Post: #1

Allow me a more serious thread, gents.

There's a thread on here by Lucky where he summarizes and reviews a book by Susan Cain called "Quiet: The Power of Introverts in a World That Can't Stop Talking."

One of the pieces of advice in the book that has nothing to do with introversion and has been very helpful in deciding a career path was to ask yourself who you envy.

Susan Cain Wrote:Pay attention to what you envy. Jealousy tells the truth. Who do you envy? That will tell you something about what you want to do.

This was illuminating because I didn't envy anyone in my previous line of work. Travesty444 remarked that that helped him on his game path even before finding the RVF. I asked him what he envied exactly, and he shared a great response.

So I'd like to extend this question to the forum. Yes I envy Leo DiCaprio because he walks out of a club with 100 bitches. But realistically, I envy a few normal people too. When I really thought about it, the patterns I saw were unexpected.

1. I envy my dentist. Not necessarily for the job he does, but his demeanor while performing it. He talks smack with his patients and generally just has fun on the job. It doesn't matter if he's cleaning teeth, the dude is just happy looking at mouths all day and telling me about his trips to Dubai with his wife. Although #TagYourSponsor has me seeing those stories in a different light...

2. I envy only one of my indirect mentors. She's a pretty unique person and has been able to force her own worldview to create a job of her own, so to speak. Very determined yet enviable work-life balance, and sees humor where a lot of people in her field don't.

3. I envy one of my best buddies, because his conversational ability is, without exaggeration, world class. He makes people feel at ease.

4. I envy a professor I would play pickup 5-on-5 basketball every Tuesday and Thursday for a while. This guy is studying interesting shit, went to a no-name undergrad and a no-name grad school, then paid his dues at top notch places after and eventually landed got recruited to a world-class university as a tenured professor. Yet, he manipulates his schedule such that meetings are on off days so he can hang out with the guys and play pickup midday Tuesdays and Thursdays. This guy gets it.

5. I envy my dad. He made some mistakes and got a bitch pregnant when he was 18. From then on his life changed and made it a priority to make bank for his kids, which ended up being 5 in all. Somehow, he was able to find a well-paying 9-to-5 and was able to take my thoroughly athletically average-ass to basketball practices when I was growing up, giving me a leg up, physically, on the majority of people I know.

The pattern that most jumps out at me is that I envy personality traits more than job hookups overall. I envy balance. It almost doesn't matter what the hell a person does as long as their outlook and disposition are fun.

Who do you envy?

Post: #2

Post: #3

(05-16-2015 04:21 PM)Kamikaze Wrote:  Who do you envy?

'Quiet' is an interesting book for us introverts, but I disagreed with her on this point.

Envy is traditionally-associated with the female. Discard it, as it's negative framing.

What you should be asking is: what can I observe in others that I respect enough to want to emulate?

Feeling genuine respect for them, rather than envy, creates a positive feedback loop, and, if the guys are good mentors, it will be noted by them.

Post: #4

Envy is often emotional, and almost never constant (today you envy this, tomorrow you envy that). It's similar to that of a child who wants a different toy every day they go into a shop. Basing your life on such a transient emotion is a recipe for disaster.

Post: #5

I don't mean to knit-pick, but I think the OP is referring to jealousy.

Jealousy is when you desire what the other person has. This is normal.

Envy is when you don't desire it for yourself, but don't want the other to have it for themselves. This is not good and why it's considered to be one of the seven deadly sins.

Post: #6

I don't really feel much in the way of envy or jealousy. Not to brag, but I'm really just not giving a fuck about most people. When someone tells me they have something great going on in their lives I am happy for them, not sad or angry because I don't have it. Just the way I'm wired.

Post: #7

Nice points. 'Envy' carries a negative connotation. The people I listed aren't people I feel ill-will towards, they are traits I respect. So yea, semantically, envy is not a trait you want to base your life off of. But respect, fo sho.

The point is to find underlying themes in the traits of people you admire, respect, or envy, whatever words are applicable. Finding those patterns has been a helpful exercise, for me at least.

It reminds me of Chris Rock:

Rock Wrote:You get any two girlfriends in this room, been girlfriends for 25 years, you put a man in between them, "Fuck that bitch," "Fuck that bitch." Guys are not like that. Guys actually think that there are other fish in the sea, and if a guy introduces his boy to his new girlfriend, and when they walk away, his boy goes, "Aww man, she's nice, I gotta get me a girl LIKE that." If a woman introduces her new man to her girlfriend, and they walk away, her girlfriend goes "I gotta get HIM, and I will slit that bitch's throat to do it." Every girl in here got a girlfriend they don't trust around their man.

I won't be taking swings with a baseball bat at anyone's knees anytime soon because I 'envy' them. Semantically envy is not respect, but... you know what I mean.

Post: #8

People with close-knit, warm families.

People with 20/20 vision.

Dudes with a full head of hair well into their 40s and 50s (fuck you, Richard Gere)

Post: #9

JJ Roberts

Post: #10

(05-16-2015 06:17 PM)scotian Wrote:  JJ Roberts

Post: #11

(05-16-2015 06:03 PM)Onto Wrote:  I don't mean to knit-pick, but I think the OP is referring to jealousy.

Jealousy is when you desire what the other person has. This is normal.

Envy is when you don't desire it for yourself, but don't want the other to have it for themselves. This is not good and why it's considered to be one of the seven deadly sins.

Jealousy and envy have gotten confused over the last 100 years. Jealousy used to be about perceiving a threat to losing something of value, most commonly, a romantic partner, but this could also be status or attention. As such, it's based on insecurity and is a common feminine trait.

Envy is about coveting what others have, to the extent your happiness can be increased by seeing the thing you desire so much taken away from them. "If I can't have, then no-one can have it." This is every woman I've ever known.

I just bought a copy of The Divine Comedy this morning. Note this:

Quote:In Dante's Purgatory, the punishment for the envious is to have their eyes sewn shut with wire because they have gained sinful pleasure from seeing others brought low.

Envy is how every progressive SJW operates against good men.

I wouldn't expect a female writer to understand the difference. Either way, negative emotions. Be genuinely-happy for the successes and superiorities of those around you, and you will be an immensely-likable person.

Post: #12

Honestly, right now, I'm only envious of one man.

Gavin Mcinnes. I would love to get up on Fox News, suited up, and lay down some truth. That looked supremely satisfying.

People always accuse Roosh and others of being bitter or whatever, but once you become comfortable in your own skin, it makes life more enjoyable because you lose a lot of the fear you used to have.

Post: #13

I respect my father for loving me yet 'administering' discipline when it was necessary.

My girlfriend's grandfather is right up there too except he disciplines her (as opposed to me; we're mates) when she's 'overly modern' in his presence.

Oh yes, I'm so privileged you literally can't even.
Interested in joining the FFL? I tried (and failed).

Post: #14

It's a not a person, but I envy, maybe not envy, but would love to be/have been the good looking, star athlete at any big suburban high school.

The amount of tail and quality of said poon these guys have access too is astonishing.

Post: #15

(05-16-2015 05:52 PM)Roosh Wrote:  Envy is often emotional, and almost never constant (today you envy this, tomorrow you envy that). It's similar to that of a child who wants a different toy every day they go into a shop. Basing your life on such a transient emotion is a recipe for disaster.

Of course, but we're all human; who among us hasn't, at least sometimes, felt the slight sting of envy on the back of their necks?

Here is who I DON'T envy...

- Guys married 'perfect' women in the west - perfect maybe now, give it 5-10 years.
- Guys who make bank but do so because they work 70 hours a week. Nice BMW, I'll take my freedom, thank you.
- Women who get all the bounces and favors from academia and their employers. When you're 30 and unmarried and childless, it's all gonna crash down.


I don't envy guys who 'pull mad bitches' because there have been times when I myself have been that guy and yes, it's definitely fun having 4-5 'regulars' on call and being able to pick and choose who I want to fuck, I also know that to do so requires a fuckton of work, some of the girls will likely be of questionable appearance (while I believe it is possible to fuck only at least cute girls if you're willing to get laid less and adhere to your standards - there's no such thing as a guy who exclusively fucks extremely attractive women - any guy with a high count, myself included...there are some very very nice ones but there's also some regrettable ones in there too) and there's a lot that goes down behind the scenes that you just don't see - a main girl you care about to a reasonable degree + 1-2 occasional, 'every few weeks' fuckbuddies (all 7 and up on the classic scale) is enough for me.

I also don't envy those who work like dogs and make six figures but are stuck in the west, if anything they should envy me.

There are also people out there that strive to create envy in you - again, almost always guys that profess to 'pull mad bitches' - these people are doing so out of a desire for validation and respect because secretly they know they have nothing to offer. People like this have nothing interesting to say, are incapable of being discreet and will (blatantly or indirectly) cockblock you and are to be avoided.

==

To finally answer the question, who do I (at times) envy? Guys around my age (early 30's) who have it figured out (red-pill), have it together (solid bankroll and game) and have their freedom and their souls intact (out of the west).

Post: #16

We only have a very limited time in this life, and none of it should be wasted on envy.

Post: #17

There is a 50 yold guy I see regularly and his late 30 wife has a better body than the average 18 here in oz. She is feminine, long hair, friendly (from eastern Europe of course and he got her very young).... I'm enviously player hating on him like Silky Johnson..."I thank God for giving you all so very much, and me so very little "

Post: #18

Who do I envy?

Future me.

Post: #19

I've never felt a strong sense of envy or jealousy. Rather I think "I want that, what does it take to get that? Is it worth it?".

Post: #20

I envy no one.

There are a few I look up to but that's very different, such as Elon Musk because he sets a great example.

Post: #21

Envy and jealousy are dangerous as they lead to a hater-type mindset. Learning to respect those who have accomplishments and learning from them is the way to go.

Post: #22

As someone else already said it's all basically opportunity cost.

What does it take or what are you giving up to achieve your result?


Envy is wishing you had something and are jealously inclined because you have poor emotional control.

Post: #23

Bilzerian. What's he got that I don't have?

Post: #24

Christiano Ronaldo.

At that level, you don't actually have to open or approach anyone. Apparently he just tells a friend which girl he likes (which often includes celebrity models) and they bring them to him. Basically 'point and fuck'. Fortunately Ronaldos make up the tiniest fraction of the male population. I don't need to beat him, I just need to beat 95% (or be working towards that) to be happy.

Post: #25

Honestly, I envy people with moderation. I'm an all or nothing type of guy. While that gives me an advantage in many areas, the day to day grind can kill me at times. When drinking, I almost always black out. When working, I can let 12 hours go by in order to solve a problem. Sometimes my own intensity gets the best of me. I feel that this personality will continually make me successful, but I wish I had a button to press to turn me into a moderate guy. My brother is super laid back and sometimes I wish I could be like him. He doesn't get laid much and has a mediocre life, but he's perfectly content watching football all day and updating his fantasy team. I almost wish I could be blue pill and content with life sometimes.