Post: #151

This will be similar to the bailout... "The lesser evil is to save banks with taxpayer money, and then enact tough controls over banks so that this shit doesn't happen ever again". Then the project gets stalled as soon as it gets past the money part, and the clock is set for it to happen again in 15, 30 and 50 years.

Post: #152

Meanwhile, Japan has a less self-destructive prime minister

http://www.vdare.com/posts/shinzo-abe-for-president-3

Quote:On a recent television programme, Shinzo Abe was asked about one of Japan’s most politically delicate topics: immigration. Given that the population is shrinking and fewer than 2 per cent of residents are foreign, was it time for the country to throw open its doors?

The prime minister’s answer could hardly have been clearer – or more disheartening for advocates of a radical new embrace of outsiders.

This was because Abe got straight to reality:

“In countries that have accepted immigration, there has been a lot of friction, a lot of unhappiness both for the newcomers and the people who already lived there,” he told the audience, as he held up a white signboard marked with a red “x” to underscore his negative position on the issue.

Post: #153

(11-19-2014 07:36 PM)MidWest Wrote:  

(11-19-2014 07:07 PM)scorpion Wrote:  MidWest obviously falls into this camp as a leftist Mexican who is much more interested in flooding the United States with people who look like him than he is in preserving and respecting its laws.

Right, whatever you say man!

Let's try to discuss this without low-key attacking somebody personally, shall we? That will go a long way.

Why don't you attempt a rebuttal of what he said instead of posting gifs?

Are you not a person of Mexican descent who is politically left of center?

By supporting a unilateral, unconstitutional action by the president are you not making it abundantly clear that you do not give a shit about preserving and protecting this country's laws?

Post: #154

I'm surprised no one seems to discuss the real issue- it is already far, far too late.
Mexicans aren't the worst people to be invaded by anyway. I lived in California and Mexicans seems really nice for the most part. and I worked in prisons and even the Mexican criminals to the small degree I understand mostly prey on each other.


Anyway, it's too late because the LEGAL Hispanic vote (people who are here legally) are more than enough to sway any presidential election one way or the other in our exclusively two party system.

So BOTH parties have to pander to the Hispanic vote. The game's over.

Also, I know my ancestors were viewed as disgusting and primitive and meant the end of America. They did mean the end of Anglo-Saxon America. Which led to the greatest cultural achievements of America.

Most of our greatest composers -- Bernstein, Aaron Copeland--Jewish. Our greatest pop musicians-- Donald Fagen, Bob Dylan, Jimi Hendrix, John Coltrane-- Black or Jewish.

Sure Anglos were great-- Thomas Edison? Henry Ford who was reputed to be anti-Semitic but his cars still rane.

The point is a lot of very creative people came here and made us very powerful. It's not the end of the world or the country. Who here wants to bet on ISIS vs US? i don't know any objective way to measure body count, but who would you rather have as a team of bodyguards, Delta force operatives or ISIS recruits?

Anyone use GPS, assembly line manufactured products, vaccines....all invented in the USA

Post: #155

Arminius you have 2 posts and are attacking veteran members!? Troll!

Post: #156

(11-20-2014 12:18 AM)Matt Forney Wrote:  A lot of people have been pushing the argument that "Latinos will assimilate just like the Irish and Italians did!" and "America has taken in immigrants before and things turned out just fine!"

Allow me to advance a radical counter-argument: maybe the Irish, Italian and other immigrant groups shouldn't have been allowed to come here either.

The history of how European Catholic immigrants---and their political handlers---made America poorer and more corrupt in the 1800's has been completely erased from common knowledge. For example, everyone knows Tammany Hall as the corrupt Democratic political machine that ran New York (city and state) from the 1850's up to the Great Depression. What you don't know is that Tammany Hall maintained power through buying the votes of immigrants and white ethnics (Irish, Italians, Poles etc.) through patronage, graft and gimmedats. Sound familiar? Pretty much every other major Northern city (Chicago, Boston etc.) was controlled by machines who played the exact same game.

Tammany Hall was swept from power in the 1930's only because Fiorello LaGuardia, Thomas Dewey and other Republicans forged an electoral alliance with the crypto-communist American Labor Party, since there weren't enough Republicans in NYC to win on their own. Let me repeat that: a Democratic political machine powered by immigrant and ethnic votes was so powerful that the GOP had to ally with COMMUNISTS to get them out of office. Additionally, the anti-Tammany Republicans were supported by FDR; even the national Democrats had gotten sick of Tammany's antics. I'd argue that the immigration reforms passed in the 1920's also helped crush ethnic political machines by drying up their supply of potential votes and forcing the remaining ethnics to assimilate.

Not only that, as Jim Goad wrote in The Redneck Manifesto, corporations have been using immigrants to drive down wages and dilute the power of organized labor since the 19th century. During the Industrial Revolution, coal-mining companies, railroads and other corporations promoted immigration as a way to break the power of unions and ensure themselves a never-ending supply of scabs who would work for next to nothing.

Labor is a commodity, and like all commodities, it's subject to the law of supply and demand. By flooding the country with immigrants (workers), the price of labor (wages) goes down and vice versa. Labor laws and minimum wages can mitigate this somewhat, but there's no escaping the basic laws of economics. This is why in places where labor is scarce, such as North Dakota and Alaska, wages are higher than the national average. This is why unions such as the AFL-CIO used to viciously oppose immigration.

I imagine most of the pro-amnesty/pro-immigrant folks here are of a leftist bent, meaning you support unions, workers' rights and a higher minimum wage. Agitating for workers' rights while supporting adding 20 million workers to the labor pool is like trying to heal a broken leg by shooting yourself in the head. Every amnesty/immigration proponent is a tool for increased corporate power and wealth inequality, and most of them don't even know it.

The Ellis Island mythology is just that: a lie. Your "legal" immigrant ancestors came here for exactly one reason: to make the rich richer and the poor poorer. Immigration restriction in the 1920's was part of what made the "American Dream" and the middle-class prosperity of the post-World War II era possible. If corporations get their way (and thanks to the idiocy of the modern left, they will), your children will be just as poor and living in just as much squalor as the ethnics of the Gilded Age.

Viva la Estados Unidos de America!

"Allow me to advance a radical counter-argument: [i]maybe the Irish, Italian and other immigrant groups shouldn't have been allowed to come here either."

I'm Italian-American and agree with this. My reasons are different though. The Irish and Italian immigrants were Catholic and I think upping the Catholic population altered the way Americans think. Self-sufficiency went out the window and was replaced by "charity" and ideas about "social justice."

Even though our current day SJWs are not Catholic in what they believe or what they do, their ambition to "change the world," I believe, was influenced by the mindset of Catholicism.

On top of all that, the Irish gave us Senator Ted Kennedy, who promoted the The Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965 (devised by the half-Jewish/half-Catholic Sen. Emanual Celler and Catholic Sen. Phillip Hart). This liberal piece of legislation changed the face of the country by throwing open the doors to more immigrants than ever. This set the groundwork for what we're dealing with now.

Post: #157

(11-20-2014 03:53 AM)Brian Shima Wrote:  Arminius you have 2 posts and are attacking veteran members!? Troll!

I thought the same thing at first, but he has a very valid point.

Post: #158

(11-20-2014 03:27 AM)Arminius Wrote:  

(11-19-2014 07:36 PM)MidWest Wrote:  

(11-19-2014 07:07 PM)scorpion Wrote:  MidWest obviously falls into this camp as a leftist Mexican who is much more interested in flooding the United States with people who look like him than he is in preserving and respecting its laws.

Right, whatever you say man!

Let's try to discuss this without low-key attacking somebody personally, shall we? That will go a long way.

Why don't you attempt a rebuttal of what he said instead of posting gifs?

Because frankly right now I'm too lazy. Why try to offer a rebuttal when the guy was clearly going off of emotion and has already developed his bias. Nothing I say or do will change that.

Quote:Are you not a person of Mexican descent who is politically left of center?

Its a little suspicious that you having only posted twice on this forum somehow can come to this conclusion about me, quite honestly its a little creepy.

Quote:By supporting a unilateral, unconstitutional action by the president are you not making it abundantly clear that you do not give a shit about preserving and protecting this country's laws?

Well I've said this before and i'll say it again, these illegals weren't going anywhere anyway. So yes I do support the action because all its doing is bringing them out of the shadows. If you look at the big picture nothing will change really. These people are already here working so whatever.


Nice attempt of trying to bait me though.

Post: #159

(11-19-2014 10:17 PM)MidWest Wrote:  

(11-19-2014 09:05 PM)Tuthmosis Wrote:  If enough Mexicans come maybe Americans might finally learn something about how to keeping their intransigent, cunty women in check. Because those dudes don't fuck around with bitches who can't cook, attention-whore with hand-written signs on Twitter, or come at them with "snarky" mouths, feminist bullshit, or "open relationships." Last time I heard, there was no hint of a "campus rape crisis" and "affirmative consent" in Mexico. That noise would disappear right quick.

If that's the case, I'm all for it. I'd like to see these bitches kicked back into submission with one of those Norteño boots.



One of my Mexican friends sent me this shit, with a translation, a while back:

Quote:Long Live the Wetbacks
By Los Tigres del Norte (the Tigers of the North)

Because we are the wetbacks
the law is always looking for us
because we are illegal
and we don't speak English
the stubborn gringo throws us out
and we come back
If they throw one out through Laredo,
ten come in through Mexicali
If they throw one out through Tijuana
Six come in through Nogales
Just go ahead and take account
of how many of us enter every month

Our problem is easy to fix
Just give us a white girl,
so we can get married
and as soon as we get that card
go ahead and get divorced

When the wetback
goes on strike to never return
who will pick the onion,
lettuce or beets?
The lemon and the grapefruit
will all go bad.

All these nightclubs,
will all get closed
Because if the wetback leaves
who will come to dance?
And besides four white guys
no one will be able to console them

Long live all of the wetbacks
the ones about to emigrate
the ones that go on vacation
and the ones that are just passing through
and the ones who are going to marry
to make arrangements.

Haha, this is the funniest post i've seeing in a while. I just can't stop laughing. Funny thing is that I actually have an uncle who married a white girl and then got divorced just for the green card.

That was hilarious.

I do not see the humor in any of this.

Post: #160

So basically our leaders want to turn the US into a Latin American style country where there's a large underclass and a small rich elite. Similar to how my city LA looks right now.

And a large number of these women are unattractive and get fat within a few years because they dont have a fitness culture.

Post: #161

(11-20-2014 03:37 AM)iknowexactly Wrote:  I'm surprised no one seems to discuss the real issue- it is already far, far too late.
Mexicans aren't the worst people to be invaded by anyway. I lived in California and Mexicans seems really nice for the most part. and I worked in prisons and even the Mexican criminals to the small degree I understand mostly prey on each other.

I have to disagree with this. I live in Phoenix and used to live in Los Angeles.
There is nothing more depressing to me than seeing once great neighborhoods deteriorate into third world scumtowns.

Here is a photo of Maryvale developer “John F Long” with Ronald Reagan in 1958, selling new homes to World War II veterans who were lined up for blocks.



50 years later, Maryvale is a total shithole, one of the highest crime areas in Phoenix. Aside from the occasional meth addict, almost every car theft, robbery, rape and shooting in Phoenix is committed by an illegal immigrant or one of their zillion teenage offspring gangsters(the american born children of illegals are considered "citizens.")

On my experience living in Los Angeles nearly 20 years ago, I wrote this(which later appeared in a longish piece I wrote called "Scumtown" for a self published book of poetry and essays)

Quote:On my first full day in Los Angeles,
my first impression was a Sears on Santa Monica and Western
which I would come to refer to as "third world Sears."
There were hordes of people stampeding throughout the place,
and clothing strewn about everywhere, with reckless disregard
for the generally accepted and often excessively anal standards
of your average department store. This is not your average
department store, but as the US continues its transition toward
becoming a third world country, where such refugee camp swap meets represent normalcy, it soon may be. I wasn't thinking about that, though. All I could think of was that at one time it must have been a wonderful store, and anyone involved in the building of the building
or who had worked there in it's heyday would be appalled and saddened
at the looted corpse of an establishment it had become.
More comically, there is a place on Sunset called "The All American
Burger," where there literally did not appear to be one American working there.

I thought about that Sears a lot. It was a beautiful old building in the heart of the city. I thought about how proud the people must have been the day they finished building it. I went there to buy some jeans thinking it was going to be a normal department store, but when I walked in, there piles of clothing and products literally everywhere. You couldn't even walk through the place....just a total disaster and it was as if the employees and the swarms of Spanish speaking customers were completely oblivious to it, like it was a standard for an establishment that they were just fine with. I was somewhat against it before then, but that was my red pill moment on immigration.. where I just said to myself "hell no, I'm not down with this."

Most people think of California as liberal, but Southern California was once a bastion of Barry Goldwater conservatism, and look at it now? Look at Anaheim, where Disneyland is. It's garbageville. Same with the high desert, the San Fernando Valley, Riverside, I could go on and on.

Here is the telling Urban Dictionary entry for Pomona, CA:

Pomona:
a ghetto ass place, where it use to be such a popular and lovely place. it was an attraction for stars, but not anymore.. now its an attraction for the cholos and shit. its mostly hispanics, some blacks and cambos, and fewww whites.
aye foo, where'd my homie go?

he went to some kickback in pomona.

That's the new California. If you're super rich you can live in one of the pockets of gated communities and price out the riff raff and isolate yourself from the richness of mass immigration...for a while, until they vote away enough of your money or the public schools become so ghetto that you decide to move.

We don't need to import millions of impoverished people from ragtag third world countries. We have all that we need and then some.

Post: #162

It really is amazing that every place leftist socialism/communism is instituted the same results happen.

The middle class gets destroyed. The poor get poorer and then more violent. The tax base dries up, and so do hand outs. And the wealthy elite build gated castles with private security.

In the end you have mass starvation and eventually the entire country collapses into chaos.

The leftist economic model might be the most evil invention in mankind. And there is no stopping it once you turn a Republic into a Democracy. Once women and the weaker men vote, they will vote in more govt. and the pattern starts over again.

Which SHOULD be the larger concern of anyone who would support this or the Democrats in general. The end result in 10 to 25 years will be damn ugly for them and their families. History has already shown this to be true and we are seeing the same patterns in the USA now.

Post: #163

Undocumented LA County Parents On Pace To Receive $650M In Welfare Benefits

LOS ANGELES (CBSLA.com) — A projected $650 million in welfare benefits will be distributed to illegal alien parents in 2013, county officials said Monday.

Supervisor Michael D. Antonovich announced the latest figures from the Department of Public Social Services, which showed more than $376 million in CalWORKs benefits and food stamps combined have been distributed through July to illegal alien parents for their native-born children.

Approximately $54 million in welfare payments are issued each month, consisting of nearly $20 million in CalWORKs and $34 million in food stamp issuances, according to the data.

An estimated 100,000 children of 60,000 undocumented parents receive aid in Los Angeles County, according to Antonovich, who said this year’s projections — up about $1 million from the nearly $53 million in total benefits issued in July 2012 — underscore the economic impact of the nation’s immigration debate.

“When you add the $550 million for public safety and nearly $500 million for healthcare, the total cost for illegal immigrants to county taxpayers exceeds $1.6 billion dollars a year,” Antonovich said in a statement. “These costs do not even include the hundreds of millions of dollars spent annually for education.”

Post: #164

Ok, no welfare and new citizenship acquisitions for all the criminals and poor people who aren't even trying to land a job.

But what about all the guys who work a decent job, pay taxes, are assimilated, mainly speak English, and totally behave like white Americans, except for the skin color and the accent maybe?

No citizenship for them even after decades of staying in the US without causing any trouble, and contributing to the society?

Post: #165

Mikado, I served in the Army with a Columbian citizen who was brought to the US illegally by his parents. I felt awful for him - he spoke perfect American English, he lived and loved the culture, and was in every way 100% American. Great friend of mine. But at the end of the day, he was illegal.

Military service is a great way to earn your keep. Anyone who is willing to shed their blood for the US deserves a shot at citizenship. Those that aren't willing can get the fuck out. For amnesty to work, something needs to be offered by these people in return.

Post: #166

(11-19-2014 08:37 PM)WD-40 Wrote:  

(11-19-2014 08:07 PM)scorpion Wrote:  There is simply no way to defend what Obama is doing as being in any way, shape or form in the best interests of the citizens of the United States. It's pure destruction.

.
OK, let me put it to you this way:

Do you think that deporting U.S. citizens to foreign soil just because they are minors and their parents happen to be illegal aliens is OK?

How can it possibly be in the best interests of citizens of the United States to allow fellow citizens to be deported?

An unpopular opinion: if you were born from an illegal immigrant that came here ready to pop you out, you don't deserve US citizenship.

Post: #167

If a list was made ranking the worst 5 presidents in the history of the US, Obama would come in 1st or 2nd. This law is definitely not in the interest of your average American citizen.

Post: #168

(11-19-2014 11:39 PM)DChambers Wrote:  The President has to all effects declared war upon the Congress of the United States. He has taken upon himself the powers of a king, and the mantle of a tyrant. The President cannot legally override any law or part of a law that has been legally made. His powers are Constitutionally restricted to Executing laws. Executive orders are meant only to affect the executive branch of government and assist in carrying out his Constitutional duties.

The great argument of the President's supporters is that Bush Jr. and many other Presidents have expanded the powers of their office . That may be so, and if those tyrants were afflicting the nation today I would speak against them with the same righteous fury I do against the current. None of the Presidents before now have acted with such disdain for the Congress, or so obviously disregarded the Constitution. Some will say Regan offered amnesty, but he did only with regards to a law passed by Congress.

It is the Duty of Congress to hold this President accountable for his crimes against the nation. Were they worthy of their positions they would declare the President an Enemy of the United States and raise the legions against him as the Roman Senate did of old against Caesar. But our representatives seem to be made of far weaker mettle than the Ciceros' and Brutiis' of old.

I'm also reminded of Charles I's spats with the English Parliament. He couldn't negotiate, didn't know how to turn popular or parliamentary opinion to his favor, and dissolved the people's parliament, raising taxes without the consent of parliament (like the infamous ship money), and essentially sidelining and alienating much of his natural support base.

When he needed to finally call a parliament again in 1640 to deal with troubles in Scotland and Ireland, unsurprisingly he found himself facing anger. He didn't know how to deal with it, considering such opposition an assault on his person and even attempted to arrest MPs that disagreed with him on charges of treason.

The gauntlet was thrown and parliament raised an army to defend itself against the king and prevent such abuses of power. It went completely haywire of course, but the principle began with good intentions.

Obama in some ways reminds me of Charles I. He's narcissistic and does not know how to negotiate. For all the talk of people like Reagan and Clinton (who himself had a lot of trouble with congress), they were still likeable people that were able to negotiate. I have never seen a president in recent times show such open, Charles I-like contempt for congress as I have seen this one show.

He at least attempted to do the right thing and pass a law before, but now suddenly the mid terms don't go his way and he can't deal with it?

We must remember that the 1986 amnesty was at least passed in pursuant to an act of congress. This executive order is unilateral and arbitrary. Obama can basically declare a de facto amnesty by refusing to enforce laws, but I have no idea where he gets the power to suddenly declare 5 million people legal by his own decree.

This is a very blatant insult and assault on congress, but we know they won't do anything. They won't be like the Long Parliament was in 1642. Obama will bullshit something from his team of lawyers, the GOP will balk and whine but ultimately do nothing, and the same corporate interests that control both of them will be served, and yet another shot at the Constitution will have successfully been fired.

Same old story, same old song and dance.

Post: #169

(11-20-2014 02:41 AM)Feisbook Control Wrote:  I have two thoughts on this.

The first is that the very people who will get completely screwed by this -- low wage workers of all colours, but especially blacks, and (white) tech workers -- will be those most fervently defending this. Why? Because the rank and file on the right oppose it. Everyone will line up tribally, and so the left will line up against their own interests just because. As Tuthmosis pointed out, it's a brilliant divide and conquer strategy.

The second thought is that I wonder who this benefits, besides the political and business interests within the US. Matt Forney (I think it was) mentioned that China and others must be laughing their arses off as the US repeatedly hits the self-destruct button. I'd also be very interested to see, over the next five to ten years, the US emigration numbers. My guess is that Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Singapore, Chile, Uruguay and maybe some others will be huge beneficiaries of all of this as the skilled/entrepreneurial middle class (whites) of the US engage in the ultimate (white) flight. Some of these countries (e.g. Chile) are actively trying to poach the cream of the US through incentive programmes for entrepreneurs. Likewise, I would not be surprised at all to see much of Silicon Valley decamp to Singapore within a generation. Of course, there will still be a Silicon Valley, but as it gets increasingly buddy-buddy with big government and attracts a lot of people looking for what they perceive to be a/the safe life in the US, it will become increasingly sclerotic and the real action and innovation will occur somewhere else.

Funny you say that.

I actually once tried to move to Singapore and do IT consulting from there instead of staying in the US. I ultimately decided to stay here and bring my wife here. I kinda of regret that now. Singapore does not have alot of space and it is still too expensive for most things. Since South China is just a short flight, I still might think about this option and live in China with my wife, or bounce back and forth. I dunno. I want to do something though. I think I have about 5-10 years before US living might get worst.

I wonder when the super rich are going to start building large walls to isolate themselves from the violent poor? Are they going to start having armed checkpoint guards at all the chokepoints? Detroit suburbs are somewhat like that now. This country is going to become one huge ghetto. I hope I am wrong, but it's hard to see any differences. Like Samseau said, others will see this and attempt the same thing. Soon the only border control will be where the millionaires and billionaires live.

Post: #170

(11-19-2014 07:15 PM)Chapped3rdEye Wrote:  Most people don't understand this, but illegals who make it to the US interior and don't get arrested for something are very rarely deported. Something like 10,000 a year are deported out of a population of 10+mil. The biggest change Obama is proposing is probably the additional 500,000 high-tech work visas. That's what Mark Zuckerberg and the other Silicon Valley immigration supporters have been after. They want cheaper programmers. Anyway, this is the endgame we're moving toward:

Holy fuck, that book predicted everything that's happening today, back in 1997!!!

Top reviewer:

Quote:Thomas Chittum's "Civil War II" is not for the weak minded or squemish. Chittum, a retired special forces veteran and freedom fighter, paints a horrfiying, but probable future for the United States as a nation state.
Chittum starts out by asking the reader to figure out which "tier" you belong to in the new order. If you are a member of the white working class you will immediatly understand what Chittum means. The "International Bureaucratic Elite" are the ones destroying America and creating an empire for their own purposes,power and greed. To do this the white working class must be degraded to third class citizens. This will be done through "racist affimative action",politcal correctness, and outright tyranny. Since whites are the economic and racial backbone of America, they must go.
Chittum further relates how illegal immigration, racial politics, and cowardly and devious politicians , are exploiting the ethnic tensions already present from "multiculturalism" The Mexican "reconquista" of the American Southwest is happening at lightning speed and within 20 years whites will no longer be the majority in those states. A revolution in Mexico is predicted within 15-20 years which will be a spark for a "Aztlan republic" and outright secession. Along with this will come a brutal race war between whites and blacks in the America south.
Chittum draws a map of new America showing the probable breakdown of the new ethnic nations: the Northwest and Midwest a white European nation, the South a black one, and the Southwest hispanic. He also describes how black and hispanic street gangs( the Gangster Disciples of Chicago 50,000 strong) will be the new ethnic militias along with white militias forming for self defense. He reccomends white Americans, when the time comes, form Committees of Correspondence with other white communities for self-defense and cooperation. He also advises any whites living in the South or Southwest to get their affairs in order and move out the Northwest before the shooting starts.
If this books sounds pessimistic, it is. It is also a warning to America and the International Elite who are creating the conditions for this race war: affirmative action, racial politics, blatant discrimination against the majority whites,
destruction of the white working class, gun control, and the feudalisation of society through ethnic "tiering" and annhilation of the Bill of Rights. Chittum predicts this to begin about 2020 or so. He believes ethnic riots in Los Angeles or a city with a large black population during the summer will be the spark. The USA will degenerate into anarchy shortly after this as the Federal government seeks to regain order. Not a pretty picture.
This book is a warning, so prepare yourself.

http://www.amazon.com/Civil-War-Two-Brea...dp_product

Post: #171

^^^ It is a good book. I have a copy. If anyone would like me to mail it to them feel free to PM me.

Post: #172

(11-20-2014 08:20 AM)Libertas Wrote:  

(11-19-2014 11:39 PM)DChambers Wrote:  The President has to all effects declared war upon the Congress of the United States. He has taken upon himself the powers of a king, and the mantle of a tyrant. The President cannot legally override any law or part of a law that has been legally made. His powers are Constitutionally restricted to Executing laws. Executive orders are meant only to affect the executive branch of government and assist in carrying out his Constitutional duties.

The great argument of the President's supporters is that Bush Jr. and many other Presidents have expanded the powers of their office . That may be so, and if those tyrants were afflicting the nation today I would speak against them with the same righteous fury I do against the current. None of the Presidents before now have acted with such disdain for the Congress, or so obviously disregarded the Constitution. Some will say Regan offered amnesty, but he did only with regards to a law passed by Congress.

It is the Duty of Congress to hold this President accountable for his crimes against the nation. Were they worthy of their positions they would declare the President an Enemy of the United States and raise the legions against him as the Roman Senate did of old against Caesar. But our representatives seem to be made of far weaker mettle than the Ciceros' and Brutiis' of old.

I'm also reminded of Charles I's spats with the English Parliament. He couldn't negotiate, didn't know how to turn popular or parliamentary opinion to his favor, and dissolved the people's parliament, raising taxes without the consent of parliament (like the infamous ship money), and essentially sidelining and alienating much of his natural support base.

When he needed to finally call a parliament again in 1640 to deal with troubles in Scotland and Ireland, unsurprisingly he found himself facing anger. He didn't know how to deal with it, considering such opposition an assault on his person and even attempted to arrest MPs that disagreed with him on charges of treason.

The gauntlet was thrown and parliament raised an army to defend itself against the king and prevent such abuses of power. It went completely haywire of course, but the principle began with good intentions.

Obama in some ways reminds me of Charles I. He's narcissistic and does not know how to negotiate. For all the talk of people like Reagan and Clinton (who himself had a lot of trouble with congress), they were still likeable people that were able to negotiate. I have never seen a president in recent times show such open, Charles I-like contempt for congress as I have seen this one show.

He at least attempted to do the right thing and pass a law before, but now suddenly the mid terms don't go his way and he can't deal with it?

We must remember that the 1986 amnesty was at least passed in pursuant to an act of congress. This executive order is unilateral and arbitrary. Obama can basically declare a de facto amnesty by refusing to enforce laws, but I have no idea where he gets the power to suddenly declare 5 million people legal by his own decree.

This is a very blatant insult and assault on congress, but we know they won't do anything. They won't be like the Long Parliament was in 1642. Obama will bullshit something from his team of lawyers, the GOP will balk and whine but ultimately do nothing, and the same corporate interests that control both of them will be served, and yet another shot at the Constitution will have successfully been fired.

Same old story, same old song and dance.

The parallels to certain other periods in time are uncanny.

I am very sad today. I was sitting with my grandparents in the living room reading the paper this morning. I couldn't contain myself when I read the front page which was talking about Executive Amnesty.

My grandfather and I got into it good. He couldn't even deny it was illegal, his only argument was that Congress had failed to act so now the President had to. I think I must have looked upon him in abject horror. That someone can rationalize away the Constitution like that.

This is perhaps the crowning example of what the incremental centralization of powers can do. A generation ago the people would have risen up in arms against what the President is doing, now through years of slow abuse such tyranny barely merits to them a passing thought.

Post: #173

For me this has become a quality of life debate. America is the world's whore, problem is, after everyone's had her, being in her presence is no longer enjoyable. Make sense? Sure back in the early-mid 18-1900s we welcomed immigrants, to make the country quickly become prosperous and powerful.

Just because it's been a policy in past decades, doesn't necessarily mean At 330m+ and 10x past solvent national debt loads, that increasing the "allowed" population gives us a better sample size for ambitious-minded-bodied human assests / intellectual capital, than we can already draw from. Not so sure ...

I think the best of the best, should they want to be part of the US, would find a way here out of desire, not desperation.

Also, how many public-sector systems can we press for more services we already fail to provide the current citizens? I've got absolutely no qualms against the Mexican/Hispanic population.. the timing of this amnesty is not good for an overspent nation however.

Post: #174

(11-20-2014 02:54 AM)Deluge Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 02:41 AM)Feisbook Control Wrote:  Matt Forney (I think it was) mentioned that China and others must be laughing their arses off as the US repeatedly hits the self-destruct button.

China is doing the same now, they've started bringing in workers from Africa to manufacturing cities like Guangzhou to try and boost their shrinking workforce.

That's a silly idea that will only come back to haunt them. Those people (if they're allowed to stay) will only get old too. The constant emphasis on growth is a giant ponzi scheme that every country, including or especially China, will have to address at some point if it wants any kind of quality of life and doesn't want to devolve into a Malthusian nightmare.

On the other hand, if the plan is to either keep them there as permanent second class citizens or limit the amount of time each worker can spend in the country before being sent home, they'll eventually end up with a population of foreign youngsters who will create all sorts of social problems once they get sick of being the local whipping boys, not to mention various foreign concern trolls sticking their noses in.

What China should be doing is one of three things. It should be thinking of changing the definition of retirement, benefits, etc. so that old people can still contribute to society without thinking that they're going to sit on their arses and being looked after by younger generations. I know that in Japan there are legions of old people engaged in volunteer work such as recycling and other low level service sector jobs. That's actually more healthy for them in retirement anyway as it keeps them physically and socially active. Another angle China should be pursuing is mechanisation and generally putting in place infrastructure that is efficient for old people. Given that they're building their infrastructure now, they have the possibility of doing it right the first time, rather than trying to retrofit it as many nations that are already developed will have to do. The third thing, of course, is to transition from the world's maker of plastic shit into something requiring actual skills rather than just the ability to endure sixteen hour sweatshop shifts. Trying to cling desperately to what has worked for the past thirty years is a race to the bottom that they can't win. Having been able to take such work off other wealthier, more developed East Asian nations, they should realise that for exactly the same reasons, they can't stop poorer, less developed nations from doing the same to them in turn. Of course, this is all pie in the sky. China won't do any of this and will consequently be fucked, stalled in a middle income trap (if they're lucky) in a couple of decades.

To bring this back on track, low skilled, foreign immigration from radically different cultures is never going to work for any country, be it the US or China. Immigration, in so far as it exists, should have at least two basic conditions attached to it. The first is that it should be of net benefit to the per capita standard of living (not just GDP, but even with GDP there should be a per capita increase). There's no point bringing in people who are going to make things on average worse, whether that's economically, socially, environmentally or anything else. One of the things that annoys me more and more every time I go back to Australia (a place that does immigration far better than the US) to visit my family is what a huge rat race full of people crammed in like sardines it has become in its cities. I don't want high density urban planning and I don't want urban sprawl. How about liveable cities instead?

The second point is that it should be at a sufficiently low level that the people can be readily assimilated through natural processes, rather than changing the existing culture, be it through that culture making concessions to the immigrants or having to fight against them. The Japanese prime minister has it right in noticing that the mass immigration in much of the West over the past half century has been a colossal cluster fuck. He's sensible for being hesitant to see that as something worth embracing.

Post: #175

What do BIG corporations want? More profit and cheap labour, by bringing the cheap labour into the country they save money.

Big Corporations run America (world) and they put the politicians into power and pass the laws that suit them.
The politicians talk on one side of their mouths in front of the camera, the reality they do not care about the country or the people.

Comparing China and Japan to America is stupid, America has always been a immigrant country. China was communist and America is heading that way real soon. China was the testing ground and Japan cannot support immigration.