Post: #1

I think there are two different types of guys that run game in clubs.
The guys that pull the trigger on the shotgun and just approach every girl in sight, hoping that one of them will get hit center mass

The other guy is the sniper, that moves slow and picks his targets.

I was having a conversation with a friend about this.. how I like to sit back and watch what people are doing. It led into this..

Some of my friends have mentioned that in the 3-4 hours at bar, they may pull 10+ approaches but still go home without a makeout.
On the other hand, if I make 5 approaches during the night.. I've done a lot.
I have just as much success or more..and my conversations usually last a whole lot longer.
Its rare than Im completely blown out on a set

A couple things I notice in bars and clubs.
* a lot of guys seems to have a mad dash instinct and hop around way to much, trying to talk to as many girls as possible.

Or they wont make approaches at all.. They just sit around and stare at girls

When they do make approaches.
They come in with low energy and the girl can't even hear them.
Their low energy makes them seem boring and uninteresting right off the bat
The guys approaches seems extremely awkward and forced
I also see a lot of guys that don't want to dance.. but will try to approach a girl dancing and just stand and talk to her.

The bottom line..is that it all seems extremely forced and unnatural.

I think that we should talk about tips and advice for night club game, and expand one what we already know.

As for myself.. I'm more of the sniper
My average routine is to move myself to a bar next to a girl and usually make some sort of joke about it taking forever to get a drink.
Its pretty easy to do this, considering..the girl is gonna be standing still for some amount of time while ordering or waiting.
Because of this.. we have an excuse to talk.

I'm usually not even very flirty at this point.. Im just playing the happy interested person.
*I feel like, girls that do get approached, get approached so often and direct that their shield is already up.

Even if the girl is with a friend, its pretty easy to just keep the banter between them all because you didn't go for a direct shot


* I also feel like this approach is psychologically safe.
I notice a lot of guys walk up to a girl, get shoooed away and then have to make a walk of shame somewhere else, or back to their friends.
By making the approach at the bar.. I don't feel the need to go somewhere if the set is going bar.. ill get my drink and walk away or the girl will do the same.
But if things go well.. both of us have a valid and natural excuse to talk while we wait for our drinks to be made..




________________________________________
When you are with a wing,
sSme things that I notice guys do is to have one guy approach the girl, while the other dude or dudes just huddle around next to the guy or behind him.....As if the one guy is the lead speaker and the other guys are waiting to be introduced.
They all just hold their beers an stare around.
They clearly don't realize it...but from the outside it looks awkward and sometimes you can tell that the girl.. or her friends think the other guys are just awkward.

If 2 guys are gonna approach 2 girls.. everyone needs to talk... there shouldnt be some meeting between the two lead speakers before everyone else joins in.

I have had this happen to me on many occasions... where a friend seems to rely on me to make the approach.

-What works for me and has worked for a lot of other is that.. someone needs to go do their own thing for a minute.

What I like to do , is have someone go and do something else for a minute while the approach is made.
If my friend is about to make the approach, I head of the the bathroom or go to the bar and grab a drink for myself or both of us.
That way..assuming the set isnt blown from the beginning.. you get a couple minutes to chat up the girl on your own, before the wingman comes in in a natural manner.
That way, no one is standing around looking awkward.
*There is also a chance that, as I head to the bar, I have a opportunity to open a different chick.

Post: #2

I've noticed that as a beginner, you make more progress by using 'shotgun' game.

But then, as you improve you want more success with less effort, so you start transitioning to 'sniper' game.

Nowadays if I'm on a night out, for the usual 2 hours including the 1 hour peak time, I might make 10 approaches, if that. Give or take up to 5, it depends on how busy the club is, my mood, the vibe and people, etc.

A year ago I used to make double the amount of approaches.

Back then, I had to approach more to find what works. Nowadays, I approach less, but I get farther. I have more satisfying interactions and find more receptive girls. And, these girls are higher quality on average than they used to be when I first started heading out.

I've noticed experienced guys that are older than me and have put in their time approach even less, but succeed more.

When I first learned this, I wrote an essay on it on a thread here. Essentially we have very similar observations.

On energy levels, I believe that as a beginner, the one that approaches more girls will do better because he will get into a good state. The guy that approaches less looking for better opportunities will do worse because his energy levels have been lower.

However, I found that the more experienced you become, this does not seem to matter. You can turn on your state out of your own control, and kill it despite not taking social strides beforehand, so to speak.

In other words, when I was a beginner, I had to listen to pump up music before heading out, engage in chats with people on the way to the bars, warm up approaches. Now, I can enter a club at peak time with no warm up and still do well, because of reference experience. If I tried this back then I doubt I would have been able to approach a single girl.

Just to add one more thing: The best way to improve is to head out on your own, sober. The more you do it the better. That is a true test of getting out of your comfort zone and improving, not only on a conscious but also subconscious level.

Nowadays I head out much, much less. 1x a month (winter), but even in the summer I'm lucky if I do 1x a week. I always have fun nights out. I went through a phase though that helped me get to this point. 2 years ago now I went out consistently, for 6-8 months of the year, at least 2x a week, sometimes up to 4x. Almost always sober.

That was a fundamental period for my night game. Now I no longer have to focus on it, I just go out and have fun.

Post: #3

If I have to do six approaches without getting something going, I consider I'm having a bad night.

I'm a definite sniper, and spend plenty of time just observing for the signs I and others have discussed here before that a girl is open to a SNL.

85% of my approaches at done at or very near the bar, since as you said it's just very natural and low pressure.

But I feel for the first year at least, newbies need to do a lot of approaches to lower their AA and to learn the patterns of how interactions develop and how they should respond. I don't consider someone an experienced cold approacher until they have at least 1000 approaches under their belt; they need to get that time on task to learn the techniques and reshape themselves psychologically.

Post: #4

I can't even fathom doing ten or more approaches.
I feel like even in a big club. Unless the interactive were only a minute each or something, I wild exhaust the room and look thirsty

Post: #5

Also, we have to consider everyone has their own type of game.

Some guys are really into conversation with girls in secluded areas of the bar, or in the patio.

Most of my night game happens on the dance floor. I like to dance with girls. For this reason, either my approaches will be unsuccessful and the interaction will last less than 10 seconds, or it will be, where it may last a few minutes to potentially the rest of the night.

When I take a more conversational approach, interactions last at least several minutes, where I can get a feel for the girl and decide if I want to keep the interaction going or not.

There is no best type of way to do night game, I've been out with guys rolling entirely different styles.

Post: #6

(01-18-2015 03:09 PM)Sourcecode Wrote:  My average routine is to move myself to a bar next to a girl and usually make some sort of joke about it taking forever to get a drink.

One technique I use (stolen from somewhere, possibly Bang?) is to make a bet that I'll get served before them.

If they're receptive I suggest making the 'bet' the loser pays for the other's drink.

The barmen in my normal spots know the deal so I rarely lose. If the girls cool I'll chat for a while, leave, then bring her a drink over later. If she's not I take the drink and go.

One of my boys used to have a late-night bar just outside of London. Was an absolute dive but was good for drugged up Uni chicks. My variation on the above was to make the bet then walk around the bar and pour the drinks myself. Always worked like a charm.

Post: #7

Tyler this is a great technique, will try it if I get to lockdown some place (my usual lockdown place in Lille got me banned for fighting..)

Post: #8

(01-18-2015 04:37 PM)Sourcecode Wrote:  I can't even fathom doing ten or more approaches.
I feel like even in a big club. Unless the interactive were only a minute each or something, I wild exhaust the room and look thirsty

I'm the exact same way. Depending on the bar size and busy-ness, and now that I carry myself as "a guy who isn't afraid to take you home and fuck her brains out", I know chics check me out and have some awareness of my behaviors when I enter (not out of self-doubt, but respect). Not all of them, but the ones who look around the room (potential targets).

It's why I use Tyler's method of sniping them at the bar. I just sidle up and have fun with them.

...but I don't dance like Nascimento. I would imagine that would allow way more approaches.

All that said, I do way more "bar, lower energy just out having drinks and having fun" than nightclub sorta game, so I'm admitting less experience with night/danceclub game.

Post: #9

I'm same as SourceCode.

5 approaches is a big night. I look for energy, what mood, the girl is in, how fucked her friends are... is she in a dancing drinking mood? Is she impatiently waiting for her fuck buddy to show up?

I make less approaches. I know there is all this talk about you never know until you escalate even if the chick acts cold. I think this is an outlier over-the-top theory to protect beginners against pussing out. The longer you game the more you can tell what chicks you vibe with and like. Yeah you can change your clown act to go after chicks that don't match your personality, but I see that as too much work. There are enough chicks with a wide enough spectrum of looks that I enjoy flirting with I don't force a square peg through a round hole.

I also don't consider an approach walking by some chick and high 5'ing her saying "let's party tonight!" and doing a 5 second dance off with her then moving on. That's not an approach. An approach is where you go in for the long haul to try to bang the chick that night.

Not be Running For Mayor.

Post: #10

If saying something to a girl counts as an approach then I have no idea how many I do because it's just socializing as Distant Light would say for example I might throw a comment like "hey what's this? I kind of like that..".

Personally I like to start with social proof and see who's who and what's what and later on it's a matter of who's available and what I want.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hkKURdjtIQ

It sounds like a lot of work and looks flashy/juvenile but it really doesn't have to be.

Low key bar/pub version: You chat up one girl/group and engage nearest girl/group in the conversation by asking relevant question or something. Then you introduce everyone to each other and merge them all. Very casual, friendly and socially acceptable move. And once you're IN you start gaming for real "from within".

Post: #11

How do you guys deal with approaching girls that are interested, but have multiple friends

Even when I go out with groups of friends, I prefer to break off from the group and approach solo.
* Its hard to find good wingmen..I feel like I do better alone.

The problem is, lately, I keep hitting groups of girls.. or a single girl i'll approach and then her friends pop up soon after.

I can't really keep a conversation going with 3 girls.. and entertain then all.
Im not trying to play clown for the group..especially when I only want one of them.
I feel like the other girls.. don't really want to let their friend go,cause they aren't getting anything.

*I've watched dudes approach girls.. and leave the friend out of the conversation, and the friend just stands around with that bored look on her face.. eventually..she'll make a excuse to block her friend

And I don't get a lot of great help from friends that might be floating around the club to run interference.

Post: #12

I'm lucky to have had phenomenal wingmen of several different types.


#1: the Little brother.
my younger brother is young, very tall, and very good looking. He is almost always too drunk and he is kind of an asshole, so he isn't going to steal the chick I'm talking to. Due to his looks women approach him pretty consistently, and then I take the girl's friend. Even if she does not have a friend, women see me and him talking to a girl, which makes me appear desirable. When he is not being approached, he shotguns (he is 27 yrs old) and its like a sacrificial bunt. He has opened a girl with sloppy drunk asshole game and I might then take her or I get her friend. My little brother is unaware that he is my wingman. He gets plenty of ass on his looks alone and going out in LA 3-5 nights per week for the past six years. He has easily had at least 300 different women at age 27. Serious. He came to stay with me in SF one month and I personally witnessed him have 10 one night stands over that month.


#2 the mouthpiece:
I have two friends (one coworker and one little brother) who speaks so quickly they sounds like auctioneers. Or con men. They can literally "hit it off" with anyone. They are snipers. And they will fuck anything. And they usually do. If I walk up to a 7 and her friend is a 5, these friends will not give a fuck. They are going in. They were both in the military. I wonder if that matters.


#3 the nice guy:
I have a coworker who is very innocent, talkative in a nonthreatening and totally nonsexual way, married, and extremely white. Women eat this up. He makes me look less sleazy because I'm just out having a drink with a married friend of mine. But he also makes me look like his cool friend because he is dressed like a married guy (north face jacket, button down shirt from target, wedding ring, beta beard, irrepressible smirk). I think it helps that he is very happily married. Any girl I talk to who has a friend still enjoys talking to this very obviously married man. I can see their eyes light up when they talk to him because 1) they imagine one day they will have a man like him and perhaps I will one day be like him, or 2) they want to see if they can get a married man to flirt with them.


#4 the lady friend:
I have a very good platonic female friend who I convince to go out with me. She is aware of my manwhoring and would never date me. But she would never rat me out. To outsiders I appear legitimate because I am out with a woman, so there is basically no bitch shield when I start talking to a woman. My roommate is a professional, attractive woman who is not so attractive that she will intimidate my targets. My other lady friend is a good friend of mine who is a feminine, attractive lesbian. She is a cross between wing type #4 and #2. I think it helps that both are extremely cute, very social, and enjoy a drink, but they are obviously not sexual or slutty looking. And they both look at me affectionately but do not look like they would ever let me smash.

I have noticed I attract different types of women based on who is wingmanning for me. My favorite wingmen as I get older are #s 3 and 4.

when solo, I am a sniper (<5 approaches per night). These 5 approaches usually get me 1-2 phone numbers with a high rate of return.

I usually dance by myself and lots of times a girl will come into my territory and want to dance. Or I'll casually approach as I walk past a girl on my way to the bathroom or dancefloor or whatever, implementing the 3 second rule. And I always approach a decent looking woman who eye fucks me. But that is not that often.

Post: #13

Hey guys, this is a good thread gone cold for some time. I would like to know how you create comfort with a girl in such loud environments as far as night game is concerned. Even isolating her doesnt help in a confined place like a pub. The live music from anywhere except the restrooms is deafening.

I find myself having to shout at her each time I talk to her and this doesnt help in building that connection needed for the next step. The only option I can see is to bring her out of the venue and this is difficult in the winter when it's freezing. What have your experiences been? Are girls willing to step out into the cold assuming you have successfully isolated them? Any other suggestions?

Thank you all.

Post: #14

In a loud environment, you create comfort by moving her around.

By your question, methinks you don't have a good picture of what all these terms mean in practice.

WIA

Post: #15

(07-27-2016 07:51 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  Hey guys, this is a good thread gone cold for some time. I would like to know how you create comfort with a girl in such loud environments as far as night game is concerned. Even isolating her doesnt help in a confined place like a pub. The live music from anywhere except the restrooms is deafening.

I find myself having to shout at her each time I talk to her and this doesnt help in building that connection needed for the next step. The only option I can see is to bring her out of the venue and this is difficult in the winter when it's freezing. What have your experiences been? Are girls willing to step out into the cold assuming you have successfully isolated them? Any other suggestions?

Thank you all.

I don't visit night game venues where talking isn't conducive at all. If you have to create comfort and can't go outside I would do it through dancefloor game where speaking isn't super emphasized.

Its summer I wouldn't worry about it right now... Just get to the point where you need to into comfort and ask her to go outside for a bit of fresh air.

Post: #16

(07-27-2016 07:59 AM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  In a loud environment, you create comfort by moving her around.

By your question, methinks you don't have a good picture of what all these terms mean in practice.

WIA

When I mean comfort, its more about getting to know her after the attraction phase. Mostly conversation on things things like what she wants to be or do, what she does currently, family etc. anything to create rapport basically and to agree and amplify what she feels about things while amping up the kino like palm reading etc.

Post: #17

Rapport isn't comfort, and you don't need rapport to bang.

But you do need it to screen. Screen for her logistics, dtf, LTR, and red flags. In better environments, you can get some of those out of the way before you flirt heavy.

With regard to rapport

She needs to be unguarded to tell you stuff that will put her in the one night stand only slot, or the harem box. Like in the rapport stage, if she lets slip that she cheats on her boyfriends - well you're not going to have a different experience if you become her boyfriend. I'd not react and encourage her more to speak (and mentally relive) on those exploits.

If you have the attraction, then the comfort, you can move her out of the venue. Good solid game can keep her motivated while you chat at the next location. (I've never understood guys that HAVE to get a girl straight from the club to their living room. Logistics doesn't mean just in time delivery)

So in a practical sense
- attract mostly non verbal
- build trust mostly non verbal
- trust aka comfort keeps building as you isolate her at the club, take her outside for a smoke or to get some air, and more trust builds as you say let's get a slice of pizza up the street, I'll bring you right back.

As the trust builds, because nothing bad is happening in her time with a cool dude - you're moving her to a quieter environment.

As the volume goes down, then you can start to build rapport. Within that bubble of attraction, trust, and rapport you can than delve into what makes her tick.

In general, building rapport can happen at any time, but prior to attraction, it turns you into the friend, not the lover.

The real issue, is having the balls to generate attraction non verbally, because it requires a fair amount of courage to really step to a girl in a direct fashion.

Verbal direct is ten times easier because it doesn't violate the social contract as much as getting into a girl's personal space and putting your paws on her. And keep in mind, most new players try to rapport their way into pussy like square guys.

When you watch the frat boys sneak attack grind sorority chicks on the dance floor, that's basically what's being attempted. They're going direct in a non verbal fashion. Rarely have I seen that work. But I've seen it work.

WIA

Post: #18

So how does one generate non verbal attraction?