Post: #1

Online game was easier even 2 years ago, anyone knows this, or should.

The ratios have never been good online, but they've only gotten worse given the commonality of online dating and how Tinder made it "normal". Tinder allowed for every woman on facebook who is above a 5 on the looks scale to introduce random orbiters she didn't have before it.

Of course, women only seem to get fatter in the US, so there's another problem.

We've reached a point where I'd argue the majority of women are using online dating in any form as daily diversion. Basically collecting cans in the form of orbiters.

Which leads to the original point I wanted to make. You essentially have to "neg" as they called it in the old-school PUA says in your initial message.

A simple straightforward hello with a short message isn't as efficient anymore.

Example: Those of you in Tier 2 or 3 cities probably see this a lot.

I've lived in both, people in Tier 2 or 3 cities are way more fanatical than Tier 1 for the most part. On most profiles, you'll see women on there usually make some mention of their local art gallery, local farmers market, basically anything local and they'll sound legitimately impressed by it.

Instead of saying hi in a normal way, you have a much better chance of getting a reply using:

So are you one of those people who thinks Denver is basically New York or LA?

Some will laugh, some will get mad and instantly block you, but it will typically get a reply. It only works in Tier 2 & Tier 3 cities. A Tier 1 city there is no point, anything below Tier 3 they won't care, maybe a few college towns being the rare exception.

This is obviously a broad example, but I've noticed it's almost required these days. It's one that you see time & time again so I thought it would be a good one to use.

Anyone else seen this shift online?

Post: #2

I still remember when I was out with a few friends on Canada Day 2 years ago.
One of the girls, who was decently attractive - maybe a 7, had the Tinder app installed on her iPhone.
The app had a little red notification button with the number 86 (or something crazy like that, don't remember the exact number).

Seeing that has given me a lot of perspective on the online dating world. It has definitely turned me off from online dating as I did not want to be one of 86 notifications. Overall, I think girls mostly use the app for the little pings of validation / temporary release from boredom it affords.

Post: #3

(03-26-2015 07:21 PM)The_e_man Wrote:  Overall, I think girls mostly use the app for the little pings of validation / temporary release from boredom it affords.

Also a passive way to boost their ego getting those infinite pings.

Post: #4

Been like that for a couple years now. POF is worthless, OKCupid is still solid, but honestly the new Tinder is actually something to get excited about. I've had significantly more matches and dates since the changeover to paid subscription; of course I somehow got it for $4.95 a month and jumped on it - would it be worth $19.99 if I was 30+? Probably not.

It's all a numbers game.

Post: #5

I am hoping that you worked on some other areas over the last two years and didn't just stick to one 'hello' opener till it dried up.

Two years is a lot of time to make gains in the gym.
Two years is a lot of time to earn some money, get your business going and move to a move favorable area.
Two years of game resources and hitting the clubs/street is going to give you some serious game skills.
Two years of reading style blogs...

I have been using my 'cute pics' opener for two years (successfully) but I have also made big gains in almost every other area of my life to back that up and keep it effective.

Post: #6

Perhaps a straightforward hello doesn't work anymore but whatever it is, if you strive towards anything more than a stock opener than you've already lost. It detracts from the mission that is required of you online - mindless spamming of thousands of girls. Stopping to think about a tailored opener is already too much investment on your part and derails this train. In the time and care it took read over each girl's profile and send 20 well crafted messages to impress girls with your topical wit, who won't give a shit anyway, you could've have opened up a flurry of tabs in Firefox and copypasta'd 400 girls. It's all about looks online, aka fitting a girl's "type", and playing a ruthless numbers game, aka throwing shit on the wall and seeing what sticks. If you still want to cling to the idea that your personality matters, then fine, let it shine through in your written profile and let that speak for you, generally. But otherwise to care even a little for one particular girl is to care too much.

Post: #7

You know what, I remember using an automated message app for POF, I'd just let it run all day, while I worked-out, studied, did whatever, and I had several girls respond. That's how you do it nowadays, don't even care about the opener. That combined with the automated ''would you meet this person'', and it was too easy. But I was doing this a year ago, I don't know how it fares anymore, nor do I remember how to use it on Firefox.

Don't get stuck on the opener, try to write anything if you don't want to go the automated way. Also, many girls are using the dating services in order to get ego boosts, while at the same time letting lots of guys down who actually thought they would get a date out of this.

For the girls, this is like their daily horoscope on their cellphones circa the early 2000s, something to look at that will bring them a smile, but not something to respond to. Essentially, you are the prop that brings the woman good fortune/mood/joy, and you get nothing out of it, like a tool. You're going to be questioning yourself all day, and wondering what you did wrong, whereas the woman is going to be like ''why am I so perfect?'', giving her false confidence to be a bitch at her workplace/school/club, doesn't matter where. All this fucking complimenting is detrimental to society as a whole. Don't let them think they are better than you, don't waste time on them. So, it's really not worth to spend time on your opener because you could have opened a lot of girls in the meantime, and girls who would have responded.

No offense, but online dating can be fickle, especially depending on your location, combine that with an immense emphasis on profile style, universal thirst, female ego trips, and the new ''You need to step up your game'' bullshit that they are putting in women's mags to take away the power from men, you are at a disadvantage because bitches be bitches.

If there was a male equivalent for cosmos (sounds like a daily horoscope too, huh?) that covers a wide-range of daily aspects in our lives, we wouldn't be here right now. Girls have had this sucker for years, and it's putting ideas into their heads, and they are no longer individuals, just sheep who follow drivel from the female mags, also some garbage site called 'x.o. jane' where lesbians gather to teach heterosexual women how to behave online/parties/condone orgies/sexual experimentation with the same sex, so you can understand how bad it is, and the extent of the brainwashing. Also, women don't like thinking for themselves, so when they see something written in a magazine for them, they automatically take it because they like being lead, right? They don't question the reasoning, they just think ''hey, somebody thought this out for me, I don't need to think anymore, so I should just follow it'', just like a clothing trend, it's very easy to shear the cheap. The problem is, the mags got to them first, and told them to be weary of the male, but it's okay to turn into a lesbo though. Women are very influenced by something in a mag because to them, it looks like an ''official'' source, but with no scientific backing, and logic from a sound mind. So yeah, a sincere hello is not good enough anymore.

Post: #8

(03-27-2015 10:13 AM)TroubleMaker Wrote:  Been like that for a couple years now. POF is worthless, OKCupid is still solid, but honestly the new Tinder is actually something to get excited about. I've had significantly more matches and dates since the changeover to paid subscription; of course I somehow got it for $4.95 a month and jumped on it - would it be worth $19.99 if I was 30+? Probably not.

It's all a numbers game.

OK Cupid is absolutely DEAD in my area. POF is eh, and Match is still fairly solid although I don't want to pay for it. Tinder I haven't decided about. If they let me reset my profile as part of my subscription I would do it. Otherwise, I'm eh about it. Although I still get some leads on it.

Post: #9

(03-27-2015 03:17 PM)civpro Wrote:  Perhaps a straightforward hello doesn't work anymore but whatever it is, if you strive towards anything more than a stock opener than you've already lost. It detracts from the mission that is required of you online - mindless spamming of thousands of girls. Stopping to think about a tailored opener is already too much investment on your part and derails this train. In the time and care it took read over each girl's profile and send 20 well crafted messages to impress girls with your topical wit, who won't give a shit anyway, you could've have opened up a flurry of tabs in Firefox and copypasta'd 400 girls. It's all about looks online, aka fitting a girl's "type", and playing a ruthless numbers game, aka throwing shit on the wall and seeing what sticks. If you still want to cling to the idea that your personality matters, then fine, let it shine through in your written profile and let that speak for you, generally. But otherwise to care even a little for one particular girl is to care too much.

Mostly true, the only downside is that you run the risk of them calling it out as a canned opener. Not that there's anything wrong with that; plenty of fish in the sea. But if you want to eliminate the number of those calling you out, all you have to do is add ONE little detail to the end of the message.

EX: <insert copypaste message>

PS: I noticed you like the Yankees, too. +1

Again, don't have to read her whole profile. Just the first paragraph to get an idea of something she likes. Occassionally you may have to browse a little deeper to find a common ground, but it's certainly quicker than crafting a message tailored to her profile (I certainly never bother to do this).

Post: #10

Doesn't matter if you tailor a message to her profile. Pictures are the deciding factor. I am also positive POF actively hunts profiles which send a certain number of messages and checks them for copy/paste or subtle changes.

Post: #11

A straightforward 'hello' works depending on your visual presentation, no way around it. OKC/POF/Tinder has been reduced to a beauty contest, if she doesn't find you attractive she doesn't bother to read your glossy bio

Write less on your profile & have bonafide pics

Also when replying to a prospect, it's all about critical skim and keeping it to the point

Post: #12

I got rid of tinder months ago but I do have a few thoughts I have never articulated on the forum.

Tinder was the most enjoyable for me when I was opening with outrageous shit. The old, "You look like the cute girl next door who also loves a good fuck" or however it was actually worded, was lightning in a bottle. Girls went nuts over that. It was hilarious.

I would sit in class and troll tinder just for fun. I even had one girl off tinder that I had insulted recognize me in a bar and I actually ended up banging her a week or so later.

My theory is that online dating only works the best when you don't take it seriously, which means "Hello" probably isn't a viable opener. When you open with something ridiculous it tells the chick that you really don't give a fuck and they start to play along.

A lot of dudes take it way too seriously. One night I traded phones with a girl and we trolled each other's Tinder accounts. I was straight up dissing dudes on her phone and they would just sit there and take it. It was fucking pathetic. Not to mention the number of dudes who opened her with hello was off the chart.

Post: #13

Sometimes I think we spend so much time discussing how to get a quality response/openers, to the detriment of other aspects

Namely, how to navigate the waters of conversation into a meet up and finally the conversion into a notch

Ideally the whole process, when it works smoothly, takes place within a matter of hours to a couple days