Post: #1

Sup playas,

I'm entering my fourth month in china and I find myself constantly angry and sullen. I just feel so much antipathy for the people here--but I know I'm being irrational. I've talked with other people about this and they all tell me it's natural and that it will either pass or I'll get the fuck out of china before anything drastic happens.

How do you guys deals who have lived abroad for months on end cope with the first few months in any locale? I just find myself oscillating between anger, awe, disgust and amusement.

Post: #2

Couple of ideas:

* get a wingman;
* listen to music on the phone while out;
* speaking the local language goes a long way

Post: #3

What is there to be angry about? Do you just get angry at the way people do things differently?

Post: #4

What is the reason you are feeling those things??

I think that feeling of wanderlust often times isn't discussed here or really on any travel website . I always see people online (mostly from people with low income) who say how much the USA sucks and it's xyz however aside from the women in the USA almost everything here is better then most other countries. Especially if you are making a good income.

Moving to any other country and thinking it will be better/easier then your home country is a mistake that I don't think many people here acknowledge.

My cousin just moved to my city and is 32 and newly married to a foreigner(who has no plans to work). They are living in a crappy studio apartment and he hasn't gotten a job in 3 months and doesn't even have a career type documented work history(he mostly did retail in his 20s and was an English teacher abroad...) so he has an uphill battle and yet he tells me with sincere enthusiasm he wants to live in France and Germany within 5-6 years... I just laugh and tell him he's an idiot and he just gets mad at ME for giving him the real talks.

Post: #5

(08-28-2015 10:26 AM)Fortis Wrote:  Sup playas,

I'm entering my fourth month in china and I find myself constantly angry and sullen. I just feel so much antipathy for the people here--but I know I'm being irrational. I've talked with other people about this and they all tell me it's natural and that it will either pass or I'll get the fuck out of china before anything drastic happens.

How do you guys deals who have lived abroad for months on end cope with the first few months in any locale? I just find myself oscillating between anger, awe, disgust and amusement.

You need to hit the gym. It will calm you down quite a bit. Make sure you're getting enough sleep as well. After some time the culture shock will leave and then you will get reverse culture shock when you go back home. heh

Post: #6

(08-28-2015 12:34 PM)AvidArtisan Wrote:  My cousin just moved to my city and is 32 and newly married to a foreigner(who has no plans to work). They are living in a crappy studio apartment and he hasn't gotten a job in 3 months and doesn't even have a career type documented work history(he mostly did retail in his 20s and was an English teacher abroad...) so he has an uphill battle and yet he tells me with sincere enthusiasm he wants to live in France and Germany within 5-6 years... I just laugh and tell him he's an idiot and he just gets mad at ME for giving him the real talks.

Shouldn't be too hard, all he has to do is tear up his papers and claim to be a refugee, if he can string together some Arabic he's golden.

Post: #7

I've never lived in a predominately Asian country but just the thought of having access to so many young Asian women:





would more than likely keep my spirits up regardless of whatever culture shock/xenophobia I may encounter.

Post: #8

Google "culture shock."
In basic terms, what you're experiencing is normal. You go through stages, the excitement of the newness at first,the frustration of things being very different, of cultural differences seeming "stupid" and finally you get to some equilibrium of knowing that some things are better there, some worse, and like everything in life there are tradeoffs. Eventually, you learn to cope with the challenges of the new place, just like "home" seemed better than it wouldseem to a foreigner because you knew how to deal with the frustrations of bureaucracy, society, business, traffic congestion etc.

Post: #9

(08-28-2015 10:26 AM)Fortis Wrote:  Sup playas,

I'm entering my fourth month in china and I find myself constantly angry and sullen. I just feel so much antipathy for the people here--but I know I'm being irrational. I've talked with other people about this and they all tell me it's natural and that it will either pass or I'll get the fuck out of china before anything drastic happens.

How do you guys deals who have lived abroad for months on end cope with the first few months in any locale? I just find myself oscillating between anger, awe, disgust and amusement.

Are there specific things that you are upset about or everything in general?

Post: #10

There's an interesting mind experiment you can do that may help dramatically.

Here's a relevant story about how this was invented:

In the early 1900s a lost tribe was discovered deep in the jungles of some pacific island. A Doctor decided to do everything he could to learn their language and bring Christianity to them. No one so far had been able to decipher their unusual language which consisted of unusual sounds, clicks, grunts and sign language. He lived with them for months, becoming increasingly frustrated with only being albe to learn a few words.

Then, one day, he decided to go with a group of the men on a hunt in the forest. He accompanied them with the mindset of a child going along with experts. He observed how they communicated with each other, coordinated the pursuit of their quarry and ultimately the kill. He was in awe of the inherent wisdom and genius of their communication on the hunt. He picked up many insights during that excursion to hunt for the night's dinner.

He realized that he had been approaching the stay and his time observing this tribe the same way a scientist would observe a pack of animals or even an ant colony. He was , in his mind, the superior scientist studying the curious ways of a primitive people. A people much more different and primitive than him. He was, not consciously, but unconsciously, carrying an arrogance and type of bias with him. An arrogance and bias based on the fact that he was from the civilized world and he was essentially living amongst savages. Surely, his ways were better, much much better than theirs. So, while not outwardly arrogant, he realized his mind was operating on this level in some way which was prohibiting him from truly observing, from taking the mindset of a true student. A student with an open mind. A mind that, may even be filled with awe and wonder the way a child's mind is.

From that point on, he vowed that he would approach his stay with them with the mindset of an apprentice. An apprentice who is ignorant and knows nothing but with an open mind ready to soak it up. An apprentice who is eager to learn the ways of the master. He viewed the peoples of the the tribe as the masters and teachers who held the knowledge of what he desired.

After this mind shift, he was able to rapidly learn how the tribe communicated. He learned their language and all the words comprising it. He cracked the code of the mystery of the this tribe's language by submitting to the role of the apprentice and letting go of his biases, feelings of superiority that he had taken with him from his home country. He was a curious apprentice learning as much as he could, asking questions and following the "masters"

I'm not saying that you're arrogant or feeling superior, nor am I suggesting the Chinese are on par with a savage tribe living in a jungle. However, the paradigm may be the same.

Perhaps you're carrying the thoughts, subconsciously or other, of the way you lived life in your home country. Of the way that your ways, traditions and habits of doing things, are better than these foreigners who do things in a seemingly odd way. Perhaps this, over time, creates resentment or anger of some sort.


Try to consciously "call yourself" if you catch yourself doing this. Instead, perhaps you could befriend or align yourself with a group of indigenous people there ( make some friends ) and start doing things with them. Be like a curious apprentice who knows nothing.

Abandon all pre conceived prejudices, judgements or knowledge about how the western way of doing things is better. Pretend your mind is a blank slate eager to learn the unique ways this people do what they do. Ask questions. Ask why it is done that way and how it came to be. Learn. Be amazed. Be the apprentice. Learn from the 'masters'.

If you do, then you can become a master. A master of this culture, their language and their way of life.

I know it's easier said than done, but a mind shift like this could be helpful in overcoming culture shock and the potentially the bad things it brings.

Post: #11

Hmm I don't know if the culture shock is the problem per se. It might just be China. Not sure how many of the people who've replied have been to China but it's quite special in a short bus kind of way. A friend of mine that lived in China for 8 years once told me the same thing your friend told you; you either learn to shut your feelings/brain off or you leave. When I visited, I found every day to be a struggle to not commit mass murder.

I don't know you personally OP but I believe if you're the type of person to value things like common courtesy, personal space, and basic manners China will drive you into fits of rage. I'm pretty well traveled but I've never had as many thoughts of committing acts of violence as I did when I was in China. I could literally write a book about the reasons how China and the Chinese people pissed me off but that doesn't really help anyone. Also it goes without saying that I'm speaking in general and there are always exceptions. I don't know the details of why you're in China but I'm sure there is a reason why you're staying after all the negative emotions you're feeling. With that said, I would say just try and come to terms with being there. If you have to be there a year then just realize, 'yeah it sucks, but I'm here for reason A so I'll think of it as another one of the many bs things in life that I have to put up with'.

Like a job, there's so many bullshit factors we put up with because we need money to buy/do what we want. Traveling and living in different countries is not a experiment to see how tolerant and understanding we can be of other cultures but it's for pleasure. We do it because we enjoy it, not to prove to anyone that we are worldly. You don't like the culture? Meh, chalk it up as a loss and finish out your time there, then run as fast as you can to the nearest airport. In conclusion OP if you're in China for a specific reason/goal just keep that goal in mind and know that there is a finish line, unless you're writing us from a Chinese prison, thinking of why you're there and what you hope to accomplish should provide a good enough carrot for you to grin and bear it. Also props to you OP, because I don't think I could live in China for an extended period of time.

Post: #12

Fortis - It could be that China just isn’t “right” for you… It could be something as simple as you being located in the wrong part of the city and you don’t get the right experience or your personality doesn’t vibe with China.

I was born and raised in UK and I moved to downtown Los Angeles, near MacArthur Park and the area was a shithole back then. London was the city that I was used to and LA didn’t compare in my opinion. I also had no car back then and the public transport in LA is terrible. Once I bought a car things got a lot better. I like LA now and I would miss it if I left. However, people who know me well tell me that my personality is way more NYC than LA…maybe one day I will move to NYC for the experience.

I don’t know how easy it is for you but if I was in your shoes I would try to make local friends and see where it goes from there. Easier said than done though – that’s hard in Los Angeles, let alone China.

Give it a few more months and if things don’t get better I think you should leave. China may not be for you.

Robreke – I get what youre saying there but sometimes once you learn about a culture you may end up disliking it even more. I have very negative feelings towards many aspects of Indian culture and I know the culture very well.

If you think China is stressful India is worse. It’s hotter, dirtier and there’s way less chance of getting laid there. You’ll hear about many US or Canadians raised of Chinese descent moving to China for a couple of years, but when’s the last time you heard of an Indian from the west moving to India? It’s VERY rare.

Post: #13

(08-28-2015 07:27 PM)WalterBlack Wrote:  Fortis - It could be that China just isn’t “right” for you… It could be something as simple as you being located in the wrong part of the city and you don’t get the right experience or your personality doesn’t vibe with China.

Four months isn't really enough to know if the culture is a bad fit for you. You really don't know until after the culture shock subsides which can take up to a year. Typically, after a year I would say it wasn't a right fit if he continued to feel that way.

Post: #14

I think we all get "the rage" to some degree. I have traveled a lot , but I still usually get frustrated with women, the first 10 days I am in a new city.
Getting used to Colombian woman after being in Ukraine, is not easy. And vice versa. The more you travel the more you see how flawed is woman.

Post: #15

(08-28-2015 07:48 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  Four months isn't really enough to know if the culture is a bad fit for you. You really don't know until after the culture shock subsides which can take up to a year. Typically, after a year I would say it wasn't a right fit if he continued to feel that way.

True, four months is about the point at which annoying things tend to get intolerably so, and it's hard to focus on anything else. Culture shock of this sort is very difficult to avoid by that time, especially a culture as different and uncompromising as China. I'd say if you're still feeling this way 2-3 months from now, it's time to start looking elsewhere...if you want to head out before then no one can hold it against you, though.

By the way, I've heard of a lot of people having this reaction when they live in China. I've never been there, but what you're experiencing seems rather normal. Hopefully you can take it in stride and focus on the things you enjoy while you're there.

Post: #16

I'll leave a more thorough reply later, but like one of the posters said already, if you haven't been to china the you have NO clue. I don't say that in a condescending way but it is very true.

Post: #17

(08-28-2015 01:41 PM)the high Wrote:  I've never lived in a predominately Asian country but just the thought of having access to so many young Asian women:





would more than likely keep my spirits up regardless of whatever culture shock/xenophobia I may encounter.

Yep, but that will only last for so long...about 5 years and 200 girls

Post: #18

I'm finding a few factors here to be aggravating.

The maturity level of the women here is astoundingly low. I feel like I'm dealing with teenagers but I'm making the proper adjustments to my game to compensate. I'm learning to keep my expectations in check because I've been here 3 months going on 4 so it is what it is.

Truthfully, the only time the language barrier bothers me is when I'm talking to girls, otherwise I don't particularly care. I have some local friends So I don't mean to give you the impression that I'm sitting in my apartment depressed and doing nothing. Last night, the owner of my local cafe served me free beer and dinner just because she likes me so much. I'm being serious. The clerk at the cafe just sent me a text telling me I left a few items at the shop and that he will store them for me until I'm able to pick them up. This leads me to my next point.

The people here are unusually nice in some ways and total assholes in other ways. I'm experience major cognitive dissonance because I feel like there is a real tradition of generosity and friendliness that's disarming but on the other hand a huge portion of the population act like debased animals: they spit everywhere, shit everywhere, smoke everywhere and generally don't give a fuck about anything or anyone but themselves. There is a real sense of greed and gluttony here that I have never seen before. People will fuck you over for the smallest shit. It's so shortsighted.

I'm having a really hard time reconciling this behavior with how generous the people can be at the same time. I generally chalk it up to people being people but somedays I'm like "fuck all these guys."


I can't afford the gym right now and may actually not get a gym membership because in china they want you to pay 1 year upfront and that is cost prohibitive for me, especially since I'm only teaching here for one year. I've been going to the park and doing sprints, dips, pull ups, chin ups, squats and other things about three days a week. I may start doing more days of exercise once I'm better acclimated to china. I will say that exercising outdoors is fun as hell.

I was talking with jetlagged about my experiences. He and I talk a fair bit. He thinks I need to chill out and find a hobby or two in my spare time. Another expat who had been here for 5 years told me to find something about china that I enjoy and immerse myself In that while avoiding the other shit.

I've been finding it hard to make consistent friendships with other expats because my schedule had me working full 8 hour days on the weekends so I've been spending a fair bit of my free time alone but I have been studying more Chinese so everything works in that regard.

Robreke, good advice. Not sure how applicable it is to being in china, but I will keep it I'm mind.

As far as the ladies go, it can be a little frustrating but I'm working on keeping shit in perspective. I've gotten 1.5 bangs since June. Not bad for a guy who doesn't speak chinese. I'll be exploring the night environment in nanshan soon too. The major night gsme area is too far from me. About 40 minutes by taxi but There is a solid night game area called sea world that i haven't had the opportunity to visit much since getting here. It is only a few metro exits away though so at I rides back won't be as bad.

Post: #19

^^ that's just how the Chinese are and have always been. They drive other Asians up the wall too, mate.

Post: #20

(08-28-2015 09:00 PM)Fortis Wrote:  I'll leave a more thorough reply later, but like one of the posters said already, if you haven't been to china the you have NO clue. I don't say that in a condescending way but it is very true.

I'm sure you want to believe this is something special because it's China, but it isn't. You should take a trip to India mate.

Post: #21

I didn't mean to sound condescending, so I apologize if I am coming across that way.

Post: #22

@Fortis, you can afford the gym.

Find a Chinese blue-collar chain and you'll pay 1000 RMB or less for the year.

I don't know Shenzhen too well, but there must be one nearby to you. Just go onto Baidu Maps and type in 健身房 and go in and bargain hard.

Post: #23

(08-28-2015 11:47 PM)Fortis Wrote:  I didn't mean to sound condescending, so I apologize if I am coming across that way.

No worries man. The main thing I am trying to get across is this is normal and it doesn't last forever. That doesn't mean you will fall in love with China within the year. You will just stop focusing totally on the bad shit and start enjoying to good stuff.

It just takes time to get settled. The honeymoon phase is over. heh

Post: #24

I guess you must not like Asian girls that much. Otherwise, I can't imagine being exasperated with life in China to the extent that you're indicating. I lived in Shanghai for almost a year straight out of college and this is basically how my mindset was the entire time:

(substitute Azns for drugs)




Nah, but in all seriousness, living in China is pretty pointless unless you have a strong thirst for the women. I'm sure this goes double in a city like Shenzhen where there are fewer opportunities to be engaged in various activities than in more international cities like Shanghai or Beijing.

With that said, if you do like the girls (and they don't hate your guts), living in China is a fucking blast. Sure, they certainly do things differently over there and some of those things are frustrating. It gets old when people barge in front of you in line or taxis pass you by to pick up the Chinese guy a block down the street. But it's just the price of doing business.

Realize this: at the end of the day, you're waiting 10 extra minutes for a taxi, but you're also banging multiple young cuties in a country with a terrible gender ratio where dudes are killing themselves to own a house just to get laid, and making 5-10 times the money that a Chinese college grad makes just for blabbing around in you native tongue. And this is as someone on the very bottom of the expat pyramid, the despised English teacher. If you can climb past that level and become a reputable professional at a brand-name corporation, it's a whole 'nother life.

Anyway, enough with the abstract bullshit. I think what you need to do is make some solid friends with people in your own age group and who have similar goals. You're not going to be happy rolling solo in Shenzhen, nor with wasting your time with 35 year old, beta English teacher lifers. It's absolutely key to find at least 1 dude that you can connect with and have a blast just shooting the shit over beers, even better if he's a poon hound like ourselves.

My first 2 or 3 months in China were more or less miserable (on a personal level, not because of frustration with the country) because I had no one to hang with. Once I fortuitously met some guys who were cool, it was like night and day. Now that I'm about to make a return to Shanghai in a matter of a couple weeks, I know my first priority will be finding an apartment with roommates who I think I can hit it off with as a first step, then growing my circle of friends further via signing up for sports, joining an MMA gym, etc. I would suggest you try to do the same. As long as you're generally having fun, the annoying idiosyncrasies of living in China sort of just fade into the background. They're still there of course and you have to deal with them, but they are nowhere near prominent enough to affect your general state of mind.

Post: #25

(08-29-2015 01:15 AM)Fast Eddie Wrote:  I guess you must not like Asian girls that much. Otherwise, I can't imagine being exasperated with life in China to the extent that you're indicating. I lived in Shanghai for almost a year straight out of college and this is basically how my mindset was the entire time:

(substitute Azns for drugs)




Nah, but in all seriousness, living in China is pretty pointless unless you have a strong thirst for the women. I'm sure this goes double in a city like Shenzhen where there are fewer opportunities to be engaged in various activities than in more international cities like Shanghai or Beijing.

With that said, if you do like the girls (and they don't hate your guts), living in China is a fucking blast. Sure, they certainly do things differently over there and some of those things are frustrating. It gets old when people barge in front of you in line or taxis pass you by to pick up the Chinese guy a block down the street. But it's just the price of doing business.

Realize this: at the end of the day, you're waiting 10 extra minutes for a taxi, but you're also banging multiple young cuties in a country with a terrible gender ratio where dudes are killing themselves to own a house just to get laid, and making 5-10 times the money that a Chinese college grad makes just for blabbing around in you native tongue. And this is as someone on the very bottom of the expat pyramid, the despised English teacher. If you can climb past that level and become a reputable professional at a brand-name corporation, it's a whole 'nother life.

Anyway, enough with the abstract bullshit. I think what you need to do is make some solid friends with people in your own age group and who have similar goals. You're not going to be happy rolling solo in Shenzhen, nor with wasting your time with 35 year old, beta English teacher lifers. It's absolutely key to find at least 1 dude that you can connect with and have a blast just shooting the shit over beers, even better if he's a poon hound like ourselves.

My first 2 or 3 months in China were more or less miserable (on a personal level, not because of frustration with the country) because I had no one to hang with. Once I fortuitously met some guys who were cool, it was like night and day. Now that I'm about to make a return to Shanghai in a matter of a couple weeks, I know my first priority will be finding an apartment with roommates who I think I can hit it off with as a first step, then growing my circle of friends further via signing up for sports, joining an MMA gym, etc. I would suggest you try to do the same. As long as you're generally having fun, the annoying idiosyncrasies of living in China sort of just fade into the background. They're still there of course and you have to deal with them, but they are nowhere near prominent enough to affect your general state of mind.