prerogative. He risks everything, including his most cherished asset… his trust.

This is the wrong way of approaching relationships. It’s fine to be calculating about the pick up, and the dating, and even the relationship management, but attempting to corral as thermonuclear an emotion as love is only going to light the fuse on the bomb. I’ve seen many players sabotage their relationships with really great girls who had captured their hearts because they feared losing control under the chaos of being in love. They put all this effort into bedding her and making her fall for them that they lost sight of the main objective. A man can be all alpha but if he doesn’t cash it in for the ultimate prize he’s revealed the beta at his core.

I once lost a girl I loved. The rush of pain was so intense even a fight club pummeling couldn’t have distracted me from it. But I didn’t stoically shrug it off. I threw glasses at the wall. I broke things. I smashed up my apartment.

If you aren’t smashing stuff after losing a lover, you don’t know the pleasure of relinquishing everything for love.

Post: #6

Love is making permanent decisions based on temporary feelings.

Love is pleasure and pain at the same damn time.

Love is a Ying Yang type of relationship.

Love is an amazing feeling of exctasy that makes you delusional and out of touch with reality .

Love is what brings life into the world.

Love can raise your happiness to great heights, but also have it crashing deep into the ground.

Post: #7

Post: #8

I no longer believe in love.

Post: #9

(10-07-2015 12:33 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  Women cannot love men the way men WANT to be loved.

This is not to say women don't experience very strong feelings and show affection, but their brains are wired differently than our male brains. Love in women's minds is not the unconditional love we are taught to think it is. Men are the romantics, despite what the blue pill might tell you. Men's brains are wired in order to build families and society by mate guarding, and that is why we define love the way we do.

On the contrary, women are attracted to the apex of their hypergamy like magnets, and if you stay there for a long time, you could say that she "loves" you. But as soon as you fall off that apex, she wouldn't love you anymore. You're done.

The ONLY unconditional love we get is from our mothers. Or from a pet dog. As soon as you let go of expecting unconditional love from women, you free yourself from the blue-pill ideology and you gain more control over your life.

Bravo

Post: #10

(10-07-2015 12:55 PM)TheDuncan Wrote:  Hmm, so as long as you have a good status as a man you will have a women by your side that "loves" you, except what she is really attracted to is your power/status/ability to provide.

Ok I get that part, that much is evident as I have had girls attracted to me because of my popularity but as soon as I started to feel more for them and expected the same in return they backed off, with that being said I dont get why we think that way then, is it what society and our parents tell us?

It all seems like a big lie even though we see it all around us, women attracted to men for their status and money and not because they "love" him.

I swear the more I go through life while reading about the red pill and experiencing things first hand; all I can say is that everything the red pill says is true, at first its hard to accept certain things and you might feel a little messed up for looking at women in a certain light and question yourself for thinking that way but as you go through the experiences it all makes sense and its very freeing.

I admit I still struggle sometimes with wanting "true love" as people call it, when a man and a women love each other unconditionally no matter what but the more I see the less I believe in that, in fact its hard to see women in that light
anymore, I kinda just see women as pleasure and dont even take them serious anymore.

Girls "love" you the most when the give and take of the relationship is 80% them giving and wanting vs. your 20%.

This is why they back away because in your mind you are giving just a little, but to them you going from 80/20...even to 70/30 is going to be too much and makes them want to find a new guy that values them less.

"True love" to you is 50/50.

I think this can only happen realistically if she is below your league in looks by a fair amount for whatever the male/female looks standards are in the country you are in.

Post: #11

1. It's not about 'a feeling' (you don't have to always 'be in it' to love somebody)
2. It's a lot more practical than it sounds.
3. It's not about what you get out of it, but about what you're giving up (a lot)
4. It doesn't have to do anything with liking her (ie. you can love her even if you don't like her..ideally you should like her though)
5. It's only partly sexual, mostly not about that.

From what I've been able to gather, love is about how much you're willing to give of yourself. Energy, time, nerves, compassion, your future...
Until I found the girl who is now my wife I wasn't willing to give very much at all. Now I'm with somebody I want by my side for many years to come. If that's not love, I don't know what is.

Post: #12

(10-07-2015 12:33 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  As soon as you let go of expecting unconditional love from women, you free yourself from the blue-pill ideology and you gain more control over your life.

This solves many of the problems discussed on this forum.

Accept that women are what they are. They aren't evil but they aren't the altruistic princesses that western culture taught you they were either. They aren't going to be a source of unconditional love but that doesn't make them evil either.

And NYC or any large U.S. city is probably not a great place to find the future mother of your children.

Post: #13

As far as unconditional love I remember hearing a good speech or argument about how it doesn't exist, all love has conditions or someone "gets something" from every relationship. Once whatever they get ceases to be gotten they move on. I forget the exact argument and logic but even love between parents and child was transactional.

I definatly think things have changed over the years. Maybe we look at history with rose colored glasses but you hear about stories from the past where someone dies and wives mourn for months or years, where as today for example I can remember an incident at a buddys house where this girl who's husband was dying from cancer was blowing someone in the bathroom in his basement. People dont have the loyalty and love they did in the past.


Even just looking back at our parents generation I feel like people combined finances, divorice wasn't as prevelant, etc. These days it seems like relationships and people have changed there's no loyalty, everyones a whore, etc. I don't think I would ever combine or share finances in a marriage, I'm very hesitant to get married or have a kid and get tied down to someone as up until now every relationship I've had has ended and I see how nasty women can be afterwardds.

As far as love I have a chick now who's a down ass chick, who woudln't cheat, who I think will always be there for me. That said the sex life has gone downhill. I find myself wondering whether its worth keeping a rare good chick around or whether its more fun to play the field and have fun and have good sex but not have a down chick.

Post: #14

https://youtu.be/ofhmTOBhS7Y

Post: #15

(10-07-2015 12:33 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  Women cannot love men the way men WANT to be loved.

This is not to say women don't experience very strong feelings and show affection, but their brains are wired differently than our male brains. Love in women's minds is not the unconditional love we are taught to think it is. Men are the romantics, despite what the blue pill might tell you. Men's brains are wired in order to build families and society by mate guarding, and that is why we define love the way we do.

On the contrary, women are attracted to the apex of their hypergamy like magnets, and if you stay there for a long time, you could say that she "loves" you. But as soon as you fall off that apex, she wouldn't love you anymore. You're done.

The ONLY unconditional love we get is from our mothers. Or from a pet dog. As soon as you let go of expecting unconditional love from women, you free yourself from the blue-pill ideology and you gain more control over your life.

Spot on.

They don't love the core of who you are as a person, sad to say.

Women love the gina tingles you give them.

They love the status you have and the aura of that status that they get to bask in.

They love the feeling of safety and security you, as an alpha male, provide them, whether it be as a boyfriend or husband over the family.

They love being directed, managed, lead and corrected when they get out of line. They love the way that makes them feel.

They love your unpredictable, uncontrollable nature and the way you take no shit from them and, with humor and amused mastery, throw it back at them.

In short, they love the way a player , aka alpha male, makes them feel.

If you stop giving them or have an inability to provide at least one or two, but preferably most of these things, they'll either find a guy who will or they never "loved" you in the first place.

Post: #16

Love is tough, trust no bitch even when you're in love. Some say that in order to love someone you have to trust them but that is usually the precise time for getting fucked over

Post: #17

Love for men is idealistic in their minds. The true romantics from the beginning of time have been men, not women, wrap your head around that then read on.....

Love for women is conditional. Yup, ever hear a women spout the words "I don't judge," or "my love is unconditional." That's total bullshit, they're perfectly the opposite. They're pandering to your wants when spouting those lies, playing you.

Now here is where some men will argue that a woman's love for her children is unconditional. I might agree with that to the extent of "young" kids, like adolescent (<13ish). But if you really dissect every last word, mannerism, action of "today's westernized mom," you'll find that even their love for their own kids changes at some point, and becomes more conditional. Granted a death, or major sickness of a child at any age might seem to reveal there was no conditionality, but in practice there almost always is. After 18, your problems are their inconveniences.

This was one of top 1-2 truths i discovered about women in the past 3 years reading this site, and comparing others' findings to my own life experiences.

As i once heard it put by a very wise mother in her 70s - "What Kevin doesn't understand (her own son re. how he handles his grandson's destructive life), is that you never get to quit being a parent. A child is your responsibility in some form until the day you die, if you're parenting like a noble person."

Post: #18

^^ In more simple terms, the "utility" you provide a woman gives her reason to conditionally love you as long as that utility remains. On separate occasions with different women I've heard these three statements:
"I love you, you make me feel so safe."
"I love you, you're such a good provider."
"I love you, you're such a great lover."

So basically, they'll love you for one of three main reasons; security, provisions, or sex. The more reasons, the more conditional love you get. Sad but true.

Post: #19

(10-07-2015 12:33 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  The ONLY unconditional love we get is from our mothers.

Post: #20

Men fall in love through the eyes, women fall in love through the ears.

Post: #21

To use a friend's words, I believe that you should not love a woman because of how you feel about her, but because of how she makes you feel about yourself.

G

Post: #22

There is a discussion on this subject between pre-ban cardguy and me, starting from this post and continuing for a few posts downthread. I'll quote below the two posts that express my view:

(12-29-2013 12:37 AM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  cardguy,

I think your remark is about more than just marriage. It is about erotic love in the sense of "being in love". I take your remark seriously.

I agree with you that erotic love is greatly overvalued as an ideal and has been for a long time.

I also agree that this ideal has been invoked too often to blind men to the nature of women, and to make fools and white-knights of them.

Nevertheless, erotic love is real. It exists and it can have great and even terrible power. It may be unwise to wish for it and more unwise to follow it, but its hold on men and women cannot be denied. It is not something that was invented 500 years ago or 1000 years ago, and it is not merely the figment of an ideology.

There is no need to overvalue passionate love, and it is in any case something that does not happen very often -- which is fine. But neither is it something to be denied. It is just one of the facts of life.

(12-29-2013 12:51 AM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  The phrase "believe in love" can mean a number of different things.

Do I believe that there is such a thing, that it exists? Yes. I know that it does.

Do I believe that love, in the sense of passionate erotic love, is the greatest ideal, the most important thing to wish for in a life? No.

Do I believe that someone hasn't lived if they haven't experienced this kind of love? No.

Do I believe that it is necessary to be "in love" to marry someone and have a long and successful marriage? No, I know it isn't. Some of the best marriages of all are ones in which the husband and wife learn to love each other over time in a way that is entirely different from the kind of love we are talking about here.

So I "believe in love" in the sense that I acknowledge its (occasional) existence and its (terrible) power. I do not believe in it as the sanctified and absolute ideal that it is often held to be.

And I think that many intelligent men ruin their lives by believing that their best and deepest experience of life must be the experience of romantic love.

Post: #23

What's that famous quote from Devil's Advocate?

Kevin Lomax: What about love?
John Milton: Overrated. Biochemically no different than eating large quantities of chocolate.

Post: #24

I was in love once as a younger man. It was awesome until she decided to cheat and lie. That wasn't so awesome. How are you going to tell me you love me while taking another man's dick?

Anyway, fuck love.

Post: #25

I was once told by a woman that I am "in love with love".

It's a powerful drug. To someone with an addict's mind like myself, it can be irresistible.

Oz's quotes above are pure gold. Placing too much importance of experiencing the romantic love can lead men into making disastrous choices. Think Helen of Troy, and men going to war over her.

Furthermore, I respectfully disagree with the commonly shared notion that women cannot love, or that their love is 100% opportunistic. While they may not love the same way we do - they are a different animal, after all - you'll have heard about some who've never gotten past their "one true" lover. Alpha widows, is it?

One thing I tell myself every time is, choose carefuly whom you decide to love. Love inevitably leads to losing a level of control, and you don't want to do that with someone you can't trust.