Post: #26

I personally disagree with this.

I went to a top 30 liberal arts college in the US where girls are hot and female/male ratio is 60/40. All 4 years I didn't get laid. Niether did most of my guy friends. The frat boys clean up the most.

I graduated with more honors and awards than I can put on a CV, with an Honor Thesis, Magna Cum Laude (top 10%). I then spent 2 years at La Sorbonne in Paris, still makes top of class and I still struggle to find an internship, much less a job.

If anything I get laid way more in Paris but that's because I discovered game here.

Girls wise college is just like life. If you suck in general you will suck in college. Sometimes you get lucky due to sheer probability.

Money wise it's worthless unless you are doing STEM from a top school, like some pointed out. But even then prepare for life in corporate slavery. In fact no job and no college actually beats being a bartender at a high end bar nowadays. Girls, alcohol and parties and once you've aged you should have enough $ and connections to open your own bar or move to higher venues with better positions.

Post: #27

Well, if you find that guys in fraternities get the most ass, it might be worthwhile to join one. From my experience being in a fraternity guaranteed at least 4 formal events a semester, of which you could almost always get laid if you chose your date correctly.

And if you're in a non STEM major you can have time to work and attend class, so you can't count it as 4 years, because you most likely won't have to put your life on hold.

In social sciences you can definitely choose professors who offer more than a textbook, not to mention the networking opportunities.

Post: #28

I had fun in college, and got laid. It was worth it for me because it set me on the path I am now, and led me to the forum. I made a lot of mistakes in college that had I known about the forum first, I never would have made, and would have enjoyed college even more.

If I had the forum before I went to college I may not have gone, and probably would have just moved to a university town and moved into a house with 2-3 other guys who were in college and focused on my own business. Then you get the best of both worlds because you're.hooked into the college scene via your roommates and living in a party house close to campus, preferably with a swimming pool, and also building your business.

Maybe sign up for open university classes so you have access to the gym and some fun/interesting classes you actually want to take. The amount of bullshit classes I had to take to get my degree was maddening and I almost dropped out my last semester because I was learning fuck all and just wasting my time to get a piece of papper.

Post: #29

College is amazing. Plenty of opportunities without it hurting your career options.

Post: #30

(02-26-2015 01:05 AM)Sonoma Wrote:  Well, if you find that guys in fraternities get the most ass, it might be worthwhile to join one. From my experience being in a fraternity guaranteed at least 4 formal events a semester, of which you could almost always get laid if you chose your date correctly.

Right, I'm not saying it's impossible to do well, I'm saying it caters to a very specific form of game, which is based on a very specific personality. If you're more introverted, it's one of the least conducive environments for your game that you could possibly imagine. And between the big winners and big losers in the SMP there isn't much middle ground.

Quote:In social sciences you can definitely choose professors who offer more than a textbook, not to mention the networking opportunities.

Professors rarely choose to actually mentor students. I've seen it of course but it's mostly out of your control and probably won't happen, and that goes double for people who exhibit critical thinking tendencies. That aside, I think the networking opportunities are 99% of the reason for college...so if you go, choose your school wisely on that basis, and get ready to make connections like it's your job (because it is). Of course if that's not your thing (like those deluded souls who think college is for intellectual enrichment), then stay far away.

Again, I think college can work if you plan it right, and you've put up some good advice to that end. That said, I think it's useful to provide a counternarrative to the BS and lies that young men are told about college outside this forum. Everything college fashions itself as (a place of genuine learning where young people have fun while finding themselves and becoming adults) is a complete joke. Anyone considering college should think carefully about the information on offer here (both for and against), and never buy into the image of "College Life" because you're being sold snake oil.

Post: #31

(02-26-2015 03:55 AM)Saga Wrote:  

(02-26-2015 01:05 AM)Sonoma Wrote:  Well, if you find that guys in fraternities get the most ass, it might be worthwhile to join one. From my experience being in a fraternity guaranteed at least 4 formal events a semester, of which you could almost always get laid if you chose your date correctly.

Right, I'm not saying it's impossible to do well, I'm saying it caters to a very specific form of game, which is based on a very specific personality. If you're more introverted, it's one of the least conducive environments for your game that you could possibly imagine. And between the big winners and big losers in the SMP there isn't much middle ground.

Quote:In social sciences you can definitely choose professors who offer more than a textbook, not to mention the networking opportunities.

Professors rarely choose to actually mentor students. I've seen it of course but it's mostly out of your control and probably won't happen, and that goes double for people who exhibit critical thinking tendencies. That aside, I think the networking opportunities are 99% of the reason for college...so if you go, choose your school wisely on that basis, and get ready to make connections like it's your job (because it is). Of course if that's not your thing (like those deluded souls who think college is for intellectual enrichment), then stay far away.

Again, I think college can work if you plan it right, and you've put up some good advice to that end. That said, I think it's useful to provide a counternarrative to the BS and lies that young men are told about college outside this forum. Everything college fashions itself as (a place of genuine learning where young people have fun while finding themselves and becoming adults) is a complete joke. Anyone considering college should think carefully about the information on offer here (both for and against), and never buy into the image of "College Life" because you're being sold snake oil.

10% of the frat guys pull. The other 90% get laid here and there from what I've seen.

Post: #32

Here's an idea: Go to college and ball out in the classroom your first year. I mean disregard everything else and accept nothing less than an A on any exam or any class. Do all of your homework and study at all times.

After a year or so with your ~4.0 GPA, you can apply for a multitude of scholarships. Then, college is free, you just have to pay for rent and books. Plus you've got a kick ass GPA and a leg up on all the competition post-graduation.

One of my biggest beefs with these manosphere guys is their direct shaming of college. You grow some balls and life skills when you've got to pull all nighters studying organic chemistry because you refuse to not get an A. That's as "red pill" as it gets.

I may write a big post or data sheet on the topic another time.

Post: #33

(02-26-2015 03:55 AM)Saga Wrote:  If you're more introverted, it's one of the least conducive environments for your game that you could possibly imagine.

There's some serious rationalization going on in this thread. The conclusion a lot of people have come to in this forum and just through general experience is that proximity and social circle is the best and easiest way to pull quality for normal, non-famous, non-rich guys. Personally the 2 baddest girls I've pulled have been through school, by far. Hell, even "science" provides some evidence for this:

Paul Eastwick and Lucy Hun Wrote:Mate value is predicated on people’s ability to reach some degree of consensus about one another’s desirable qualities....

The old axiom says beauty is in the eye of the beholder. When it comes to initial impressions, this statement is not really true: Consensus about desirable qualities creates a gulf between the haves and have-nots. But the truth of this maxim increases over time: As people get to know each other, decreasing consensus and increasing uniqueness give everyone a fighting chance.

So if you do not have a high mate value, take heart. All you need is for others to have the patience to get to know you, and a more level playing field should follow.

Introverts have trouble with game because it requires actively seeking out and creat-ing social experiences. In college, social experiences are creat-ed for you. When else are you going to live in the same building as an 8 you can run into as you wash your clothes a few washing machines apart? When are you ever going to be paired up on a project with a nubile 19 year old you are forced to talk to? Not to mention the logistical advantages of having a high concentration of bitches living at walking distance from you. Proximity engenders familiarity, and in especially provincial places, there is a psychological safety net in talking to one of your peers, as opposed to one of your same-aged locals who *gasp* aren't going to school.

For many introverts and people with no game, college is the be-all end-all. So many guys have trouble once they get out. If anything, college is a huge crutch. If you can't pull in college, I would guess you'll have trouble pulling anywhere else with the same skill-set. And I haven't even mentioned certain frats, who host parties where they socially engineer favorable ratios to virtually guarantee dick-wetting. Some frats take this shit extremely seriously and keep databases of incoming talent not just to the university, but to other schools and their city in general.

Here's a final tip. If you see a couple where the bitch is on point, small-talk them and ask them how they met.

Don't be fooled by what appears to be an anti-college consensus in this thread. College, and school in general, is without a doubt the easiest way to get quality pussy for a normal guy with no fame. But more importantly, it can set up a decent career in the process, too.

Post: #34

I agree on some bits with the OP but I also disagree. I agree on the part that College is the easiest way to meet chicks (It is really; plenty of young girls in one location and with favorable ratios) and college is still a worthy investment for getting a job (seriously, most guys just aren't down to be entrepreneurs or skilled laborers/tradesman). However, for careers, college isn't the be-all and end-all for getting a good paying and rewarding career unless your calling is to work in an office, work in a physical science/math based field, or be medical practitioner.

I for one, left college (I was a STEM major) because I hated sitting in a classroom all day and I didn't want to work in an office. Plus, I hated all the bullshit that came with attending college (the tuition and fees, dealing with a bunch of book smart but experience barren professors, and being around anti-social peers). For me, leaving college helped me boost my social skills (when you have to get jobs, you either learn to be social or you sink) and I learned a lot about a whole range of topics. For me, my calling is the trades.

What's the answer? None. Do what works for you and gives you the most amount of growth, satisfaction, life experience, and makes you content. We are all destined to do different things that come with all our different personalities.

Post: #35

(02-25-2015 02:59 PM)Sonoma Wrote:  You also seemingly might want to learn the difference between college and collage.

Not everyone is capable of handling rigorous academic study. Hell, the high school graduation rate is what, 80%? That shows 1/5 guys isn't even capable of graduating high school, much less successfully pursuing higher education. Not everyone is cut out to be an entrepreneur or do manual labor, either.

Couple things from this thread:

1 - Professors at smaller schools are much more likely to engage with students and take on a mentoring role, especially after a student has done well in lower level classes and is taking on more advanced studies.

2 - If you're going to college just to get pussy, you're probably not going to make it all the way through to graduation. If you put it on a pedestal, you'll reek of desperation and you won't be able to score. Game is the opposite of Dos Equis, don't stay thirsty.

3 - If you think college is just for a sheet of paper to frame and hang on the wall, you're probably not going to make it all the way through to graduation. Some guys do, more power to them, but it must be difficult putting in the 12-15 hours/week in class + homework + studying for something you don't really see value in. If your major doesn't excite (not merely interest) you and you aren't able to find value in your other classes either... Well, good luck.

4 - Guys who grow up poor can get financial aid up the wazoo. Fill out your damn FAFSA. I didn't get a scholarship for being black until I began graduate school, even then it wasn't all the much. While there are some scholarships for students of color, most of the ones I saw when I was in undergrad were "$500 for one semester and a 5 page essay with two letters of recommendation" (not worth the effort of applying for).

5 - If your humanities professor can't teach you something you couldn't learn just from reading a book, you should probably switch and find a professor that can. It's not high school, where you're just repeating what is put in front of you. A good humanities/social science class should challenge you and make you consider different interpretations in addition to introducing you to more information.

(02-26-2015 12:49 PM)Kamikaze Wrote:  Hell, even "science" provides some evidence for this:

Post: #36

(02-26-2015 12:49 PM)Kamikaze Wrote:  Introverts have trouble with game because it requires actively seeking out and creat-ing social experiences. In college, social experiences are creat-ed for you. When else are you going to live in the same building as an 8 you can run into as you wash your clothes a few washing machines apart? When are you ever going to be paired up on a project with a nubile 19 year old you are forced to talk to? Not to mention the logistical advantages of having a high concentration of bitches living at walking distance from you. Proximity engenders familiarity, and in especially provincial places, there is a psychological safety net in talking to one of your peers, as opposed to one of your same-aged locals who *gasp* aren't going to school.

The problem isn't seeking out experiences, the problem is being obliged to partake in a certain type of experience. The vast majority of lays are initiated at parties, not study halls. That means being loud over a beer pong table is a far more relevant skill than chatting up a girl in a cafe. Student activities can be one alternative but they're almost always inferior in participation and possibility to their real-world equivalents (I can't count the number of moribund to nonexistent "student groups" I've encountered, but of course they're all officially active to trick prospectives into thinking it's a dynamic campus).

You're forgetting that proximity hurts game in many ways. In a city, if a guy cold approaches a dozen girls over a few days it's no problem. However, if he does that on a campus, he will develop a rather unenviable reputation fairly quickly because it's a self-contained population. This is especially the case when most students' "psychological safety net" extends only so far as their particular social circle. Even at small schools, students won't identify with the whole student body but rather with a specific sub-demographic...it's harder to cross those lines on campus than off. In this regard it's more like high school than anything else, only you're always there. If anyone doubts that they can sit in a dining hall for 2 hours and see for themselves.

I'm not basing this on my own experiences as much as observing others and seeing what succeeds and what fails. If that's "rationalization" then so be it.

(02-27-2015 12:35 AM)Osiris Wrote:  If your humanities professor can't teach you something you couldn't learn just from reading a book, you should probably switch and find a professor that can.

The only appreciable difference between a lecture and a book is the form the information takes...and of course the price tag. In fact, most of what students learn in a humanities course is from the readings, not the lectures (every honest professor will tell you as much), so if you read the book list on your own you'll know roughly as much as someone who got the credits. Don't even get me started on "discussion-based courses" that functionally have no discussion because college students are typically incapable of independent thinking.

I was fortunate in that I had fantastic professors, really brilliant scholars and lecturers. However, was it worth the price tag, the barely marketable degree and the all the attendant aggravation of college? Absolutely not.

To be honest, the liberal arts education is a rather antiquated system that belongs to a bygone age. It's not unlike apprenticing oneself to a shoe cobbler in order to break into the sneaker industry. It's why adjunct professors get paid about as much as janitors after completing a full decade of higher education.

Post: #37

College is okay if you be realistic about it. Kids need to sit down and budget out the costs and debts they will incure with their major, then consider the health of the job market plus pay scale and student loan once they graduate. Most kids don't ever consider doing this.

I have had a tough time finding anything with my non-stem major. At this point if I don't go to grad school I'll have to close the book on my career aspirations or find a new one.