Post: #1

Hello guys,
I’m looking here for some advice regarding opening problems and how to deal with negative and hostile reaction from women to stay motivated.
I’m not new to the game and have been already approaching a ton of women within the last few years. I’ve tried different kinds of openers and lately used more high energy and a bit more direct openers to match with the high energy in night clubs. I’m able to hold a conversation once I open succesfully. But the overall results are pretty discouraging.
Not only that I get rejected 80% of the time on the opening, I also have to deal with mocking hostile reactions all the time .
I’m really asking myself if I somehow come across as threatening or unconsciously do something that disgust most women so that they respond protectively. The irony is that I use rather indirect openers so that I can avoid that. If I would use super direct and aggressive Openers I would totally understand their responses. Maybe it’s due to my subcommunication, I come in pretty strong with a super loud (kinda yelling) voice. But I have to… those nightclubs are just really loud.

Or is it possible that women in western Europe use this as an default way to get rid off guys? Like as if they punish men (who they don’t view valuable enough) on autopilot. They have the power and they feel they can get away with it, especially when the man is perceived as low value. I can totally understand if they don’t view someone as a mating option, but if that’s their preferred way to reject guys then I have to say it’s really UGLY… they don’t just reject you, they also TRY to drop your self-esteem from under you. I thought I was pretty normal (just a bit shy) but since I’ve been treated like a piece shit all the time I’m somehow questioning my own dignity as a man already.

I would love to hear some opinions from average players out there.
Maybe some of you has gone through the same problem and can tell me how low the the tolerance for errors is. I fear it would probably take me months of hard practice to improve all the subtle elements in subcommunication / delivery so that I avoid triggering the above responses. But I’m somehow loosing my motivation and my desire/ passion already, it’s painful and putting my desire to test. Whenever the mocking in the field happens I stay unaffected and keep my cool and stay friendly. But when I go to sleep I have all these mocking angry girl faces going through my head. It’s kinda paralyzing and I don’t know if it’s worth putting in all that effort just to have intimacy with this kind of creatures... I'm really loosing my desire. It’s like I’ve seen the women’s dark side too often and experienced too much hostility. I hope there’s an at least equal good side to discover (besides their bodys) once you have gone through their shield.
Do you have some advice on how to rebuild my passion?

I would definitely keep practicing game for truth seeking and to improve my social skills.

Thank you

Post: #2

How does your usual approach look like? I mean the time between you notice the target until you start talking with her.

I have noticed just lately, that if I choose a target and then have a second thought for a millisecond, they most likely won't even speak with me when I approach her/them.

Post: #3

The problem is that its all mental and everyone is different. I don't think there's anything anyone here can tell you to make you not give a fuck and I won't pretend that I don't either. At least you're out there approaching!


If you're that worried start going after "low value" women.

Post: #4

As above, the key questions is how are you approaching them? What are you saying? Are you looking them in the eye or up and down when you approach?

If you're having a dry spell go for some "low hanging fruit" to get yourself back in the game and get some runs on the board.

I've been shot down a few times, it goes with the territory, but I've not experienced consistent shutdowns that are designed to humiliate. Most girls are relatively polite with their rejection, at least in Australia where I operate.

Post: #5

Here is how my usual approach looks like:
I hang out at the bar with my friend and try to relax without looking like I'm scanning the room. When I see a girl or a group of girls I will usually start to approach them immediately (in any case within 3 seconds). I walk up to them without any hesitation in a circular fashion (45 degree) and open slightly over the shoulder with a smile on my face when I say "Hi"... and then deliver my opener

- if its a more high energy environment and they seem to be in a good mood:
I use a more direct approach
... you seem fun/nice... I had to come over to say HI
==> Than continue with Teases and Buying Temperature Material if possible.

- if it's a more lounge type environment I often use an Opinion Opener:
... let's make a poll / I need your female opinion .... e.g. Jaleous Girlfriend Opener. When using Opinion Openers I use a FTC, Root the opener and have some interesting input ready

Thats pretty much following MM guidelines. I take care that I don't lean in, that I speak loud enough and that I speak slowly and with pauses. I definetly make eye contact with all the members of the group.

But most of the time its an uphill battle from the start... they are sceptical from the start and will do everything whats effective to get rid of me. I often percieve them like they enjoy to punish me for trying...
While I was sarging in the USA (LA) the girls seemed to be way more friendly and open to my approach.

I have also approached "low hanging fruit" but they aren't so easy to get either. They get approached very consistently in some venues (even by good looking man). Men are very thirsty and give validation away for free. Do you think online game is an easier way to get some fruits?

Post: #6

hmm sounds like it has a lot to do with the environment you're in. if you say a high energy environment like a nightclub then personally I would avoid lengthy conversations as the noise just kills the vibe completely. secondly I would look not so much for the woman but more a REASON and ill give you one of my examples:

- valentines day in Crown Burswood, girl sitting with her friends looking noticeably glum (that was the sticking point)
- her friends were with their guys and she was alone however had a "fuck off" vibe to her
- as soon as she went for a drink in I went, told her to come join me as she looked bored
- she joined me and we were chatting for about 30mins, laughs were had
- took her back to my hotel (was staying there at the time for work) and good morning blowjobs were had in addition.

that's moreso nightclubs where the noise and the atmosphere detracts from any verbal communication, and also the shields where most guys come up with some cheesy line but are oozing desperation. coming up with a genuine reason throws them off.