Post: #1

This isn't something that gets mentioned a lot but Game like any other game requires a lot of energy - both physical and mental. It doesn't matter how good you are, the moment you start to get tired your Frame and Game will begin to slip and once that starts to happen - game over. The less the woman is helping you, the more Game you will need thus more energy. Want a SNL, it will take a lot of energy right up to the end. I think a lot of guy don't understand just how much energy this takes. And as you get other older 30+ it becomes increasingly difficult to maintain the energy for long gaming sessions. Also a lot of guys burn themselves out "entertaining" the girl in the first few hours and then becomes too tired to close the deal - and I have been guilty of this on numerous occasion. Understanding how much energy you have and realizing that you will need a lot to close most of the time will make you aware that you have to pace yourself - just like in any other sport game.

It's actually worse than a boxing match or a basketball game. In a boxing match you know exactly how long you have to go - the total time of the game. With a woman, you never know how long it will take. This is why you need to be in top physical and mental shape to be at the top of your Game.

Post: #2

There are many styles of (capital-G?) "Game." Some of my greatest conquests came at moments when I must have looked like shit, like picking up an airport ticketing girl at 9 AM after clubbing all night just by telling her to write her number on the ticket out of nowhere. Banged the week after. When she came to lunch once, a 19-20 Aussie friend said to me "omg look at that" when she walked in, then she sat in our booth and he left. That beta unfriended me from social media afterwards for no other possible reason.
Entertaining and clowning have never been my thing. Seeing an interaction as a "gaming session" shows a lack of frame to begin with. "The first few hours" idea is already a disqualification since you should always come across as having better things to do than interact with the girl.

Post: #3

I feel time and energy are interchangeable. The waste your energy, they waste your time because you need to recover from the energy drain.

One of the arguments for the prohibited subject of marriage. Looking for girls, talking to them, weeding out time-wasting flakes ( which I think short of just asking women if they want to fuck is unavoidable) finding out after fucking a girl a few weeks she has fatal anger issues when stressed waste SO MUCH FUCKING TIME>

I develop emotional attachment to women I spend a significant amount of time with and getting over the grieving from missing them takes energy and time.

One of the ways I am screening now is right from the beginning explaining to new girls that their main function in my life is to protect me from and REDUCE the amount of drama in my life.

I ask girls if they have bad tempers, but I've realized people with bad tempers don't think they are angry-- they are in denial about it- - the think they are telling someone stupid something they need to know. From the outside they look pissed off, but from inside their world, they are righting a wrong that needs to be righted.

So people with bad tempers (big, big time wasters because of the stress they induce) don't know who they are.

Post: #4

"Picking up" a girl, getting a phone number doesn't require a lot of energy. I am talking about when you are out on a date with a girl. Also the more a girl is into you for whatever reason the less energy you need. Not every girl will require a lot of energy but for most guys most of the time I believe this will apply. I have a friend that the sum total of his game is swiping right on Tinder. The most energy he expends is when he's fucking the girl. But he's an exception because of his model good looks.

Post: #5

Another advanced game concept cloaked in a warning.

Let's see if anyone sees it

WIA

Post: #6

(05-09-2015 01:15 PM)RedParadigm Wrote:  This isn't something that gets mentioned a lot but Game like any other game requires a lot of energy - both physical and mental.

There's really little of physical IMO, unless we talk about club game after 4am (I found out there's no way I can game girls after 3 or 4am)
For the rest, it's all in your mind. Which physical energy may require talking, or nodding to the bullshits that come out of a girl's mouth? Which physical energy you need to escalate? You really don't have the energy to instist for a girl coming inside your pad? Must be so strong to finger a bitch or receiving a bj?
I had some slump period in my player life, in which I started to wonder if I was getting too old not olny for game, but for girls in general. Turned out that was all in my mind: lack of motivation, problems in other areas of my life, enviroment I was in, ecc.
It may be because I'm from Italy but I know dudes in their *seventies* who are still out there chasing girls kinda full time, travelling for it and all that stuff. Of course they don't go to club nor get laid with college girls, but these dudes have the program so deeply installed in their mind that I'm sure that as long as they can move just some part of their body they'll try to find a way to get as closest as they can to a vagina.
Enjoy the ride until you can.

Post: #7

(05-09-2015 01:15 PM)RedParadigm Wrote:  This isn't something that gets mentioned a lot but Game like any other game requires a lot of energy - both physical and mental. It doesn't matter how good you are, the moment you start to get tired your Frame and Game will begin to slip and once that starts to happen - game over. The less the woman is helping you, the more Game you will need thus more energy. Want a SNL, it will take a lot of energy right up to the end. I think a lot of guy don't understand just how much energy this takes. And as you get other older 30+ it becomes increasingly difficult to maintain the energy for long gaming sessions. Also a lot of guys burn themselves out "entertaining" the girl in the first few hours and then becomes too tired to close the deal - and I have been guilty of this on numerous occasion. Understanding how much energy you have and realizing that you will need a lot to close most of the time will make you aware that you have to pace yourself - just like in any other sport game.

It's actually worse than a boxing match or a basketball game. In a boxing match you know exactly how long you have to go - the total time of the game. With a woman, you never know how long it will take. This is why you need to be in top physical and mental shape to be at the top of your Game.

Game as a high performance sport? Surely such a concept does not exist:-)

On the positive side, just about every male on the planet, from frogs, to rhinos, lions, penguins and dolphins all share the same problem...and they don't even have tinder.

Post: #8

(05-09-2015 01:38 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  I feel time and energy are interchangeable. The waste your energy, they waste your time because you need to recover from the energy drain.

One of the arguments for the prohibited subject of marriage. Looking for girls, talking to them, weeding out time-wasting flakes ( which I think short of just asking women if they want to fuck is unavoidable) finding out after fucking a girl a few weeks she has fatal anger issues when stressed waste SO MUCH FUCKING TIME>

I develop emotional attachment to women I spend a significant amount of time with and getting over the grieving from missing them takes energy and time.

One of the ways I am screening now is right from the beginning explaining to new girls that their main function in my life is to protect me from and REDUCE the amount of drama in my life.

I ask girls if they have bad tempers, but I've realized people with bad tempers don't think they are angry-- they are in denial about it- - the think they are telling someone stupid something they need to know. From the outside they look pissed off, but from inside their world, they are righting a wrong that needs to be righted.

So people with bad tempers (big, big time wasters because of the stress they induce) don't know who they are.

Very good post. Had a bad-temper 3-monther that dumped me because caught me with another girl early April. Frankly I liked her body more, and woulda tamed down with other side-ass naturally had she simply not been such a bitch.

At the end I said: "Frankly Lisa, you blow the fuck up and maintain a high intensity bitch-scream about any little thing that gets under your skin. Take a look in the fucking mirror, I won't tolerate that shit nor would any sane man, and acting that way makes you less pretty to boot. It's a lose-lose scenario with you so glad we're done."

FEAR & ANGER go hand in hand. If someone's angry, they're hiding a fear of something.. always. And vice versa, if someone's fearful all the time, look out they're gonna blow eventually. Angry women are first and foremost, afraid of losing the guy they're with or any element of security, so much so they become constant bitches that literally drive the very thing away that they want so bad. So the cycle repeats in psychopathic events of the closet sociopath so many women really are.

Post: #9

(05-09-2015 02:35 PM)Apollo21 Wrote:  

(05-09-2015 01:15 PM)RedParadigm Wrote:  This isn't something that gets mentioned a lot but Game like any other game requires a lot of energy - both physical and mental. It doesn't matter how good you are, the moment you start to get tired your Frame and Game will begin to slip and once that starts to happen - game over. The less the woman is helping you, the more Game you will need thus more energy. Want a SNL, it will take a lot of energy right up to the end. I think a lot of guy don't understand just how much energy this takes. And as you get other older 30+ it becomes increasingly difficult to maintain the energy for long gaming sessions. Also a lot of guys burn themselves out "entertaining" the girl in the first few hours and then becomes too tired to close the deal - and I have been guilty of this on numerous occasion. Understanding how much energy you have and realizing that you will need a lot to close most of the time will make you aware that you have to pace yourself - just like in any other sport game.

It's actually worse than a boxing match or a basketball game. In a boxing match you know exactly how long you have to go - the total time of the game. With a woman, you never know how long it will take. This is why you need to be in top physical and mental shape to be at the top of your Game.

Game as a high performance sport? Surely such a concept does not exist:-)

On the positive side, just about every male on the planet, from frogs, to rhinos, lions, penguins and dolphins all share the same problem...and they don't even have tinder.

Gaming the female of the human specie is one of the toughest games there is. I would venture to guess that there are less professional "players" (at Roosh level) out there than on a pro football team

Actually animals have it much easier. They know exactly when a female wants to have sex and the rules are fairly well defined. The females animals always pick the top alpha lion or chimp for example. Animals also don't have to deal with females seeking attention and validation. If sex with human females were as straight forward as it is in the animal kingdom we would hardly need much game

Post: #10

Red, do you think as a player gets older, he should become better at the target and knowing where to position himself so that the lizard does at least 50 percent of the work or higher?

I know another guy that I roll with who must be in his 40s but leverages dance game heavily. He doesn't actually focus on an SNL per se but spends a lot of time making obvious suggestions and then laughing. He has a very friendly demeanor and even though the lizards know he wants to fcuk, they don't actually see him as desperate. He's funnelling sluts to my pad to bang, both black and white.

Post: #11

Location and pre-selection (the woman is into you before you even open your mouth) are the keys to working less. With age and experience you get better at reading women but that doesn't mean you have location or pre-selection working for you, you could be in a city with women that are not your type for example or you just don't like the vibe of the place. Pre-selection doesn't come with age either but that's whole another topic...

Post: #12

I'm older, and being efficient with my time and energy is one of my primary concerns in my game strategy..

That's why I like when topics such as slut signs and screening are discussed on the forum. When I'm in a venue I take plenty of time to observe the appearance and behavior of the women in the place then decide on a small number that have the highest probability of a SNL. If the approach goes well I then screen for her logistics and DTFness. If those don't look good I bail out.

Preapproach IOIs are important to me also. I think it's silly that some PUA types denigrate relying on preapproach IOIs as somehow being cowardly or taking the easy road. That's like a salesman turning away customers because the walked in with a wad of money in their hand.

I also dress in such way that prompts women approaching me fairly regularly. Another savings of time and effort.

I'm also selective about which venues I go to and which nights I'm there. I don't go out specifically to daygame because it doesn't fit into my schedule. I do online though because I can do it while multitasking.

The older you get the less tolerance you have for BS and wasting time.

Post: #13

MrXy is totally right. The whole idea of approaching in tons as a younger person is so that one builds up the instincts to determine who's down when they are older. It's a feel for a situation as we will have less energy as we get older and have to make much more accurate decisions.

With youth, one can afford to be frivolous with attempts and do day game on an entire procession of nuns if one feels the need.

RedParadigm, you say game requires energy, are there any social events that you enjoy attending that you don't find exhausting? Maybe it's the whole concept of 'game' that depletes you. If you actually enjoy talking to lizards and don't see it as an 'end' goal per se, it might be more enervating for you.

I personally do find some social engagements tiring and don't see the purpose in pursuing those endlessly. With time, I can determine which events I like and which ones require a quick ejection from premises.

Post: #14

I beg to differ on the "energy" aspect although "time" can be a factor depending on your style, what do I mean?
- I don't go on dates
- I don't text or call girls
- I don't go out to "pickup"

Game IMO is YOU...

The tools such as "cold approaching" is simply just a facilitator to display your PRESENCE and give a woman the chance to meet you regardless of the setting or circumstances. I say this because 2014 was a horrible year for me YET I was able to leverage hanging out with friends, who are guys that are always around tons of chicks.

So literally, 1x a week i'd be out and DOING NOTHING I'd be around 8-25 girls, all I'd have to do is just BE and pick who I want.

IMO I can't comprehend why "men" go on dates it is a major time waster.

Keep in mind, I'm a guy who used to do daygame into nightgame there were times when I approached 60 different girls in a day. (Literally INSANE!!) If I were to do that now being how I am, I might as well just open my own club.

P.S...There was a time period where I realize there was a certain threshold where chicks would just be hitting me up everyday atleast 1 to 3 girls a day. I've had so much free time that at times I don't even think of myself as a guy "aware" of the community because I don't really do much girl related. Only time, you'll see me out is if there is some social activity I really want to go to OR if I'm catching up with friends.

Post: #15

@Distant Maybe you could elaborate on this? Are you talking about building a social lifestyle that just allows you to meet girls? Or are you like my model friend who can just tell girls to come over to his place?

Post: #16

@OP

You sound like you may be an introvert. Am I right? Game requires lots of forced interaction with strangers as well as being able to master making small-talk(at least initially) with anyone. These two things are draining and runs against introvert nature.

You might want to forgo spam approaching all together and focus on a smaller but better selected group of women who you are more likely to build a chemistry with.

Post: #17

Thanks but actually, the most draining part is having to listen to American women for hours and pretending to be interested in the inane shit they talk about. They just can't seem to shut up. Even when they are having sex they keep talking.

That smaller select group is somewhere in Europe

Post: #18

(05-09-2015 11:13 PM)RedParadigm Wrote:  Thanks but actually, the most draining part is having to listen to American women for hours and pretending to be interested in the inane shit they talk about.

Then dont.
Learn how to tease and steer conversation to topics of your interest.

When Im enamored by a girl I actually find her chatter and gossip amusing. If it gets too much, you just tease her or change the subject.

Girls who have the same interests as your own are much easier to tolerate, and then its not so much "energy" spent tolerating her as enjoyable time spent together. If you feel continually drained after being with someone, regardless of the gender, perhaps you should be shooting the shit with someone else.

You have interests and passions of your own right? Get in social circles where other people share them. Not all women are vapid creatures devoid of personality. Not all women are shrieking harpies. Perhaps you have a negative generic outlook towards women that needs to be changed.

At its peak, "game" is effortless and innervating.

It is hard to continuously feign interest in another person, but if you genuinely find someone interesting, is it really energy wasted or time well spent?

I was in DC today and went to a hookah lounge to chill afterwards. There was this server who was wearing an accessory which looked familiar so I asked her about it, turned out to be a great story. We got talking and spent the next couple of hours laughing and talking a fair bit. I got her number and we're tentatively going snorkeling after finals week. It didnt require enormous mental or physical effort.

Its easy to cultivate the aura of serendipity in a relationship if you're genuinely interested in someone, and you feed off off each other's energies.

You dont HAVE to feign interest when its real, you dont HAVE to entertain a girl if the two of you are really having fun, you dont HAVE to put effort into long gaming sessions if you're surrounded by people with similar likes.
You dont HAVE to do something just to have a girlfriend or a fuckbuddy (within reason, ofcourse).

Post: #19

(05-09-2015 01:40 PM)RedParadigm Wrote:  "Picking up" a girl, getting a phone number doesn't require a lot of energy.

Sure it does.

If I grab eight numbers on a Sunday afternoon while running cold approaches at a local upscale shopping center, that usually means about 16 approaches. At twenty minutes an approach (and more if I seriously invest into any girl with an instant-date or significant conversation), that's over fine hours, on my feet, moving around, running my mouth, etc.

From those 8 numbers, only 5 are going to respond, and getting the three most viable into bed the next weekend is going to recruit a minimum of nine hours of date time (unless I'm lucky and one is complete DTF).

Don't know about the extroverts here, but that type of schedule would be exhausting for me even if I was unemployed and didn't work 10 hour days, six days a week. Since I do work 10 hour days six days a week, fitting in the number of approaches I need each week, just to keep the pussy pipeline consistent, is a major energy commitment, not to mention that it pretty much snatches up all of my available time too.

Post: #20

(05-09-2015 05:26 PM)RedParadigm Wrote:  

(05-09-2015 02:35 PM)Apollo21 Wrote:  

(05-09-2015 01:15 PM)RedParadigm Wrote:  This isn't something that gets mentioned a lot but Game like any other game requires a lot of energy - both physical and mental. It doesn't matter how good you are, the moment you start to get tired your Frame and Game will begin to slip and once that starts to happen - game over. The less the woman is helping you, the more Game you will need thus more energy. Want a SNL, it will take a lot of energy right up to the end. I think a lot of guy don't understand just how much energy this takes. And as you get other older 30+ it becomes increasingly difficult to maintain the energy for long gaming sessions. Also a lot of guys burn themselves out "entertaining" the girl in the first few hours and then becomes too tired to close the deal - and I have been guilty of this on numerous occasion. Understanding how much energy you have and realizing that you will need a lot to close most of the time will make you aware that you have to pace yourself - just like in any other sport game.

It's actually worse than a boxing match or a basketball game. In a boxing match you know exactly how long you have to go - the total time of the game. With a woman, you never know how long it will take. This is why you need to be in top physical and mental shape to be at the top of your Game.

Game as a high performance sport? Surely such a concept does not exist:-)

On the positive side, just about every male on the planet, from frogs, to rhinos, lions, penguins and dolphins all share the same problem...and they don't even have tinder.

Gaming the female of the human specie is one of the toughest games there is. I would venture to guess that there are less professional "players" (at Roosh level) out there than on a pro football team

Actually animals have it much easier. They know exactly when a female wants to have sex and the rules are fairly well defined. The females animals always pick the top alpha lion or chimp for example. Animals also don't have to deal with females seeking attention and validation. If sex with human females were as straight forward as it is in the animal kingdom we would hardly need much game

I agree there's a learning curve. But once you get the skillset down
game gets reduced down to a few core variables.

Females in the animal kingdom are just as individualistic. It's not all based
on instinct. She still has to like the male. And the male still has to worry
about hunting/finding food as well as competition from other males.

Plus most animals don't live in cities, so "day gaming" for a lone wolf or grizzly bear
can get pretty tough. It's miracle they've even survived.

What you're talking about though are the realities of game.

Because it takes does so much energy and effort, most guys do eventually
settle down with one woman and devote all that "extra" energy to taking care
of their family, building a company or other accomplishments.

Post: #21

Game should be fun, which is why it is called game instead of job.

Post: #22

(05-09-2015 01:41 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  Another advanced game concept cloaked in a warning.

Let's see if anyone sees it

WIA

Screening, qualifying, and integrating women into one's life rather than seeing them as a separate component that has to be inefficiently chased down.

I have more work to do in this department.

Post: #23

Picking up one girl does not require a lot of energy but yes, if you are going to pickup a bunch then it will require a lot of energy. A couple of hours of day gaming does burn quite a bit of energy.

It doesn't matter how good you get. The amount of work seems to stay about the same BECAUSE the quality of girls you go after also increases. Where it gets good is that you are able to spot the Yes girls more easily and act on them quickly.

Yes, it would be nice to spend time with girls you are really interested in. Finding these girls is another problem. I find European girls far more interesting than American girls. To me, most American girls are basically variations of the same theme.

Don't get me wrong game is still fun. The primary point of this post was to point out that you need to be aware of your energy level and keep enough in reserve to go the distance with the girl. Because once you start to get tired your game will start to slip regardless of how good you are.

Post: #24

Context, context, context. Night game is easier when you're young and have high energy. Game at 21 is different than game at 30. If I tried to pull off some of the moves I did when I was younger it would look weird.

The trick is offering a different experience than a typical high energy clown. You'll get women who match your energy level as opposed to sloots who have a complete lack of impulse control. Like attracts like.

However, day to day social interactions with women (eg day / social circle game) should be easy and low to moderate energy. Anything more is like killing a fly with a bazooka.

Post: #25

Game isn't a hobby or part time 'thing', it's a (the) foundation for success in life. You either do it or you don't. And it's applications go far beyond procuring pussy.

See my tagline. Learn it, live it, prosper from it.