Post: #1

Nothing new here to the stone cold seasoned players but still good that it is explained by a psychologist.

The advice I can give to guys out there is stop being friends with women. Treat them more as an acquaintance. The only women you do "favors" for ....are women that are giving you poosy. Not "promising" you poosy. Not fucked you once a while ago. Actually giving it up on the regular

How a Hopeful Lover Ends Up a Disappointed Friend

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/beau...ign=FBPost

The reasons are more complex than you think, but begin with timing.

Published on August 22, 2008 by Scott Barry Kaufman, Ph.D. in Beautiful Minds

"I think we should just be friends."

Those are seven of the most horrifying words a woman could ever utter to a man. These are also cringe-worthy:

"Yes, I slept with Bobby and not you, but that's because I respect you!"

Many men, upon hearing such a declaration, may think to themselves: "Please, stop respecting me!"

For many men and women, being rejected, especially sexually, is the greatest insult, worse than being called a jerk, a loser, or even a "bad friend." This makes some sense: Evolutionary psychologists (and others) would point out that sexual intercourse gets our genes passed on to the next generation, while friendly banter, in itself, cannot offer the same vehicle.



Why am I writing about this? I'm a serious intelligence and creativity researcher. But I am deeply interested in the role of creativity in human mating behavior, so some of these ideas are on the forefront of my mind. And I'm spurred on by a recent post by my esteemed colleague Michael J. Formica on the topic, "Pornography, Emotional Availability, and Female Objectification." His posts add much needed soul to life, and this one particularly struck a chord with me.

Formica argued that pornography is about the objectification of women and, for some men, can substitute for a real emotional connection. I agree with him that addiction to pornography can be a problem, especially when it interferes with forming desired emotional bonds. But it's important to bear in mind that the problem isn't with pornography itself, but, as Formica astutely points out, when that pornography acts as a substitute for real human contact.

More relevant to this post, he wrote:


"Most men who indulge themselves in pornography would be appalled—despite the immediate response—if their wife or girlfriend walked into the bedroom wearing fishnets, stilettos and a latex corset and wanted to get nasty."

I found this humorous but also thought-provoking. Thinking along these lines reframes, at least for me, the entire meaning of "The Friend Zone." Suddenly, comments such as "I didn't get nasty with you because I respect you," and, "Let's just be friends. I want to sleep with the milkman and you are getting in my way," make sense. The other person (male or female) actually does respect you, and that is the reason they don't want to have passionate sex with you. The problem (for you) is they respect you too much to see you as a sexual opportunity.

Formica framed his blog post in terms of the objectification of women, but objectification, of course, is an equal opportunity employer. Even if more men consume hardcore pornography than women, some women are quite capable of objectifying men in similar, or other ways, such as valuing them strictly for their wealth or fame.

My point is this: For many (if not most) individuals, the mystery and intrigue of meeting an attractive stranger is exciting, maybe even sexy. If we become too close to that person in a "friend way" too soon, we start caring about them in a way that isn't associated with sexual interest. If this emotional connection forms before at least a modicum of sexual attraction has, then that person may enter "The Friend Zone."

Of course, none of this means that if you have passionate sex with your interested partner that you don't care for or respect that person. For many healthy relationships, it's a normal way of expressing each other's love, devotion, and sensitivity to each other's desires. Here I only address the issue of "The Friend Zone"—that curious, poorly understood, and unfortunately, much under-researched place where one is cared about in a way that isn't sexual.

Of course, friends can (and do) develop into lovers. But this only happens when the long-time friend, for whatever reason, starts to be seen in a new light, as a sex object—among many other objects: social, emotional, etc. Indeed viewing someone as a sex object isn't in itself objectification; only when that's the only way you view them.

The reality is that being in "The Friend Zone" can be seen as an honor: It means you are well-respected, have formed an emotional connection with a person, and are thought of as nice, considerate, and dependable. These are valuable traits—I really mean that. They just aren't all that helpful if the recipient of the honor also feels a sexual attraction to its presenter.

Still, for many who get in the zone, it's easy to lose sight of how much of an honor it really is.

Post: #2

WTF?

No part of this article makes sense.

1) you don't need pornography to be a misogynist or have unhealthy attitudes towards women.

2) To be real, a "healthy" attitude towards women tends to pedestalize women, and that is just.as bad.

3) if a man has been placed, or more likely put himself in the friend zone, neither party is being honest. She's using him for his comfort and counsel, and he only offers that because he's trying to sleep with her. That's despicable from both sides, yet understandable.

4) it suggests that women do not respect the men that.they sleep with, and do respect the ones they don't. Quite the opposite.

This whole thing is a disgrace.

You can of course be actual friends with women, but being in the friend zone is the exact opposite of actually being friends.

The one bright spot mentioned is that you can get out when she sees you in a new light, of course he offers no workable solution on how to do that.

WIA

Post: #3

This seems to be some sort of friend zone rationalization piece.

Post: #4

Women put men in the friendzone because they consider them inferior mating material. Period.

They may like the guy but they don't respect him as a man. They fuck men they respect. They may or may not like the men they fuck.

Post: #5

(12-07-2014 01:23 PM)MrXY Wrote:  Women put men in the friendzone because they consider them inferior mating material. Period.

They may like the guy but they don't respect him as a man. They fuck men they respect. They may or may not like the men they fuck.

I'd add that women "invent" reasons via their hamster to dislike the ones they fuck.. it's like a subconscious reasoning to mentally stay attached to those they're fucking..

"I'd 'like' him but reasons X,Y,Z make him unlikable, and that much more fuckable because he doesn't fit any mold preconceived by women. But, I respect him all the same for being THAT guy, which includes all the unlikable parts I'll never change, but forever be trying to with the power I think my pussy wields."

Post: #6

Do you guys think men and women really can be "friends"?

Post: #7

I don't personally

I've considered that it may be a way to get exposure to other available females but this might only be a viable option if YOU friend zone the girl.

Post: #8

(12-07-2014 04:45 PM)RURALGAMER Wrote:  I don't personally

I've considered that it may be a way to get exposure to other available females but this might only be a viable option if YOU friend zone the girl.

This scenario could also arise when you get over whatever oneitis you have for the one who friendzoned you, and proceed to use her social circle or social proof for your own benefit.

In my experience, friendzoning a woman still converts them into acquaintances, not friends.

Post: #9

Her; "We should be friends"
Him: "Yeah, I agree. Bartender - another beer? Thanks."
Her: "One for me?"
Him: "Huh?"
Her: "Aren't you going to order one for me too? I thought we were friends?"
Him: "We are. My friends buy their own drinks."
Her: "Wha? So rude!"
Him: "Rude? You wanted to be friends, but didn't even ask me. If I needed a friend I'd get a dog."

Post: #10

(12-07-2014 01:23 PM)MrXY Wrote:  They may like the guy but they don't respect him as a man. They fuck men they respect. They may or may not like the men they fuck.

Not necessarily - think of all the self-described "male feminists" who get occasional sympathy bangs from actual feminists. Those women don't respect them any more than they would a dildo attached to a mannequin.

Post: #11

Men and women can't be friends. I just don't get it. Unless the meaning of 'friendship' has been changed to just 'talking by text'.

Post: #12

Another piece of joke from "psychology" experts. This whole industry is now full of scam and feminist supporters. Given that a lot of women major in psychology because they read "elle" magazine.

Anyways, what kinda position are you in when you are certainly not friendzoned but she doesn't want to sleep with you either?

I hit on a girl in salsa class once over a week. Kino at the top and tried several times to kiss her even though I don't really know the girl. One day I was getting her out to see me alone. And I made my intention already very clear that she comes alone. She called and said "I don't want to be your girlfriend. It's clear you want me for something more". Nexted without question.

Post: #13

I've told women this in the past: "All your male 'friends' secretly want to fuck your brains out."

You can be friends with a woman whom you feel no attraction towards. There's no such thing as being "friends" with someone you want.

Post: #14

Chris Rock offers red pill wisdom in a palatable wrapper. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zywIR_ZFLts

Post: #15

CS Lewis has insight in the the love between friends in his book The Four Loves (I recommend)...Philia

Quote:Philia (philía, Greek: φιλία) is the love between friends. Friendship is the strong bond existing between people who share common interest or activity.[11] Lewis immediately differentiates Friendship Love from the other Loves. He describes friendship as, "the least biological, organic, instinctive, gregarious and necessary...the least natural of loves"[12] - our species does not need friendship in order to reproduce - but to the classical and medieval worlds the more profound precisely because it is freely chosen.
...
Growing out of Companionship, friendship for Lewis was a deeply Appreciative love, though one which he felt few people in modern society could value at its worth, because so few actually experienced true friendship.

When you read that, do you think of W-W or W-M friendship?

Me neither.

The most common place to find this bond is between soldiers. Ugh, modern day specification....between male soldiers. Strongest when at war.

Post: #16

Chris Rock said women friends are just ones you haven't fucked YET.

Post: #17

(12-07-2014 03:43 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  Do you guys think men and women really can be "friends"?

Of course.

I don't have a female friend that is as close to me as my male friends, but I don't think that's by design, just by chance.

But I have female friends that
1) I don't want to sleep with
2) Don't want to sleep with me
3) That can have a good conversation and have a good time

The key is lack of sexual tension.

Do I know a lot of women who are basically users?
Only time the call is when they need something? Sure do.

But that's women being women.
Getting mad at a chick for being a chick is the height of insanity.

Since her birth, if she can't reach something on the counter, she gets someone bigger than her to do it. Trend continues until she's in the grave, and even then a bunch of men have to lower her into the depths of the earth.

She uses people to get what she wants.
She uses her charms and her insight on emotions to wring things out of people.
With men, she uses lust. With women she uses guilt or status, or any # of tricks up her sleeve.

At some point, little boys are taught to do shit for themselves, but that's part of socialization. By not relying on others, men grow up to be independent, but naturally socially isolated. The men who can get women to do what they want are players. The men who get men to do what they want run the entire society.

Women eventually learn to be self reliant, but it's not the universal lesson that's drummed into their heads like it is for boys.

And there are plenty of men who can't do shit for themselves, and lots of women who are actually independent. But just because you have all of one, doesn't mean you don't want some of the other...

*rant mode off*

WIA

Post: #18

A guy once told me, 'A female friend is just a woman you havent fucked yet.'

Post: #19

Does the author touch on the reason for a lack of sexual tension?

1. No game
2. Not in shape
3. Poorly dressed
4. Bad frame
Etc

The list goes on. The only time a girl should ever be trying to friendzone you is because she thinks you're too good to ever care about her and she doesn't want to be hurt when she gets pumped and dumped. And then you overcome her objections and pump and dump anyway

Post: #20

Post: #21

"I think we should just be friends. Those are seven of the most horrifying words a woman could ever utter to a man."

Can someone please explain to me how the hell the media began whitewashing the friendzone as a guy problem? This is bullshit. The premise of this entire article is based on a lie. Men friendzone women all the time but the "friendzone" is being used only to bash men.

1). Men friendzone women when they see them and don't think they're worth an approach. In this regard, men at least get conversations before they're friendzoned. Women get frozen out.

2). Men friendzone women when they talk to them but don't feel they're worth a number close.

3). Men friendzone women when they meet at a party but never follow up.

4). Men friendzone women they known when they're cool with saying "hi," but don't feel the woman is worth initiating a full conversation with.

5). Men friendzone women when they don't call for a second date.

6). Men friendzone women when they don't call the next day after sex.

7). Men friendzone the countless women they don't message on OKCupid and Match.com after seeing their profiles.

8). And finally, most of the millions and millions of men who can't be bothered to raise their own kids with single moms have friendzoned those women in some way.

Post: #22

^^^ But 1,2,3,4, and 7 could also be caused by anxiety/not knowing what to do/low T/whatever

Post: #23

(12-09-2014 09:02 AM)Days of Broken Arrows Wrote:  "I think we should just be friends. Those are seven of the most horrifying words a woman could ever utter to a man."

Can someone please explain to me how the hell the media began whitewashing the friendzone as a guy problem? This is bullshit. The premise of this entire article is based on a lie. Men friendzone women all the time but the "friendzone" is being used only to bash men.

1). Men friendzone women when they see them and don't think they're worth an approach. In this regard, men at least get conversations before they're friendzoned. Women get frozen out.

2). Men friendzone women when they talk to them but don't feel they're worth a number close.

3). Men friendzone women when they meet at a party but never follow up.

4). Men friendzone women they known when they're cool with saying "hi," but don't feel the woman is worth initiating a full conversation with.

5). Men friendzone women when they don't call for a second date.

6). Men friendzone women when they don't call the next day after sex.

7). Men friendzone the countless women they don't message on OKCupid and Match.com after seeing their profiles.

8). And finally, most of the millions and millions of men who can't be bothered to raise their own kids with single moms have friendzoned those women in some way.

Except for #8 these are all examples of rejection not friendzoning.

The core component of friendzoning is when the friendzonee is complicit in developing a surface level friendship after being explicitly rejected or after not having the balls to escalate to the point of rejection.

I do have some girls who I have friendzoned and kept as friends but it is rare. Most girls can not take the rejection since they have come to believe the lie that they can get sex whenever they want it or because their ego is so frail. Meanwhile there if you through a rock you would hit 10 guys that are currently in multiple friend zones.